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JamestheFox
2015-09-16, 02:34 PM
Google Docs Downloads:
The KHT Manual (continuously updated) (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NTz5k9J_WE9Pm74o3MrXiq93qoh4QWYQgYosMemxHhg/edit)
KHT Basic Item List (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cDfRtM6dwEIw1qE48JZjo6WHxHERuurNg1gzjd4OAX0/edit#gid=0)
KHT Character Sheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1jjp_1p1AKghtwxsb1e0Apy9VvMOWltUR9U__8cahu9s/edit?usp=drive_web&ouid=106586966779147906207)
KHT Command, Spell, and Ability Index (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1za2ZQmLJKAaT3L3S7TbfuXRwRJUjxmj64Pm4hUVloCA/edit#gid=4)
KHT Old Heartless Bestiary (A new, sleeker one's on its way, promise) (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1s-anrDoRJDIcsKbR8UR64BKRrv3jA9RHGIDiOD51HlA/edit)
New Heartless Bestiaries: Pureblood (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1EIICLU0AvhC7-9tt-6c7vUlr_-0THszxt0adJ5nGkUc/edit?usp=drive_web&ouid=106586966779147906207), Emblem (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1U2ITnCtZCAXD-VHg5WNLINnS31cJJIWxZu8rZSTq7ak/edit#gid=0)
KHT Manual (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zLtbxUksz-8dMcwBDPnHPsmhQs0ouuot4k91lqaAlUk/edit#)
Item List 3.0 (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CkR5Cf963CSl36AObdOgNGpS5Q9wCCeggfaw2EWi4pU/edit#gid=847085364)
Character Sheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1amniHTc_vpIyXPftcSbnOwDJuQuFWS7veKiTJu_tndQ/edit)
Gummi Ship Sheet (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1iThrVWofAmKSUIVwcUczgKr9Us6ihtrWQLlZF4rqHro/edit#gid=0)
Command, Spell, Ability List (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1yPjMN7T37DgpFt4aWQidEHU8ORy1-zdT6vtkTzcmGaM/edit#gid=4)
Heartless Bestiaries:

Emblem Heartless (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1GCNPVkupCGfITb2TXzCbohO-sLhzv6MBxSLXM58GJx0/edit#gid=0)
Pureblood Heartless (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ytJbnIzpV0CGNjmLalTYNLB0YNNB1sdQD705StLfQZc/edit#gid=2007586495)
Gummi Ship Enemies (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1I6NPsC-qcM2v0iEaZic2nxWgzERpdHxdV0GyrcqrLIY/edit#gid=448243700)



A few years ago, I started a Kingdom Hearts Quest on a different forum, in which the players controlled Sora as he progressed through his adventures. In doing so, I also developed a system to run said quest on. Eventually, though, I came up with ideas to create this spinoff: a standalone system for playing games in the KH universe. Now, after years of work and showing it to my friends, I finally feel comfortable enough with the basic structure of it to shove it out into the light of day for testing. I feel it's far from perfect, but if I'm going to get this thing moving, it needs more eyes on it than I have in my head.

It's a d6 System, but currently requires the Google Spreadsheets Character Sheet linked above to make calculations manageable.

I hope you all enjoy what's there, and await any suggestions or questions you all have.

EDIT: Updated with Links to KHT 3.x

AuraTwilight
2015-09-16, 07:16 PM
The Character Sheet link takes me to the Item List.

Sgt. Cookie
2015-09-16, 08:08 PM
I want you to know, seeing this made me drop EVERYTHING I was doing, this is that damn awesome.


Second, I'm currently looking through this, so I'll edit this post shortly.


And lastly, if you need someone to playtest this, you can be damn sure I'll be there to help.

JamestheFox
2015-09-16, 08:38 PM
Fixed the link to the Character Sheet, and reopened the item list (I don't know WHY it was closed).

I've done little snippet playtests with my friends via skype/roll20, some of whom are interested in doing a full campaign to stress-test it. I'll post here again if I actually decide to run something. In the meantime, if you want to run something, and/or have questions, let me know.

One thing I'm trying to do is streamline the Magic System a little. I still want there to be a lot of spells and ways you can cast them, but I also want to make the damage and MP cost calculations easier for those who aren't using a computer to game (though I somehow doubt I'll ever simplify this enough to make it actually tabletop friendly). It currently calculates based on your MAG Stat and two Damage Factors - one for the Element (such as Fire or Thunder or Ultima), and one for the Type (such as dropping lightning on a target or shooting fire or shooting several tiny shots or fire). One thing I'm considering is cutting the Damage Factor for Spell Elements - only your Magic and your Spell Type determine damage, while the Spell's Element offers chances to exploit vulnerabilities and affect spells fired in different ways.

I'm also streamlining the Bestiary Sheet, to make it easy for GMs to figure out what each specific generic foe does at a glance, and even to make your own enemies.

Sgt. Cookie
2015-09-16, 09:53 PM
So, going over it:

It's a good start. There's a LOT missing, of course, like Abilities and spells and such, but its a damn fine start.

The layout, however, leaves much, MUCH, to be desired. It's... not easy to follow. (Also, I'd suggest AGAINST having "KHFTB". Just use KHT.)

The idea of using D6s and D2s is a... decent idea. Keeps it simple for people who don't have access to specialist gaming dice.

Character Creation: I like it. Well... I like the IDEA. Very White Wolf. Unfortunately... it's janky as all hell. Because of the way the point costs end up, it makes critical builds very, very inefficent. Most of the "balanced" builds had 19 stats to their name, while critical builds barely scrape 12. The Defence build caps at 16. Also, if players DO have extra points, then they should be allowed to do something with them, rather than have them go to waste. Personally, I'd let them exchange a character point for, say, 20 Munny? That should be fine.

Abilities:


The most common kind of requirements are X Plot Rewards.

I'm not sure I like this. Sure, every 5th level, you get an ability, but having them dependent on, effectively, "how much" you've done in the campaign, is... not something I can agree with. After all, that's what EXP's for.

You have the paths via the Awakening (The implementation of which I REALLY like, BTW.), so use those. Don't have it relegated to just an... actually extremely minor stat boost. At least, as far as I can tell, it's minor. Have certain abilities have different requirements depending on your Path. The Sword Path gets Combo Plus at a much earlier level than the Staff, for instance. The Awakening is a big thing in the character's story. But at present, all they do is provide a negligible bonus to your stats. Have them MATTER.

The "Skills" or "Movement Stats", as you put them, its a good start. I like the idea challenge/rank thing. But... there aren't enough skills. Now, I don't mean go all D&D with forty gajillion skills that do all sorts of things. But you've cut them down *too* much. Sure, these work well when its only Sora that's being controlled, but for actual CHARACTERS, it's useless.

This is a game about telling a story, right? So, how do I determine if my scholarly character has the right knowledge we need? How do I determine if my mechanic character is able to keep the ship flying after a hit to the engines? All that sort of stuff is important in a story. But how the eff do I KNOW if I can do it or not?

Dispositions:

Basically a title, gives extra stats. All well and good, some gains some drops and... what's this?


the boosts (and drops!) a Disposition has grow as you level, along the following formula:

Disposition Bonus Rank*(LVL/100)

Wait, what?

So your telling me that something my GM gives me, something that is COMPLETELY out of my control, has a greater effect on the stats of my character than, what is effectively, the last god damn stage of CHARACTER CREATION? (Which is, I might add, a big step in the character's story.) What? J.. just WHAT!? (Unless of course, the Awakening skill bonus was also going to be affected similarly. Which it really. REALLY should.)


It's almost 4AM for me, so I'll go over the rest of the stuff later. But, for now, it all seems pretty OK. But, to speak my opinion, it's a good framework. You've got everything you need to make a good system. It's just has its glaring flaws.

JamestheFox
2015-09-17, 11:12 AM
There's a LOT missing, of course, like Abilities and spells and such, but its a damn fine start.

Right now, the Magic, Abilities, and Commands are all tucked away in the Character Sheet. I'm hoping to fix that... eventually. Give each their own Word Document.


The layout, however, leaves much, MUCH, to be desired. It's... not easy to follow.

Do you have any advice to fix that?


The idea of using D6s and D2s is a... decent idea. Keeps it simple for people who don't have access to specialist gaming dice.

That was the reason I went with d6s and d2s. An earlier version of this system had d20s, but I felt going with six-siders keeps everything relatively simple.


Character Creation: I like it. Well... I like the IDEA. Very White Wolf. Unfortunately... it's janky as all hell. Because of the way the point costs end up, it makes critical builds very, very inefficent. Most of the "balanced" builds had 19 stats to their name, while critical builds barely scrape 12. The Defense build caps at 16. Also, if players DO have extra points, then they should be allowed to do something with them, rather than have them go to waste. Personally, I'd let them exchange a character point for, say, 20 Munny? That should be fine.

Not sure what you mean by critical builds. Single-stat-focused ones?

I have been trying to figure out what to do with unused Creation Points - it's been irking me for a long time. 20 Munny sounds like a good start.


Dispositions vs Awakening

The Disposition Boost starts as a number between 1 and 5. The manual was downright wrong - By its calculation, at max level you'd get 1*(LVL100/100)=1*1=1. I ultimately buffed it to Disposition Boost*(LVL/50), which I suppose is better written as "at LVL 100, your Disposition Boosts Double," though I might make the double effect occur at an earlier level (since I have my doubts about how many parties will ever actually play to LVL 100). So Dispositions can buff at least one stat by anywhere between 1 at minimum and 10 at maximum, depending on how high level you're aiming with your campaign. Though I'm hesitant about hard-coding it into the manual, I do not recommend that GMs give out Dispositions that give net bonuses over that number. That way leads to insanity and most likely imbalanced characters

Meanwhile, while it needed to be codified in the manual (thanks for pointing that out, I'm still finding little things like that to this day), Awakening Boosts offer a grand total of 13 points - your Chosen Stat goes up by 6, your neutral stat goes up by 4, and your lost stat goes up by 3.

Plot Rewards are generally (or should be) akin to "Get Bonuses (http://kingdomhearts.wikia.com/wiki/Level#Bonus_Level)" from the KH series - you obtain one upon defeating a boss or miniboss-like foe, or by completing a some major event (like clearing a particularly rough trap in a dungeon, or completing a quest of some sort). My guideline is about the same as KH2's - somewhere around 2-4 Plot Rewards per World/Arc/Quest/Whatever. That said, they can also be handed out when a plot-related change occurs - such as a character undergoing an apprenticeship getting a Plot Reward related to the apprenticeship.

One thing I'm considering codifying (if I haven't already) is that you can hold on to unused Level Ups until such a time (out of battle) that you're ready to grab an Ability or Command you're trying to qualify for.

As for skills like mechanical skills, piloting, and lore, to an extent I've left that to your backstory. That said, both of those examples can potentially be covered by what's already here.

Due to the nature of the KH universe (http://i2.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/962/305/3c8.jpg), the party's most likely jumping from one reality to another, and conventional knowledge from one world doesn't always bleed over into another. Thus, a scholarly fellow would likely use Investigate to represent not his knowledge, but his ability to find knowledge. Go to the library, Investigate with the goal of finding information the party might need, find newspaper clippings or ancient tomes of knowledge or whatnot.

While it's a bit more of a stretch, your GM may also call for Grip to keep a hold of your controls while performing especially difficult maneuvers with a vehicle. Call for a "Piloting" skill, I feel, isn't quite as ubiquitous as what Movement Stats are already there.

I can also codify such backgrounds as Creation Abilities (which thus far have been mostly around for the sole purpose of holding the sort of odd setting-exclusive stuff that's not necessarily KH).

That said, I'm going to wait until I get some more opinions regarding doing anything regarding Movement Stats.

As a side note I felt is hilarious enough to toss on here, it occurred to me that a lot of characters in the KH series seem to instantly master almost anything esoteric or vehicle-based that they lay eyes upon - tree surfing, lightcycles, skateboarding (seriously, Roxas. When'd you learn to do that?), flying horseback riding...

St. Noof
2017-08-05, 07:30 PM
First of all, I'd like to apologize for "bumping" this thread. I don't mean to be disruptive, but I'd like to share ideas and get you (the author, JamesTheFox) a fresh dose of interest on this project.

Hello! I've just started looking for a Kingdom Hearts RPG to play, and I've found this one to be the most enticing thus far. While I typically prefer a 5th-Edition style d20-based system, I found your d6-based system to be largely very fitting for a game like this. I am, however, having some trouble accessing the material. For example, I can't seem to access the Commands, Abilities, and Spells in the Character Sheet. It says on Google Spreadsheets that the lists are "hidden", which is sad to see.

You see, I'm a legally blind DM/GM, and I'm interested in compiling a more accessible compendium, and I would need access to those lists in order to start working on that.

From what I've read so far, I really like the customizability that the character creation has. I enjoy the challenging idea of having a limit to the healing items you can use per rest (personally, I'd call it Durability Points instead of Overdose Points, but that's just semantics. :D) I also have a great deal of appreciation for the lack of classes, races, and skills. This means that each character can be unique without having to worry about which race is better, which classes work better than others, and which skills are relevant at which times.

My only current concern is how easy it is to hit with attacks. You have to roll 1d6 and get a 2 or higher, which seems very easy, especially in cases where you're facing off against melee-based enemies and using melee weapons. Also, there doesn't seem to be anything in the manual about how Dodge, Guard, and Reversal Rolls work, and I'd love to see how they affect the Attack Roll part of combat.

I would like to take this time to make a humble request, if you have been kind enough to check this thread and read through this post. I would be very grateful if you could provide a simpler version of the spreadsheet documents; the decorations you've added to the spreadsheets are both delightful and beautiful, but my eyes have a hard time keeping thrack of all the colors and designs.

I hope that my feedback has been helpful and has inspired you to continue work on this project, and I look forward to your future response. :)

JamestheFox
2017-08-05, 08:53 PM
First of all, I'd like to apologize for "bumping" this thread. I don't mean to be disruptive, but I'd like to share ideas and get you (the author, JamesTheFox) a fresh dose of interest on this project.

No problem, I've still been working on and updating this. I've got a longtime "Quest" style game running on SV and a rather obscure forum that this system was based on, and which jumped to this system when it was "complete" enough to start being run on it. It's good to hear of interest outside that circle!


Hello! I've just started looking for a Kingdom Hearts RPG to play, and I've found this one to be the most enticing thus far. While I typically prefer a 5th-Edition style d20-based system, I found your d6-based system to be largely very fitting for a game like this. I am, however, having some trouble accessing the material. For example, I can't seem to access the Commands, Abilities, and Spells in the Character Sheet. It says on Google Spreadsheets that the lists are "hidden", which is sad to see.

Since the original post, we've been working a fair bit on KHT. There is now a snazzy index that serves as the source for all KHT sheets. The rules here must have changed while I was gone, which means no links that don't already exist, so I'll instead point you to the "What Do I Need To Play" part of the manual, where it should be by now. When something changes in the index, it changes for all sheets currently connected to it. Thus far, we're not quite at the stage that I feel certain that the list won't change, so this is currently the best method I've come up with for keeping the sheets updated no matter what wacky changes I implement.

I will also note that you guys are free to make copies of this sheet via Google Doc's "Make a Copy" function, and doing so allows you full access to the squishy guts of the sheet. I'm sure there are still bugs to bash in there - I find them all the time - so be careful.


You see, I'm a legally blind DM/GM, and I'm interested in compiling a more accessible compendium, and I would need access to those lists in order to start working on that.

From what I've read so far, I really like the customizability that the character creation has. I enjoy the challenging idea of having a limit to the healing items you can use per rest (personally, I'd call it Durability Points instead of Overdose Points, but that's just semantics. :D) I also have a great deal of appreciation for the lack of classes, races, and skills. This means that each character can be unique without having to worry about which race is better, which classes work better than others, and which skills are relevant at which times.

My only current concern is how easy it is to hit with attacks. You have to roll 1d6 and get a 2 or higher, which seems very easy, especially in cases where you're facing off against melee-based enemies and using melee weapons. Also, there doesn't seem to be anything in the manual about how Dodge, Guard, and Reversal Rolls work, and I'd love to see how they affect the Attack Roll part of combat.

I would like to take this time to make a humble request, if you have been kind enough to check this thread and read through this post. I would be very grateful if you could provide a simpler version of the spreadsheet documents; the decorations you've added to the spreadsheets are both delightful and beautiful, but my eyes have a hard time keeping thrack of all the colors and designs.

I hope that my feedback has been helpful and has inspired you to continue work on this project, and I look forward to your future response. :)

As said above, I'm not entirely convinced that our current list of spells, abilities, commands, etc, are even close to absolute just yet (one complaint I have is KHT's current reliance on Excel formulas to put together complex stats from spell to spell), but if you're up for making a more accessible list, I'm game.

We've been running a test campaign set in a Dissidia-esque universe, with a fair bit of feedback involved. It means that right now there is a lot of fluctuation in the system where there wasn't when I started this thread.

As a relevant example, KHT used to have a "roll 3 or higher to hit" for accuracy, but we found that on a d6 misses were incredibly common (though that may be Roll20 shenanigans), which is incredibly disruptive when most Combos end if you miss (until you get Combo Master later in, which nobody has gotten yet). Thus, we're currently trying "roll 2 or higher, unless a Command/Spell description says otherwise" out.

Dodge Roll, Guard (which may very well be a bit on the OP side right now, especially at low levels), and Reversal all have their current effects in their description in the index. Dodge Roll lets you make an opposing roll to the foe's roll - roll higher than they did, they miss. Guard has you roll 3d6 (which may be too high in my opinion) and add it to your DEF. If you roll 6 on all three or your DEF exceeds your foe's damage (which is too easy at low levels), you outright block their attack. Reversal is Dodge Roll but lets you counterattack afterwards, and you can't use it as often per battle.

I've actually received mixed reviews on the customization aspect, especially as far as Commands, Abilities, and Spells go - too many options, not enough slots for the options, and sometimes not enough direction in what kind of skills a certain build should be taking.

Sariel Vailo
2017-08-06, 02:44 PM
I have a friend and ill let him look at this.

St. Noof
2017-08-06, 10:53 PM
Well, I certainly can't argue with playtesting. :D If "roll 3 or higher" was making the combo system unuseable, then that's just no good!

As for the number of options for Commands/Spells/Abilities, I happen to think that you've captured the..ahem, magic of the Kingdom Hearts franchise rather well with those lists (now that you've helped me figure out how to view them), and the spell customizability is something I could really see some players liking. I would have a blast building characters that specialize in different magics and using all those different spell types.

One thing that either needs to be a bit clearer (listed in the manual, perhaps; maybe a chapter on spells a la D&D) or possibly simplified a bit, is how to calculate the MP cost and damage of a spell. I see a lot of numbers in columns, but it's hard to make it work in my head without a sentence or two or an equation to lay it out for me. Some examples of spells would also be helpful.

I must say that, while I understand Sgt. Cookie's issue with how vague the Movement Stats can be, I think it is actually pretty refreshing to have one skill for Communicate, and one for Investigate. As a 5E DM, I run into a great deal of "Persuasion vs. Intimidation vs. Deception" or "Investigation vs. Insight" issues (and don't even get me started on "Intelligence vs. Wisdom"!). One skill that provides all the functions of social interaction and one that encompasses information is actually a very nice change for me.

Just keeping the attention for this thread rolling. Anyone interested in playtesting this still, I'd welcome your voiced interest.

JamestheFox
2017-08-07, 09:48 AM
One thing that either needs to be a bit clearer (listed in the manual, perhaps; maybe a chapter on spells a la D&D) or possibly simplified a bit, is how to calculate the MP cost and damage of a spell. I see a lot of numbers in columns, but it's hard to make it work in my head without a sentence or two or an equation to lay it out for me. Some examples of spells would also be helpful.

That's one thing I've been considering changing. Currently, the spell multiplies together MAG with the modifiers and damage factors and such. Simplifying it without making it too strong or too weak is high on my list of things to do. I'm currently considering simplifying it to (MAG*Spell Type Damage Factor)+Element Modifier. So if Fire had a modifier of 5 and Pillar has a Factor of 2.5, a spellcaster who knows Fire Pillar with 5 MAG would be doing... 20 damage per cast, which is a fair bit higher than damage for such spells is, which means I'd have to reduce those Damage Factors. To keep it simple, Damage Factors would be .5, 1, 1.5., 2, etc.

EDIT: Have made the change, it seems to work fairly well right now. Will codify it in the manual.


I must say that, while I understand Sgt. Cookie's issue with how vague the Movement Stats can be, I think it is actually pretty refreshing to have one skill for Communicate, and one for Investigate. As a 5E DM, I run into a great deal of "Persuasion vs. Intimidation vs. Deception" or "Investigation vs. Insight" issues (and don't even get me started on "Intelligence vs. Wisdom"!). One skill that provides all the functions of social interaction and one that encompasses information is actually a very nice change for me.

We've found Grip to be far more useful than expected, during our playtesting, because GRAPPLING! is a thing. It was a big goal of mine to boil down skills to as few things as possible, leaving most of the specific stuff to backstories and such (admittedly leaving such things in the hands of the GM). You're a mechanic according to your backstory? Well, that should mean you know what you're doing with most machines. Investigate can help you inspect broken machines or figure out how something works, while Grip can represent your ability to physically work with the machines. If you're a mountaineer or doctor, the same stats probably can be used for entirely different contexts. As a GM, modify the difficulty of doing a task if it's within the player's in-character background, and think of it as an RP bonus.

That said, if someone's thought up a skill that could be as central and adaptable as these, I'd love to hear your ideas. Thus far swimming hasn't come up much in my test campaign, so it's the only heavily situational stat I've noticed so far.

St. Noof
2017-08-07, 02:16 PM
Okay, I'm happy to see a straight formula, and I'm glad it's actively in development. What about MP Cost? I remember seeing a tidbit in the manual about how each rank above base, the cost is multiplied by... 1.5? I think the wording there was just a bit vague, so an equation for that would also be quite helpful to see.

When I looked at the manual initially, I could swear I remember seeing Search, Spot, and Endurance as Movement Stats. If it's been changed since, I could see Endurance being easily absorbed into Grip (I have to admit that I really love how Grip is becoming the all-stat for exploration. That makes me smile like you wouldn't believe). If Search and Spot have been removed, my recommendation is that you add a "Sense" stat--something that mimics the Perception skill in D&D; you can use it both for catching something out of the corner of your eye and scanning an area or object for things that pop out. It can even represent the other senses (hence the name), in keeping with the centralized nature of the Movement Stat mechanic.

JamestheFox
2017-08-07, 04:01 PM
Investigation has long since gobbled up anything akin to Perception, making it about as used as Grip.

Endurance still exists, though.

MP Cost goes up by half the original MP Cost (rounded up) for each rank of spell you cast. If Fire Shot costs 10 MP (which it doesn't, not even close), Fira Shot costs 15 MP, Firaga Shot costs 20 MP, Firaja Shot costs 25 MP, and so on. Equation wise it's (Base MP Cost + ((Base MP Cost*0.5)*Number of Ranks above Base)).

JBPuffin
2017-08-07, 05:42 PM
This is nifty. I like having the Excel sheet around, and for a forum-centric game it makes sense, but it is tricky to get used to. Having to manually open the Ability/Command/Spell Lists rather than having a dropdown function complicates things - for awhile, I thought I'd have to write my own >.>.

Mechanically, it's simple enough, and while I do think the layout still needs some work, after a couple of reads I could figure out what I needed to do to make a character. My first guy really wanted Commands from both Melee and Ranged to match his actual abilities - what'd be the best way to handle that? Would an Ability that allows that be fair for a level 1 character?

JamestheFox
2017-08-08, 04:57 AM
This is nifty. I like having the Excel sheet around, and for a forum-centric game it makes sense, but it is tricky to get used to. Having to manually open the Ability/Command/Spell Lists rather than having a dropdown function complicates things - for awhile, I thought I'd have to write my own >.>.

Mechanically, it's simple enough, and while I do think the layout still needs some work, after a couple of reads I could figure out what I needed to do to make a character. My first guy really wanted Commands from both Melee and Ranged to match his actual abilities - what'd be the best way to handle that? Would an Ability that allows that be fair for a level 1 character?

Dropdowns could probably be arranged, I just never added them for fear of lag possibly happening.

Far as Commands from both Melee and Ranged goes, there are options. A GM that's friendly to the idea can let you take Commands from both sections. Alternatively, you can work with your GM to create a Limit Drive that has you change attack types, even going as far as creating a second character sheet for that moveset. My long-running KH Quest has for instance given its main character the ability to enter Drive Forms wherein it has entirely new stats, abilities, etc.

apprenticeoflin
2017-08-10, 10:05 PM
Hi! Just got done reading over the system and it is pretty cool. I did have some questions about things like equipment, spells, and the gummi ship.

For equipment, what sort of stats would we put in? Like for a protect chain or something that grants resistance to a certain element type? I can't seem to find any of that on a sheet if you did make it. As well as an item like a Keyblade, are there any examples as to what a basic one like Kingdom Key would look like in this system? Or do you just rip the stats straight from the game?

For spells, I'm confused as to how someone would know what to link a spell type to. As in, my character chooses the Thunder spell and I think it's considered a drop spell, but the actual spell description doesn't label that.

And there's a section for the Gummi Ship character sheet that isn't clickable. I'm assuming that it's not implemented yet but if there are more rules as to how the ship stats are made and how to add onto the ship, that would be cool!

Also, the sections for CP and AP don't auto deduct based off of the amount I'm spending on the character sheet. I can equip two items for 1 AP each but the AP counter on the sheet doesn't change if I do this. Is it supposed to or am I supposed to keep track of that manually?

Also, in the guide you say to enter our basic level 1 stats in the LVL 1 fields but that doesn't seem to affect the Base sections at all. I had to go in and edit the base to be what I had at level 1. Not sure if intentional or not but I thought I'd bring it up.

Thank you very much for making this awesome looking system. I'm hyped to try it out

St. Noof
2017-08-11, 02:25 PM
Figure I'll put this on GitP, just for the purposes of collaboration. I'm currently working on a Roll20 version of the character sheet, but there's a lot I don't know and don't have the time to learn right now. So, anyone who has a knack for HTML and/or CSS may certainly join this Roll20 game. If you want to contribute to the sheet, send me a message and I'll add you to the game and assign you as a GM so you can work on the sheet.

I'll be adding a changelog into the game proper, so any contributors should make notes within that handout, along with a signature to let everyone know who changed what.

Currently working on trying to figure out how to set attributes for Awakening choice, neutral, and lost. I've got the equations themselves down pat, but getting the sheet to recognize which is selected and apply it to the appropriate stats is proving to be a challenge.

JamestheFox
2017-08-11, 10:28 PM
For equipment, what sort of stats would we put in? Like for a protect chain or something that grants resistance to a certain element type? I can't seem to find any of that on a sheet if you did make it. As well as an item like a Keyblade, are there any examples as to what a basic one like Kingdom Key would look like in this system? Or do you just rip the stats straight from the game?

Right now, there's not an even remotely full list of pre-made equipment and weapon.

Starting equipment (usually a Chain and a Weapon) are each given 1 point in a stat of the GM's choice.

Beyond that, I'd generally have GMs make their own gear - there's a synthesis system that's already mostly put together that needs to be properly added to the manual, setting any selling price according to the combined material cost, plus "manufacturing fees."


For spells, I'm confused as to how someone would know what to link a spell type to. As in, my character chooses the Thunder spell and I think it's considered a drop spell, but the actual spell description doesn't label that.


Spells function in a combination system. Unless the Spell Type and Element say so, you're generally able to mix together any Element with any Type. In your example, you could have (to name a few):

Thunder Drop: Thunderbolts from above, of course. A classic.

Thunder Shot: Shoot a bullet of lightning at foes. Has been seen in BBS.

Thunder Volley: Shoots a wave of several smaller bullets of lightning. Also seen in BBS

Thunder Trap: Set a trap that zaps whatever gets too close. Not necessarily as canon in the KH series, but fully doable in KHT.

And others such as Thunder Aura, Thunder Sentry, etc.

In short, go nuts, the system allows most combos.


And there's a section for the Gummi Ship character sheet that isn't clickable. I'm assuming that it's not implemented yet but if there are more rules as to how the ship stats are made and how to add onto the ship, that would be cool!

It is pretty far along in development, and may need proper testing at some point. Next chance I get, I'll add it and the synthesis stuff properly.


Also, the sections for CP and AP don't auto deduct based off of the amount I'm spending on the character sheet. I can equip two items for 1 AP each but the AP counter on the sheet doesn't change if I do this. Is it supposed to or am I supposed to keep track of that manually?

Also, in the guide you say to enter our basic level 1 stats in the LVL 1 fields but that doesn't seem to affect the Base sections at all. I had to go in and edit the base to be what I had at level 1. Not sure if intentional or not but I thought I'd bring it up.

That... is odd. I've never encountered that problem before. If you can send me a link to your copy of the sheet, I can look it over. It should track everything you mentioned automatically. Base usually tracks your combined LVL 1 and LVL Up stats, adding them all together. Absolute should be adding from your equipment section (and multiplying, if you're talking about HP, MP, and AP).

apprenticeoflin
2017-08-11, 11:00 PM
Thank you for the quick reply. That clears a lot of things up. I sent you a PM with the character sheet in question.

apprenticeoflin
2017-08-12, 11:21 AM
Ok weirdest thing. I copied the basic file over to my drive account again as a test and now it's auto populating when I fill in the level 1 info and equip commands

QuadraticGish
2017-10-27, 10:14 AM
I don't mean to bump this thread, but a friend found this and is planning on running a oneshot that may or may not spawn into its own thing. Looking through, we noticed the following statement:


In addition, HP, MP, and AP boost based on your Level and your stats. DEF boosts HP, MAG boosts MP, and all three stats influence AP.


Looking through the manual and character sheet, we didn't find find any specific rules or calculations that reflected stats influencing each other. Are we missing something?

JamestheFox
2017-10-29, 11:21 AM
No worries about bumping, it's a very slow thread and I'm still keeping an eye on it.

As for the manual passage you found, no, you're not missing anything, that's more a clerical issue that I haven't gotten around to fixing. Thanks to your input, that passage should be removed as of this post, as those stats no longer influence each other.

If you see anything else that isn't reflected on the character sheet or such, or have other questions, let me know here, and I'll get back to you.

QuadraticGish
2017-10-29, 07:11 PM
No worries about bumping, it's a very slow thread and I'm still keeping an eye on it.

As for the manual passage you found, no, you're not missing anything, that's more a clerical issue that I haven't gotten around to fixing. Thanks to your input, that passage should be removed as of this post, as those stats no longer influence each other.

If you see anything else that isn't reflected on the character sheet or such, or have other questions, let me know here, and I'll get back to you.

Ah, I see. I've got a few questions to ask. Why was the 3 main stats influencing the main 3 resources removed out of curiosty? Is spell damage reduced by defense? It's not explicitly mentioned. How should resistance be calculated in Mix Tier spells in the case that both a resistance and weakness are hit or in anyother similar situation? Why LP instead of calling it Drive? In the command list, I see "Aerial" listed a few times, but the manual doesn't describe what it means. How should limits be balanced?

Sgt. Cookie
2017-10-30, 12:08 AM
It's... Been far too long since I came to this. This system has a special place in my heart that I hope can one day live to its fullest potential.

That said, I can tell you exactly what the problem with KHT is: It's far too simulationist.

Now, what I mean by that is this system succeeds in translating the video game experience to the tabletop. I can roll up a character and do battle with the heartless. For this systems original purpose, that was fine.

What this system fails to do, though, is provide a framework with which to tell a story. It gives lots of details about combat and abilities and plot rewards (which I inherently disagree with, by the by. Character advancement should not be at the whim of the GM) but it has very little in making sure the characters have, well, character.

Tough guy, thief, detective and diplomat. As far as character options go, that's your lot. There's no... Engineer or medic or pilot. There's no real difference between PC A and PC B other than one decided to go melee and one magic. These skills, sorry "movement stats", make up such a tiny aspect of a character, that they may as well not even exist.

I think you focused so hard on giving people the tools to play a game, you forgot to give people the tools to tell a story. That maybe you just assumed that if the mechanics were there, the story would follow. But it doesn't work like that. Yeast makes bread rise, not hope.

Now, I know this may seem disheartening, like I've defecated all over your years of work, but... if I didn't give you honesty, then KHT would never improve.

But, I'm not saying start from scratch. The foundation is there. I think you need to take a step back, put away any sort of pride or ego and ask yourself a simple question: "Does this system let me play a game or does this system let me tell a story?". Because it doesn't matter how long you've been working on KHT, if this system doesn't let you tell a story then why even bother? If I want to play the game, I'll boot up my PS2 and have another crack at Sephiroth.

JamestheFox
2018-03-22, 07:26 PM
Alright, it's been a fair while, apologies.

Work has progressed, I've been running a KHT campaign on Roll20, lots of little changes have been made. New commands, spells, and abilities have been added, the manual has had some clarification of rules, all sorts of little things like that.

I honestly wish I'd gone and written up a changelog, but coulda-woulda-shoulda.

I'm mostly here to answer some questions and comments, at this juncture. So let's get at that.


"Why were the 3 main stats influencing the main 3 resources removed out of curiosty?"
A few different reasons. I felt that the resource stats got bloated far too easily when you could both add points to them specifically and to the stats that boosted them. I have considered removing MAG as a stat, and basing spell power purely on MP (as in KH1), but I've had mixed reactions from the testers. Another option I have personally considered was setting MP to a flat, unincreasable 100, ala KH2. But ultimately, I stuck with the separate stats for customizability of the current settings - a mage can choose to be powerful but run out of juice quickly, or have plenty of magical stamina but not as much raw power, or any balance inbetween.


"Is spell damage reduced by defense? It's not explicitly mentioned."
Yes, DEF guards against anything that doesn't explicitly bypass it. I've considered splitting it into physical DEF and magical DEF, for similar reasons as above, but for now I've chosen to keep the defense stats at HP and DEF. My testers likewise dislike this as well, as it makes their less tanky characters even more squishy and breakable.


"How should resistance be calculated in Mix Tier spells in the case that both a resistance and weakness are hit or in any other similar situation?"
There are several situations in which this can happen. "Sword" Spells apply their element to every attack you use, and can be combined with other elemental Commands, which results in the Command having both its native element and the Sword Spell's element. In cases where two or more elements are involved (remember that Physical and Magical are elements as well), the most extreme modifier wins. If you take 50% damage from Magic and 300% damage from Fire, Fire wins. If you take 25% damage from Magic and 200% from Fire, Magic wins. If its a tie (such as with 25% vs 300%), resistance effects win. Healing from elements always wins against everything else. No, this wasn't in the manual before now, but has needed elaborating for a while. Just recently had a situation like this play out while playtesting, myself.


"Why LP instead of calling it Drive?"
Because every game has different resources. Drive, D-Link, Focus... I ultimately chose Limit Points, and referenced Drive as one of the three kinds of Limits - Limit Drives (super modes), Limit Calls (summons), and Limit Breaks (single big attacks).


"In the command list, I see "Aerial" listed a few times, but the manual doesn't describe what it means."
Aerial Commands again need to be properly codified in the manual, but the effect only comes into play in a few situations related to elevation: Firstly, when you're targeting a foe that's being juggled. Secondly, when dealing with flying foes. Thirdly, your foe just plain happens to have the high ground. In all cases, Aerial Commands completely ignore all accuracy penalties related to elevation (including distance between you and your target produced by said elevation).


"How should limits be balanced?"
Hoooo, this is the tough one. Alright, settle down and listen to uncle James' seminar on how he prefers to build Limits.

The big thing to remember is that these are the trump cards, usually, and above all need to feel...
A: ... in tune with the character using them. Talk with your player, figure out what they envision for their character, and build some cool Limits centered around those concepts. A magical girl uses her finishing move, a mechanic busts out his personal superweapon/mecha/robot partner/whatever. A fun one I recently used was Captain Jack Sparrow pulling a piece of Cursed Aztec Gold from nowhere and temporarily becoming unable to die but weak to all magic. This is where your character's flavor must shine, even if it shines nowhere else in the battle mechanics.
B: ... really fun to use. I tend to try and lean towards "don't bother making them balanced." This is the player character's chance to pull something cool and unique for them. Let them have this.

On a similar note, if you're not letting them regain LP in between every single fight (as I would recommend), they'll have their doubts about busting out their potential "I win" button every single time a fight breaks out, so it's important to make sure the incentive is there to consider using it when the going gets tough. If you're going to let them recharge after every fight, of course, you may want to consider using weaker Limits vs stronger ones.

Other fun ideas:
- Give them Limit Breaks that are somehow tied to already existin Limit Drives. Perhaps you give them a Break that costs no LP free if they're in a specific Drive, but ends the Drive immediately. Almost every Limit Call I've created has its own Limit Break or Drive, which drains its SP (With Breaks immediately reducing the SP to 0 and increasing the effect of the Break based on how much SP was left, and Drives simply draining SP at a faster rate while active.).

- Mess with duration. The baseline for Drive length is 3 Rounds. You can choose to make this longer or shorter based on the exact power of the Drive. You can also give the player conditions they can fulfill to reset their Drive length or restore SP or such. In the play-by-post quest that spawned KHT, I gave Riku Dark-Knight-esque Drives that would drain his HP every few turns, instead of giving the Drives specific lengths, and gave Sora a Drive that he could recharge every time he used a specific Command. This gets pretty ridiculous pretty fast, but can be loads of fun.



... plot rewards (which I inherently disagree with, by the by.Character advancement should not be at the whim of the GM)
Okay, this actually peeves me to hear and I have to rebutt it. Like, I don't know what tabletop you're playing.

Does it have EXP?

Does it have loot?

Does it have shops and stores to spend your gold or gil or Pokedollars or Gems or whatnot at?

Does it have anything at all that the party doesn't straight up make themselves?

All of that is entirely at the whim of the GM. How they choose to distribute rewards is very much their call. How much EXP a puzzle or other encounter is worth is chosen by the GM (or, in the case of premade encounters, the maker of the module, who was most likely the original GM). And even then, it's not uncommon for GMs to hand out EXP, at their pleasure, for things they like, such as good roleplaying.

They may choose to delegate loot to a random table or some such, or they may hand-craft their rewards specifically to help their players get the things they want and ask for. GMs in the Pokemon Tabletop games literally are the arbiters of what kinds of characters each Player has the opportunity to recruit into their personal party.

Plot Rewards, AKA Get Bonuses in some KH games, are very much what the KH name for them implies - Bonuses. Since the last discussion regarding them, I've removed them as requirements for Commands, Abilities, or Spells. You instead use your Level for that.


Tough guy, thief, detective and diplomat. As far as character options go, that's your lot. There's no... Engineer or medic or pilot. There's no real difference between PC A and PC B other than one decided to go melee and one magic. These skills, sorry "movement stats", make up such a tiny aspect of a character, that they may as well not even exist.
I will admit that this and certain discussions among the test crew prompted me to do some slight revisions and clarifications that I'll actually bring up here. But first. Let's go back up the character creation checklist. Before Movement Stats. Before Combat Stats.

Let's go all the way to "Creating your Characters Background" and Developmental Data.

That "Description" thing? In the absence of straight up stats for "I am a doctor" or "I am a farmer" or "I am a performer," the "Description" section is immensely important, please fill that out before you even start combat stats. Give yourself a specific history. And GMs? Please read that background. Discuss it with your player. It's part of where you get inspiration for their starting Disposition, it's where you decide what the fluff for their starting gear are (if not necessarily the crunch, I generally suggest boosting at least one stat they have prioritized).

I admittedly have, through this comment, been inspired to actually expound on the importance of the Description section, and apply a few minor explanations for the Movement Stats section.

GMs must take that background seriously and scale their challenges to suit that background.

If you're a doctor, I can already tell you the following:
1: Investigate, Grip. You would not believe how much I've seen Grip used. But specifically for doctors, these two Movement Stats can be used for almost everything a doctor might have to do, and as a GM I am inclined to make the Movement Challenges relating to those tasks infinitely harder for your non-doctor traveling companions. Some examples I might suggest: Investigate to check for the most serious injuries in an emergency situation, or look through medical journals for clues to diagnose or treat a disease, or check your surgical patient's insides for the one thing you need to remove from them. Grip (or perhaps Stealth) or for precision incisions, or to hold down a patient. Acrobatics could theoretically be used for quicker, more hasty work. I could come up with similar answers for every character you suggested. Obviously, this is something that needs to be clarified within the Manual itself and will be when I get the chance to fully develop examples.

2: There are a lot of Commands, Spells, and Abilities. Enough that even people with the same stat build may not take the same route. I've got like three mages in this test party and they all do different things. For a doctor I suggest the following: Medishot, if you're a Ranged Fighter. Multiple flavors of Cure. Biologicial Spells, if you want some offense. Biological Strength, as an ability. I had been considering adding (and after reading the above, I did add, thank you for pushing me over the line) a Command: First Aid, which is very Field Surgeon.

3: When you and your GM discuss your Limit Break/Drive/Call, make sure your Limit of choice distills your character concept into one glorious in-battle action. Pull your allies into melee range and heal them for a huge amount of health. Double the effectiveness of your healing actions. Immediately allow an Ally at 0 HP to Get Up with Full HP. Remember, as stated above: your Limit is You, At Your Best.

In summary, I feel that having precious few, but incredibly broadly-used Movement Stats (with the GM having an eye for when a character's background would be relevant to the task) has its benefits over having 16-30 skills you'll only pick 5 of (and almost everyone puts something into Perception) but only use 2 of consistently (and one of those is Perception). Please, if you're a cowboy farmer from the Wild West, you don't need "Animal Handling," "Ride," "Intimidate," "Survival," and "Use Rope," that stuff should go without saying and you and your GM should expect to make use of your Movement Stats to determine just how good you are at using them. Grip to swing a lasso at a foe and reel them in, Endurance for surviving out in those untamed lands, Communicate to intimidate everyone as you walk into the bar, gun smoking.

This all said, I may in the future rename these stats to further broaden their usefulness.

http://orig09.deviantart.net/0f87/f/2013/163/e/2/kingdom_hearts_3_wallpaper_by_krovash-d68rojn.png.

QuadraticGish
2018-03-23, 08:58 AM
Hoooo, this is the tough one. Alright, settle down and listen to uncle James' seminar on how he prefers to build Limits.

The big thing to remember is that these are the trump cards, usually, and above all need to feel...
A: ... in tune with the character using them. Talk with your player, figure out what they envision for their character, and build some cool Limits centered around those concepts. A magical girl uses her finishing move, a mechanic busts out his personal superweapon/mecha/robot partner/whatever. A fun one I recently used was Captain Jack Sparrow pulling a piece of Cursed Aztec Gold from nowhere and temporarily becoming unable to die but weak to all magic. This is where your character's flavor must shine, even if it shines nowhere else in the battle mechanics.
B: ... really fun to use. I tend to try and lean towards "don't bother making them balanced." This is the player character's chance to pull something cool and unique for them. Let them have this.

On a similar note, if you're not letting them regain LP in between every single fight (as I would recommend), they'll have their doubts about busting out their potential "I win" button every single time a fight breaks out, so it's important to make sure the incentive is there to consider using it when the going gets tough. If you're going to let them recharge after every fight, of course, you may want to consider using weaker Limits vs stronger ones.

Other fun ideas:
- Give them Limit Breaks that are somehow tied to already existin Limit Drives. Perhaps you give them a Break that costs no LP free if they're in a specific Drive, but ends the Drive immediately. Almost every Limit Call I've created has its own Limit Break or Drive, which drains its SP (With Breaks immediately reducing the SP to 0 and increasing the effect of the Break based on how much SP was left, and Drives simply draining SP at a faster rate while active.).

- Mess with duration. The baseline for Drive length is 3 Rounds. You can choose to make this longer or shorter based on the exact power of the Drive. You can also give the player conditions they can fulfill to reset their Drive length or restore SP or such. In the play-by-post quest that spawned KHT, I gave Riku Dark-Knight-esque Drives that would drain his HP every few turns, instead of giving the Drives specific lengths, and gave Sora a Drive that he could recharge every time he used a specific Command. This gets pretty ridiculous pretty fast, but can be loads of fun.Ah okay. I wasn't sure how to deal with it so I wound up messing around with a system for making traditional KH2 drives that granted increasing power with how much LP was spent at once to start the drive form.. Duration was one of the things I was having issue with deciding.

JamestheFox
2018-03-23, 05:23 PM
Ah okay. I wasn't sure how to deal with it so I wound up messing around with a system for making traditional KH2 drives that granted increasing power with how much LP was spent at once to start the drive form.. Duration was one of the things I was having issue with deciding.

Spending more than one LP to enhance a Limit is also a perfectly acceptable idea. I actually quite like it, in fact. Also note that Limits don't have to be static - they can be made stronger later (or weaker, but I don't recommend that unless it really is just shattering the game experience for everyone).

Maybe if when I make GM guide sections for the manual, I'll add that to the Limits section as an example.

Here's a few other Examples I've been using, myself:

Sfumato
Limit Drive
Infinite duration, but Riku loses 5 HP every 3 Rounds
Riku lets the darkness flow about him as a thick smoke, obscuring him from attackers. Riku may perform a single free Dodge Roll (or Dodge Roll +) in reaction to the first three attacks made against him each Round. Anyone without a Dark Immunity or Absorb effect are treated as Blinded while within Close Range of Riku.

From KHVD, the Hive Mind Roleplay/"Forum Quest" that spawned KHT. Most to all of Riku's Limits, save his initial one, are centered around his use of Darkness. I honestly have considered increasing the HP loss to 5 HP every Round (vs every 3 Rounds), but it suits his build and fits his ever-so-slow fall into the Darkness. Later, if and when the players controlling Sora can get him on his canon route, or such, he may develop light-aligned abilities as well.

Sealing Flame
Limit Break
Tasuke slaps the opponent with a special sealing tag. Perform a single attack on an opponent, dealing double damage (before or after DEF, Player's Choice). This attack does Fire Element damage, and if the opponent has over 4 more points of Darkness than Light in their Heart, they are afflicted with Silence3.

Used by Tasuke, a character one of my testers brought in from his Exalted campaigns. As a combat Limit, I actually feel this one to be fairly weaksauce, in retrospect. Alas, he currently has quite the testing group, so it's a little late to realize this.

Peer to Peer
Limit Drive
3 Rounds
Select an allied target, and one of ATK, DEF, or MAG. Add half of your target's stat to your stat, and add half of your stat to their stat. For example, you may select MAG, boosting your MAG by half of your target's pre-Limit MAG and boosting your target's MAG by half of your pre-Limit MAG.

Used by a reality-hacking (and regular-hacking) lass by the pseudonym of Netcat, this makes her a powerful support unit for her allies, and at least in name fits in with her character. I admittedly could and should properly explain what exactly she's doing.

I could and probably should also reclassify this as a Duo Drive, vs a standard Limit Drive - it affects both herself and one of her allies.

Black Fang
Limit Break
The Shadow Dragon unleashes its most devastating power. Select a single target within Close Range, and reduce the Shadow Dragon's SP (or MP if it is not a Summon) to 0. Roll 1d6 for every five levels the Shadow Dragon has, and add 1 to the combined result for every 25% of its SP it lost to use this attack (for example, if it still had 83% of its max SP when it used Black Fang, add 3 to the results of the dice roll). If the results exceed the level of the target, the Shadow Dragon annihilates them, inflicting Instant KO. If the foe is immune to Instant KO, instead deal damage equal to three times the Shadow Dragon's LVL, bypassing DEF.

A Summon's Limit, this time. One of my players is currently controlling what can simply be summed up as "Alternate Universe Golbez," and his Limit is to summon The Shadow Dragon, a trademark companion of his in FFIV. My general rule for a Summon's Limits is that the Limit should always be intertwined with their remaining time on the battlefield. Breaks should desummon them, but be stronger the sooner you use them, while Limit Drives should drain additional SP from them over time. If I were to buff this one, I might change the fail clause to "If the foe is immune to Instant KO or if the results do not exceed the level of the target, instead deal damage equal to three times your roll.." That said, around LVL 15 (3d6), 9-108 Damage is no small thing, and can spell the end for a lot of enemies, even removing the "Bypassing DEF" effect.

I should also note that Limit Calls or Drives which require their own Character Sheet can either directly level up with their user, or simply catch up every few predetermined levels (such as every 5th Level).

DualShadow
2018-03-25, 12:07 AM
Is it normal that the links gives me errors in the spreads sheets for the spells and abilities?

Blackjackg
2018-04-02, 06:58 PM
I ran a Kingdom Hearts-based game for about a year on a gently-modified Fate Core system. It worked pretty well for simulating the aspects of the game that interested me, but I did leave out Gummi Ship travel and summons. The one real downside was that it was a little too rules-light for frequent combat. I'm still working on ways to bring a little more complexity to battle for the next time I run that game, and I may borrow a few ideas from you here.

I expect you're past the point of wanting big picture advice on this, but for what it's worth it seems to me like you're erring in the opposite direction (like a lot of video game-to-pen and paper ports do, actually) and creating a system that is a little too finicky and rules-heavy. From my read of the rules, it seems like the game would tend to crawl along at times with administration and calculations. Probably not too bad for games-by-post, but a potential problem for realtime games. If it were me, I'd be looking for ways to simplify the record-keeping and number-crunching, even if it means leaning away from a faithful recreation of the video game experience.

That being said, I appreciate a lot of what you have going on here. This is clearly a labor of love and you've put a ton of thought into making it work. I think an abbreviated skill system is a wise choice and the ones you've chosen make a lot of sense for the game. I do agree with one of the previous commenters that a few more utility skills might be a good idea. Keeping them tight and concise makes sense, but when you use the same skill for climbing walls as for performing surgery, that may be taking it a little too far. Even just having a few basic skills and giving players the option of choosing their own specialties could cover that gap.

I like the idea of Dispositions, but I wish your system document had some examples of what they might look like and how they work (I suppose it's possible that they're in there but I've just missed them). Earning new dispositions as a result of roleplay is a cool idea, but I share the concern of the former poster who pointed out that when the GM-granted options are numerically superior to the player-selected ones, it kind of invalidates that part of the character generation process. When I work this kind of system in my own games, I try to introduce elements that give variety without necessarily inherent enhancement. Maybe the GM could grant players dispositions that grant different bonuses, but the actual number of the bonuses is something that increases with character advancement? Just a thought.

As a minor formatting note, on page 20 in the No Affinity table, your options are "Below 12," "Above 11" and "Above 15," which is an unusual and slightly awkward way to represent those numbers. It would be more typical to list them as "0 to 11," "12 to 15" and "16 or higher" or something similar.

Anyway, I know I'm throwing out suggestions, but overall I think what you have here is great, and clearly the result of a lot of hard work. Thank you for sharing your ideas!

Ruxeth
2018-06-28, 02:59 PM
Hey, love this game so far. I'm running a game with a friend of mine, but we are wondering how the damage on commands work. On the command list it shows a modifier (whether its adding or whatever isnt explained) but when the command is put in the sheet it gives a number that's not even close. (I have an attack stat of 15, but jump says I do 73 damage) how does commands work?

JamestheFox
2018-06-29, 07:17 PM
Apologies for the late responses.

Lately, I've been working on a fairly large update to KHT, big enough that it required me to massively change several aspects of various sheets we use. I'm tentatively calling it KHT 3.0. I'll be releasing this update as soon as it's ready to go.

There are a number of new features and countless attempts at tweaking the balance of the game. I'll talk more about them soon, but first, questions and answers.

I expect you're past the point of wanting big picture advice on this, but for what it's worth it seems to me like you're erring in the opposite direction (like a lot of video game-to-pen and paper ports do, actually) and creating a system that is a little too finicky and rules-heavy. From my read of the rules, it seems like the game would tend to crawl along at times with administration and calculations. Probably not too bad for games-by-post, but a potential problem for realtime games. If it were me, I'd be looking for ways to simplify the record-keeping and number-crunching, even if it means leaning away from a faithful recreation of the video game experience.

I will admit, yes, it's a lot of bookkeeping, and not very good for traditional pen and paper. At all. There is a Google Docs character sheet that does most to all of the calculations for you (and even more of them when 3.0 hits), and it's fairly indispensable. As the game sits, I would never, ever, ever play this nightmare of a game without something capable of easily navigating and manipulating Google Sheets on hand. For me that's fine, because that's how I prefer my tabletops. But not everyone likes that, and I have resigned myself to that.

Utility Skills

One of the additions to 3.0 is what I'm calling the "Talent Stat" system. As opposed to building a massive list of skills that fit across genres and universes and a wide variety of professions, you instead build your own by combining two Movement Stats (or in some cases, even other Talent Stats). The crux of the idea is that you build the talents your character and your character alone have.

If you have a Talent Stat that is relevant to the situation at hand, the Difficulty of the Movement Challenge is reduced significantly compared to if you just tried to use one of the generic Movement Stats.

For example: Say I am playing a trained doctor, and made "Medical Journal Knowledge" out of Investigate and Calm, and ended up having to determine whether or not something is, in fact, lupus (and what it is if it's not), I can roll Medical Journal Knowledge instead of Investigate. Since my Talent matches the situation exactly and specifically, my GM dictates that the Movement Challenge is a solid Rank 3 Medical Journal Knowledge Challenge, vs the Rank 6 Investigate Challenge my non-doctor friend has to deal with, or the Rank 5 Random Trivia Challenge my other non-doctor friend has to roll with his Talent.

I like the idea of Dispositions, but I wish your system document had some examples of what they might look like and how they work (I suppose it's possible that they're in there but I've just missed them). Earning new dispositions as a result of roleplay is a cool idea, but I share the concern of the former poster who pointed out that when the GM-granted options are numerically superior to the player-selected ones, it kind of invalidates that part of the character generation process. When I work this kind of system in my own games, I try to introduce elements that give variety without necessarily inherent enhancement. Maybe the GM could grant players dispositions that grant different bonuses, but the actual number of the bonuses is something that increases with character advancement? Just a thought.

I'll make sure to add some solid examples and explanation in the new Manual. It's been needed, just hasn't gotten done. Dispositions are a fairly small powerup in 2.0. About 1-5 stat points, plus any commands/spells/abilities. The effect does double at LVL 100, but that is a long, long way off.

In 3.0, the potency of the Disposition is multiplied by your LVL/20, rounded down, minimum 1. So a +1 to ATK becomes +2 at LVL 40, +3 at LVL 60, +4 at LVL 80, and +5 at LVL 100. The base potency of your Disposition's boost can range from -3 (meaning it reduces the stat) to 3, with a maximum net boost of 5.

Thus, the highest net boost Dispositions can give in 3.0 is 25 points at LVL 100, spread across all stats. Which isn't that much. Synthesis Gear can go pretty high itself, and there are a solid 99 points to put into your stats via LVL Up*.

*Assuming you don't revert your character to 1 and continue with a chunk of your Level Up stats retained as Plot Rewards (yes that's a feature detailed in the manual), which makes the amount of points gained via LVL Ups effectively infinite...

As a minor formatting note, on page 20 in the No Affinity table, your options are "Below 12," "Above 11" and "Above 15," which is an unusual and slightly awkward way to represent those numbers. It would be more typical to list them as "0 to 11," "12 to 15" and "16 or higher" or something similar.

I wanna thank you for the suggestion, it and a lot of other things got added a long time ago thanks to your in-doc suggestion, I really should poke my head in here more often.

Is it normal that the links gives me errors in the spreads sheets for the spells and abilities?

Hmm. Those links may lead to old sheets that no longer exist. I'll try and fix them with the latest pre-3.0 stuff.

Hey, love this game so far. I'm running a game with a friend of mine, but we are wondering how the damage on commands work. On the command list it shows a modifier (whether its adding or whatever isnt explained) but when the command is put in the sheet it gives a number that's not even close. (I have an attack stat of 15, but jump says I do 73 damage) how does commands work?

Commands take your ATK, and add to it by an amount equal to the Command's Damage Boost multiplied by a tenth of your level. Not sure how you got Jump to exactly 73 damage with 15 ATK, though. You must have been at about LVL 20, though, I'm guessing. At 15 ATK and LVL 20, Jump should do 75 damage before DEF.

I'm glad you are enjoying the game. Feel free to let me know if you've got other questions, complaints, things you find that are ridiculously OP, etc. I do have a Skype and a Discord, and the Discord for the play-by-post that inspired and now runs on KHT (https://discord.gg/TQrG9qq) has a Mechanics Discussion Section I'd love to see more talking on. You probably will even get actually timely responses over there!

fultz307
2018-07-31, 05:42 PM
In the Character sheet i noticed that the command list looks up commands in The Ultimate Command List. i notice thats not the list name for the command list provided via link

JamestheFox
2018-08-01, 11:42 AM
In the Character sheet i noticed that the command list looks up commands in The Ultimate Command List. i notice thats not the list name for the command list provided via link

The 2.0 KHT Character sheet actually looks things up from a hidden tab on the doc containing a copy of the command list, which automatically updates itself when its source, the list provided in the link, is updated.

Likewise, KHT 3.0's char sheets will have a hidden copy of the 3.0 Ultimate Command List, Ultimate Ability List, etc., which will pull from a 3.0 index containing all such content.

JamestheFox
2019-03-06, 06:40 PM
Hello again, everyone, I hope you're doing well. Hope you're enjoying KH3. Thought now would be as good a time as any to post the updated version of KHT. You'll find it on the first post of this thread! I'm considering this 3.0, and it features a lot of new additions:

New Commands, Spells, and Abilities
New Talent Stats to further your character definition
A new integrated option to switch your Character sheet between a high-contrast dark version, and the classic edition
Slight changes to character creation
New Bestiary
The Gummi Ship

And a fair bit more.

Of course, this isn't the end, and I encourage you to send me questions and such. I'm available on Discord, through this link. (https://discord.gg/VERZ4YA) I'm always open to constructive criticism - goodness knows I give enough of it to myself.

I hope to see you there, and hope you enjoy this next step in KHT!

Maat Mons
2019-03-09, 09:45 PM
Okay, well, my first criticism is that it really should be possible to glean a few basic bits of information with far less searching than I've already done.

From what I can tell, there exists a mechanism by which an attack might hit, or might not hit. As best I can tell, this is based on Attack, Defense, and a d8 roll. But how does it work? Where in this PDF might I look to find that answer? I still have no idea after fully reading "Combat Basics" and skimming all other chapters.

I was able to find mention of what determines the damage of spells. I couldn't find any equivalent for other attacks. But the formula I found doesn't factor in Defense at all. And the description of Defense suggests it would. Is Defense purely used to make attacks miss altogether? Or does it also have its original function from the game, reducing damage?

Is there any particular reason not to use the damage formula from the games? If I recall, it was C * max ( Attack - Defense , X ) , with C depending on the particular attack, and X depending on whether the target was a player character or an NPC.

JamestheFox
2019-03-10, 09:30 AM
Okay, well, my first criticism is that it really should be possible to glean a few basic bits of information with far less searching than I've already done.

From what I can tell, there exists a mechanism by which an attack might hit, or might not hit. As best I can tell, this is based on Attack, Defense, and a d8 roll. But how does it work? Where in this PDF might I look to find that answer? I still have no idea after fully reading "Combat Basics" and skimming all other chapters.

No offense meant, but you must have missed Page 34, because right at the top, how you hit or miss is explained. For any kind of attack, make a 1d8 Accuracy roll, 2 or higher hits (unless a Command's effect says otherwise). It used to be 3 or higher, but exhaustive testing resulted in a disruptive number of misses, even without things like Dodge Roll and Guard.


I was able to find mention of what determines the damage of spells. I couldn't find any equivalent for other attacks. But the formula I found doesn't factor in Defense at all. And the description of Defense suggests it would. Is Defense purely used to make attacks miss altogether? Or does it also have its original function from the game, reducing damage?

Is there any particular reason not to use the damage formula from the games? If I recall, it was C * max ( Attack - Defense , X ) , with C depending on the particular attack, and X depending on whether the target was a player character or an NPC.

Page 15, in the description of Commands, is the description for Command damage, right above the page describing Spells and their damage.

Defense is applied to damage to reduce it, yes. It has no say on whether someone hits you or not (unless you're using Guard and have enough DEF to outstrip their damage).

This all said, I'll add a few more instances of all of this info to make finding it easier.

As far as damage formulas go, I saw no reason to go poking around into the game code for each and every game to find the damage formula when I could keep it relatively simple. That said...
C: Commands and Spells have different ways of calculating their damage.
Attack: is the base upon which Commands get stronger. Magic does similar things to Spells.
Defense: is Defense.
X: I saw and still see no reason to modify damage based entirely on whether someone is a PC or not.

Thank you for your feedback!

Maat Mons
2019-03-10, 05:02 PM
Okay, so there exists a mechanism to determine whether attacks hit or miss, but it is in no way tied to the skill level of the attacker, nor the skill level of the defender. It's based only on range and other circumstantial considerations.



I don't really agree with the decision to multiply damage before subtracting defense. Multiplying damage after subtracting defense is what the actual games did. And it results in defense having a consistent degree of usefulness, regardless of whether damage is coming in as one big chunk, or as many small chunks.

Consider this scenario. Your attack is 100, and your opponent's defense is also 100. Each normal hit in a combo deals 1 point of damage. (That's max ( 100 - 100 , 1 ) .) The combo finisher, however, deals 100 points of damage. (That's max ( 2*100 - 100 , 1 ) .) I don't think the finisher should be 100 times as valuable as each other part of the combo.

This means that, if the statistics of both player and enemy are high, Combo Plus is objectively making the character worse. It's decreasing the chances of dealing finisher damage, in exchange for dealing more regular damage. But with finisher damage and regular damage being that drastically out of scale, it's a terrible trade.

If you instead multiply damage after differencing attack and defense, the finisher is always twice as good as a normal step of the combo, regardless of player and enemy stats.

JamestheFox
2019-03-10, 09:58 PM
Okay, so there exists a mechanism to determine whether attacks hit or miss, but it is in no way tied to the skill level of the attacker, nor the skill level of the defender. It's based only on range and other circumstantial considerations.

To an extent. It falls to the player to make careful use of their limited supply of Dodge/Guard/Reversal rolls per battle (see the relevant Abilities in that Index).


I don't really agree with the decision to multiply damage before subtracting defense. Multiplying damage after subtracting defense is what the actual games did. And it results in defense having a consistent degree of usefulness, regardless of whether damage is coming in as one big chunk, or as many small chunks.

Consider this scenario. Your attack is 100, and your opponent's defense is also 100. Each normal hit in a combo deals 1 point of damage. (That's max ( 100 - 100 , 1 ) .) The combo finisher, however, deals 100 points of damage. (That's max ( 2*100 - 100 , 1 ) .) I don't think the finisher should be 100 times as valuable as each other part of the combo.

This means that, if the statistics of both player and enemy are high, Combo Plus is objectively making the character worse. It's decreasing the chances of dealing finisher damage, in exchange for dealing more regular damage. But with finisher damage and regular damage being that drastically out of scale, it's a terrible trade.

If you instead multiply damage after differencing attack and defense, the finisher is always twice as good as a normal step of the combo, regardless of player and enemy stats.

Regarding your Combo Finisher's multiplicative effect, I will admit I've been on the fence about that as well, and been considering setting most to all multipliers in general as post-DEF, since otherwise you get some ridiculous levels of damage inflation. It's really quite scary. I've also noticed that the vast majority of my playtesters rarely if ever use their basic combos in general, preferring instead to use their Commands and Spells, so I've been considering trying to implement a means to buff non-Finisher steps of a Combo (this has also caused me to not get to see as many situations where a full Combo plays out).

Anyway, thanks for pointing that out. If you would like to get messages to me more quickly and easily I do have a Discord, as mentioned in previous posts and on the manual.

QuadraticGish
2019-03-11, 09:41 AM
To an extent. It falls to the player to make careful use of their limited supply of Dodge/Guard/Reversal rolls per battle (see the relevant Abilities in that Index).



Regarding your Combo Finisher's multiplicative effect, I will admit I've been on the fence about that as well, and been considering setting most to all multipliers in general as post-DEF, since otherwise you get some ridiculous levels of damage inflation. It's really quite scary. I've also noticed that the vast majority of my playtesters rarely if ever use their basic combos in general, preferring instead to use their Commands and Spells, so I've been considering trying to implement a means to buff non-Finisher steps of a Combo (this has also caused me to not get to see as many situations where a full Combo plays out).

Anyway, thanks for pointing that out. If you would like to get messages to me more quickly and easily I do have a Discord, as mentioned in previous posts and on the manual.

I think one thing that could be done to alleviate that is to make more abilities that modify combos(outside finishers) available; KH2 had plenty of that. On the side I've been tinkering with a system that let's a player take a command as a combo modifier. At the moment, I'm not sure how to deal with multi-hit ability or one that required limits, so I outright barred though. I also have a couple of other house rules I am going to run in conjunction since it seemed like the combo game was too fun to exclude from commands and magic. I haven't had a chance to have some real testing done with others yet sadly due to scheduling issues.

JamestheFox
2019-03-14, 06:31 PM
One thing I've considered lately is redefining and expanding the Combo Finishers Abilities to Combo Modifiers, which have different effects based on whether you use them as part of the normal Combo, or as a Finisher to one.

Beyond that, there is something else that personally bugs me, and I'd like some feedback on it:

Status Effects. I'm considering cutting some of them, combining a few, changing some of how it works. So I'm actively soliciting feedback on how many there are (too many, not enough), how true to KH they are, and how they function in general.

JamestheFox
2019-03-19, 08:40 AM
Quick update: I'm currently compiling Patch Notes/A To Do List for KHT content. You can find that here (https://drive.google.com/drive/u/0/folders/1Ls_yBdFh9IMduVaeGLtRUgf4hrrpb79g), along with drafts of any changes I've already put together but not implemented into KHT itself.

Feedback is of course appreciated.