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Arzar
2016-09-08, 01:35 AM
Dissatisfied with the options for making a Warcraft style Demon Hunter I opted to make my own homebrew. Criticisms about balance and cost of abilities would be greatly appreciated.




Level
Proficiency
Chaos Points
Features


1
+2
-
Spectral Sight, Unarmoured Defence


2
+2
2
Power of Chaos


3
+2
3
Mark of the Demon


4
+2
4
Ability Score Improvement


5
+3
5
Extra Attack, Eternal Hunt


6
+3
6
Mark Feature


7
+3
7
Demonic Glide


8
+3
8
Ability Score Improvement


9
+4
9
Hunter's Tongues


10
+4
10
Mark Feature


11
+4
11
Chaotic Rend


12
+4
12
Ability Score Improvement


13
+5
13
Summoning Mastery


14
+5
14
Mark Feature


15
+5
15
Demonic Wings


16
+5
16
Ability Score Improvement


17
+6
17
Imprison, Fel Athenaeum


18
+6
18
Mark Feature


19
+6
19
Ability Score Improvement


20
+6
20
Demon's Soul



Your hit dice is 1d8
Your hit points at level 1 is 8 plus your constitution modifier
Your hit points at every level thereafter is 1d8 plus your Constituion modifier


Proficiencies
Armour: Light armour
Weapons: All one handed weapons
Tools: none
Saving throws: Dexterity, Intelligence
Skills: choose two from perception, arcana, history, acrobatics, deception, intimidation and religion

Equipment
You start with the following...
A) Two warglaives or B) two one handed weapons
A) Four daggers or B) two handaxes
Leather armour
An explorer’s pack

Unarmoured Defense
When you are not wearing any armour your AC is equal to 10 + dexterity modifier + intelligence modifier

Spectral Sight
At 1st level you have taken a ritual to remove your eyes, and have gained sight beyond sight. Your sight remains normal as per your race, however as an action you may activate spectral sight and you can see the locations of fiends, demons, Devils, hidden or invisible creatures and magic and magical effects within 60 feet until the end of your next turn. You may do this an amount of times equal to your intelligence modifier.


Power of Chaos
At 2nd level you have tapped into a well of chaotic power. You have a number of chaos points that is equal to your Demon Hunter levels. You may spend chaos points to use chaotic abilities. You regenerate these points on a short rest. Two abilities are

Fel Rush
You may spend your action and one chaos point to rush forwards 30 feet, and make a melee attack on an enemy that you pass. You may spend extra chaos points to increase the amount of enemies you may attack as you pass.

Vengeful Retreat
You may spend your action and two chaos points to leap backwards and away from the enemy, dealing 1d4 slashing damage. You move 30 feet backwards and this movement does not promote attacks of opportunity.

Some abilities you use require the enemy to make a saving throw. The save DC is equal to 8 + your proficiency + your intelligence.

Mark of the demon
At 3rd level, you gain a demonic mark that represents the path you have chosen. Pick between Havoc and Vengeance, which are detailed at the end of this article.


Ability Score Improvement
At 4th level, and again at 8th, 12th, 16th and 19th level you may increase one of your ability scores by two or two of your ability scores by one.

Extra Attack
At 5th level, when you take the attack option on your turn, you can attack twice instead of once.

Eternal Hunt
At 5th level, your knowledge of demons and their nature has begun to expand. You gain advantage on any checks made to discern what type of demon a fiend is. Additionally, you gain advantage on checks to track demons and fiends.


Demonic Glide
At 7th level you are able to summon bat like wings from your back. Your long and high jump distance is doubled. Additionally, you can spend 1 chaos point to cast feather fall upon yourself, using your wings to glide down or 2 chaos points to cast levitate and use your wings to mimic the effect. If you use any of these features and you are wearing clothing or armour not built to function with wings, they are destroyed.

Hunter’s Tongues
At 9th level, your study of the way demons and creatures of the lower planes has granted you great knowledge of how to deceive your foes. You learn the languages Abyssal and Infernal and gain advantage on social checks with fiends.

Chaotic Rend
At 11th level you have become so suffused with chaotic power that each of your strikes rends the very soul of your target. Your attacks deal an extra 1d6 damage.

Summoning Mastery
At 13th level, you have learnt how to discern demonic summoning runes. You gain proficiency in checks to figure out information about the summoning of fiends and demons. Additionally, you passively know which plane of existence a fiend will return to upon its death, unless it is of a particularly archaic form.


Demonic Wings
You gain a flying speed equal to double your walking speed. Every turn you are flying you must pay a chaos point. You can pay two chaos points to soar 60 feet into the air without provoking attacks of opportunity as bonus action.

Imprison
At 17th level you gain the ability to imprison a being in a cage of blighted power. The being has its movement speed reduced to zero and is unable to attack. If the being is damaged this effect ends, and it also ends if the being succeeds on a wisdom saving throw. If a fiend, devil or demon is imprisoned it also gains weakness to all damage. You may use this ability once per short rest

Fel Athenaeum
You have gained access to a grand library of knowledge on all demons and fiends. You may perform a ritual that costs 150 gold in readily available reagents such as charcoal and brimstone to summon a tome full of knowledge on a specific type of demon. This ritual takes an hour and may be performed during a short or long rest. This gives you access to knowledge about resistances, weakness, summoning rituals and the modus operandi of one type of demon until you recast the ritual.

Demon’s Soul
At 20th level, you are so infused with the power of the lower planes that your soul begins to mimic those of the demons. When your hit points is reduced to 0 and you fail your death saving throws, instead of dying your soul ventures to the lower planes with all your equipment. You leave a pile of ash and your heart as remains instead of a corpse. You remain in the lower planes until a ritual is performed to summon you using your heart, or the spell ‘ressurection’ is cast on it or the spell ‘true ressurection’. The ritual costs 250 gold in readily available reagents and requires a full caster of at least level 10 to complete.

Demonic Mark
At 3rd level you must choose between a demonic mark, Havoc or Vengeance.

Havoc

A strong wielder of chaotic Fel Magic, able to destroy and dismantle his enemies with the power of the demons they slay.
When you first take the mark of havoc at 3rd level you learn how to change yourself into a demon. You gain the ability metamorphosis and can use it twice every long rest. When you use metamorphosis you gain the following properties.

Your creature type is considered demon.
Your speed increases by 10.
Metamorphosis lasts for 30 seconds
Your attacks, and all attacks against you, have advantage.

Eye Beam
At 6th level you gain the ability to fire a blast of Fel energy from your eye sockets in exchange for 3 chaos points.. You deal 3d8 damage to all enemies in front of you, 2d8 damage to anyone directly behind them and 1d8 damage to anyone directly behind them. Eye beam’s range is 15 feet. The enemy may make a dexterity saving throw to half the damage.

Throw Glaive
At 10th level, you can expend 3 chaos points and summon a blade of Fel energy and hurl it at a target. You make a ranged attack upon an enemy and two within 15 feet. If successful, deal your regular attack damage and afflict the enemy with Felblight, dealing 1d4 damage at the start of an enemy’s turn for one minute or until they can make a constitution saving throw.

Blade Dance
At 14th level, you gain the ability to perform a blade dance by spending 3 chaos points. All enemies within a 5 foot circle around you must make a dexterity saving throw. If they succeed they take half damage but if they fail they take full damage. You deal 2d8 slashing damage. You also gain the effects as if you had used the dodge action.

Fel Barrage
At 18th level you have learnt how to let out a blast of chaotic Fel power, stunning and damaging all who surround you. Everyone surrounding you You also deal 5d8 necrotic damage that deal full damage against people that have resistance to necrotic damage and half damage to those with immunity. Once you have used this ability you cannot use it again until you have finished a long rest.

Vengeance
A defensive pact, those who take vengeance shrug off blows that would kill mortal men, using the power of the Fel to heal and reduce damage.

When you first take the mark of vengeance at 3rd level you gain the ability metamorphosis. You are able to use this ability to transform into a demon. You may use this ability an amount of times equal to your intelligence modifier, minimum 1. Metamorphosis lasts for 30 seconds. While active, you gain the following features

Your creature type is considered demon
You gain resistance to nonmagical bludgeoning, slashing, piercing damage and fire, electric, cold, poison and necrotic damage.
You gain weakness to radiant and psychic damage.

Fiery Brand
At 6th level, you have the power to invoke a runic brand of flames upon the enemy. As an action, you may force an enemy to make a wisdom saving throw, or they suffer disadvantage when attacking you or anyone within melee range of you. This lasts until the beginning of your next turn. You may use this feature an amount of times equal to your intelligence modifier.

Demon Spikes
At 10th level you have the knowledge of how to summon horrid, ebony spikes to enhance your armour. You gain +1 AC and you may use a reaction to add 3 AC after being attacked but before the attack is resolved. This costs one chaos point.

Immolation Aura
At 14th level you have learnt how to burst out fire offensively. You can spend 3 chaos points to let out a burst of flames around you, dealing 2d8 fire damage to everyone within a 15 foot radius. Anyone who has taken damage will also take another 1d8 fire damage at the end of their turn until they can make a constitution saving throw.

Sigils
At 18th level you have mastered your power and have gained Sigils that can be used to harm or hinder enemies. Each Sigils costs five chaos points to use and each Sigils has a ten foot radius.

Sigil of chains
Enemies thin the Sigil have their speed reduced to zero for one minute. They may make a strength saving throw at the beginning of their turn to break this effect.

Sigil of Misery
All enemies within the Sigil must make a wisdom saving throw to avoid being feared for one minute or until they can make a wisdom saving throw at the beginning of their turns to resist this effect.

Sigil of Silence
Everyone within the Sigil is silenced for one minute.

Rerem115
2016-09-08, 03:55 AM
First off, this needs some 5e love. Durations are not measured in rounds; common durations are "Until the end/start of your next turn", "Until the start/end of their next turn," 1 minute, 10 minutes, 1 hour, 8 hours.

Secondly, you don't have a recharge time for your Chaos Points. Since you gain them like Ki, I'm assuming short rest.

Thirdly, how does the extra d8s from Demon's Bite work? It says you use your bonus action to add them to your attack; but which part? Every damage roll? The first damage roll? The attack roll?

Fourthly, Metamorphosis is absolutely bonkers. Let's start with Havoc Mark. A 3rd level ability should not grant a 60 foot walking speed, a 120 foot fly speed, doubled smite? damage, and an additional 1d4 (scaling up to 1d8) damage per attack. Disregarding the insane movement speed, your damage at level 3+ is very high. Here's some math (assuming dual wielding, and Demon's Bite only adds damage to your next successful attack):

[1d6 (weapon) + 1d4 (Metamorphosis)] x 2 + [6d8 (Demon's Bite) + 3 = approximately 20 DPR, with an additional 30 on the first attack the next round. Compare that to the king of pre-5 damage, the Hunter Ranger: 4d6 + 1d8 + 6 = 27 DPR, but requires concentration. Now, that is less DPR, but the Demon Hunter doesn't require concentration to maintain his damage, and can do an additional 30 damage at the start of the fight. Let's take a look at level 11:

[1d6 (weapon) + 1d6 (Metamorphosis) + 1d6 (Chaotic Rend)] x 3 + [22d8 (Demon's Bite) + 10] = 46 DPR, plus an extra 110 damage over the next 3 rounds, vs the Ranger's 6d6 + 1d8 + 15, or 43 DPR, which requires concentration. By the time you reach 20th level, you're dealing 52 DPR (Which I'll admit, is fair), but with an additional 40d8 (200) damage over the next 4 rounds.

To fix this, the fly speed has to go. You can keep a movement speed buff, but definitely not 30; 10 seems appropriate. The extra damage on transformation has to go, or at least be limited to 1d4; you already have smites. Speaking of which, the part that says your smite is doubled has to go.

Eye Beam needs a save, but it's damage is actually pretty weak.

Throw Glaive is way too strong. With one use, you deal weapon damage to 3 people (fine), they bleed for 1d4 (fine, but needs a set duration; until they save is ridiculous), and inflict each of them with Exhaustion until they make a save (Not kosher; no PC abilities, AFAIK, inflict Exhaustion on the enemy, and for good reason. Exhaustion is extremely debilitating. The first gives Disadvantage on ability checks, the second halves your speed, the third gives Disadvantage on attack rolls and saving throws (!), the fourth halves your max hp (!!), the 5th reduces your speed to 0 (!!!), and the 6th is instant death (!!!!)). Being able to do that to 3 people, up to 10 times per day, is insane. Throw Glaive has to get rid of the Exhaustion rider.

Blade Dance is Dodge + 2d8 in a 10 foot radius? That's a really long reach; 5 would be more appropriate.

Fel Barrage should reduce its damage on a successful save.

Let's move on to Vengeance Mark, then. The resistances are fine, in and of themselves, but what theme are you going for? At this point, you're a Paladin/Ranger/Bearbarian whose smites recharge on a short rest. The temp hp, however, should go; you're already really tanky from the resistances, you don't need an additional 6-25 hp every time you roll initiative. The healing definitely has to go; the only class in 5e to get fast healing is the Champion, and it's their capstone, can't heal them above one-half, and heals them an average of 1 less.

Shear is also way too strong; when you first get it, you deal an average of 8-12 damage (depending on weaponry), so you'd heal 16-18 hit points. At later levels, you could be dealing 20-23 damage, thus healing for 30-33 hit points. From level 6 to level 20, it's stronger than most healing spells, lets you deal damage, and you can use it up to 30 times a day. I'd recommend changing this for a completely new feature.

Demon Spikes is probably balanced, I just don't like it. I loathe flat AC bonuses.

Immolation Aura is probably fine as is.

The Sigils are balanced, they just need to be cleaned up. They need 5e durations, and what does rooted mean?

Demonic Glide is fine.

I'm fine with Chaotic Rend, but it should probably be reworded to just "Your attacks deal an additional 1d6 damage."

Blur is game breaking. You can take the Dodge action as a reaction, and benefit from it until the end of my 3rd turn? That thumbs its nose at the concept of action economy, and makes you ludicrously hard to hit while still doing full damage. This should be replaced with a completely different feature.

Demonic Wings is fine; it's like the Draconic Sorcerer's wings, only at a later level and with a maintenance cost.

Demon Soul is fine.


Overall, I'd suggest you ask yourself what kind of class you want this to be, because right now it looks like you tried taking the best aspects of the Paladin, Barbarian, and the Monk and called it a demon. Nothing really stands out as "Demon Hunter" (Granted, I've never played WoW, but when I hear Demon Hunter, I picture a person who hunts demons, not a paladin/barbarian/monk that is occasionally a demon) except for the Metamorphoses...which don't come online until 3rd level and are horribly unbalanced in their current state. You have two abilities that don't directly deal with combat...and they're your Tier 1 and your capstone. This class needs some serious rebalancing, a more clearly defined and distinct flavor and purpose, and more than just combat abilities.

Arzar
2016-09-08, 06:26 AM
First off, this needs some 5e love. Durations are not measured in rounds; common durations are "Until the end/start of your next turn", "Until the start/end of their next turn," 1 minute, 10 minutes, 1 hour, 8 hours.

Secondly, you don't have a recharge time for your Chaos Points. Since you gain them like Ki, I'm assuming short rest.

Thirdly, how does the extra d8s from Demon's Bite work? It says you use your bonus action to add them to your attack; but which part? Every damage roll? The first damage roll? The attack roll?

Fourthly, Metamorphosis is absolutely bonkers. Let's start with Havoc Mark. A 3rd level ability should not grant a 60 foot walking speed, a 120 foot fly speed, doubled smite? damage, and an additional 1d4 (scaling up to 1d8) damage per attack. Disregarding the insane movement speed, your damage at level 3+ is very high. Here's some math (assuming dual wielding, and Demon's Bite only adds damage to your next successful attack):

[1d6 (weapon) + 1d4 (Metamorphosis)] x 2 + [6d8 (Demon's Bite) + 3 = approximately 20 DPR, with an additional 30 on the first attack the next round. Compare that to the king of pre-5 damage, the Hunter Ranger: 4d6 + 1d8 + 6 = 27 DPR, but requires concentration. Now, that is less DPR, but the Demon Hunter doesn't require concentration to maintain his damage, and can do an additional 30 damage at the start of the fight. Let's take a look at level 11:

[1d6 (weapon) + 1d6 (Metamorphosis) + 1d6 (Chaotic Rend)] x 3 + [22d8 (Demon's Bite) + 10] = 46 DPR, plus an extra 110 damage over the next 3 rounds, vs the Ranger's 6d6 + 1d8 + 15, or 43 DPR, which requires concentration. By the time you reach 20th level, you're dealing 52 DPR (Which I'll admit, is fair), but with an additional 40d8 (200) damage over the next 4 rounds.

To fix this, the fly speed has to go. You can keep a movement speed buff, but definitely not 30; 10 seems appropriate. The extra damage on transformation has to go, or at least be limited to 1d4; you already have smites. Speaking of which, the part that says your smite is doubled has to go.

Eye Beam needs a save, but it's damage is actually pretty weak.

Throw Glaive is way too strong. With one use, you deal weapon damage to 3 people (fine), they bleed for 1d4 (fine, but needs a set duration; until they save is ridiculous), and inflict each of them with Exhaustion until they make a save (Not kosher; no PC abilities, AFAIK, inflict Exhaustion on the enemy, and for good reason. Exhaustion is extremely debilitating. The first gives Disadvantage on ability checks, the second halves your speed, the third gives Disadvantage on attack rolls and saving throws (!), the fourth halves your max hp (!!), the 5th reduces your speed to 0 (!!!), and the 6th is instant death (!!!!)). Being able to do that to 3 people, up to 10 times per day, is insane. Throw Glaive has to get rid of the Exhaustion rider.

Blade Dance is Dodge + 2d8 in a 10 foot radius? That's a really long reach; 5 would be more appropriate.

Fel Barrage should reduce its damage on a successful save.

Let's move on to Vengeance Mark, then. The resistances are fine, in and of themselves, but what theme are you going for? At this point, you're a Paladin/Ranger/Bearbarian whose smites recharge on a short rest. The temp hp, however, should go; you're already really tanky from the resistances, you don't need an additional 6-25 hp every time you roll initiative. The healing definitely has to go; the only class in 5e to get fast healing is the Champion, and it's their capstone, can't heal them above one-half, and heals them an average of 1 less.

Shear is also way too strong; when you first get it, you deal an average of 8-12 damage (depending on weaponry), so you'd heal 16-18 hit points. At later levels, you could be dealing 20-23 damage, thus healing for 30-33 hit points. From level 6 to level 20, it's stronger than most healing spells, lets you deal damage, and you can use it up to 30 times a day. I'd recommend changing this for a completely new feature.

Demon Spikes is probably balanced, I just don't like it. I loathe flat AC bonuses.

Immolation Aura is probably fine as is.

The Sigils are balanced, they just need to be cleaned up. They need 5e durations, and what does rooted mean?

Demonic Glide is fine.

I'm fine with Chaotic Rend, but it should probably be reworded to just "Your attacks deal an additional 1d6 damage."

Blur is game breaking. You can take the Dodge action as a reaction, and benefit from it until the end of my 3rd turn? That thumbs its nose at the concept of action economy, and makes you ludicrously hard to hit while still doing full damage. This should be replaced with a completely different feature.

Demonic Wings is fine; it's like the Draconic Sorcerer's wings, only at a later level and with a maintenance cost.

Demon Soul is fine.


Overall, I'd suggest you ask yourself what kind of class you want this to be, because right now it looks like you tried taking the best aspects of the Paladin, Barbarian, and the Monk and called it a demon. Nothing really stands out as "Demon Hunter" (Granted, I've never played WoW, but when I hear Demon Hunter, I picture a person who hunts demons, not a paladin/barbarian/monk that is occasionally a demon) except for the Metamorphoses...which don't come online until 3rd level and are horribly unbalanced in their current state. You have two abilities that don't directly deal with combat...and they're your Tier 1 and your capstone. This class needs some serious rebalancing, a more clearly defined and distinct flavor and purpose, and more than just combat abilities.

Thank you very much for your feedback, I appreciate it greatly. As is probably very blatantly obvious by my distinctly unbalanced homebrew, this was my first real attempt at 5e homebrew that I have dealt with, so I really am grateful for the help you've given me. That being said, time to list the changes.

- Removed Shear, Demon's Bite and Blur entirely.
- Added Fiery Brand
- Added Vengeful Retreat
- Added noncombat abilities: Eternal Hunt, Hunter's Tongues, Summoning Mastery and Fel Athenaeum
- Reworked both metamorphosis abilities
- Nerfed Throw Glaive, Fel Barrage and Blade Dance
- Changed wording of a lot of abilities to make it clearer.

My intent on flavour and mechanics for this class was for it to be a quick, mobile class with a few crowd control abilities that didn't step on the Monk's toes. Evidently, I failed in making that. I would really appreciate it if you could give me a few more pointers on how to make that possible.

KoyukiTei13
2016-09-23, 12:13 AM
Just want to say I love this idea. I've been playing WoW almost non-stop since it came out, and I really want to make all the WoW classes & races in D&D, so this is fantastic thematically for me. As for balance, I don't have the energy to go over it now that I've discovered it, so I'll look it over in the morning with fresh eyes and tell you what I think :D