Gun Mage or Magitech gunner

[Redfil09]

After reading a few ideas about the Gunslinger or Gun Mage, I realized that most people don't like to mix gunpower in a High Fantasy campaign, which makes sense in a way, in a world like Eberron for instance, magic is technology, there would be no need, to develop, something so complicated. So I was thinking about a arcane gun, similar to the Element Gun that Starlord carries on the Guardians of the Galaxy! However I'm kinda new to the whole, homebrewing and creating new classes or sub classes. So could it be possible to have a Class or sub class that makes use of a gun like that? Shooting elemental spells that increases in level, with the character!
Possibly work with charges, like a wand but carrying different spells?
Since I've no idea where to start I was hoping someone could give me a hand in this...

[RazDelacroix]

Hey there! Welcome to one of the most fun/headachey-inducing bits of D&D. Homebrewing! To begin with, let me just say that I for one love mixing high-fantasy with whatever-the-bloomin-hells-I-want. If we want dragons to reside upon mountaintop castles armed with snarky walking cannons than let's do it! But back to your questions.

First place to begin with is the question of, 'Do I really need new game mechanics for what I want?' If it's not in the DM's guide perhaps you can find it in the official Unearthed Arcana articles with free to download supplements that are of the 'Here's a nice idea but we're still sketchy on it' ideas.

When I personally feel lazy, I don't alter rules. I alter fluffy flavor. For example...

Already arcane classes can use arcane foci (orbs, staves, and wands) for casting their spells. You could reflavor these as pistols, rifles, and tactical-magic-buttonO'doom as needed. Instead of having the listed required components for spells, you alter those requirements for particular spell-shells that might either be common to work with or inordinately expensive (I'm looking at you RAISE DEAD!).

You could even have certain magic items like scrolls worked out as specially preserved spell shells that could be either used as intended or studied to open up new spells for wizards.

Please note that this whole idea of yours is not necessarily confined to arcane classes. The holy-gun-wielding paladin is a fun idea to play with as well!

[tsj]

There are many many gun mage home brew classes online for dnd 3.5... some as prestige classes and others as regular classes.

Some of the classes might inspire you when creating a class for 5e :)

I am currently DM'Ing a 3.5e game where one of my players play a tibbit warmage that through the use of DM approved feats, have gained gun mage like powers with her warmage spells and her DM created gun sword (I think the concept of a sword with a gun I'm the middle is cool, It is not the FF kind since this sword can both chop and shoot)

The end result? An incredible cool PC :)

For me, a gun mage and a gun sword goes hand in hand :)

I have been thinking about a variant gun sword... a
lightsaber type blade with a Lazer rifle in the middle.

[Amnoriath]

After reading a few ideas about the Gunslinger or Gun Mage, I realized that most people don't like to mix gunpower in a High Fantasy campaign, which makes sense in a way, in a world like Eberron for instance, magic is technology, there would be no need, to develop, something so complicated. So I was thinking about a arcane gun, similar to the Element Gun that Starlord carries on the Guardians of the Galaxy! However I'm kinda new to the whole, homebrewing and creating new classes or sub classes. So could it be possible to have a Class or sub class that makes use of a gun like that? Shooting elemental spells that increases in level, with the character!
Possibly work with charges, like a wand but carrying different spells?
Since I've no idea where to start I was hoping someone could give me a hand in this...

Well to make things simple you could just say your gun is your arcane focus and over the course of the campaign by accumulating certain elements it could incrementally become like a legendary item such as a Staff of the Magi with a couple different spells. Mountain Dwarfs are already proficient in medium armor giving yourself a more tech-like look. This way you can choose whatever base caster and sub-class you want your character to be without the headache.

[AeonsShadow]

I happen to find this (http://hedgegm.blogspot.com/2015/02/magic-guns-firearms-modification-in-d.html) while searching for Magic gun stuff myself.

[Mr.Moron]

First place to begin with is the question of, 'Do I really need new game mechanics for what I want?' If it's not in the DM's guide perhaps you can find it in the official Unearthed Arcana articles with free to download supplements that are of the 'Here's a nice idea but we're still sketchy on it' ideas.


This is hardly the place to begin. In fact this question shouldn't even register. It's not factor. The important questions are:

"Do I want new mechanics to for the thing I'm trying to do?"
"Can I provide mechanics that are substantively different than existing ones?"
"Can I provide mechanics that are fun to use as player, manage as GM and work with as another player?"


The officially released materials are not the sacrosanct text of some dogmatic canon. They're a set of tools for playing a game that you can add to or subtract from for any reason. One wouldn't "Need" a revised version of say Paladin or Wizard but such things would make for fine home brew if somebody wanted a different implementation.

imo. The idea of homebrew is not fill gaps where the original creators failed to implement something at all. It's to provide create content that best suits one's own personal tastes and the dynamics of your table. Totally original content that covers new ground can be a part of that, but so can implementing something that already as solutions.


EDIT: To the OP. There are a lot of directions you could go. All of them valid. I think the first design decision to get out of the way is:

Do you want this gun mage thing to stand on it's own for 20 levels be a centeral concept for which there are variants (Base Class)
or
Do you want this gun mage thing to be a tweak to an existing character archetype, that narrowly changes an existing class. (Sub Class).



I personally think the base class would be the way to go, with sub-classes that focus on different gun play styles. If you'd like I could whip up a quick skeleton for you to use as a starting point for something like this.

[AeonsShadow]

*snip*

EDIT: To the OP. There are a lot of directions you could go. All of them valid. I think the first design decision to get out of the way is:

Do you want this gun mage thing to stand on it's own for 20 levels be a centeral concept for which there are variants (Base Class)
or
Do you want this gun mage thing to be a tweak to an existing character archetype, that narrowly changes an existing class. (Sub Class).



I personally think the base class would be the way to go, with sub-classes that focus on different gun play styles. If you'd like I could whip up a quick skeleton for you to use as a starting point for something like this.

I personally think a base class as a halfcaster with variants for pumping out different spells, different guns (pistols with elemental damage, long range rifles with ever increasing crit, shotguns who can shoot two spells at once....)

there is a lot of room to go with this.

[Mr.Moron]

I personally think a base class as a halfcaster with variants for pumping out different spells, different guns (pistols with elemental damage, long range rifles with ever increasing crit, shotguns who can shoot two spells at once....)

there is a lot of room to go with this.

I was roughly thinking half caster with gun types too. Though not that disparate in their function.

[Redfil09]

I agree with the full 20 lvl class being flesh out, my idea was a class with light armor proficiency, perhaps medium, not sure yet! I was also considering the spell point system... the Gun should be bond, to the character meaning no two Gun Mages should have same gun design! But I don't know how to add the elemental spells, to the gun, how to increase with each levels...
So the half caster sounds good, maybe some spells for self buff, and some to debuff to make easier to hit something.

[Mr.Moron]

I agree with the full 20 lvl class being flesh out, my idea was a class with light armor proficiency, perhaps medium, not sure yet! I was also considering the spell point system... the Gun should be bond, to the character meaning no two Gun Mages should have same gun design! But I don't know how to add the elemental spells, to the gun, how to increase with each levels...
So the half caster sounds good, maybe some spells for self buff, and some to debuff to make easier to hit something.

I'd avoid spell points simply because it's a variant of an existing system. If you're going with traditional casting go with traditional casting I think. I might suggest this as a starting point:


Energy Shot: Starting at 2nd level you can prime your weapon(s) to fire energy shots. When you take the attack action, for each Magegun you are wielding you may spend one spell slot. Until the start of your next turn your Magegun(s) now deal 1d6 damage + 1d6 per level of the spell slot spent. The damage dealt is a type of your choice between: Fire, Electric, Cold or Acid.

My thinking here: This is similar to the paladin's smite, but affects all attacks made in around instead of just one. This is less powerful on single attacks but more powerful if both your attacks for the round hit after level 5. That said, unlike with paladin you can't spend the slots after if you've seen things are hit or even a crit. Meaning it could whiff entirely. I think this balances out with the higher overall damage conversion per spell slot (paladins can still spike/nova better by spending multiple slots in a round).

Spell Shot: Starting at 2nd level you can cast a spell as a spell shot. As an action make an attack roll with your Magegun if the attack hits it deals no damage but you may cast a spell as part of the action. You may choose to either cast the spell with them as the target or use their location as the point of origin for the spell, resolving the effects normally from there. If you choose the creature hit as the target any attack rolls made against them as part of the spell automatically hit, and they have disadvantage on saving throws against the spell.


My thinking here:This quite literally lets you shoot spells out of your gun. It gives you some ways to play around with range but puts a second point of failure in front of save-allowing spells. You have to hit first and then they have to fail their save. Even with the granted disadvantage your overall success rate is probably lower unless your facing a creature with much lower AC than saves. I think this is a useful situtional ability when you need a short range spell to go long range but isn't super powerful unless you put stuff like Scoring Ray on their spell list.


EDIT: Note the language on both of these is clumsy and off-the-top of my head. They'd need refinement but should get the point across.

[Amnoriath]

Well before we get ahead of ourselves you did say an Eberron-like, magitech setting. When you make a base class it is assumed that not only do they have something unique and exclusive to them but also has a progression as well as different concepts unique and exclusive to them. So are you saying that in your campaign that only these Gun-mages can have these magical firearms, that only they can advance such technology, and finally that no other class can conceptually fit it either in its founding nor progression? Otherwise lets try to make a sub-class first to see where it goes.

[Redfil09]

I would make it a sub class of something, if there was anything similar. There's no Artificer class yet, and I believe the Wizard sub class is the wrong aproach. Perhaps, the concept its not strong enough to stand as a full class on its own... But yeah, I would consider it being a sub class of the Artificer, one that focus on making only one thing, instead of being a Jack of all trades!

[Amnoriath]

I would make it a sub class of something, if there was anything similar. There's no Artificer class yet, and I believe the Wizard sub class is the wrong aproach. Perhaps, the concept its not strong enough to stand as a full class on its own... But yeah, I would consider it being a sub class of the Artificer, one that focus on making only one thing, instead of being a Jack of all trades!

You could make a PrC. After all that is what WotC did with the Runescribe seeing it as something on its own but not enough breadth to be a full base class. If you believe the Wizard to be the wrong approach you could consider a Ranger. I know iconically it is suppose to be wilderness based but much of what you want as a skirmisher and martially is there. You just need to introduce magical damage, crafting, and more arcane flavor. You could have them select other spells and cantrips which then are further altered by your weapon as a start.

[WarrentheHero]

I would personally make it a Wizard subclass, but I can see a lot of convincing arguments for a full class.

As a subclass, at level 2 I would call it something like:


Gunslinger Savant
When you choose this tradition at 2nd level, you gain proficiency in Spellguns. Whenever you use a Spellgun as your arcane focus to cast a spell with a spell attack, you may use the Spellgun's range instead of the spell's.

Elemental Charge
Starting at 2nd level, you may undergo a 10-minute ritual with a Spellgun to infuse it with elemental energy. This ritual can be done during a short or long rest. At the end of this ritual, choose Cold, Lightning, Fire, or Thunder. You may use your action on your turn to use your Spellgun to make a ranged spell attack against a creature within your Spellgun's range. If you hit, you deal damage of the type you chose and of an amount equal to the Spellgun's specified damage plus your Intelligence Modifier.

Spellguns
A spellgun is a specially crafted artifact, a lethal weapon designed to channel a mage's power into a small, lethal shot. Over the centuries of their existence, a multitude of different varieties have been crafted in order to give casters a wide range of options. Spellguns do not typically have a price, as they are rare enough to not be common and are usually either found or passed down.
A spellgun has a variety of traits. Each Spellgun has a range and a damage value. Also, each Spellgun has a specified number of shots it can fire before needing to be 'reloaded'. Every time it is used to make a ranged spell attack, it uses a Shot. Once it has used the number of Shots noted on the table below, it must be reloaded using a bonus action.



Spellgun
Range
Damage
Shots
Properties


Pistol
40'
d6
6
-


Shotgun
20'
d10
2
Area, Two-Handed


Rifle
80'
d6
4
Two-Handed


Sniper
80'/200'
d8
4
Two-Handed, Long Range



Properties:
Area: This weapon can be fired in an area. When you use this Spellgun, you may choose an area in a 10' cube within range. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw against your spell save DC. A creature takes the weapon's damage plus your Intelligence modifier on a failed save, or half as much on a successful one.
Long Range: This weapon works best at long ranges. When fired at a target in its shorter range, you roll the spell attack at disadvantage. This works in the opposite fashion as ranegs are described in the Player's Handbook.

And then you could add more guns and more features as you wish.

[Redfil09]

Thanks for the ideas, I think it's going to be similar to the Arcane Trickster build, being an arquetype... probably even a Rogue, as well, a daredevil character of wit and daring actions...

[Submortimer]

When I personally feel lazy, I don't alter rules. I alter fluffy flavor. For example...

Already arcane classes can use arcane foci (orbs, staves, and wands) for casting their spells. You could reflavor these as pistols, rifles, and tactical-magic-buttonO'doom as needed. Instead of having the listed required components for spells, you alter those requirements for particular spell-shells that might either be common to work with or inordinately expensive (I'm looking at you RAISE DEAD!).


This can do wonders for getting an idea across without having to make all new mechanics for it, especially when the end result is very similar.

example: I built a custom class, the Warmage (http://middlefingerofvecna.blogspot.com/2015/11/warmage.html). In an upcoming game, I'm going to use that class and alter the flavor of some of the abilities to play a Brotherhood of Steel Knight who was displaced in a teleportation accident. without coming up with any new mechanics, i've reflavored all the cantrips to be tech devices, guns, grenades, and all that. now, granted, this is my own custom class, but I could have easily done the same with Warlock and been more or less happy with it.

[dokugin]

Not really any criticism or help, but I have always wanted to play a wizard with a sniper rifle and cast spells at football field range.

[WarrentheHero]

You could do that with a range increment on the Sniper I presented earlier. Especially with the Spell Sniper feat.