PDA

View Full Version : [Attack Mechanic] Success Based Damage



illathid
2007-04-22, 08:52 PM
I had this idea for a house rule after reading some of the previews for the new Star Wars: Saga RPG and the mechanics they have for speeding up combat.

Anyways here it is, weapons would no longer have damage dice. All damage would be based on how much your attack roll exceeded the targets AC. Instead each weapon having set amount of damage dice to be rolled, they would give a bonus to your attack roll. I would probably make the attack bonus equal to the weapons previous average damage, rounded up. So for a longsword, the attack bonus would be +5 (1d8: average damage = 4.5).

Some benefits with this system is that it would most likely speed up combat, and be a more realistic combat system. This way the amount of damage you do is based on how good your attack is (no longer will you beat the enemies AC by 20, and only do 3 damage). It would also allow the DM to keep the amount of damage done a secret as the player wouldn't know the targets AC.

Anyways, I wanted to know if anyone could come up with a reason why this wouldn't be balanced, or any other problems they have with this system.

Thanks a ton.

p.s. I will be adding ideas for this system as I come up with them.

Keledrath
2007-04-22, 10:46 PM
Main problem is at the higher levels when the fighter has a minimuim total attack roll of about 15 and has a high magic weapon, he starts dealing way more than usual. It also steals most of Power Attack's thunder.

Matthew
2007-04-22, 11:41 PM
It's fine. I rememeber there was a lengthy article concerning this published in Knights of the Dinner Table a couple of years back. It wasn't the first such article either. Main problem - No use for your other dice.

Scribbler
2007-04-23, 12:03 AM
It also steals most of Power Attack's thunder.

Actually, it pretty makes Power Attack a useless feat. All it would do is subtract from you to-hit chance. Only useful for a two-handed weapon then.

Magnor Criol
2007-04-23, 12:54 AM
What if the attack roll was some sort of modifier for the damage? Beat the AC by a lot, you get the whole damage, beat it by just a little, you only get a little bit of the damage?

I don't know what sort of scaling would be best for that scenario, but it seems logical to me.

illathid
2007-04-23, 01:05 AM
I would probably change Power Attack as well. Make it 1:2 ratio for attack-penalty:bonus-damage for one handed weapons, and 1:3 for two handed.

Well, massive damage isn't too hard to come by with the right amount of planning, and there is a 9th lvl ToB maneuver that just adds a flat +100 bonus to damage as well.

jlousivy
2007-04-23, 01:09 AM
i'd think that some weapons would be able to hit easier (daggers/rapiers) but deal less damage, while others would be harder to hit ie. easier to evade but deal much more damage (greataxe)

Orzel
2007-04-23, 01:41 AM
In my d20 homebrew that how damage is dealt. kinda. During power attack the amount you exceed the AC by is also doubled (or tripled). Causes warriors to Power attack for 1 a lot.

But the weapon's bonus should be to damage rolls not attack rolls or everyone would use greatswords, morningstars, longbows, and long swords.

illathid
2007-04-23, 02:34 AM
But the weapon's bonus should be to damage rolls not attack rolls or everyone would use greatswords, morningstars, longbows, and long swords.

They don't already? :smallwink:

This is also more of a solution for higher level play, where the difference between +2 and +4 isn't going to matter that much.

Peregrine
2007-04-23, 03:33 AM
This also looks like a great solution to a problem I've been having with a homebrew system based on the injury system (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/adventuring/injury.htm), namely, that it requires too many bloody rolls! :smalltongue: You have to roll attack, then damage then a fort save for every attack that connects. And when combined with making defence rolls... well, this is why I've settled on rolling defence once per round, and I still feel it's too many rolls per attack.

I was looking at giving each weapon a flat damage value, which I hated but which would have helped a lot. Attack and damage being one roll is good for me though. If you don't mind me nicking the idea, that is. :smallsmile: (I know people have said others have had the same idea, but fair's fair, it was your thread that gave me the idea.)

illathid
2007-04-23, 06:06 AM
This also looks like a great solution to a problem I've been having with a homebrew system based on the injury system (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/adventuring/injury.htm), namely, that it requires too many bloody rolls! :smalltongue: You have to roll attack, then damage then a fort save for every attack that connects. And when combined with making defence rolls... well, this is why I've settled on rolling defence once per round, and I still feel it's too many rolls per attack.

I was looking at giving each weapon a flat damage value, which I hated but which would have helped a lot. Attack and damage being one roll is good for me though. If you don't mind me nicking the idea, that is. :smallsmile: (I know people have said others have had the same idea, but fair's fair, it was your thread that gave me the idea.)

Go right ahead. Tell me how it works out too, as I won't have time to play test it for a while (stupid college papers).

Indon
2007-04-23, 10:49 AM
So how do you calculate a critical hit? Is it going to be double (triple, whatever) the weapon's damage, or also double the exceeds-AC damage?

I recommend doubling only the weapon's damage modifier, and strength and such, considering critical hits already have high AC-beating capabilities.

Legoman
2007-04-23, 11:32 AM
What about:

AC +5 = +1 to Confirm Criticals
AC +10 = +2 to Confirm Criticals
AC +15 = +4 to Confirm Crit, +1 Crit. Multiplier.
AC +20 = Automatic Critical Threat, +8 to Confirm Criticals, +2 Crit Multiplier.

Power-Attack is still viable, but so is non-power attack with massive +tohit.

Indon
2007-04-23, 12:45 PM
Also, True Strike would be kinda crazy with this system.

Not only would it make your next attack pretty much a guaranteed hit, it'd also add 20+ damage.

Matthew
2007-04-23, 02:16 PM
I forgot to ask. Do Strength Bonuses and Magical Bonuses to Damage continue to work, since they are also part of the Attack Roll? [i.e. +1 Long Sword is actually +2 Damage in effect if it is +1/+1.] If they don't, Masterwork Items become as good as Magical +1, ones, though Something to watch out for.