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mabriss lethe
2007-05-29, 12:41 PM
"Is there sorcery invested in that blade of yours?"

"Not as investment is commonly known. The power of Grief lies in the focused intent in its creation. The sword demands a singular will in its wielder. With such a will, it cannot be defeated."

"And have you that singular will?"

"Had I, human, this would not be your last day this side of Hood's gate."

-Cutter and Darist, House of Chains by Steven Erikson

This little exchange set my mind aflame. A magical weapon with powers that increase or decrease based on the strength of will the weilder posesses.

Will-forged weapons

A will-forged weapon is an ancient relic of forgotten magic. Its power can potentially dwarf that of more modern forms of magical investiture. All it requires is someone with the strength of will necessary to weild it. All Will-forged weapons have some common traits. All are large, two handed affairs, Greatclubs, Bastard and greatswords, greataxes, scythes, and various polearms. Whether this was some sort of requirement for this odd sort of magical enhancemnt or a matter of ancient tastes is unknown. Nor has the method of their creation survived the passage of time.

The Test of Wills:
When the bearer first takes up a will-forged weapon with the intent to use it, the weapon resists. It forces the PC to succeed on a will save with a DC of 20. Failure means that the weapon remains a simple +1 weapon of its type. Succeeding at the save is the first step to unlocking the weapon's true nature. This test can be made once per day by the PC. This test of wills has to be made to improve the weapon every time the character's will save bonus would increase to a point where new powers would be unlocked. Failure on secondary saves doesn't negate the old power level, merely halts the forward progression of power

*I know the DC should, by all rights, increase for the secondary saves, I just haven't figured out how much it should increase yet.


Creating Will-forged weapons:
Calculate the willforged blade's powers using all bonuses to will saves that the character recieves from race, ability scores, class level, class features, feats, or epic progression. Only bonuses that function under all circumstances apply. (ex: +1 to will saves is acceptable, +1 to will saves vs. magic is not.)Magical enhancements to saving throws from spells, items or other similar sources do not effect access to a willforged blade's powers.

All listed abilities on the table below are chosen in advance by the DM

Table: Will-forged weapon enhancement progression
{table]Total Will save bonus|Effect
0-1|+1 enhancement, Nigh unbreakable
2-3|+2 total enhancement
4-5|+3 total enhancement, bonus feat
6-7|+4 total enhancement
8-9|+5 total enhancement
10-11| +6 total enhancement, bonus feat
12-13|+7 total enhancement
14-15|+8 total enhancement
16-17|+9 total enhancement, bonus feat
18+|+10 total enhancement, bonus feats continue to accrue at +20 and every +5 increment thereafter[/table]


Enhancement bonus: As per a normal magical weapon, this is the total bonus available to the weapon. This bonus can be split up between enhancement and special qualities It must always have at least a +1 enhancement bonus to gain special qualities. This bonus freezes at +10 and enhancement itself cannot exceed +5 (all else must be invested in special qualities).

Nigh Unbreakable: Willforged weapons gain an additional bonus to hardness equal to the character's total will save bonus, and twice that bonus to the item's HP.

Bonus Feat: When weilding the willforged weapon, the character gains the use of these feats, most are drawn from the fighter list, though rarely other feats are available as well.

Poppatomus
2007-05-29, 05:46 PM
Very, very cool. Do you think the idea could work with other abilities or stats as well, to different effects? Or combinations of Saves? (Fort+will = Martyr's weapons; Ref + Will = Hatred Weapons)


When powerful wielders of will forged weapons perish with blade in hand a part of their essence is sometimes captured and encorporated into the magics that power the item. In the future, the weapon no longer simply yields its power to the strong, but bends their will to its own.

One such type is the Martyr's weapon, created when a character perishes in the defense of the innocent or in hopeless battle with overpowering evil. With a martyr's weapon at the first check where the character would normally get use of a bonus feat they instead must make a fort save. If they fail the fort save they get no benefit and weapon progression ceases (as though they failed the will save)

If they succeed they gain a bonus to the damage of their first successful melee hit equal to the amount of damage taken in the prior round. This check is made each time a bonus feat would be taken. For each additional successful check made they gain a bonus multiplier to this bonus, increasing by .5 at each increment (x1, x1.5, x2, x2.5...) but also reduce their armor bonus to AC by 2.

aaron_the_cow
2007-05-29, 06:20 PM
this is totaly asome...
totaly...

DracoDei
2007-05-29, 07:54 PM
For characters with multiple attacks per round, inflicting bonus damage equal to amount taken previous round is too much probably. Make it a half or a third I would say.

Poppatomus
2007-05-29, 08:17 PM
For characters with multiple attacks per round, inflicting bonus damage equal to amount taken previous round is too much probably. Make it a half or a third I would say.

Good point, I think I will change it to on their first successful attack.

DracoDei
2007-05-29, 11:23 PM
That is also a workable option I think.

D Knight
2007-05-29, 11:34 PM
WOW! iam going to use this sooner or later but most liky sooner. the idea and its weapon slection is good. with that been said keep up with it

TempusCCK
2007-05-29, 11:37 PM
It's a great concept, but I'd like to see some more diversity in the enhancement progression. Just bonus feats are pretty lame, I think it should have magic powers tied into it's backstory and/or weapon type. Hell, even better, it should develope powers based on the attributes and personality of the character using it.

Like, say you have a character who likes to charge every battle, and does so, the progression of the weapon will allow the character to eventually deal double damage on charges, like a lance, even though it could be a Greatsword.

Or a wizard is wielding a willforged quarterstaff, and he's specialist whatever, well, eventually his interaction with the staff will notice his choice of spells, and it's progression will give him the power to cast spells of his chosen school at a +1 caster level, and the wizard may not even realize it.

Poppatomus
2007-05-29, 11:56 PM
It's a great concept, but I'd like to see some more diversity in the enhancement progression. Just bonus feats are pretty lame, I think it should have magic powers tied into it's backstory and/or weapon type. Hell, even better, it should develope powers based on the attributes and personality of the character using it.

Like, say you have a character who likes to charge every battle, and does so, the progression of the weapon will allow the character to eventually deal double damage on charges, like a lance, even though it could be a Greatsword.

Or a wizard is wielding a willforged quarterstaff, and he's specialist whatever, well, eventually his interaction with the staff will notice his choice of spells, and it's progression will give him the power to cast spells of his chosen school at a +1 caster level, and the wizard may not even realize it.



Well, I think that's what the OP was going for by giving feats. There are plenty of feats that exist that allow the kind of customization you are looking for and, by putting those choices in the hands of the player, it lets them tap the power of the item more directly. It also differentiates the item from a normal intelligent magic item since in addition to the progression it also provides a less obviously "magical" bonus, in the form of feats rather than weapon abilities.

I was trying to create something like the kind of option you're looking for by creating different kinds of weapons, but continuing to tie their powers into making save rolls, getting better at each stage.

Continuing in that vein:

Dispassion's Edge (minor Artifact)

As with all other surviving will forged weapons, the origins of dispassion's edge are shrowded in mystery. However, some see clues in the intricate inlays on it's golden handle and obsidian blade. These etchings appear to tell the story of two lovers, a betrayel, and the cold-blooded revenge of a powerful mage. Whether that is the true story of this blades origin, or merely a reflection of its terrible power, is unknown.

The blade behaves like a normal will forged shortsword except that any one capable of casting an arcane spell finds that its use comes naturally to their hands and are considered profficient. In addition to the normal progression of a willforged blade, every two levels of progression allows the wielder to make an INT check against DC X. If they pass they cast any spell that harms a single target as though 1 caster level higher than normal, and a single target of the opposite gender as 2 levels higher than normal.

Additionally, at every stage of progression where the blade would normally grant a bonus feat a successuful INT check allows the character to store one single target harmful spell of that progression level or lower within the blade itself, triggering on a successfully melee attack or touch attack. However, every discharge of this ability requires another Will save at DC X+spell level. If that save is failed the character gains one point of int, but has their attitude towards a random, non-hostile intelligent creature they currently consider an ally changed to hostile, and feel the need to harm that creature as though under the compulsion of Gaes.

mabriss lethe
2007-05-30, 12:17 PM
Very, very cool. Do you think the idea could work with other abilities or stats as well, to different effects? Or combinations of Saves? (Fort+will = Martyr's weapons; Ref + Will = Hatred Weapons)


If you can think of a reasonable way to incorporate it, sure. I thought about using the same process with armor, but relying on fort saves. As for using a combination of saves, I'd do one of two things.
1. Up the save DC for the Test of wills
2. Allow the use of which ever save is highest, but not both at once.


It's a great concept, but I'd like to see some more diversity in the enhancement progression. Just bonus feats are pretty lame, I think it should have magic powers tied into it's backstory and/or weapon type. Hell, even better, it should develope powers based on the attributes and personality of the character using it.

Thanks. I figured it was a good simple start. A framework if you will. I wanted to add in some more unique alternatives, but I figured that most GMs interested in using them would come to the same conclusion and make up their own. Would some sort of idiosycratic ability for every 10 points of save bonus sound about right? or a single ability that grows stronger at the same rate?

Poppatomus
2007-05-30, 04:18 PM
If you can think of a reasonable way to incorporate it, sure. I thought about using the same process with armor, but relying on fort saves. As for using a combination of saves, I'd do one of two things.
1. Up the save DC for the Test of wills
2. Allow the use of which ever save is highest, but not both at once.


what do you think about the way I tried to do it above? I like the idea of taking the higher save. why not both at once?



Thanks. I figured it was a good simple start. A framework if you will. I wanted to add in some more unique alternatives, but I figured that most GMs interested in using them would come to the same conclusion and make up their own. Would some sort of idiosycratic ability for every 10 points of save bonus sound about right? or a single ability that grows stronger at the same rate?

Love the framework and think that you're better off going with idiosyncratic bonuses every X amount of progression. I think the feat markers seem like the natural juncture. But it should also depend on the weapon.

mabriss lethe
2007-05-31, 12:59 AM
Guardian's Tears, A will forged weapon

You see a large, two-handed sword lying discarded in a mass of cobwebs and debris. What little is visible beneath the filth implies a roughly forged, yet strikingly beautiful weapon. At the merest suggestion of a touch, the ancient wood and leather scabbard crumbles to dust, revealing a wide, single edged blade forged of black iron, with the deep gouges of hammer marks still clearly visible. A pattern of what appears to be raw copper is spattered along the length of the blade like teardrops on vellum. Something cold and foreboding seems to radiate from the blade even before you touch it.


Some whisper that this baleful blade was forged in the coldest pits of the damned by Kyton smiths, crafted for a devilish general in a war against other fiends. Some say barbarians first blooded the blade in icy wastes far to the north. A dozen other tales about the blade have sprung up as well. One thing is certain. No one knows the origin of the sword now known as The Guardian's Tears.

The Guardian's Tears is a massive two handed cold iron greatsword, last known to have been wielded by Hrathmyr, the champion of a king in his defense when the palace fell to invaders centuries ago. He failed, though. His charge slain by a hail of arrows before his very eyes. It's said that Hrathmyr lost his mind. With tears streaming from his face, he slew each and every invader before succumbing to his many wounds. Those tears spattered along the length of the blade, burning bright where they struck. Others say that it wasn't his wounds that finally took Hrathmyr's life, but his own hand. After seeing the death he'd dealt, he was so horrified that he impaled himself upon his own blade. Rumors say that several have come to posses the blade after Hrathmyr's demise. It is unknown who they are or how they met their end.

Guardian's Tears
{table]Total Will Bonus|Powers
0-1|+1 Cold Iron Greatsword, Nigh Unbreakable,
2-3|+1 defending
4-5|+2 defending, Bonus feat:see list
6-7|+2 Defending Keen
8-9|+3 Defending Keen
10-11|+3 defending keen, frost, Bonus Feat(2): see list, Hrathmyr's Anguish
12-13|+4 defending keen, frost
14-15|+4 Defending, Keen, frost, Mighty Cleaving,
16-17|+4 Defending, Keen, Icy Burst, Mighty Cleaving, Bonus Feat(3): see list
18-19|+5 Defending, keen, Icy Burst, Mighty Cleave
20+|Bonus Feats(4): see list, Hrathmyr's Anguish 2/day [/table]

Nigh unbreakable: All will forged weapons are by their very nature almost impossible to destroy. They gain a bonus to their hardness equal to the total will save bonus of the wielder and gain twice that number as a bonus to the item's hit points.

Bonus Feats: At certain points, the wielder of Guardian's Tears chooses a bonus feat. These feats are only applicable while wielding Guardian's Tears. Once this feat is chosen, it cannot be changed. If the character does not meet the prerequisites of the feat, They must choose another in its stead. After the bonus increases beyond +20 additional bonus feats are selected at every interval of 5 (25, 30, 35 etc.) The feats must be chosen from the following list: Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, combat expertise, improved disarm, Improved trip Dodge Mobility, spring attack, Improved initiative. endurance, diehard, weapon focus*, weapon finesse**

*Any Weapon specific feat only functions for this individual weapon
** Weapon Finesse may be chosen as a bonus feat for all Will forged weapons, even if the weapon would not normally benefit from this feat.
NOTE: This list of feats is just the handful that popped off the top of my head. There are a handful more that I want to add to the list.

Hrathmyr's Anguish: The blade still carries the echo of blinding grief for Hrathmyr's loss or perhaps this power was merely the cause of it. Once per day, once this power is unlocked, the character may enter a rage. This rage follows the same rules as a normal barbarian's rage, but does not stack with any feats that improve or alter a barbarian's rage. While raging, streams of shining coppery tears streak down the wielder's face. The wielder may use this power once per day for every 10 points of will save bonus he possesses.

puppyavenger
2007-06-03, 01:30 PM
just wondering, shoulde't it be a cha check istead of a will save?

My reaso is saves represent stopping somethig while checks represet doiing something, ad charisma meas stregth of will so it would be a charisma check.

mabriss lethe
2007-06-03, 02:38 PM
theoretically, it could be a cha check(maybe have to mess around with some DCs..but not really an issue), but the flavor I had in mind involves what you could call an "invasive bond" between the wielder and the weapon. Will save progression to determine its powers felt right to me. No other reason I can coherently name at the moment. (too many hours spent slaving in a kitchen will do that to a man.) I actually plan on revamping the idea a bit when I have the time. There are some things I want to try out first.

Keledrath
2007-06-05, 06:25 AM
Very, very cool. Do you think the idea could work with other abilities or stats as well, to different effects? Or combinations of Saves? (Fort+will = Martyr's weapons; Ref + Will = Hatred Weapons)

While we're doing that, what about the Survivor's weapons (Reflex+Fortitude)?