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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Hellfire Cleric Domain (WIP) - [PEACH]



DracoKnight
2015-12-10, 03:56 PM
I was trying to make a Cleric who use the powers of the Nine Hells and there wasn't any existing domain that really does that - and yes, I realize that you can worship a god (like Asmodeus) who lives in the Nine Hells and be one of the domains in their portfolio, but it wasn't working for the character. So here's the Hellfire Cleric (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1x8TfDUhepw-e-YVdlwRZ-fFOx6G59Fo1wxEk3RNz9so/edit?usp=sharing).

I'm having a little bit of trouble coming up with a 17th level ability, so if anyone has a suggestion for that, I would be more than happy to take it into consideration :smallbiggrin:

Ace Jackson
2015-12-10, 04:29 PM
I was trying to make a Cleric who use the powers of the Nine Hells and there wasn't any existing domain that really does that - and yes, I realize that you can worship a god (like Asmodeus) who lives in the Nine Hells and be one of the domains in their portfolio, but it wasn't working for the character. So here's the Hellfire Cleric (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1x8TfDUhepw-e-YVdlwRZ-fFOx6G59Fo1wxEk3RNz9so/edit?usp=sharing).

I'm having a little bit of trouble coming up with a 17th level ability, so if anyone has a suggestion for that, I would be more than happy to take it into consideration :smallbiggrin:

Perhaps a terrain modifying AOE?

"Hell on Earth:
Once per long rest you may call the forces of hell to wreak havoc upon the face of the earth. All terrain within 120 ft of your position is transformed into a hellscape for one minute. Dealing 2d6 fire and 2d6 necrotic damage to all within 60 ft. damage decays to 1d4 of each beyond 60 ft. After 30 seconds damage is only 1d4 of each within 60 ft. and limited to 1 point beyond 60 ft. This damage triggers your Abyssal Step feature."

It certainly provides your hellfire cleric mobility, and will mow down lots of weak enemies quickly. It might not be balanced, it isn't ally friendly, and the text needs work. But that's my wild idea of a suggestion. An AOE of some sort.

DracoKnight
2015-12-10, 04:49 PM
Perhaps a terrain modifying AOE?

"Hell on Earth:
Once per long rest you may call the forces of hell to wreak havoc upon the face of the earth. All terrain within 120 ft of your position is transformed into a hellscape for one minute. Dealing 2d6 fire and 2d6 necrotic damage to all within 60 ft. damage decays to 1d4 of each beyond 60 ft. After 30 seconds damage is only 1d4 of each within 60 ft. and limited to 1 point beyond 60 ft. This damage triggers your Abyssal Step feature."

It certainly provides your hellfire cleric mobility, and will mow down lots of weak enemies quickly. It might not be balanced, it isn't ally friendly, and the text needs work. But that's my wild idea of a suggestion. An AOE of some sort.

I like this. I think I'll use it :smallsmile:

GandalfTheWhite
2015-12-11, 02:45 PM
Huh. This is actually really fun and flavorful. I like it. Honestly, I think the cleric is one of the best classes to make subclasses for, because they're usually very fun and flavorful, and the cleric is honestly powerful enough to satisfy the power-gamer inside me.

All in all, well done. This is an archetype that was missing from the PHB - fighting fire with fire, using the Gods of Hell to fight the powers of Hell. It's kinda like the Warlock in that sense, but this definitely has a more priestly feel, whereas the Warlock can be trapped into becoming what they are.

Requiemforlust
2015-12-11, 02:46 PM
Huh. This is actually really fun and flavorful. I like it. Honestly, I think the cleric is one of the best classes to make subclasses for, because they're usually very fun and flavorful, and the cleric is honestly powerful enough to satisfy the power-gamer inside me.

All in all, well done. This is an archetype that was missing from the PHB - fighting fire with fire, using the Gods of Hell to fight the powers of Hell. It's kinda like the Warlock in that sense, but this definitely has a more priestly feel, whereas the Warlock can be trapped into becoming what they are.

Gotta agree with Gandalf here: I think you've hit it out of the park with the Hellfire Cleric and the Dragon Priest, as far as capturing archetypes that don't really exist in the PHB, and that before now we were kind of lacking.

Dralnu
2015-12-11, 05:01 PM
First off, I love it. I need to preface that because I'm harsh on criticism. Here we go:

Domain Spells: They all look good and very flavorful. Only one spell, Evard's Black Tentacles, stands out to me. I guess you can reflavor it though as the hands of the damned reaching from the ground to grab you or something though. Good.

Tongues of the Inferno: I don't like this seemingly arbitrary stat swap. I feel like its only purpose is to make for better multiclassing. Also I feel like we're overloaded on CHA classes already. I'd take this out.

Bonus Proficiency: Fine.

Abyssal Step: Seems very situational to me unless I missed something. How often are you taking fire/necrotic damage? Are you doing it to yourself? Probably want to let it happen whenever you take damage, or just melee damage, as that's most often when you'd want a reaction teleport. Then make it used equal to WIS mod.

Infernal Summons: This one is the most controversial. I love the flavor and want this to work. At the same time, fiends have great stats and you're breaking the Concentration rule with summoning. After thinking about it, I think it's solid right where it is. You get an Imp/Quasit servant for an hour to do scouting at level 3, and it will always be excellent as you level. Then at level 6 you get a combat pet with Spined Devil and so forth. 1/3 CL is the magic number I think! Good job.

Improved Abyssal Step: See Abyssal Step concerns.

Divine Strike: Standard.

Hell On Earth: Hmm. This is insanely powerful, moreso than other cleric domains. But it does eat a Channel Divinity. But... I'd still lower that damage, that's crazy.


Alrighty. Love the summoning of fiends. Think Abyssal Step is oddly situational, and Hell On Earth is too strong. Like it a lot though.

DracoKnight
2015-12-11, 05:22 PM
First off, I love it. I need to preface that because I'm harsh on criticism.

I welcome it gladly :smallsmile:


Here we go:

Domain Spells: They all look good and very flavorful. Only one spell, Evard's Black Tentacles, stands out to me. I guess you can reflavor it though as the hands of the damned reaching from the ground to grab you or something though. Good.

That was actually exactly how I was picturing it functioning.


Tongues of the Inferno: I don't like this seemingly arbitrary stat swap. I feel like its only purpose is to make for better multiclassing. Also I feel like we're overloaded on CHA classes already. I'd take this out.

This was actually mainly because Fiends' spellcasting stat is CHA, it actually wasn't to make multiclassing any easier, or anything like that. This was done purely for flavor.


Bonus Proficiency: Fine.

I didn't think it would be a problem.


Abyssal Step: Seems very situational to me unless I missed something. How often are you taking fire/necrotic damage? Are you doing it to yourself? Probably want to let it happen whenever you take damage, or just melee damage, as that's most often when you'd want a reaction teleport. Then make it used equal to WIS mod.

Well, fire damage is the most common damage type in the game, so fairly often. I like the WIS mod restriction (it'll probably be CHA mod).


Infernal Summons: This one is the most controversial. I love the flavor and want this to work. At the same time, fiends have great stats and you're breaking the Concentration rule with summoning. After thinking about it, I think it's solid right where it is. You get an Imp/Quasit servant for an hour to do scouting at level 3, and it will always be excellent as you level. Then at level 6 you get a combat pet with Spined Devil and so forth. 1/3 CL is the magic number I think! Good job.

Thank you :smallbiggrin:
CR 1/3 CL felt right :smallsmile: (After all, it's moon druid's wild shape)


Improved Abyssal Step: See Abyssal Step concerns.

Okays.


Divine Strike: Standard.

Yep.


Hell On Earth: Hmm. This is insanely powerful, moreso than other cleric domains. But it does eat a Channel Divinity. But... I'd still lower that damage, that's crazy.

I'll probably drop it down to 2d6 fire/ 2d6 necrotic.


Alrighty. Love the summoning of fiends. Think Abyssal Step is oddly situational, and Hell On Earth is too strong. Like it a lot though.

Thank you, I'm glad you like it :smallsmile:

weaseldust
2015-12-11, 07:07 PM
I think Infernal Summons is too much as it stands. Conjure Elemental is 5th level, and you take 1 minute to get a CR5 elemental that might turn on you. At level 15, Infernal Summons gets you a CR5 fiend that won't turn on you (and I think is meant to take 1 action - is that right?). So you're getting an effect better than a level 5 spell twice per short rest. At level 18, you're getting an effect better than the level 6 Conjure Fey 3 times per short rest.

I don't think the analogy with wildshape works, because with wildshape you can either be a druid or a bear, but you can't have both present and taking actions at once, and because fiends are much more versatile than beasts of the same CR (due to invisibility, spells, and high intelligence).

My suggestion would just be to allow the Cleric to summon an imp only, and one at a time. That's comparable to the chain pact warlock - the warlock gets all the benefits of a familiar, but the Cleric can summon their imp as an action rather than over the course of an hour. An imp is going to be useful at all levels for scouting and subterfuge.


The only other negative comment I have is that Hex isn't very useful for a Cleric because they only ever get one attack and their damaging cantrip doesn't use an attack roll. I'd suggest False Life instead.

Otherwise, I really like Abyssal Step and Hell on Earth. Can I suggest for the latter that the affected area become permanently cursed in some minor way (the growth of plants and animals is stunted, inhabitants have an increased risk of madness, that kind of thing)?

Dralnu
2015-12-11, 08:09 PM
This was actually mainly because Fiends' spellcasting stat is CHA, it actually wasn't to make multiclassing any easier, or anything like that. This was done purely for flavor.

But the Cleric isn't a fiend, it's a Cleric. The WIS to CHA swap is unnecessary.


Well, fire damage is the most common damage type in the game, so fairly often. I like the WIS mod restriction (it'll probably be CHA mod).

No, bludgeoning / piercing / slashing are the most common damage types (I think bludgeoning is top). Fire is the most common elemental resistance/immunity, and that's not including those 3. I can't think of many fire damaging monsters I've encountered in my 1+ years playing 5e.


Also agree with weaseldust on pretty much everything. I still don't know if Infernal Summons is too good, it's certainly worrisome. Keeping it as just an imp/quasit would be easier to balance.

DracoKnight
2015-12-11, 08:19 PM
But the Cleric isn't a fiend, it's a Cleric. The WIS to CHA swap is unnecessary.

I felt it was more thematic, but no matter. It's WIS once again.


No, bludgeoning / piercing / slashing are the most common damage types (I think bludgeoning is top). Fire is the most common elemental resistance/immunity, and that's not including those 3. I can't think of many fire damaging monsters I've encountered in my 1+ years playing 5e.

Yeah, but I feel if it was one of those types, it would be way too OP. Huh...maybe I've just encountered a lot of them :smalltongue:


Also agree with weaseldust on pretty much everything. I still don't know if Infernal Summons is too good, it's certainly worrisome. Keeping it as just an imp/quasit would be easier to balance.

I added a concentration clause, and a chance for them to attack you.

PoeticDwarf
2015-12-12, 05:12 AM
Cool idea, works good, I like it

Ivellius
2015-12-12, 06:18 PM
Overall I really like this, but "Abyssal Step" should be "Infernal Step"--in D&D cosmology, the Nine Hells and the Abyss are two completely separate and diametrically opposed planes. The Blood War is a thing, after all.

DracoKnight
2015-12-12, 09:41 PM
Overall I really like this, but "Abyssal Step" should be "Infernal Step"--in D&D cosmology, the Nine Hells and the Abyss are two completely separate and diametrically opposed planes. The Blood War is a thing, after all.

Eh, I didn't base it on D&D cosmology, I used the mythos from my own homebrew world :smalltongue:

EDIT: I had created a "Nine Hells" before I knew that D&D had a place called the Nine Hells.

GandalfTheWhite
2015-12-14, 03:55 PM
Looks good. I think you're done with this one. :smallsmile:

SterlingWren
2015-12-18, 03:17 AM
I say, well done!

DracoKnight
2015-12-20, 04:05 PM
Are there any further thoughts on this, or can I release it to my players?