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Williambart22
2017-01-28, 04:50 PM
So I want to play D&D with my gf, but I have no idea how to play it with just two people seen as though 1 has to be DM *HELP*

Kid Jake
2017-01-28, 04:54 PM
With 2 people then one of you kind of does have to, in D&D at least. DMPCs are usually a no-go, but in a solo campaign I could see the DM using a lower level PC to basically be the main character's sidekick. Giving them the chance to help out and sort of interact with the world, but leaving it up to the player to make the big decisions and drive the plot. Otherwise, you're going to need a third.

Potato_Priest
2017-01-28, 05:00 PM
One person can control several adventurers, although that does tend to get a wee bit complicated.

WbtE
2017-01-28, 05:07 PM
I'm not sure which rules you want to use so my answer is conditional. :smallsmile:

It should be practical to do with the lighter weight D&Ds without a great deal of conversion. Someone could write the details for a party of four B/X adventurers on just one sheet of paper and their hirelings on another.

For something like 3e, it's probably easier for the DM to make adjustments to the challenges than it is to lump a single player with a squad of complicated characters.

Kid Jake
2017-01-28, 05:23 PM
For some reason I thought the original intent was that you wanted a workaround for one of you having to DM, ignore me. :smalltongue:

A solo campaign works just fine, so long as you scale down challenges accordingly or maybe beef up the PC a bit. You could try something like gestalt or automatically granting max hp every level to make up for the lack of support, or maybe just start the PC at level 3 or 4 and then run it as though it's a normal 1st level adventure.

Quertus
2017-01-28, 06:03 PM
One person can control several adventurers, although that does tend to get a wee bit complicated.

IMO, this is the easiest way, for certain definitions of "easy".

With just a single PC, when that character goes down, you have a TPK. That's no fun.

The obvious way to fix this is to add characters. But how?

Unless you really know what you're doing, a DMPC is gonna be several kinds of bad news.

Running one or more "throw away" NPCs, who are weaker than the PC, can work. When they start dropping, the PC had some clue that it's time to get out of dodge. Of course, when it's the PC who falls their save, they're still out of the game while you play with yourself. Not the way to impress your gf.

So, I contend that, if y'all can handle the logistic and RP challenges, having her run multiple characters is best. And, if you both really know what you are doing, you could each run 2 characters, and have a full 4-member party.

Thrudd
2017-01-28, 06:09 PM
Yep, for D&D the best way is the solo player controlling an entire party of 4-6 characters. One of you needs to be the DM. It really isn't designed for only two players.

thirdkingdom
2017-01-28, 06:23 PM
You've got two options:

1. Have one person control all the PCs and flesh out a full sized party. This can be either as a party of equal level adventurers or a single main PC with multiple henchmen.

2. Scarlet Heroes is a D&D supplement for use with Labyrinth Lord (a retroclone of the Moldvay/Cook B/X version of D&D), specifically designed for use by one DM and one player. Oh, look! Here's the free Quickstart for Scarlet Heroes (http://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/127458/Scarlet-Heroes-Quickstart) (Lab Lord is available for free as well!).

johnbragg
2017-01-28, 06:33 PM
Me and my best friend in high school ran one-player campaigns pretty often. (OTOH, it was high school D&D, so not the highest quality.)

Usually a DMPC is bad news, because they're Mary Sues overshadowing the party. But your main PC should also be a Mary Sue overshadowing everything around them, so that's not a big problem. So your girlfriend's PC and your DMPC are partners who adventure together. Pick classes that complement each other, maybe recruit more NPCs as needed.

You two might want to let her choose your DMPC's tactical options in the fight. That way, if her PC goes down the game doesn't become you rolling your monsters against your NPCs while she watches.

With a two-player party (PC and DMPC), gestalt is a pretty popular option in 3X. (Gestalt means your character gets to be two character classes at once per level. Powerful, but mechanically complicated and it can be hard to justify fluff-wise. OTOH if one half of the gestalt is Cleric, it's because the god chose you to be a special snowflake.)

EDIT: Okay, I just checked your post history, hopefully not in a stalker-y way. You're a new player, and that's fine. I (we all) should adjust our advice to account for that.

You've convinced your girlfriend to play D&D. Good job. (Probably. Now the trick is to play D&D without losing the girlfriend.) This was your idea, so you have the responsibility of DMing.

So find out what kind of character she'd like to play, and make other decisions based on that. In my opinion, RPG characters break down into the fundamental elements of Smashy Guys, Sneaky Guys and Magicky-Guys (with technobabble doing the job of magic in some games/genres). Superheroes are a good language to use sometimes. Does she want to play a Hulk/Wonder-Woman-type (Smashy), a Black Widow/Batman type (Sneaky) or a Jean Grey/Iron Man type (MAgicky). (These aren't the purest examples of Smashy-Sneaky-Magicky, but I think they get the idea across. Although it might lead to you guys playing Mutants and Masterminds instead.)

I wouldn't pick a system actually until you have a handle on what kind of hero she wants to play.

BWR
2017-01-28, 06:47 PM
One on one D&D is perfectly possible, and I have done so for years, you just can't do it quite the same as 1 on 3+.

First you have to realize that combat is VERY swingy. Where a lucky crit or a failed ST might make things easy or difficult for a party, it can be the difference between life and death for a single person. You really have to balance combat encounters extremely carefully to make things challenging yet minimize the chance of a single roll making or breaking the game.

Secondly, while PCs can often be interchangeable in a group so long as most (or even one) PC survives to keep some sort of continuity, a PC death in a solo campaign really does end things.

Thirdly, some players find being in charge all the time and having no other people to talk to frustrating. While some players might prefer to do things solo, some like having a group. It means that you have someone else to point out when you make silly mistakes, other ideas and options, and more opportunity for roleplaying. Make sure you have a way of handling things when a player gets frustrated and stuck.

The best solution to all of these is, in my experience, more characters.
Having more warm bodies to help is generally a good thing. Hirelings, followers, cohorts, multiple PCs and DMPCs.
Hirelings don't need a lot of roleplaying or personality and can be used for cannon fodder, if you are a bit callous.
Followers and cohorts generally have more personality, but also require more investment.
Multiple PCs can be done but is, IME, a bit tiresome unless you have a very sure grasp of the differing personalities. Once I know exactly who the characters are, it is merely a matter of juggling numbers.
While the concept of the DMPC is at best very controversial, I have found them to be utterly invaluable in 1v1 games. An extra person in the group, an easy and constant source of roleplaying, a way to give suggestions and hints should the player get stuck, and a way for the player to feel as though not everything rests on her shoulders all the time. Just make sure to have a well-defined personality and avoid any temptation to have the DMPC constantly overshadow the PC or always take charge.

What you absolutely should not do is run a single player through a published adventure unless the PC is significantly higher level than the recommended, and only if the adventure does not contain challenged that cannot be solver/overcome by the PC.

johnbragg
2017-01-28, 07:06 PM
What you absolutely should not do is run a single player through a published adventure unless the PC is significantly higher level than the recommended, and only if the adventure does not contain challenged that cannot be solver/overcome by the PC.

This. Those adventures are designed to be a challenge for 4-6 players of the levels listed on the cover or box or whatever. If you run a single 3rd level PC through a published 3rd level adventure, the PC will not make it.

Feel free to ask us for help on how you guys can build very powerful characters, so that 2 PCs (your GF's PC and a DMPC) can handle adventures designed for 4-6 PCs a few levels below them. For example, for a published 1st level adventure, two overpowered 2nd or 3rd level "PCs" will probably be fine. (It depends on how much complexity and cheesy stuff you can understand and handle in the character building.)

Oh, one more thing. For your first few D&D campaigns, don't worry too much as a DM about sticking closely to rules that seem unfun. If your girlfriend and only player has a sad because she's playing a fire cleric and the rules say that Fireball is not a spell clerics can cast, screw the rules, let her have fun throwing Fireballs around.

Freed
2017-01-29, 03:49 PM
What I'll do when in a two-player game is basically just run a easier, free-form kind of adventure, and I like to give the player a (non-sentient) magic item. You can have the item replace a mary sue DMPC, because while very powerful, it cannot overshadow the player, as it is used as a tool by them, so their accomplishments are very much their own.

Pugwampy
2017-01-29, 04:30 PM
Yes its possible but its more fun with friends .

Dragonexx
2017-01-29, 04:56 PM
I've been running 1-1 games for a while and am currently planning another. Usually 1 PC and DMPC. Same with groups. 2 PC's and 1 DMPC. Never a problem save with my first campaign ever.

HidesHisEyes
2017-01-29, 06:19 PM
While I think a two-player game where the player controls the whole party sounds awesome, I definitely wouldn't recommend it for a beginner. So many class features and spells to worry about! But a solo game with just one character can work. I did it with my girlfriend (my flatmate had since joined in the fun).

Err on the side of caution in designing encounters. Two kobolds are a serious threat to a single level 1 character. Give her lots of ways to resolve things other than combat, too. Reward cunning plans and don't assume everything will be a fight.

If you do include an NPC ally, two things: 1) use an NPC statblock from the monster manual that is weaker than your girlfriend's character rather than making a second actual PC, so as not to outshine her character. 2) Let her control the NPC during combat. We found combats got really tiresome for both of us when I had three or four turns (badguys plus ally NPC) for every one of hers.

Also, guide her in making a character that would work well in a solo game. The charismatic jack-of-all-trades bard is probably a better choice than the big dumb warrior who hits stuff with an axe and sucks at everything else. That said, if there's a character she's definitely keen to play then go for it, and let her choice inform how you design adventures.

Best of luck! The game may be designed for six people but you can definitely have fun with two.

LibraryOgre
2017-01-30, 11:51 AM
While a lot depends on edition, you might consider a thief-oriented campaign. In a lot of mixed campaigns, a thief runs into problems, because their sneakiness clashes with the clanky tanks they have around. In a solo game, a thief can really shine, and some of the things handled by other players (like healing) can be between-adventure sorts of things... either getting healing potions or spells from a cleric, or simply waiting a while between adventures to rest up and heal.

Flickerdart
2017-01-30, 11:56 AM
So I want to play D&D with my gf, but I have no idea how to play it with just two people seen as though 1 has to be DM *HELP*

You have a few options.

One DM and one player. This is called a solo campaign, because there's only one character. It's not a bad way to learn the game - both of you can take turns DMing, and run different characters with different storylines. Perhaps one day you DM for your girlfriend's barbarian warlord, the next time she DMs for your cunning wizard, and the third time it's back to the barbarian. The DM can introduce NPCs to help the single character round out his weaknesses - but think sidekick, not main character. The spotlight should always be on the player.

No DMs, two players. Find a meetup group! Meetup.com is a good place to start to look for D&D groups in your area, and a lot of people play remotely over Roll20, Skype, or chat.

thirdkingdom
2017-01-30, 02:55 PM
While a lot depends on edition, you might consider a thief-oriented campaign. In a lot of mixed campaigns, a thief runs into problems, because their sneakiness clashes with the clanky tanks they have around. In a solo game, a thief can really shine, and some of the things handled by other players (like healing) can be between-adventure sorts of things... either getting healing potions or spells from a cleric, or simply waiting a while between adventures to rest up and heal.

Rob Kuntz supposedly soloed most of Castle Greyhawk with his character Robilar by using boots of spider climb and staying almost entirely on the ceiling and avoiding pretty much every fight and/or trap.

LibraryOgre
2017-01-30, 03:26 PM
Rob Kuntz supposedly soloed most of Castle Greyhawk with his character Robilar by using boots of spider climb and staying almost entirely on the ceiling and avoiding pretty much every fight and/or trap.

That's brilliant.

Williambart22
2017-01-30, 05:33 PM
This. Those adventures are designed to be a challenge for 4-6 players of the levels listed on the cover or box or whatever. If you run a single 3rd level PC through a published 3rd level adventure, the PC will not make it.

Feel free to ask us for help on how you guys can build very powerful characters, so that 2 PCs (your GF's PC and a DMPC) can handle adventures designed for 4-6 PCs a few levels below them. For example, for a published 1st level adventure, two overpowered 2nd or 3rd level "PCs" will probably be fine. (It depends on how much complexity and cheesy stuff you can understand and handle in the character building.)

Oh, one more thing. For your first few D&D campaigns, don't worry too much as a DM about sticking closely to rules that seem unfun. If your girlfriend and only player has a sad because she's playing a fire cleric and the rules say that Fireball is not a spell clerics can cast, screw the rules, let her have fun throwing Fireballs around.

So she's decided that she wants to be a fairy queen with knights at her disposal, but looking at the size and a -5 mod on strength (I've done a little bit of research👌) to the untrained eye, doesn't look like it can be a over powered character like you guys are talking about, I'd like to play a teifling, but to begin with we aren't going to play DMPC/PC we think solo campaign taking it in turns, so with that said can you help us make over powered characters ? (Btw I'm sure if there's something more "pretty" she will pick that)

Freed
2017-01-30, 06:26 PM
What edition do you need help with? It'd help if we knew what kind of options were available to help with those characters.

johnbragg
2017-01-30, 06:50 PM
So she's decided that she wants to be a fairy queen with knights at her disposal, but looking at the size and a -5 mod on strength (I've done a little bit of research👌) to the untrained eye, doesn't look like it can be a over powered character like you guys are talking about, I'd like to play a teifling, but to begin with we aren't going to play DMPC/PC we think solo campaign taking it in turns, so with that said can you help us make over powered characters ? (Btw I'm sure if there's something more "pretty" she will pick that)

Don't sweat the -5 STR penalty--a Fairy Princess shouldn't be making melee attacks anyway. Caster classes can be very powerful very easily. What she's thinking about sounds like Druid or Sorcerer would be a good fit. (EDIT: Or Bard, of course, but that's harder to set on God mode.) The knights are more of a challenge--storywise it makes perfect sense that the Fairy Princess would be traveling with a half-dozen bodyguards. The problem is though that's a half-dozen characters to roleplay, track hit points and attacks, and keep alive.

I'm rethinking having the Playground build you OP characters, because they're liable to come up with things that are very powerful, but also very complicated, and as new players and new DMs you're going to have problems figuring out what's going on.

But there's also being overpowered the easy way--cheat with the numbers.
1. Instead of rolling, or using a standard point buy system, you could use my Epic Array, 18 16 14 12 10 8 before racial adjustments. That gives you at least a +4 in your most important stat.
2. Max HP per level instead of rolling.
3. If you're using published material, make characters 2 levels above the recommended level. (The first two are because you're noobs, this is to balance the fact that you've got 1 PC instead of 4-6.)
4. Give each player a couple of "fate chips" that force a re-roll of whatever was just rolled. (PCs are special snowflakes and the gods favor them.) Especially if you go solo instead of DMPC.

Herobizkit
2017-02-01, 06:11 AM
At its core, D&D is "kill things and take their stuff".

If your gf wants to be a Fey Princess in command of Knights and what have you, you're going to want to be a lot more talk-y and story-focused and tone down the "grit". Maintain a lighter, maybe even comical tone and avoid graphic descriptions of murder and other unpleasantness.

Ask her many questions about her character. How does she feel, what does she think, how does she react... who does she know?

In my dating past, I introduced a gf to D&D. She wanted to be a human fighter. I helped craft her backstory by asking questions about her family. To my delight, she went into great detail about how she lived with her grandmother and wanted to become a sell-sword to make enough money to keep the farm in the family.

Her first combat encounter was with a small band of kobolds trying to steal the farm's stuff. She only faced a pair at a time and used her farming scythe to kill them. Once one went down, the other ran away yip-yipping. She chased 6 of them as they fled all over the place, which allowed me to round out what was ON the farm in the meantime.

So yeah, your gf is the Star of the Show™. Let her be one. ^_^

Cozzer
2017-02-01, 06:40 AM
I haven't tried it, but I would probably use the Bioware Option: your GF's character is the main character (find an in-universe reason why that has to be), you create a few "companions" that she gets to control (better if she's the leader of the group in-universe too) during combats to make things more interesting (though they could refuse to do what she says depending on how she treats them).

Don't decide beforehand who's going to be a companion: have her start with maybe a "crutch character" (or a couple of them) and let her try to convince the friendly NPCs she likes more to become companions, and just deal with things depending on how their relationship develops.