Vote! What racial (paragon) class would you like to see? Take 3 (Voting has begun)

[Zaydos]

https://media.giphy.com/media/l2JInQdBPv4NOwlG0/giphy.gif

WELCOME ONE AND ALL,AFTER THE PLEASURE OF THE LAST TWO ROUNDS I, ZAYDOS THE HARD SHELLED HAVE DECIDED THAT A THIRD ROUND IS IN ORDER! I WILL HAVE MY GNOMISH ASSISTANT, ILLISWORTH, EXPLAIN THE RULES.


http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6vehnl15G1rafdwyo1_500.gif

So as to the rules:

This thread will be divided, temporally into two sections. First there will be the suggestion round which will last until the 10th, or 11th (at the chang... erm... peanut dracolich's whim), during this time each poster may, suggest a single race to be added to THE LIST below. The c... dracolich reserves veto authority, i.e. they can say no I don't want to make that. In addition the race must be 3.5 and have a listed (official) LA, and their ECL must be less than 18. It may also not be hobgoblins, lizardfolk (poisondusk is an acceptable suggestion), changelings, goliaths, or dvati because those have been done (in round 1 and 2 that is), or kobolds (because amount of web enhancements and what rulings are being made by the DM cause their power and theme to vary wildly). So until the suggestion round is ended, which it will be done with a post including a reposting of THE LIST feel free to make whatever suggestions you want with these limitations. Glance over THE LIST and use it for some inspiration if you'd like, it should give you an idea at the range of things likely to be allowed, or maybe make you think of something not on it you'd really like to see. At the same time feel free to suggest simple, basic things like hengeyokai, maenads, goblins, and the like. Just because I'm willing to do Vampires, Bralani Eladrin, and Adu'ja don't let it keep you from suggesting the race you want to see.

Once the suggestion round has ended there will be the voting round. You may each vote for as many races as you want, or as few, from THE LIST. At the end of the voting round (the 17th or 18th) the three winning races will be given paragon classes.

Illisworth out.


http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-gqhD8s2d2BY/UdNTmLS6PwI/AAAAAAAAQd4/4DVlF-nE-Xk/s500/gfg10.gif

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.


Also I think this take's narration may end up either being gladiatorial combat versus dragons or a mad-biomage's laboratory, we'll have to wait and see.

[PapaQuackers]

Would it be... baaaaaaaaaaaad of me to suggest Satyrs?

[Zaydos]

Would it be... baaaaaaaaaaaad of me to suggest Satyrs?

Baaaaaaaaaad is this lag I'm having with GiantITP atm, but satyr will be added. Actually satyr paragon seems baaaaaasically rather easy (I'd focus on the pipes).

[GnomishPride]

Let's go with...
Thri-Kreen
(I hope I spelled that right :smalltongue:)

[Digitalfruitz]

I'd like to suggest the Centaur

[Grand Arbiter]

Aaracockra? (LA +2)

[Temotei]

Goblin.

Didn't you say you didn't want kobold either? Maybe add that to the list of nopes.

[Zaydos]

All 4 added.


Aaracockra? (LA +2)

Sources, sources. How am I supposed to know whether you mean the Races of Faerun version or the Dragon #319 version which has 3 bonus power points... and a power they autoknow but it's low light vision and they're a monstrous humanoid so have darkvision so meh. Or I assume they have darkvision it doesn't say they don't. It does say Centaurs do... Great now I have to track down my Monsters of Faerun.


Goblin.

Didn't you say you didn't want kobold either? Maybe add that to the list of nopes.

Finally someone suggested goblin. And good point.

[Tiktakkat]

Warforged
Rogue Modron
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk

[Zaydos]

Warforged
Rogue Modron
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk

As the thread title and OP state it is currently the Suggestion round when you get to suggest things to be added for voting later, actual voting will begin on the 11th (possibly earlier but 11th is the sure deal).

Also this voting round you will no longer be limited to 3 votes. Because I am Chaotic Lawful and arbitrarily changing rules are my thing. Ok more honestly it's because I thought better of the three votes and believe I will see more about what people actually want by allowing for a self-assigned number of votes. Do they just really want 1 race to win? Do they think 12 races are interesting and felt constrained by 3?

[Tiktakkat]

As the thread title and OP state it is currently the Suggestion round when you get to suggest things to be added for voting later, actual voting will begin on the 11th (possibly earlier but 11th is the sure deal).

I keep getting confused. (I need be more careful when posting after work :smalltongue: )
As it goes, I don't have any suggestions, as I'd really just like to see those.
So . . . I'll be back to request those. :smallbiggrin:

[Draconium]

So... would it be in poor taste to request a True Dragon Paragon class? :smalltongue:

Regardless, I'd also like to put forward the Vanara race from OA, because monkey people are fun to play. I may have some more suggestions, if I can remember what other races I've enjoyed playing.

[Zaydos]

So... would it be in poor taste to request a True Dragon Paragon class? :smalltongue:

Regardless, I'd also like to put forward the Vanara race from OA, because monkey people are fun to play. I may have some more suggestions, if I can remember what other races I've enjoyed playing.

One suggestion a poster :smalltongue: Which means I'm going to wait on confirmation with vanara versus true dragon.

As for true dragon... There are issues. Many many issues. The greatest is the wildly ranging LAs. Ignoring non-core dragons, and only looking at wyrmlings, starting ECL ranges from 5 to 12 so you'd get into the paragon class at 6th to 13th. Now of course by focusing on things like damaging breath weapon, and abilities that scale with dragon HD/age category you can make it work for all dragons still. That said still looking at Core only let's compare some dragons. Black Dragon (ECL 7) has Tiny size, 4 HD, +2 Con, -2 Int and Cha, and 2d4 line breath, also a swim speed. Brass Dragon (ECL 6) has Tiny size, 4 HD, +2 Con, a burrow speed, 1d6 line breath and a cone of no HD cap sleep breath. Brass dragon is much stronger than Black Dragon (cone of sleep and a bonus level). In general the metalic dragons are significantly stronger (-3 LA and a red dragon is capable of keeping up with a crusader at roughly equal optimization level, you can't quite do just -3 LA across the board even with chromatics but it gets close), and ultimately that is what makes it harder than White v Red. So while True Dragon will be allowed if you go with it, it might be better to go with Chromatic Dragon or Metallic Dragon, for example, as it will probably be a higher quality result. That is unless you really want to have something that works for any of the 60 ish true dragons out there.

[Draconium]

One suggestion a poster :smalltongue: Which means I'm going to wait on confirmation with vanara versus true dragon.

As for true dragon... There are issues. Many many issues. The greatest is the wildly ranging LAs. Ignoring non-core dragons, and only looking at wyrmlings, starting ECL ranges from 5 to 12 so you'd get into the paragon class at 6th to 13th. Now of course by focusing on things like damaging breath weapon, and abilities that scale with dragon HD/age category you can make it work for all dragons still. That said still looking at Core only let's compare some dragons. Black Dragon (ECL 7) has Tiny size, 4 HD, +2 Con, -2 Int and Cha, and 2d4 line breath, also a swim speed. Brass Dragon (ECL 6) has Tiny size, 4 HD, +2 Con, a burrow speed, 1d6 line breath and a cone of no HD cap sleep breath. Brass dragon is much stronger than Black Dragon (cone of sleep and a bonus level). In general the metalic dragons are significantly stronger (-3 LA and a red dragon is capable of keeping up with a crusader at roughly equal optimization level, you can't quite do just -3 LA across the board even with chromatics but it gets close), and ultimately that is what makes it harder than White v Red. So while True Dragon will be allowed if you go with it, it might be better to go with Chromatic Dragon or Metallic Dragon, for example, as it will probably be a higher quality result. That is unless you really want to have something that works for any of the 60 ish true dragons out there.

Allow me to clarify - Vanara was my suggestion, I was just inquiring about True Dragons for future reference (like if you allow a second suggestion later, or you do Take 4). I'll keep your thoughts in mind, though.

[Vertharrad]

Is it okay to suggest Janni from the MM1?

[VoodooPaladin]

Hmm... three shapeshifters, four undead, three goblins, two humans, two elves, two druid-types, three orientals...

The Dokufu is too high level, so I'll elect the Hengeyokai onto the options list in its place.

All these good choices, the hard part will be deciding which ones to not vote for. :smallbiggrin:

[Grand Arbiter]

Sources, sources. How am I supposed to know whether you mean the Races of Faerun version or the Dragon #319 version which has 3 bonus power points... and a power they autoknow but it's low light vision and they're a monstrous humanoid so have darkvision so meh. Or I assume they have darkvision it doesn't say they don't. It does say Centaurs do... Great now I have to track down my Monsters of Faerun.

Yes, I am referring to the Forgotten Realms version.
The Athasian version is an ugly psionic buzzard. 'Nuff said.
Sorry for not specifying (sooner).

That reminds me; I have an NPC/PC idea that I need to flesh out at some point. An aaracockra diviner referred to by the monicker "The Swami"...

The idea came to me after I saw the Rio 2 movie. There's a cockatoo that had a brief stint as a fortune teller for a booth of some kind.

[Zaydos]

Is it okay to suggest Janni from the MM1?

Most certainly. I mean even if for some arbitrary reason I'd say no (I'm not but talking hypothetically) it doesn't fall under any of the nos (it has listed LA, it's less then 18 ECL) so I wouldn't be mad even if there was some reason I felt the need to say no (not that I can think of one for janni, other than ow that LA hurts, and worse still it seems to just be there because at-will Plane Shift, admittedly at-will Plane Shift is a major game changer even limited to Inner Planes + Prime but still).


Hmm... three shapeshifters, four undead, three goblins, two humans, two elves, two druid-types, three orientals...

The Dokufu is too high level, so I'll elect the Hengeyokai onto the options list in its place.

All these good choices, the hard part will be deciding which ones to not vote for. :smallbiggrin:

"WELL THAT'S SIMPLE. ILLISWORTH EXPLAIN THE PROPER DECISION."

"Obviously the answer is to not vote for all the ones which are not shapeshifters, this is not because my master is a changel-"

"ILIISWORTH! SILENCE YOURSELF OR I WILL SILENCE YOU FOR YOU!"

(Illisworth needs a speech color.)


Yes, I am referring to the Forgotten Realms version.
The Athasian version is an ugly psionic buzzard. 'Nuff said.
Sorry for not specifying (sooner).

That reminds me; I have an NPC/PC idea that I need to flesh out at some point. An aaracockra diviner referred to by the monicker "The Swami"...

The idea came to me after I saw the Rio 2 movie. There's a cockatoo that had a brief stint as a fortune teller for a booth of some kind.

Mostly I just had to find where non-Athasian ones were to be found, and hey Dark Sun is my... um... 3rd favorite official setting.

[Draconium]

(Illisworth needs a speech color.)

Purple? Pink? This? Or that?

[VoodooPaladin]

(Illisworth needs a speech color.)


Purple? Pink? This? Or that?

Shall we vote, or just set some gnomes up with color-coded rags and see which one escapes the pit first/at all?

[khadgar567]

Is homebrew creatures are on table if yes then i nominate peanut dracolich as my sugestion

[Zaydos]

Purple? Pink? This? Or that?


Shall we vote, or just set some gnomes up with color-coded rags and see which one escapes the pit first/at all?

I have created monsters. Monsters! THOUGH I MUST ADMIT THAT SEEING A MASS GNOME MELEE IS APPEALING.


Is homebrew creatures are on table if yes then i nominate peanut dracolich as my sugestion

They are but the odds I will veto them rise significantly. In this case Peanut Dragon is not because it has no listed LA (and it's CR is badly done, comparing to core dragons Fire Vulnerability does not make up for the increased nat armor and DR so it should be at least CR 3 at wyrmling) probably would peg it at 4 or 5 compared to official dragon LAs but then I have to figure out the higher age categories and blegh, and I'm going to say no to specific creatures with templates applied, and lastly dracolich has a minimum ECL of greater than 20 as true dragons have at minimum 3 HD/age category and old is the 7th age category (21 HD; yeah the epic feats thing is just pointing out that as written all are epic by old despite less than 20 CR) and it may only be applied to old or older dragons.

[Zaydos]

https://media.giphy.com/media/l2JInQdBPv4NOwlG0/giphy.gif


I DECLARE THAT VOTING HAS OFFICIAL BEGUN! YOU MAY EACH VOTE FOR AS MANY RACES AS YOU CHOOSE, BUT ONLY THE THREE BEST RACES, AS DETERMINED BY YOUR VOTING, WILL HAVE PARAGON CLASSES BESTOWED UPON THEM BY ME, ZAYDOS THE GIANT FLOATING HEAD ILLUSION GREAT AND POWERFUL!

Rules: In plain language look at the List below. Choose any number of races you'd like to vote for. Vote for them. Next weekend I will close voting (probably the 17th) and make the top 3 choices. In the cases of ties I will break ties myself.

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.


In addition over the next seven days I have decided to offer myself a challenge to make 7 PrCs in 7 days (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?500120-7-Days-7-PrCs-a-Self-Challenge&p=21187907#post21187907) if you'd like to encourage, heckle, suggest things, or tell me what music you think is most stimulating to the creation of PrCs feel free to do so in the linked thread.

[Temotei]

Bhuka, blue, goblin, hadozee, kenku, warforged.

[CinuzIta]

Gravetouched Ghoul, Satyr, Goblin, Minotaur, Centaur, Raptoran, Vanara

[Grand Arbiter]

Aaracockra
Blue
Poisondusk Lizardfolk



Mostly I just had to find where non-Athasian ones were to be found, and hey Dark Sun is my... um... 3rd favorite official setting.

I have nothing against Athas, as it is a pretty interesting setting. I just feel they could've done better for the aaracockra than making them look like vultures. A desert hawk or something like that would've been much better.

[PapaQuackers]

Satyr, Ghost, and uhhh rytaS and tsohG.

[GnomishPride]

Centaur
Duergar (non-psionic)
Goblin
Half-Celestial
Lich
Svirfneblin
Warforged
Thri-Kreen

As the resident gnome expert, I could Illisworth with a violet.

[Zaydos]

VOTES TALLIED!

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.




Tallied Votes:


Goblin 3
Blue 2
Centaur 2
Satyr 2
Warforged 2
Aarakocra 1
Bhuka 1
Duergar (I am not going to specify, if they want to be psionic duergar they can be) 1
Gravetouched Ghoul 1
Hadozee 1
Half-Celestial 1
Ghost 1
Kenku 1
Lich 1
Minotaur 1
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk 1
Raptoran 1
Svirfneblin 1
Thri-Kreen 1
Vanara 1



Welcome one and all to todays episode of Sneaking into a Mad Mage's Laboratory. In our last episode we showed you for one time only the origin of the owlbear (and how it relates to the origin of the bugbear), but today we find an empty workshop. So let's get playing. :belkar:

Into this cauldron we'll add some of these umm... 'Genitive Essences'. Ever wonder how mage's bottle these things? I mean they have the sound of a cat's footsteps right next to the Genitive Essence of a Ghoul what even is the Genitive Essense of a Ghoul? Well only one way I can think of to find out :belkar:

And into the cauldron it goes, those bubbles are a bit disquieting, but lets add some others duergar are tough, maybe it'll create a ghouldwarf? What about thri-kreen... vanara... raptoran...

*time passes and many genitive essences are applied*

And now we wait... I hope spilling that whole bottle of goblin in didn't do anything unfortunate...

Um... is that a mechanical goblin-goattaur? It has a spear...

*please excuse our technical difficulties*


[QUOTE=Libro;21188661]I have nothing against Athas, as it is a pretty interesting setting. I just feel they could've done better for the aaracockra than making them look like vultures. A desert hawk or something like that would've been much better.

Too much Arrakis in Athas for desert hawks. To put it another way on Athas desert hawks end up becoming vultures to survive. Nothing noble was allowed to survive the setting without becoming base. At least before they made some questionable expansions outside of the Tyr region.

[khadgar567]

vampire and pixie

[UrsusArctos]

Blue
Goblin
Warforged
Thri-Kreen
Ghost

[nonsi]

.
The races I'd want to see handled are:

Lich - I'm a lot more interested in the special features than if their spellcasting progression will be full or 2/3. It seems like everything's been said already about them and I'm intrigued to see if you could add something new to their repertoire.
Satyr - Just because they're mythical creatures and they've never received the love they deserve (and they badly need whatever you could give them).
Succubus - They're quite dangerous as long as you're not on to them. I'd like to see what you'd be able to give them for when someone is on to them.
Pixie - Tinkerbelle duh.

[ImperatorV]

Ghost, Pixie, Modron, Vampire.

[Draconium]

Vanara, Thri-Kreen, Rakshasa, Raptoran, and Warforged are the options that really stick out to me, so I shall vote for those five.

[Zaydos]

VOTES TALLIED!

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.




Tallied Votes:


Goblin 4
Warforged 4
Blue 3
Ghost 3
Pixie 3
Satyr 3
Thri-Kreen 3
Centaur 2
Lich 2
Raptoran 2
Vampire 2
Vanara 2
Aarakocra 1
Bhuka 1
Duergar (I am not going to specify, if they want to be psionic duergar they can be) 1
Gravetouched Ghoul 1
Hadozee 1
Half-Celestial 1
Kenku 1
Minotaur 1
Modron 1
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk 1
Rakshasa 1
Succubus 1
Svirfneblin 1



We return now to Sneaking into a Mad Mage's Laboratory. Since we were last forced to leave, your gallant host has managed to survive the mecha-goblin-goattuar, but its transformations did not end there. While its hind legs have thankfully vanished into the aether so too has the rest of its body! Or so I thought until it hit me. It seems to have become invisible, incorporeal and capable of throwing around my equipment as if it were nothing. Please send help! I don't like goblin poltergeists!


.
The races I'd want to see handled are:

Lich - I'm a lot more interested in the special features than if their spellcasting progression will be full or 2/3. It seems like everything's been said already about them and I'm intrigued to see if you could add something new to their repertoire.
Satyr - Just because they're mythical creatures and they've never received the love they deserve (and they badly need whatever you could give them).
Succubus - They're quite dangerous as long as you're not on to them. I'd like to see what you'd be able to give them for when someone is on to them.
Pixie - Tinkerbelle duh.

I've actually got an ability for each of those except Satyr typed up for a teaser later if they get enough votes (at the moment Goblins and Warforged would get teasers and I've not started even thinking on those yet), but the real importance of which casting to go with for Lich is just how many other abilities they will get. Succubus at some point I need to figure out what non mind-affecting abilities to give them because as much as I'd like to just focus on their mind-affecting... it's not mechanically viable and so I'll have to balance things. For Lich what I was thinking for one feature (not necessarily everything it gets at the level have to do some work on it there) was the ability to make anyone who touches a paralyzed target get paralyzed... at which point I might have to include notes on using paralyzed rats as improvized thrown ranged touch weapons.

[VoodooPaladin]

Adu'ja, Aquatic Elf, Bhuka, Blue, Bralani Eladrin, Hagspawn, Half-Celestial, Hengeyokai, Kenku, Mummy, Pixie, Rakshasa, Satyr, Spirit Folk, Succubus, Svirfneblin, Vanara, Wild Elf, Yuan-ti Pureblood, Thri-Kreen


...and on a personal note, I have a question. Does it still count as throwing darts at a wall if you're using a shotgun?

[Vertharrad]

Wild Elf, Bralani Eladrin, Elan, Half-Celestial, Janni, Succubus, Blue, Centaur, Lich, Vampire, Svirfneblin, Satyr, Thri-Kreen, Minotaur, Rakshasa, Ghost

[Zaydos]

VOTES TALLIED!

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.




Tallied Votes:


Blue 5
Satyr 5
Thri-Kreen 5
Ghost 4
Goblin 4
Pixie 4
Warforged 4
Centaur 3
Half-Celestial 3
Lich 3
Rakshasa 3
Succubus 3
Svirfneblin 3
Vampire 3
Vanara 3
Bhuka 2
Bralani Eladrin 2
Kenku 2
Minotaur 2
Raptoran 2
Wild Elf 2
Aarakocra 1
Adu'ja 1
Aquatic Elf 1
Duergar (I am not going to specify, if they want to be psionic duergar they can be) 1
Elan 1
Gravetouched Ghoul 1
Hadozee 1
Hagspawn 1
Hengeyokai 1
Janni 1
Modron 1
Mummy 1
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk 1
Spirit Folk 1
Yuan-ti Pureblood 1


Help hasn't come and what's worse this thing keeps ego whipping me! It seems to have developed psionic powers, and if the momentarily visible wings were any indication it seems to be part angel for some reason. I thankfully found a portable dome of force to hide under and an ungent of see invisibility, but I am still terrified of this four armed goblin insecto-bot... why is it playing the pipes!



[QUOTE=VoodooPaladin;21190684]...and on a personal note, I have a question. Does it still count as throwing darts at a wall if you're using a shotgun?

Nah, we call that destroying bar property. Oh and there will be a fine :smalltongue:

[PapaQuackers]

My Satyr underlings gain power. I shall release Panic upon the land.

[GnomishPride]

The deep gnomes rise! Yassss!

[archon1212]

Gravetouched Ghoul
Thri-Kreen
Minotaur
Blue
Duergar; psionic
Elan

[Zaydos]

VOTES TALLIED!

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.




Tallied Votes:


Blue 6
Thri-Kreen 6
Satyr 5
Ghost 4
Goblin 4
Pixie 4
Warforged 4
Centaur 3
Half-Celestial 3
Lich 3
Minotaur 3
Rakshasa 3
Succubus 3
Svirfneblin 3
Vampire 3
Vanara 3
Bhuka 2
Bralani Eladrin 2
Duergar (I am not going to specify, if they want to be psionic duergar they can be) 2
Elan 2
Gravetouched Ghoul 2
Kenku 2
Raptoran 2
Wild Elf 2
Aarakocra 1
Adu'ja 1
Aquatic Elf 1
Hadozee 1
Hagspawn 1
Hengeyokai 1
Janni 1
Modron 1
Mummy 1
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk 1
Spirit Folk 1
Yuan-ti Pureblood 1


The pipes have stopped, thank the glorious HYPNOGOBLIN. Now I just have to worry about its GLORIOUS ego whipping and the four arms with which its mixing potions. Why is MY LORD AND MASTER mixing potions?!

In a more serious note wanted to say voting is officially more than half done (as it will close most likely on Sunday). Blue and Thri-Kreen seem to have a substantial lead since voting has also died down a fair bit.

[ShiningStarling]

i... WAN VOte!!!11!!

I wan... gHOSTIE GOO gO boooOOO!OO!OOO!!!!
an an... Peixes!!!!! sO PREETAY
oh an you AND ME!! er uh,,, yu do re mi??!? da kinda snek peoples!!!!!
OH yaYA!!! an dah TIGGER PEEPHOLE!!!

*mist lifts from her eyes*

Um... not sure what happened there.

Ghosts, Pixies, Rakshasa, and Yuan-ti Pureblood for me please... and also ignore whatever that was up there... I think it might have been a rogue spirit of chaos... stand by for magical difficulties.

[Lemmy]

Huh... I'll go with Centaur and Janni. :)

[GnomishPride]

[insert witty Svirfneblin promo here]

[Zaydos]

VOTES TALLIED!

THE LIST


Aarakockra (Races of Faerun)
Adu'ja (Dragon #317) No idea what I'd give them, except +1 to 3 levels of druid casting (since druid is the one spellcasting class that loses enough class features to give them interesting stuff, it is extremely thematically appropriate, and they have that killer +2 LA already)
Aquatic Elf
Bhuka (Sandstorm) These will be hard.
Blue (Expanded Psionics Handbook) Would of course advance Psion some, not sure what else.
Bralani Eladrin
Centaur
Duergar (if you vote for duergar include Psionic or Non-Psionic, while duergar will be tallied together regardless, I will go with which of the two gets more votes)
Elan (Expanded Psionics Handbook)
Ghost
Goblin
Gravetouched Ghoul (Libris Mortis) Maybe give stench and paralysis affects elves, already made stench a feat, though, decisions decisions. Eating humanoids heals them?
Hadozee (Stormwrack) While true flight is tempting it takes away. Referencing Spelljammer is probably a poor idea. Hmm...
Hagspawn (Unapproachable East) I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel. I will not make Grendel.
Half-Celestial
Half-Ogre (Races of Destiny)
Hengeyokai (OA)
Jaebrin (MMV)
Janni
Kenku (MMIII)
Lich I.e. 3 level full caster PrC whose only requirement is you be a lich. Now the question is... do they get full casting for the levels or not...
Minotaur Hmm... Melee of course. Some things for using size against smaller foes. Some non-combat stuff as little 'ribbons' even if strong.
Mummy Something to build on Despair, and probably should look at Sandstorm
Neanderthal (Frostburn) Will have to look up their stats.
Pixie Bonus HP!
Poisondusk Lizardfolk (Monster Manual 3)
Rakshasa
Raptoran (Races of the Wild) Aerial superiority abilities. I don't really know, never liked raptorans.
Rogue Modron (what Dragon #354 calls Exiled Modron because... they changed the 2e terms around arbitrarily).
Satyr Get the ability to use pipes for Charm Monster, and increased HD cap on Sleep, gain Bardic Music abilities as a bard twice their paragon level.
Spirit Folk (Oriental Adventures)
Succubus This one could be fun. Will be difficult.
Svirfneblin
Vampire
Vanara (OA)
Warforged (Eberron Campaign Setting) I'd give a bonus body feat but feels weird to hand that out above 1st. I'd give increased construct traits but there's Warforged Juggernaut for that. Well ok improve their composite plating in a way that improves all but the 'doesn't have composite plating' feat (which gets something different somehow), and go from there.
Wild Elf
Yamabito (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?407053-Yamabito-%28New-human-subrace-natural-initiators%29) (because why not, vanity go!)
Yuan-ti Pureblood Charm Monster and Fear SLAs, Poison Bite, lots of deception abilities, possibly a full +3 casting with their RHD + LA since those kill their ability to play casters and going +3 levels of casting PLUS level appropriate class features might make the 1 level dip into casting worth it.
Thri-Kreen Well let's think, full BAB, multi-weapon fighting... any in class bonus damage or just a focus on making other sources of bonus damage better? Oh and improvements to their existing psionic powers, but no actual psionic advancement.




Tallied Votes:


Blue 6
Thri-Kreen 6
Ghost 5
Pixie 5
Satyr 5
Centaur 4
Goblin 4
Warforged 4
Half-Celestial 3
Lich 3
Minotaur 3
Rakshasa 4
Succubus 3
Svirfneblin 3
Vampire 3
Vanara 3
Bhuka 2
Bralani Eladrin 2
Duergar (I am not going to specify, if they want to be psionic duergar they can be) 2
Elan 2
Gravetouched Ghoul 2
Janni 2
Kenku 2
Raptoran 2
Wild Elf 2
Yuan-ti Pureblood 2
Aarakocra 1
Adu'ja 1
Aquatic Elf 1
Hadozee 1
Hagspawn 1
Hengeyokai 1
Modron 1
Mummy 1
Poison Dusk Lizardfolk 1
Spirit Folk 1



The GLORIOUS MASTER OF THE DE the thing has turned ethereal again, and invisible. Why? There are dancing images of luscious gems. Beckoning to me. Beautiful... they're illusions. I'm a gnome I should know better. I should know better! *incoherent sobbing*

Voting will semi-officially close in 2 hours. In reality that is when I will begin one of Blue or Thri-Kreen paragon. Since there is a massive tie for 3rd place I will not be closing voting immediately. If someone votes and breaks the tie I may close it immediately or you know miss the window.


i... WAN VOte!!!11!!

I wan... gHOSTIE GOO gO boooOOO!OO!OOO!!!!
an an... Peixes!!!!! sO PREETAY
oh an you AND ME!! er uh,,, yu do re mi??!? da kinda snek peoples!!!!!
OH yaYA!!! an dah TIGGER PEEPHOLE!!!

*mist lifts from her eyes*

Um... not sure what happened there.

Ghosts, Pixies, Rakshasa, and Yuan-ti Pureblood for me please... and also ignore whatever that was up there... I think it might have been a rogue spirit of chaos... stand by for magical difficulties.

Chaos spirit possession happens to most of us eventually. There are even people claiming I was temporarily replaced by a group of gnomes in a dragon-corpse. Can you believe it? Though I will say cursed chaos spirit, ghost, pixie, satyr is a tie I don't want to have to break.


[insert witty Svirfneblin promo here]

It'll need to be real witty, GnomishPride, it'll need to be real witty.

[Zaydos]

Thri-Kreen (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?500961-Thri-Kreen-Paragon-(3-level-racial-paragon-class)) and Blue (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?501127-Blue-Paragon-(3-level-racial-paragon-class)) paragons are up.

Now the question...

With satyrs would you say that their sleep pipes can affect creatures with more than 4 HD or not. I mean I'd definitely rule that their charm person pipes only affect humanoids, but I'm not 100% sure of the intent with sleep (my gut would be go with 4 HD limit but)


Pipes (Su)

Satyrs can play a variety of magical tunes on their pan pipes. Usually, only one satyr in a group carries pipes. When it plays, all creatures within a 60-foot spread (except satyrs) must succeed on a DC 13 Will save or be affected by charm person, sleep, or fear (caster level 10th; the satyr chooses the tune and its effect).

In the hands of other beings, these pipes have no special powers. A creature that successfully saves against any of the pipe’s effects cannot be affected by the same set of pipes for 24 hours. The save DC is Charisma-based.

[Zaydos]

With the completion of Satyr Paragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?501418-Satyr-Paragon-(3-level-racial-paragon-class)&p=21229424#post21229424) I declare this round over and done with.