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Jon_Dahl
2016-04-21, 02:48 PM
A not-so-good friend of mine has been ill for years, and he's trying to get a disability pension but with very little luck. Out of sympathy, I have agreed to play with him and with two of his friends tomorrow. We will be playing D&D 3.5 (no need to put this thread on that sub-forum, please) and he will be the DM. His games are just awful. Usually he doesn't have any clue what he is doing, he gets riled for no reason and the DMPCs do everything. I know that I'm going to suffer, just suffer... He is too sick to run any game, and he is even worse as a player, so I wouldn't bother DMing.

Any ideas? I already regret that I agreed to play with him. Last time I did this, I called him the day before and lied that I was sick. I can't do that this time.

OldTrees1
2016-04-21, 02:56 PM
I don't have much confidence in my ability to give accurate advice in cases like this, so please judge carefully what I suggest.


You are doing this out of value for their feelings knowing it will be at the expense of your comfort and enjoyment. I suggest not expecting or even paying attention to your enjoyment/lack thereof during the session. Rather pay attention to their enjoyment. If you are moderately successful at providing enjoyment for them, then afterwards you will be able to enjoy that outcome despite the journey being painful.

Lurkmoar
2016-04-21, 03:01 PM
Are snacks and drinks being provided?

If not, be the guy that brings a 2 liter of something good. Or perhaps of gallon of iced tea or lemonade. Maybe bring some Ritz or Cheeze-Its. Go for the spirit of the game and your friends. Don't thing about it being terrible, your mind will MAKE it terrible. Just try and have a good time. It may suck, but put in a little effort to enjoying it. A good attitude helps.

Good luck.

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-04-21, 03:04 PM
You are doing this out of value for their feelings knowing it will be at the expense of your comfort and enjoyment. I suggest not expecting or even paying attention to your enjoyment/lack thereof during the session. Rather pay attention to their enjoyment. If you are moderately successful at providing enjoyment for them, then afterwards you will be able to enjoy that outcome despite the journey being painful.

Or, in small words: you're friends. Hang out with him. The game is just a thing you do while hanging out.

If you've got that part down, maybe try to find ways to enjoy yourself. Stat your character out so it can support the DMPC's with covering fire or something. Or build a skill monkey that always comes up with slightly ridiculous skill based ways to overcome obstacles (might take a lot of imagination to be fun). If that's the flavor his games have, and you can't change it, make the most of the fun that you can still find in it.

Geddy2112
2016-04-21, 03:16 PM
You can't feel bad if you don't care. Play something stupid or ridiculous that you don't care about. Don't take it seriously, and do your best to enjoy the company outside the game.

And bring booze.

SirBellias
2016-04-21, 03:20 PM
If you know you'll have a bad time, and are going to suffer through it anyways, I'd suggest you pick two random skills, and try to apply them in every situation you can. Pretend it's a logical exercise. "if I have +30 to my use rope skill, what can I NOT do with rope?“
Good luck. Try to focus on the bits that aren't everyone else, while keeping in mind he must get some sort of enjoyment out if it.

PrincessCupcake
2016-04-21, 04:39 PM
You are doing this out of value for their feelings knowing it will be at the expense of your comfort and enjoyment. I suggest not expecting or even paying attention to your enjoyment/lack thereof during the session. Rather pay attention to their enjoyment. If you are moderately successful at providing enjoyment for them, then afterwards you will be able to enjoy that outcome despite the journey being painful.


You can't feel bad if you don't care. Play something stupid or ridiculous that you don't care about. Don't take it seriously, and do your best to enjoy the company outside the game.

And bring booze.

these two have some sage advice. build whatever silly/stupid/useless/insane character you want and let the DMPCS do whatever they want. build a character entirely around making someone else better at their job if you want to feel like you have contributed.

eru001
2016-04-21, 05:01 PM
If the game isn't going to be fun, make it fun. Make a character based on comedy. encourage the others to do the same. Imbibe of the riotous liquor both IG and OOG. Army yourself with a Warhammer of 4th wall smashing, and wear a +2 Lampshade.

the game is as fun as you make it.

Booze and Pizza (or what ever snacks you prefer) will be helpful in this regard

goto124
2016-04-21, 09:15 PM
Enjoy the scenery as you ride the choo-choo trains.

Lots and lots of food. Not sure about alcohol though, if the GM gets drunk it could be a really bad thing...

Mr Beer
2016-04-21, 09:28 PM
If he's a not-so-good friend with a history of creating miserable games, I probably just wouldn't do it. I don't have a great deal of free time, so there's a short list of people in my life who get to make me do something I don't want to do for several hours.

Reltzik
2016-04-21, 11:46 PM
Come up with a character that's workable in combat, dungeons, and so forth.... but is designed first and foremost to be comic relief. Let the DMPCs do everything, support them with buffs and flanks and so on, and don't embrace radical tactics or fancy rules. But make it your goal to leave everyone unable to laugh because they're out of breath from laughing.

Kane0
2016-04-21, 11:56 PM
You're not going to a bad game. You're going to an acquaintance's performance.
Bring drinks and snacks, sit back and enjoy the show company.

The Fury
2016-04-22, 02:47 AM
Snacks seem like a good idea. All problems are less when you have food I guess. Though you mention that he's "too sick to run any game," do you mean that his games tend to have gross content? It's not not the sort of thing that'll put you off your snacks is it?

If you really feel like you should do this and be nice about it, any tips I could offer on how to have fun in a game like that seem really ill-advised. With that disclaimer out of the way, here's some tips on having fun in a poorly run game you definitely should(n't) do!

-Meet with the other players and agree on a party goal that's separate from the main plot. If it's small, asinine, or actually in conflict with the main plot, so much the better.

-Ignore any DMPCs or quest-givers. They don't need the PCs help to prevail, they just need the PCs to look cool. Though if the PCs refuse to interact with them or listen to their conversations, it can never be shown just how witty, attractive and generally awesome they are.

-Interact more with the other PCs. Odds are, they're more interesting and it really cheeses off this kind of DM.

-Address, lean on or break the fourth wall. Like if part of the setting doesn't make any sense, have your character bring this fact up in-character with the other characters.

-See a big obvious magical doodad on a plinth? Pick it up and start messing with it. Worst case scenario is your character dying in a unspectacular way.

goto124
2016-04-22, 03:10 AM
By contrast, do NOT mess up the DM's game. It'll only result in angering your DM into messing with you and the players, until everything is a raging mess of unfun.

You agreed to play with him to make him happy, right? Don't go against that objective. No need to intentionally sow bad seeds.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-22, 08:05 AM
I'm at the game right now and NPCs are having a conversation without the PCs :smallbiggrin:

Winter_Wolf
2016-04-22, 08:28 AM
You're at a live performance of essentially a one man play! I hear that some people actually pay money to see those.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-22, 08:39 AM
You're at a live performance of essentially a one man play! I hear that some people actually pay money to see those.

Now we had suicidal goblins, two of them, attack four heavily-armed men. They were highwaymen, they even said "Your money or your life". Complete suicide.

IntelectPaladin
2016-04-22, 08:57 AM
I sincerely hope that you're friend recovers. (The money, At least.)
It's kind of you to agree to play with him, Considering his reputation.

Now, Considering everything already posted,
Goto124 has what seems like the best tactic, And I agree with the reasoning behind it.

To further the train analogy, There are things you can do while aboard, So to speak.
Point out things you see outside the window,
(E-i commenting on some nice details your pleasantly surprised to see,)
Talking to the other passengers,
(The other players,)
And seeing the view from atop the train.
( Being descriptive of the visuals you're doing.)
Alright, That's all I could think up at the moment. I hope this helps!

And again, I seriously hope that you're friend receives the pension.
Take care, And thank you for reading this.

Segev
2016-04-22, 09:02 AM
I don't have much confidence in my ability to give accurate advice in cases like this, so please judge carefully what I suggest.


You are doing this out of value for their feelings knowing it will be at the expense of your comfort and enjoyment. I suggest not expecting or even paying attention to your enjoyment/lack thereof during the session. Rather pay attention to their enjoyment. If you are moderately successful at providing enjoyment for them, then afterwards you will be able to enjoy that outcome despite the journey being painful.

This is way better advice than I would have given. Well done.



I'm glad, it sounds like, the OP managed to at least enjoy the ride, from his posts during the game.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-22, 09:04 AM
I sincerely hope that you're friend recovers. (The money, At least.)
It's kind of you to agree to play with him, Considering his reputation.

Now, Considering everything already posted,
Goto124 has what seems like the best tactic, And I agree with the reasoning behind it.

To further the train analogy, There are things you can do while aboard, So to speak.
Point out things you see outside the window,
(E-i commenting on some nice details your pleasantly surprised to see,)
Talking to the other passengers,
(The other players,)
And seeing the view from atop the train.
( Being descriptive of the visuals you're doing.)
Alright, That's all I could think up at the moment. I hope this helps!

And again, I seriously hope that you're friend receives the pension.
Take care, And thank you for reading this.

Thank you for writing that, my friend.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-22, 09:33 AM
The game is actually going pretty well! Surprisingly, I have done a lot of studying! Can you believe? When I'm at home, I start to play Firefall or spend time in social media or something like that. Here, I have a PDF open that has study material that I really have to learn, and I have read it over and over again. I think I have finally learned the stuff. Can you believe?

IntelectPaladin
2016-04-22, 10:47 AM
The game is actually going pretty well! Surprisingly, I have done a lot of studying! Can you believe? When I'm at home, I start to play Firefall or spend time in social media or something like that. Here, I have a PDF open that has study material that I really have to learn, and I have read it over and over again. I think I have finally learned the stuff. Can you believe?

I can, actually!
You seem to be having fun,
So I'm glad to have been any help.
Take care, Jon_Dahl, And I hope you have it easy!

Kami2awa
2016-04-22, 11:15 AM
Now we had suicidal goblins, two of them, attack four heavily-armed men. They were highwaymen, they even said "Your money or your life". Complete suicide.

To be fair, this is the sort of behaviour exhibited by computer game guards. "Oh look! Someone who has easily killed hundreds of my comrades and is carrying more weapons than a battleship. Guess I'll take him on with this pistol!"

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-22, 11:54 AM
Everything imploded in the end.

One of the players is my regular player. A nice guy, a very good player. He was trying to use his knowledge skills but the DM refused to acknowledge them. The thing was that the player was trying identify an animal's weaknesses and strengths, but the DM didn't allow that without seeing the animal in question, as the player had merely heard about the animal and had a description of it. Now the problems began: The player said that "Jon_Dahl lets us identify monsters if we hear about them, we don't have to see them!" This irritated the DM beyond belief and I was trying to disappear, really, I just wanted to fade away. They tried to draw me into the argument, but I tried to act silly and make anagrams out of monster names. I was there just to play a little bit and read my study material, not to participate in any rule arguments, but I didn't want to say that.

A little bit later on, the DM decided that some monsters had just surprised us, but he didn't understand what that meant (to be surprised in Pathfinder). He wanted me to tell him, but I said that I don't know. That was ok for a while, but then he started to accuse me of withholding my D&D knowledge and not helping him run the game (I have never run Pathfinder in my life). I didn't say anything, but I did find his words funny and so I laughed. I thought that the situation was pretty comical. It was like the end of the world to him that the PCs were surprised... I don't know... It just felt totally absurd. He insisted that I'm trying to sabotage his game by being quiet. I replied that usually he gets upset when I try to help. And it is true. He just got upset and said that his enthusiasm was killed. Then I left.

P.S. If someone can help me with non-finite nominal dependent clauses, please send me a PM!

RazorChain
2016-04-22, 09:23 PM
Everything imploded in the end.

One of the players is my regular player. A nice guy, a very good player. He was trying to use his knowledge skills but the DM refused to acknowledge them. The thing was that the player was trying identify an animal's weaknesses and strengths, but the DM didn't allow that without seeing the animal in question, as the player had merely heard about the animal and had a description of it. Now the problems began: The player said that "Jon_Dahl lets us identify monsters if we hear about them, we don't have to see them!" This irritated the DM beyond belief and I was trying to disappear, really, I just wanted to fade away. They tried to draw me into the argument, but I tried to act silly and make anagrams out of monster names. I was there just to play a little bit and read my study material, not to participate in any rule arguments, but I didn't want to say that.

A little bit later on, the DM decided that some monsters had just surprised us, but he didn't understand what that meant (to be surprised in Pathfinder). He wanted me to tell him, but I said that I don't know. That was ok for a while, but then he started to accuse me of withholding my D&D knowledge and not helping him run the game (I have never run Pathfinder in my life). I didn't say anything, but I did find his words funny and so I laughed. I thought that the situation was pretty comical. It was like the end of the world to him that the PCs were surprised... I don't know... It just felt totally absurd. He insisted that I'm trying to sabotage his game by being quiet. I replied that usually he gets upset when I try to help. And it is true. He just got upset and said that his enthusiasm was killed. Then I left.

P.S. If someone can help me with non-finite nominal dependent clauses, please send me a PM!

Well that didn't sound too horrible! I think you did right by trying to avoid arguments. But in the end it sounds like this guy shouldn't be running games at all. Do the other players enjoy his games? Do you feel violated? You attending his game sounds a bit like pity sex and that should be avoided. Don't listen other commenters, just tell the guy how it is, what you feel about playing with him.

Else he'll end up like lot of people on trying to get on (insert country) Idol. Talentless individuals who think they can sing because their mother told them they could. And their mothers were just being nice: "Of course you can sing darling"

If my players don't enjoy themselves I want to know why. This is so I can improve my GM mastery. So after a session I ask about peoples opinions and what they liked and did not like. If I would suck then my goal would to get better and if that failed relegate myself to being a player and have someone more capable put on the GM's hat.

As a DM he has to "own the game" and make his own rulings. If I don't recall a rule during a game then I just make something up, if a player remembers the rule then we use that. In the end it is the DM that should make the call about rules and his word should be final (for the time being). There is time enough to dig up rules and discuss them later.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-23, 12:57 AM
As a DM he has to "own the game" and make his own rulings. If I don't recall a rule during a game then I just make something up, if a player remembers the rule then we use that. In the end it is the DM that should make the call about rules and his word should be final (for the time being). There is time enough to dig up rules and discuss them later.

Yeah, but in this case I was being pressured to tell the rules.

I have thought about the situation and I hope that there isn't any bad blood between the great player and me... The DM did try to badmouth me a lot, like saying that I'm a horrible DM for allowing knowledge skills to be used like that in my game and for being so difficult overall... I don't know how to remedy the situation the next time I see the great player (the DM will not be there, of course).

RazorChain
2016-04-23, 01:09 AM
Yeah, but in this case I was being pressured to tell the rules.

I have thought about the situation and I hope that there isn't any bad blood between the great player and me... The DM did try to badmouth me a lot, like saying that I'm a horrible DM for allowing knowledge skills to be used like that in my game and for being so difficult overall... I don't know how to remedy the situation the next time I see the great player (the DM will not be there, of course).

Just tell him as it is that the DM can intepret the rules to his liking and because you allow him to use that skill in your game doesn't mean that others DM are going to.


I'm just going to give you a good advice. You decide if you take it or not. Through your life you will get to meet enough a-holes that you don't have to seek them out and play with them. And people that badmouth you and talk down to you don't have to be your friends. You choose your friends, make sure you choose well. Even though this guy is having a hard time doesn't mean you have to put up with him. I have met people who have gone through a lot in life both sickess and disabilites and it didn't stop them being positive or kind. Save your pity for someone who deserves it.

Mr Beer
2016-04-23, 08:44 AM
Yeah, but in this case I was being pressured to tell the rules.

I have thought about the situation and I hope that there isn't any bad blood between the great player and me... The DM did try to badmouth me a lot, like saying that I'm a horrible DM for allowing knowledge skills to be used like that in my game and for being so difficult overall... I don't know how to remedy the situation the next time I see the great player (the DM will not be there, of course).

The great player will likely understand who the problem is without you having to remedy anything.

BTW, it seems to me that you allow your guilt to lead you into situations where you get your face metaphorically kicked in for no reward. You already described the DM as a 'not-so-good-friend', now it sounds he likes to emotionally blackmail you into going round to his house so he can take out his life frustrations on you. I took the contrarian position in this thread partially to present an alternative point of view but honestly, I think my previous post was on the money. What exactly do you owe this guy that you feel you need to be his RPG-themed punching bag?

OldTrees1
2016-04-23, 09:07 AM
The great player will likely understand who the problem is without you having to remedy anything.

BTW, it seems to me that you allow your guilt to lead you into situations where you get your face metaphorically kicked in for no reward. You already described the DM as a 'not-so-good-friend', now it sounds he likes to emotionally blackmail you into going round to his house so he can take out his life frustrations on you. I took the contrarian position in this thread partially to present an alternative point of view but honestly, I think my previous post was on the money. What exactly do you owe this guy that you feel you need to be his RPG-themed punching bag?
This ^ alternate point of view is why I lead with my disclaimer that I am uncertain of my own advice. So, OP, please consider this perspective thoroughly.

When it comes to self sacrifice for the benefit of another one needs to both consider if it is something one ought to do and about how you can make yourself do what you ought even when you will not want to.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-23, 09:10 AM
What exactly do you owe this guy that you feel you need to be his RPG-themed punching bag?

He was my first DM :smallfrown:

OldTrees1
2016-04-23, 09:20 AM
He was my first DM :smallfrown:
So?
My father was my 1st DM, I respect him because he is a good father, not because he was first to DM.
I was the 1st DM for most of my friends, I certainly hope they respect me for being a good person and a skilled DM rather than being their first DM.
One of my friends was the 1st DM for a large portion of my other friends, they certainly respect him for being a good friend and a skilled storyteller rather than for merely being their first.

There are few things in life that deserve merit merely for being first. Most things in life deserve merit for either quality or inherent traits(human life being valuable for its own sake for instance).

SirBellias
2016-04-23, 10:07 AM
He was my first DM :smallfrown:

I don't see how that factors. I mean, it's cool that he introduced you to the game and all, but you said yourself that he's pretty horrible at it and a not so good friend. The best part about playing with a bunch if different people is finding out which games and people are more enjoyable to be around. I don't think you owe him anything just because he showed you the game.

Mr Beer
2016-04-23, 10:10 AM
He was my first DM :smallfrown:

So if I show you a really cool geode, I get to ambush you with a sock-full of gravel any time I feel like it? Sounds like a sweet deal for guy who likes caning you in the skull with blunt objects.

Cheshire Goat
2016-04-23, 10:28 AM
You did a nice thing by attending this fellow's game - but lesson learned, right? Time is precious, man. Don't reward bad behavior from anyone let alone someone who you consider a bad friend.

I play a game based on the fun I will have, not out of pity for someone (though there is nothing wrong with doing a good deed!) and I would certainly take into account the behavior of a DM the n st time that person asked me to play again.

He was antagonistic and insulted you during your experience. I would never show up again, and if he asked me why, I would be as honest as possible (while trying to be kind).

With all that said, I think you did him a kindness, which is admirable.

Jay R
2016-04-23, 12:28 PM
You aren't playing a game; you are helping a sick friend. It's all right to spend that time doing something you don't enjoy.

Mister Loorg
2016-04-23, 05:53 PM
So?
One of my friends was the 1st DM for a large portion of my other friends, they certainly respect him for being a good friend and a skilled storyteller rather than for merely being their first.

There are few things in life that deserve merit merely for being first. Most things in life deserve merit for either quality or inherent traits(human life being valuable for its own sake for instance).

:belkar: "I sense a great disturbance... As if a thousand double entendres cried out, and were suddenly silenced..."

But seriously, Jon, don't just stand there and take crap from someone you don't even consider your friend. You tried to help him and it didn't work. You've done your part.

RazorChain
2016-04-23, 07:02 PM
You aren't playing a game; you are helping a sick friend. It's all right to spend that time doing something you don't enjoy.

If that sick friend treats you badly and in a demeaning manner then other things apply.

I help my friends with various tasks I don't enjoy. But my friendship with them is based on mutual respect and trust. I trust that my friends would help me in my hour of need, which is one of the reason why I treat them with respect. The other reason why I treat them with respect is because that is how I want to be treated.

But if I treated my friends, colleagues and family badly you can be damn sure my next birthday I would be alone eating cake!

IntelectPaladin
2016-04-23, 09:42 PM
I'm sorry that this happened to you.
If it's any consolation,
From my point of view you did the best you possibly could.
I hope you find another, kinder D.M. soon,
So that you can be fully introduced to D&D.

Take care, And I hope this rough patch ends soon enough.

Temperjoke
2016-04-23, 09:59 PM
This might be an acquaintance that in the future you offer to play other games with instead of a D&D/Pathfinder game with. There's nothing wrong with that. If he asks again, and you don't have a good reason to not hang out, recommend a different type of board game instead. Everyone's got a friend/acquaintance that you don't do certain things with. Just remind him how things usually go if he complains.

You don't owe him just for being your first DM. That was repaid the first time he turned on you and blamed you.

goto124
2016-04-23, 10:05 PM
recommend a different type of board game instead.

Would Monopoly be the best or worst non-roleplaying game to suggest?

Temperjoke
2016-04-23, 10:12 PM
Would Monopoly be the best or worst non-roleplaying game to suggest?

A little bit of column A and a little bit of column B. I mean, at least then it's everyone who's mad, and not just the DM losing it.

Lvl 2 Expert
2016-04-25, 12:37 PM
To further the train analogy, There are things you can do while aboard, So to speak.
Point out things you see outside the window,
(E-i commenting on some nice details your pleasantly surprised to see,)
Talking to the other passengers,
(The other players,)
And seeing the view from atop the train.
( Being descriptive of the visuals you're doing.)

Other options include loudly singing raunchy songs until you're at your destination, pissing out the window, pissing at a closed window, pissing on the chairs, pissing on the conductor, running away from said conductor, running away from the railroad police, jumping out the window, jumping at a closed window, getting arrested and loudly singing jailhouse themed blues songs until you're at the police officer's destination.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-26, 04:05 PM
The fact that I went there to play is a gift that just keep on giving.

Now I raised a lot of suspicion by coming to the game with the great player's ride and then my dad came to pick me up. Now my sick acquaitance and the great player have had a conversation that I did that just to avoid paying for the gas, which I have promised to pay. Before we did anything, I promised to pay the great player 5 euros for the gas. Now that my dad came to pick me up signals, somehow, that I'm trying to dodge paying that money and the sick dude has sent me messages today that I'm just being a bad friend because I acted like that. I told him that I have every intention of paying, but I didn't do that on that day, because I only had 20-euro bills and I want to pay with exact change. He says that this is bad form. He also insists that me leaving the game so early was bad form and he has spoken with the rest of the players that I was a very bad person at the table. I was asking what did I do, but apparently what I did wrong was to laugh at an inappropriate time so that irritated the DM (the sick guy). Furthermore, he said that he was such a great friend that he paid 10 euros for the gas even though he didn't even need a ride, and then he explained me how poor he is.

Yeah...

Temperjoke
2016-04-26, 04:30 PM
The fact that I went there to play is a gift that just keep on giving.

Now I raised a lot of suspicion by coming to the game with the great player's ride and then my dad came to pick me up. Now my sick acquaitance and the great player have had a conversation that I did that just to avoid paying for the gas, which I have promised to pay. Before we did anything, I promised to pay the great player 5 euros for the gas. Now that my dad came to pick me up signals, somehow, that I'm trying to dodge paying that money and the sick dude has sent me messages today that I'm just being a bad friend because I acted like that. I told him that I have every intention of paying, but I didn't do that on that day, because I only had 20-euro bills and I want to pay with exact change. He says that this is bad form. He also insists that me leaving the game so early was bad form and he has spoken with the rest of the players that I was a very bad person at the table. I was asking what did I do, but apparently what I did wrong was to laugh at an inappropriate time so that irritated the DM (the sick guy). Furthermore, he said that he was such a great friend that he paid 10 euros for the gas even though he didn't even need a ride, and then he explained me how poor he is.

Yeah...

I'd pay it off, then cut your losses at this point and cut him out. The "great" player too, if he's buying the BS that the sick guy is putting out. It's pretty clear at this point that the sick guy is resenting you and is trying to poison the other people in the group against you.

Mr Beer
2016-04-26, 04:56 PM
These things are only problems to the extent that you allow them to be.

DM seems to enjoy making your life miserable. Stop associating with him. Problem solved.

You said you'd give some guy 5 euros, so give it to him. Problem solved.


The fact that I went there to play is a gift that just keep on giving.

Now I raised a lot of suspicion by coming to the game with the great player's ride and then my dad came to pick me up. Now my sick acquaitance and the great player have had a conversation that I did that just to avoid paying for the gas, which I have promised to pay. Before we did anything, I promised to pay the great player 5 euros for the gas. Now that my dad came to pick me up signals, somehow, that I'm trying to dodge paying that money and the sick dude has sent me messages today that I'm just being a bad friend because I acted like that. I told him that I have every intention of paying, but I didn't do that on that day, because I only had 20-euro bills and I want to pay with exact change. He says that this is bad form. He also insists that me leaving the game so early was bad form and he has spoken with the rest of the players that I was a very bad person at the table. I was asking what did I do, but apparently what I did wrong was to laugh at an inappropriate time so that irritated the DM (the sick guy). Furthermore, he said that he was such a great friend that he paid 10 euros for the gas even though he didn't even need a ride, and then he explained me how poor he is.

Yeah...

IntelectPaladin
2016-04-26, 06:49 PM
Mr beer, that isn't exactly the answer.
Frankly, He wouldn't be lashing out at you like this if he
were actually a friend of any sort, honestly.

And if he's willing to thrash any opinion the other players have of you,
Then I just can't say the things I would like to.
What I will say is that you're attempt at a good deed has been driven entirely off the rails.

What is next is up to you, But if I may make one recommendation?
Don't hurt them verbally. That just doesn't work out well for you, In either case.
Thank you for having a look at this.

Mr Beer
2016-04-26, 07:22 PM
Mr beer, that isn't exactly the answer.

Not voluntarily associating with people who make one's life miserable is exactly the answer IMO.

SirBellias
2016-04-26, 09:44 PM
Not voluntarily associating with people who make one's life miserable is exactly the answer IMO.

I have to say, in this situation, I agree. All other viable routes seem to have been taken, and the only thing that I can see that the OP can do now is give a direct apology and leave. The DM is poisoning relationships here, and if he won't accept a call for peace, then it's time to cut your losses, if any.

RazorChain
2016-04-27, 03:35 AM
These things are only problems to the extent that you allow them to be.

DM seems to enjoy making your life miserable. Stop associating with him. Problem solved.

You said you'd give some guy 5 euros, so give it to him. Problem solved.


I second that. Pay the great player his 5€ and ignore the sick guy. The sick guy is guilt tripping you to manipulate you.

Segev
2016-04-27, 12:34 PM
Just throwing an extra two cents (sorry, I don't have any Euro-penny-equivalents) on the "stop associating with him" front. Ignore his texts or block him entirely. Don't answer the phone. Discuss it with the other players if they seem to be holding it against you, but don't bring it up nor dwell on it.

"Sick friend" is not a friend, and doesn't seem to want you around for any healthy or positive purpose, so don't worry about donating your time to him anymore. Both of you will be happier for it.

Honest Tiefling
2016-04-29, 09:38 PM
I would like to similarly chip in my two cents. First, for the love of pete, don't do this again! How would you feel if someone only came to your house out of pity, and not to mutually enjoy the time? If you think he would be hurt if he knew the truth, don't lie to him and make it worse. He might be able to see through you or get some hint that you really don't want to be there. I would imagine someone getting annoyed at preparing a game they THOUGHT their friend would enjoy only to have that friend make it clear they don't want to be a part of it in the slightest.

Secondly, I do wonder about the nature of his disability. If it is great, he might be lashing out because sometimes, very sick people do that. They could be hurt, disoriented, depressed or afraid and no one is good at handling that. It's not great, but you should consider if you want to be there for him if he is. I don't think it's bad that you decide that you are not close enough to deal with this sort of treatment. If you do decide to stick around, do consider it a possibility that he might be dealing with some awful **** and might not be the best of people right now.

If he's not that sick, bail and don't look back.

Jon_Dahl
2016-04-30, 12:53 PM
I still feel confused why I had to tell the rules to the DM. I didn't want to do that. Is that really that difficult for someone to understand? I'm still gutted about it. I had zero interest of explaining the rules and I was clear about it.

Louro
2016-05-01, 10:16 AM
I still feel confused why I had to tell the rules to the DM.
Previously, at my table, we used to discuss a lot about rules. We checked rulebooks, comments on the net, pseudo-scientific arguments...
In the end it was a huge amount of time wasted. These days I just firmly state to the DM: "You are the DM, RULE IT!!! NOW!!!" (even when I know the rules)
I don't care if the rule makes no sense at all, just keep the story going.

Mr Beer
2016-05-01, 06:35 PM
Previously, at my table, we used to discuss a lot about rules. We checked rulebooks, comments on the net, pseudo-scientific arguments...
In the end it was a huge amount of time wasted. These days I just firmly state to the DM: "You are the DM, RULE IT!!! NOW!!!" (even when I know the rules)
I don't care if the rule makes no sense at all, just keep the story going.

Yeah, keep it moving. I allow some argument from players, if they're right and I'm wrong I correct myself and keep going. If I'm not sure and it's going to take time to check, I make a ruling and say 'we'll check it later'. It doesn't make for a good game to have a 45 minute discussion about legalistic minutiae.

Kelb_Panthera
2016-05-02, 01:22 AM
He was my first DM :smallfrown:

This isn't a good enough reason to justify anything. Just putting that out there.


I've only skimmed the thread but it seems to me that you're being over-generous to someone you don't even like. Calling him a friend, rather than a mutual acquaintence with a friend, strikes me as wrong from what I did read. Pay him any fiscal debt you owe him, if any, then wash your hands of him. Life's too short to spend free time with people you dislike and that dislike you.

You're a good dude. There's nothing wrong with that. Don't be so good that it bites you in the ass, though.