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View Full Version : D&D 5e/Next Botanist-A Class



JNAProductions
2016-07-04, 11:56 PM
Hit Points-1d10 Per Botanist level

Proficiencies
Armor-None
Weapons-Simple Weapons
Tools-Gardener's Tools
Saves-Constitution, Intelligence
Skills-Choose two from Athletics, Acrobatics, Stealth, Arcana, History, Investigation, Religion, Animal Handling, Insight, Medicine, Perception, and Survival



Level
Feature


1
Natural Defense, Botany


2
Botanical Study


3
Spellcasting


4
Ability Score Improvement


5
Extra Attack


6
Botanical Study


7
-


8
Ability Score Improvement


9
Plantlike Form


10
Botanical Study


11
Lumbering Strike


12
Ability Score Improvement


13
-


14
Botanical Study


15
Apotheosis


16
Ability Score Improvement


17
Improved Photosynthesis


18
Botanical Study


19
Ability Score Improvement


20
Botanical Study



Natural Defense-At level one, plants have begun to infuse your body, giving you a hard, barklike skin. You have the option of treating your AC as 10+Dexterity Modifier+Intelligence Modifier.

Botany-Beginning at level one, you learn various botanical knacks. These work similarly to a Warlock's Invocations. You gain one at levels 1, 5, 9, 13, and 17. In addition, you gain proficiency in the Nature skill.

Botanical Study-At level two, you must select your path-that of Trees, Flowers, or Fungi.

Spellcasting-At level three, you gain spellcasting. Spells known are drawn from the Botanist spell list, but in all other respects is the same as Eldritch Knight spellcasting.

Cantrips
Druidcraft
Guidance
Mending
Resistance
Shillegah
Thorn Whip
Light

1st Level
Animal/Plant Friendship
Create Or Destroy Water
Cure Wounds
Detect Magic
Detect Poison and Disease
Entangle
Fog Cloud
Goodberry
Healing Word
Longstrider
Purify Food and Drink
Speak with Animals and Plants

2nd Level
Animal/Plant Messenger
Barkskin
Beast/Plant Sense
Gust of Wind
Heat Metal
Lesser Restoration
Locate Animals or Plants
Pass Without Trace
Spike Growth

3rd Level
Daylight
Meld Into Stone/Wood
Plant Growth
Protection From Energy
Speak With Plants
Water Breathing

4th Level
Blight
Confusion
Control Water
Freedom of Movement
Grasping Vine
Ice Storm
Polymorph

Plantlike Form-At level nine, your body becomes even more infused with plants. You no longer require food, only sunlight, water, and soil (though you can still eat and gain normal benefits from doing so). In addition, you can hold your breath for ten times longer.

Lumbering Strike-At level 11, your strikes have all the weight of a massive tree. You may double your damage dice when using a weapon attack.

Apotheosis-At level 15, you become a plant entirely. You gain advantage on saves against any mental effects, though you have disadvantage on saves against any fire based effect. In addition, when immobile, you can (over the course of a minute) take the form of your chosen plant, becoming indistinguishable from it.

Improved Photosynthesis-At level 17, when in sunlight (or other bright light, such as from a Daylight spell) and when you have at least 1 HP, you gain regeneration equal to 5+your Intelligence modifier.

Botanical Studies

Flowers

Lying Petals-You gain proficiency in Deception at level 2 when you choose this Study. (If you already have Deception proficiency, gain proficiency in another skill of your choice.)

Deceptive Form-You may cast Disguise Self at-will starting at level 6. This is not considered a magical effect-your form actually changes.

Pollen Of Power-You may, at level 10, cast Dominate Person once per long rest, and Charm Person once per short rest.

True Lies-At level 18, you may double your proficiency bonus in Deception.

A Thousand Petals-At level 20, you may use your action to become petals on the breeze once per long rest. This lasts for one minute (or until your concentration is broken). You gain a fly speed of 50', with the ability to hover. You may pass through opponents squares without provoking opportunity attacks, and have resistance to all bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage. In addition, if you pass through someone's space, you may deal 2d6+Dexterity modifier slashing damage to them, or half on a successful Dexterity save against your spell DC. This damage can only occur once per opponent per turn.

Pine Trees

Cold Weather Plant-At level 2, you gain resistance to cold damage.

Evergreen-At level 6, you are able to endure even the harshest weather while staying green and vibrant. You may survive in temperatures of as low as -20 degrees Celsius without any harm.

Tough Bark-At level 10, your bark becomes thicker than ever, increasing your AC by 1 when using your Natural Defense.

Towering Pine-At level 18, you may cast the Enlarge spell at-will, with a duration of Concentration. This is not a magical effect.

Capstone For Pines-Hell if I know. Some advice greatly appreciated.

Eucalyptus Trees

Hot Weather Plant-At level 2, you gain resistance to fire damage.

Burn! All Will Burn!-At level 6, as an action, you may light yourself on fire for one minute. You take one point of damage per round while on fire, but your melee attacks deal an extra 1d6 fire damage, and anyone grappling you (or otherwise near to you) takes 2d6 fire damage when they initiate the grapple and at the start of each of their turns.

Ablative Bark-At level 10, your bark becomes brittle and ablative. You may, once per short rest, cast Hellish Rebuke at third level as your bark explosively flies off.

Burn Brighter-At level 18, your Burn! damage increases to d10s.

Eucalyptus Nova-At level 20, you may, once per long rest as a bonus action, initiate a nova. This is similar to Burn! except it deals twice the damage to both you, anyone you strike, and anyone grappling you.

Acacia Trees

Thorns-You may, once per short rest, cast Armor Of Agathys as a first level spell at level 2. This does not deal cold damage-it instead deals piercing damage. The spell increases to second level at level 9 and third level at level 16.

Swarming Ants-You may, at level 6, summon four Swarms of Ants once per long rest. They appear from nearby areas, or, if you know you will be venturing into an area inhospitable to ants, you may create a terrarium for them, costing 10 GP, and carry it with you.

Poisonous Bark-At level 10, you can fill yourself with poison in response to danger. As a reaction, you may inflict the Poisoned condition on yourself (lasting till the end of your next turn) but any enemy that strikes you in melee takes 1d8 poison damage and must make a Constitution save against your Spell Save DC or be poisoned until the end of their next turn.

Improved Tolerance Threshold-At level 18, you grow resistant to your own poisons. You may now make a Constitution save against your own Spell Save DC when using Poisonous Bark.

Ants And Poison And Thorns-You may, once per long rest at level 20, bring all your abilities together in one massive retaliation. As a reaction to taking melee damage, you may cast Armor Of Agathys (with piercing damage instead of cold) at fifth level, poison your enemy for one minute (with a new saving throw allowed at the end of each of their turns), and create six swarms of ants in their space, acting immediately after them in the initiative count.

Trees

Improved Bark-At level 2, you gain a +1 bonus to AC when using your Natural Defense.

Large Form-At level 6, you may choose to be treated as Large whenever you wish. You, however, only occupy a 5X5 space even when being treated as Large.

Massive Form-At level 10, you may actually become Large. As an action, you may put yourself under the effects of an Enlarge spell, though the duration is simply Concentration.

Barkier Bark-At level 14, you gain a further +1 bonus to AC when using your Natural Defense.

Ironwood-At level 18, you gain resistance to bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage from nonmagical sources.

Forest-At level 20, you may use your action to become a forest. You gain the effects of an Enlarge spell, and summon three tree duplicates of yourself, each of which acts independently. The Enlarge spell, further, lasts through your first three failed Concentration checks, though each failed one causes one tree to become non-sentient and simply root where it is. After your fourth failed Concentration check (or one minute passes) all trees are nonmagical and the Enlarge spell wears off. This can be done once per long rest.

Flowers

Bend In The Breeze-You are lithe and flexible. Gain proficiency in Acrobatics at level 2. (If you already have proficiency, gain proficiency in another skill of your choice.)

Small Form-You may be treated as one size category smaller if it ever benefits you, starting at level 6.

Tiny Form-At level 10, you may actually become one size smaller. As an action, you may put yourself under the effects of a Reduce spell, though the duration is simply Concentration.

Bendier In The Breeze-At level 14, your form becomes even more flexible. Your proficiency bonus for Acrobatics is now doubled.

Nimble-At level 18, you gain proficiency in Dexterity saving throws.

A Thousand Petals-At level 20, you may use your action to become petals on the breeze once per long rest. This lasts for one minute (or until your concentration is broken). You gain a fly speed of 50', with the ability to hover. You may pass through opponents squares without provoking opportunity attacks, and have resistance to all bludgeoning, piercing, and slashing damage. In addition, if you pass through someone's space, you may deal 2d6+Dexterity modifier slashing damage to them, or half on a successful Dexterity save against your spell DC. This damage can only occur once per opponent per turn.

Fungi

Spongy Body-At level 2, you gain 2 extra hit points, and you gain 1 more hit point at every level you take in this class.

Rooting Down-At level 6, you gain the ability to put down roots as an action. In order to move you from this spot, an enemy must succeed on a strength saving throw against your spell save DC (for instance, if a foe were to shove you, they would first have to succeed on the Athletics check, then succeed against your spell saving throw DC). In addition, while rooted, your move speed is halved, but you are under the effects of a Spider Climb spell.

Improved Roots-At level 10, your roots provide better sustenance for you, and more mobility. Your speed is now no longer reduced when rooted, and you regain one hit point a minute while rooted.

Resilient Body-At level 14, you gain 14 extra hit points, and you gain 1 more hit point at every level you take in this class.

Hard To Kill-At level 18, you gain resistance to any two damage types of your choosing. You may change these during a short rest.

Fungal Spores-At level 20, you may, once per long rest, release fungal spores in a radius of 60' that last for one minute. These spores provide 1/2 cover (3/4ths cover for you) and will attempt to root down in enemies. Any enemy in the radius takes 5d6 poison and slashing (this is only resisted if they resist both poison AND slashing damage) damage at the start of each of their turns, or half on a successful saving throw. Each successful save reduces the damage taken by 1d6, and the effect goes away when the damage reaches 0d6. This takes effect either when activated or when an enemy first enters the area.

Botanical Knacks

Awaken Plants Requires 17th level-You may, once per week, cast Awaken on a plant with no material component cost.

Master Of Combat-You gain a single Fighting Style of your choice. This may only be taken once.

Glintweed-You may, given an action and a small amount of dirt or compost, cause a Glintweed to grow. This sheds bright light in a 15' radius, and dim light for 15' beyond. The plant lasts as normal if fed and watered, and will last for one day when picked.

Poisonous Blows-Requires 13th level-You gain a poisonous touch. YOur unarmed strikes now deal 1 bludgeoning plus 1d8 poison damage, and if they hit, you may, once per turn, inflict the poisoned condition on the foe hit. The foe must make a Constitution save with a DC equal to your spell DC, or be poisoned for one minute. It may repeat the save at the start of each of its turns.

Growing Corpses-Requires 5th level-You may, once per day, cast Revivify, using part of your own body as the material component. When casting it in this way, you take damage equal to half the max HP of whoever you are reviving.

Great Shillegah-You learn the Shillegah cantrip. If you already know it, learn a new cantrip from the Botanist spell list. When casting Shillegah, it now causes the weapon to be 1d10 (2d6 Versatile).

Greater Whallop-Requires Great Shillegah and level 9 or higher-When you cast Shillegah, you may now add both the normal damage modifier and your spellcasting modifier.



Not sure what to do for Botanical knacks or the other two archetypes. Anyway, offer some suggestions, and let me know if anything seems broken.

khadgar567
2016-07-05, 12:59 AM
Pixies, space marines and know jnaprofuction presents poison ivy from dc universe as class good job mate

JBPuffin
2016-07-05, 09:36 PM
I got stuck the same way building my Arithmatist class (ended up just not using Warlock style because...complex). You do need to post the Botanist spell list.

As for what Knacks and the other archetypes, look at the Monster Manual and browse around other homebrew. Flowers could get some dryad-style tricks and maybe ally support abilities, Myconoid (Why not Fungi? Fits your tense better) could crib from the myconids, other mushrooms, and other things that spore (maybe have the most direct damage/debuffs?).

JNAProductions
2016-07-05, 09:49 PM
Okay. Made one (1) knack, and added a spell list.

ravencroft0
2016-07-09, 10:07 PM
Interesting concept. Poison Ivy indeed. I see elves and gnomes jumping into this class.

Apotheosis: Reduced movement speed in cold weather / some type of effect from cold damage

Flowers: some type of charisma bonus, flowers have pollen, so something to do with allergies? if only for flavor

Myconoid: some type of constitution bonus., ability that produces an Illusion similar to the hallucinatory terrain, myconids have some telepathy/empathy with their spores, so there's that.

Spellcasting: add hallucinatory terrain to the spell list

Have you considered a Fey connection of sorts? Dryads and are sentient trees more or less.

Advantages depending on terrain? When you're in a cave system/the Underdark, a myconoid has advantage on Stealth?

Advantages on dealing with plant creatures such as treants?

Elodin
2016-07-10, 02:04 PM
Pixies, space marines and know jnaprofuction presents poison ivy from dc universe as class good job mate

This is exactly what I thought when I saw this class. :P Good job.

JNAProductions
2016-07-10, 10:39 PM
Added some more to the class.

Ziegander
2016-12-31, 11:06 PM
This is really intriguing, JNAP. Can we get a little of your design/balance philosophy on this one? EK casting but with limited (but strong) core class features and only one Extra Attack. Solid hit points, with invocations like a Warlock. I would say since you don't have mystic arcanums or 5th level spells, you'd be justified in adding substantive class features at level 7 and 13.

JNAProductions
2016-12-31, 11:08 PM
I have a design/balance philosophy? That's news to me.

I just kinda wing it, run a few numbers sometimes, and compare it to PHB classes. I honestly wish I had a more methodical way of doing it, so I could teach other people, but I don't.

Any ideas what sorts of features would be worth adding?

Darius
2017-01-02, 02:03 AM
I am confused about how a class gets to have a knack that allows ability score bonus damage at will like this at such a low level (Warlock gives at 12th with pact weapon only).

I would also think one would have like the path have the AC and not have it be something based off of a stat like Barbarians and Monks (INT bonus to AC makes no sense whatsoever). Myconids have base AC 12 that could improve with level.

Likewise bonus hit points - d10 hit dice? Bonus hit points Knack...sorcerer does 1 point per but then 14?!?

I think like Eldritch Knight or Arcane Trickster the spell casting should be a path instead of a feature as it appears here.

The super shillelagh should not be a constant feature, either - paladins need to channel divinity and fuel smites with spells; monks use ki and the like.


I like the concept, but there is lots of brokenness in this class as is.

JNAProductions
2017-01-02, 02:14 AM
I am confused about how a class gets to have a knack that allows ability score bonus damage at will like this at such a low level (Warlock gives at 12th with pact weapon only).

I would also think one would have like the path have the AC and not have it be something based off of a stat like Barbarians and Monks (INT bonus to AC makes no sense whatsoever). Myconids have base AC 12 that could improve with level.

Likewise bonus hit points - d10 hit dice? Bonus hit points Knack...sorcerer does 1 point per but then 14?!?

I think like Eldritch Knight or Arcane Trickster the spell casting should be a path instead of a feature as it appears here.

The super shillelagh should not be a constant feature, either - paladins need to channel divinity and fuel smites with spells; monks use ki and the like.


I like the concept, but there is lots of brokenness in this class as is.

Earliest it can be gotten is level 5. Admittedly, it's pretty nice, but is Int, which really only has synergy with Wizard, whereas Charisma has synergy with a poopton more. I might add a level 9 minimum to Greater Whallop, though.

There is no knack that grants extra HP-only archetypes. And it grants 14, not per level, but when you get the feature, since you've got 14 levels in the class when you get it. It's 1 extra HP per level.

Why do you think casting should not be a core feature?

And math time! At level 9 (which is probably what I'll make the minimum for Greater Whallop) a Monk is doing around 3d6+15 damage per turn, assuming all hits. That's 25.5 damage.

A Botanist who dedicated themselves to melee DPR is doing 4d6+4 (Dueling)+10 (Intelligence)+4 (Strength) for 32 points of damage on average, assuming all hits. (34 if you manage to start with a 16 in Strength, or a 15 in Strength and a 17 in Intelligence.) That's a significant increase over a monk, true-but the monk has a lot going for it a Botanist lacks, and the Botanist spent three class features exclusively on melee damage. (For instance, a Monk can flurry 9 times per short rest at this point, which ups its DPR by 8.5 each time they do it-for 35 total, handily outstripping the Botanist.)

AvatarVecna
2017-01-02, 02:45 AM
Improved Photosynthesis comes online earlier than the Champion's similar ability, and has the "half health" maximum nor the "1 HP" minimum that ability possesses, and I don't feel that being in sunlight is enough of a limiter to warrant this, but I haven't actually run the numbers.

I feel like Improved Bark and Barkier Bark should be replaced with something other than AC bumps, given how useful Natural Defense is. Perhaps bonus hit points, instead? It's not terrible, but I feel that bumping AC further is pushing a bit on bounded accuracy. Hmm...maybe additional damage resistances?

I feel that Ironwood could apply to magical weapon damage as well, but it's not a huge issue I guess.

...is Forest just something you can do, at will? Considering how much it boosts the action economy, and considering the other Botanist capstones, I would think that it was meant to be once per long rest, but I don't see 'long rest' anywhere in that ability description.

Thousand Petals it has some potential abuse in that it's damage not linked to an action, meaning that unless your attack routine is better than 5 Petal Passes, you're probably better off Dashing instead of attacking, and just spiraling though an opponent's square over and over. While no individual damage is really that bad, this means you're potentially getting it 20 times in a round (potentially 40d6+100, un-Hasted). Not sure how to solve this without nerfing it into uselessness, though...

Fungal Spores needs to be more clear about what happens. Is it an instananeous effect that affects the enemies that were within 60' when you used it, or is it an ongoing effect that affects only enemies currently within it, or is it an ongoing effect that affects enemies that are within it at any point during the duration, at which point they have to make saves until they either completely reduce the damage, or die? Regardless, it seems like a fine enough friendly blasting ability.

The existing Knacks seems fine, but I'd prefer to see more of them.

JNAProductions
2017-01-02, 02:48 AM
Improved Photosynthesis comes online earlier than the Champion's similar ability, and has the "half health" maximum nor the "1 HP" minimum that ability possesses, and I don't feel that being in sunlight is enough of a limiter to warrant this, but I haven't actually run the numbers.

I feel like Improved Bark and Barkier Bark should be replaced with something other than AC bumps, given how useful Natural Defense is. Perhaps bonus hit points, instead? It's not terrible, but I feel that bumping AC further is pushing a bit on bounded accuracy. Hmm...maybe additional damage resistances?

I feel that Ironwood could apply to magical weapon damage as well, but it's not a huge issue I guess.

...is Forest just something you can do, at will? Considering how much it boosts the action economy, and considering the other Botanist capstones, I would think that it was meant to be once per long rest, but I don't see 'long rest' anywhere in that ability description.

Thousand Petals it has some potential abuse in that it's damage not linked to an action, meaning that unless your attack routine is better than 5 Petal Passes, you're probably better off Dashing instead of attacking, and just spiraling though an opponent's square over and over. While no individual damage is really that bad, this means you're potentially getting it 20 times in a round (potentially 40d6+100, un-Hasted). Not sure how to solve this without nerfing it into uselessness, though...

Fungal Spores needs to be more clear about what happens. Is it an instananeous effect that affects the enemies that were within 60' when you used it, or is it an ongoing effect that affects only enemies currently within it, or is it an ongoing effect that affects enemies that are within it at any point during the duration, at which point they have to make saves until they either completely reduce the damage, or die? Regardless, it seems like a fine enough friendly blasting ability.

The existing Knacks seems fine, but I'd prefer to see more of them.

Made a few edits. Any ideas for new knacks?

AvatarVecna
2017-01-02, 03:01 AM
Made a few edits. Any ideas for new knacks?

Sadly not, at least as far as mechanics go. Perhaps something related to vines?

khadgar567
2017-01-02, 03:49 AM
Sadly not, at least as far as mechanics go. Perhaps something related to vines?
and charm via inhaled poison.

Darius
2017-01-02, 04:51 AM
The AC part is just silly IMHO - makes no sense (barb CON does; monk WIS does...plants/leaves fusing based off of INT? I think someone is smoking some plants when coming up with that one.). Like sorcerer, it should be a set AC like draconic sorcerer based on what you wrote since it sounds more like a natural armor class feature. As character levels up, AC could increase in the path as listed.

Monk math makes no sense to use as a comparison because they do not have spells and some of the other crazy knacks the botanist does. You should compare to bladelock damage output instead. The monk you compared to doesn't even come close level to level and can't spam because Ki is limited. Don't even get me started on the bonus at 9th and double damage at level 11. I still think these should have seed powers or something like that of Ki or powered by spell levels or something instead of at will.

So, a first level character that is going to have one stat (INT) be their prime stat would get an additional AC bonus, take super shillelagh to spam using INT as stat (so STR, WIS, CHA are all dump stats) and then have it do 2d6 to boot? Sign me up! I get a d10 for hit dice, too? Bonus!

I get that you said you put all of your eggs in one basket, but who wouldn't? "No thank you DM, I don't want to have the beatstick of doom at 1st level...instead I would rather frollic around with my glimmering glintweed so that the monsters can find me in the dark and have a salad first or leave it on the plate like parsley."

How would a planter of trees have Athletics, Acrobatics, Stealth, Arcana, History, Investigation, Religion, Animal Handling, Insight, Medicine, Perception, and Survival to choose from (without Nature, I might add) when druids have only Arcana, Animal Handling, Insight, Medicine, Nature, Perception, Religion, and Survival? Heck, even Rangers don't have Acrobatics.

Spells speak for themselves as I see it - Warlock is limited, eldritch knight/arcane trickster was my comparison - they are limited in number/type available as well; they do not have the same fighter or rogue abilities. One would think like the druid circles, you would have selection like that of EK - abjuration/evocation; Paladin/Ranger are not full casters and their spell lists are not as juicy, either.

I think the druid is already out there, and it should remain so - this class is over powered and unlike druid, it will be a one stick pony.

JNAProductions
2017-01-02, 12:35 PM
-Snip-

I would appreciate you being a little bit more polite, thank you.

And Monks lack spells, sure. They also have Flurry of Blows, Patient Defense, Stunning Strike, Step of the Wind, their archetype abilities... Hell, a Four Elements Monk is basically a 1/3rd caster in their own right.

Also note, it only doubles weapon damage, not stat damage. So you're adding, at most, 7 damage. Not a small number, sure-but not doubling damage.

Strength cannot be a dump stat if you want to max damage-Greater Whallop is useless with a 10 in Strength, and actively detrimental with an 8. Wisdom is a very important save, so it's no more of a dump stat than it is for a Fighter. Speaking of Fighters, guess who else can raise AC, to-hit, and damage by one stat? Dex Figthers. And while they might have a lower damage die (2.5 less damage per attack, on average), they can do it from 150' away with a longbow, with a +2 bonus to hit.

They do get Nature. It's a class feature for them. (I didn't think it was a big deal to give three skills when one is Nature-a not too terribly useful skill.) And I'm of the opinion that most classes, including core ones, should have plenty of skills to pick from.

You did read the spell list, right? You do realize it's pretty dang short? There are some nice spells, sure, but every caster has some nice ones.

M Placeholder
2017-01-02, 01:19 PM
Like the idea of the class, but the archetypes aren't really that inspiring and could be a lot more inventive. Tree, Flowers and Fungi (which aren't plants - more closely related to animal kingdom than the plant kingdom - the cell structure of fungi is made of the same material as an insects exoskelton) are pretty generic, and doesn't really give the feeling of "Nature green in leaf and stem".

There's not much here to me that connects with how trees use the fungal growth that connects almost an entire forest together to communicate with each other and also to transfer nutrients to each other, how plants distribute their seeds through motion and the use of animals, how the vast majority of plants in the rainforest are poisonious and how there is a constant arms race between animals browsing and the trees. Also, for the flowers, there is nothing about deception - Orchids, one of the most widespread and successful groups of flowering plants, use deception all the time in getting insects to do their bidding.

There is a lot of potential for this class. For the trees, you could divide it up further. For example, have a pine study subclass with cold resistance. For eucalypts, how about a feature where you have resistance to Fire Damage, and at the possible cost of some hit points, set yourself on fire for a minute and deal increased melee damage? Or a Christmas Tree (Australian version), where you can dessicate an enemy and leave him a dried out husk? And Acacia, where you could grow thorns, get communal ants to sting your enemy, and in ancipation of being bitten, pump yourself full of poison.

The myconid route could be so much more too. A lasso feature along with the threads? (many fungi have traps on their threads that capture worms). How about one myconid class that is inspired by Cordyceps? Mind control and puppeteering? Hell yes.

And I haven't even gotten to carnivorous plants yet. A subclass based around the study of the venus fly trap, pitcher plants or the Cobra Lily? That would be awesome.

There is a lot of potential for this class, and as someone that loves plants, I would dig subclasses based around that.

JNAProductions
2017-01-02, 01:21 PM
Like the idea of the class, but the archetypes aren't really that inspiring and could be a lot more inventive. Tree, Flowers and Fungi (which aren't plants - more closely related to animal kingdom than the plant kingdom - the cell structure of fungi is made of the same material as an insects exoskelton) are pretty generic, and doesn't really give the feeling of "Nature green in leaf and stem".

There's not much here to me that connects with how trees use the fungal growth that connects almost an entire forest together to communicate with each other and also to transfer nutrients to each other, how plants distribute their seeds through motion and the use of animals, how the vast majority of plants in the rainforest are poisonious and how there is a constant arms race between animals browsing and the trees. Also, for the flowers, there is nothing about deception - Orchids, one of the most widespread and successful groups of flowering plants, use deception all the time in getting insects to do their bidding.

There is a lot of potential for this class. For the trees, you could divide it up further. For example, have a pine study subclass with cold resistance. For eucalypts, how about a feature where you have resistance to Fire Damage, and at the possible cost of some hit points, set yourself on fire for a minute and deal increased melee damage? Or a Christmas Tree (Australian version), where you can dessicate an enemy and leave him a dried out husk? And Acacia, where you could grow thorns, get communal ants to sting your enemy, and in ancipation of being bitten, pump yourself full of poison.

The myconid route could be so much more too. A lasso feature along with the threads? (many fungi have traps on their threads that capture worms). How about one myconid class that is inspired by Cordyceps? Mind control and puppeteering? Hell yes.

And I haven't even gotten to carnivorous plants yet. A subclass based around the study of the venus fly trap, pitcher plants or the Cobra Lily? That would be awesome.

There is a lot of potential for this class, and as someone that loves plants, I would dig subclasses based around that.

I should probably know this. My mom is a master gardener after all. I've got some stuff going on, but I'll think about this advice once I'm less busy. Thank you!

JNAProductions
2017-01-02, 05:51 PM
I added a few new subclasses. The old ones are now spoilered away.

AvatarVecna
2017-01-02, 08:21 PM
New Flower sub-class doesn't specify what type of save it is to halve the damage; I assume it's Dexterity, as it was before, but making note of it would be useful.

JNAProductions
2017-01-02, 08:33 PM
I fix! It was also the old Mushroom Capstone, so...

tantric
2017-01-05, 05:57 AM
this is just for possible inspiration - plant mages from my african setting


Herbalism Ungaka
Herbal magic uses the powers of the natural world to make
potions, medicine and fetishes. This extends beyond curing
disease to treating all kinds of problems - there are herbal
cures for those who suffer from thieves. In the modern
world of Wajabu, there is a tendency towards
specialization, and herbalists are seen as having more
power in the area of diseases and ailments than other
magics, but this doesn't stop them from trying. The one
ailment they do not treat is spirit possession, which is
known to require an Ngoma mganga, those they do over
several diagnostics that will determine whether such a
course will be necessary.

Herbalism is more than just compounding various plant
products. For one, there are specific rituals for harvesting
the products. The plants themselves must be appeased with
praise songs and tended with certain sacrifices (specifically,
certain trees must be watered with specially brewed beers).
When the medicines are compounded, they must be
introduced to each other in a certain way. Also, 'herbalism'
is a misnomer as it includes many animal products. Glands
and organs from certain animals, bird eggs and special
insects are very important.

Dawa/madawa are magical remedies. In Wajabu, the word
has come to refer to treatments for illness, whereas in
kiSwahili the word can refer to a remedy for thieves, a love
potion or any number of things (kiKoka uses 'ushombwe' to
refer to a magic potion for nonmedical use). There are
several Madawa Societies that make both standard and
custom medicines. Madawa can be oral, topical (which can
be incised) or smoke-based, but they are always
consumable (as opposed to various charms and amulets
that ward off disease, but don't cure it). Madawa typically
have a secret ingredient, a kizimba, that is the activating
agent. The rest of the dawa can be prepared and even
bottled, but the kizimba must be added near the time of
administration and typically requires certain words or
ritual actions to empower it.

In the modern Empire, all herbalists are human/!Tsharg
partnerships. !Tshargs' elevated senses and attention to the
natural world make them apothecarists bar none. In
particular, they can smell diseases and know insect
medicine far beyond what humans do. !Tsharg taste bugs to
determine their properties and are famous for discovering
the bee-sting treatment for joint-pain.

Although herbalists concoct various standard remedies, to
make them truly efficacious they must be specific to a
certain person which involves adding ingredients that
either come from the person (spit or blood) or that relate to
the person's totem. One must also be careful with these
remedies that they don't contain taboo ingredients. In
general, taking a medicine from anyone other than the
person who mixed it is very dangerous.

Mngaka function in many ways like alchemists, with
serious greenthumbs. Rather than a formulary, they have
Plant Teachers, allies in the plant world. He knows how to
speak to the plant spirits and how to honor them, and they
teach him the spells to empower their herbs. The herbalist
finds the kizimba from his own knowledge. He combines
the herbs and the kizimba and uses the spell the plant
teachers taught him. To make a medicine truly powerful, it
must be bonded to the user in particular.