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StickMan
2007-07-25, 09:01 PM
Has any one tried to port Mutations from D20 Modern to DND. I've been trying to make up a few classes and feats that would work with a small group that focuses on letting there inner being out, and I think the Mutations from D20 modern might fit my idea. I think in D20 apocalypse there is a feat that gives mutation points and I was thinking you would have to take that to take drawbacks as well. Also there is a Advanced class at the back of that same book, would it work in DND?

I'm getting D20 apocalypse out from my library and am going to try to buy it but if anyone could give me some info on this between now and then plz do.


SRD info on Mutations (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/MSRD:Mutations)

Ichneumon
2007-07-26, 01:39 AM
I like the D20 MUtation system and was actually thinking of using it too, for at least a few NPCs. but before using it it would definetly need editing. For example drawbacks such as CYBERNETIC DEPENDENCY wouldn't work. I think it is balanced and would make more interesting characters, but it depends on the campaign.

EDIT: I think it would be save to allow your players to get 2 MP as a feat.

StickMan
2007-07-26, 12:41 PM
Thanks for the feed back. That is about what I was thinking for the feat as well as letting them take a few drawbacks at the same time. I'll post more when I make up a new Prestige class for it. Any ideas would be great.

Joltz
2007-07-29, 02:19 PM
Judging by that SRD (which is the only info Iíve seen on mutations), the only thing you need to add it to a D&D game is to make some fluff to explain where mutations come from.

I was thinking about some plot hooks and stuff yesterday that I could throw into an ongoing campaign. I thought it would be interesting to give the PCs an opportunity to be paid test subjects for a high level wizard. I had to think of something for him to test though. This is what I came up withÖ

Cause Mutation
Transmutation/Necromancy
Sor/Wiz 6, Druid 5
Casting Time: 1 minute
Target: 1 creature
Duration: 2d6-1 days
Effect: 1 or more mutations (see text)
Save: Fortitude negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell gradually alters a creatureís biological functions to produce mutations. When the spellís duration runs out, the changes are complete and the mutation(s) take effect. Up to 1 mutation point/3 caster levels can be manipulated (created by drawback mutations or allotted to beneficial mutations) per casting.
At the end of the spell, the subject becomes physically ill as the mutations manifest. The subject must make a fortitude save or become nauseated for an hour and take 2 points of constitution damage. A successful save reduces the effects to sickened for an hour (no con damage). If the subject willingly allowed this spell to be cast on them, the save DC is 10+spell level-other relevant modifiers instead of +other modifiers.
Finally, thereís a 10% chance each casting that the subject will have an allergic reaction to the spell. For the duration of the spell, the subject becomes sickened anytime they perform a strenuous action and for 5 rounds afterward. If the subject makes a successful fortitude save (DC= normal save DC) they may act normally for one minute. This side effect manifests 2d4 hours after the spell is cast.


You can fiddle with it if you like. I added a few unpleasant side effects for flavor (and mystery) purposes. Some obvious changes that would give it a slightly different flavor would be to alter the spell level and the amount of time it takes for the mutations to occur. I'm also allowing it to be cast on unwilling creatures. Making it a willing target only removes some capacity for evil with it.

Vadin
2007-07-29, 04:33 PM
The cybernetic dependency drawback could be replaced by magic dependency. For example, the character has to drink a potion or sacrifice a magic item every X days or hours or suffer terrible penalties as some arcane loanshark decides to collect on the gift he gave the character.

Jack_Simth
2007-07-29, 05:20 PM
You'll need to rework the mutation points if porting to D&D.

For instance, Telekenetic Mind is pretty much duplicated by the Hand of the Mage - a 900 gp item, and is 5 points. Wall Crawler costs 2 MP, and is pretty much duplicated by Slippers of Spider Climbing - a 4,800 gp item. Something's off there in a D&D environment.

Edit:
Here's a thought - keep the drawback mutations as payment forms, keep the 0 mutations as flavor, but scrap most the advantages. Advantages are based off of PHB spells as follows:

Base Cost: Spell Level Mutation Points

Type of ability:
It's (Ex): +3 Mutation Points
It's (Su): +2 Mutation Point
It's (Sp): +1 Mutation Point

Usage: Per Day limit:
Once per day: +0 Mutation Points
Twice per day: +1 Mutation Point
Three Times per Day: +2 Mutation Points
Four Times per day: +3 Mutation Points
Five Times per Day: +4 Mutation Points
At Will (not available for anything that heals HP damage, even indirectly): +5

Usage: Continuous (Self-only):
Spell Duration Is:
1 Hour/level or better: +1 Mutation Points
10 Minutes/Level: +2 Mutation Points
1 Minute/Level: +3 Mutation Points
1 Round/Level: +4 Mutation Points
Less: Not Available as a continuous ability

Effective Caster Level:
1/2 Character level, Minimum 1: +0 Mutation Points
Character Level: +1 Mutation Point

Activation (ignore for continuous abilities):
As Casting Time for the Spell: +0 Mutation Points
One step down: +1 Mutation Point (not available for casting times over 1 Round)
Two steps down: +2 Mutation Points (not available for casting times over 1 Round)
Three steps down: +3 Mutation Points (not available for casting times over 1 Round)

Casting Time Steps (start at the spell's casting time): 1 Round, Full Round, Standard Action, Swift Action

Thus, Mage Hand (0th level spell) once per day (+0) as a spell-like ability (+1) at half your character level (+0) would cost 1 mutation point. Fireball (3rd level spell) as an Ex ability (+3) as a swift action (one step, +1) at will (+5) at a caster level equal to your character level (+1) would cost 13 Mutation Points. Shield (1st level spell, base 1) as a Supernatural Ability (+2) continuously active (duration 1 min/level, +3), with a caster level of 1/2 your character level (+0) would cost 6 mutation points.

How's it look for balance?

Joltz
2007-07-29, 08:46 PM
wow... how would you get 13 mutation points? O.o

Anyway, it's true that some of the mutation point values are a little off from the value of the ability in a D&D setting. I like the mutations that are already there though. There are already plenty of methods for getting spells. There aren't methods for getting fun things like the mutation effects that are already there. I think I'd rather work with my players to adjust MP costs for some of the mutations than change mutations into another method of getting spells though.

Vadin
2007-07-31, 02:04 PM
Have you thought of bringing in some Aberrant? It's a superhero game with a class that gives tons of mutations like these.

Duke Malagigi
2007-07-31, 07:46 PM
Judging by that SRD (which is the only info Iíve seen on mutations), the only thing you need to add it to a D&D game is to make some fluff to explain where mutations come from.

I was thinking about some plot hooks and stuff yesterday that I could throw into an ongoing campaign. I thought it would be interesting to give the PCs an opportunity to be paid test subjects for a high level wizard. I had to think of something for him to test though. This is what I came up withÖ

Cause Mutation
Transmutation/Necromancy
Sor/Wiz 6, Druid 5
Casting Time: 1 minute
Target: 1 creature
Duration: 2d6-1 days
Effect: 1 or more mutations (see text)
Save: Fortitude negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell gradually alters a creatureís biological functions to produce mutations. When the spellís duration runs out, the changes are complete and the mutation(s) take effect. Up to 1 mutation point/3 caster levels can be manipulated (created by drawback mutations or allotted to beneficial mutations) per casting.
At the end of the spell, the subject becomes physically ill as the mutations manifest. The subject must make a fortitude save or become nauseated for an hour and take 2 points of constitution damage. A successful save reduces the effects to sickened for an hour (no con damage). If the subject willingly allowed this spell to be cast on them, the save DC is 10+spell level-other relevant modifiers instead of +other modifiers.
Finally, thereís a 10% chance each casting that the subject will have an allergic reaction to the spell. For the duration of the spell, the subject becomes sickened anytime they perform a strenuous action and for 5 rounds afterward. If the subject makes a successful fortitude save (DC= normal save DC) they may act normally for one minute. This side effect manifests 2d4 hours after the spell is cast.


You can fiddle with it if you like. I added a few unpleasant side effects for flavor (and mystery) purposes. Some obvious changes that would give it a slightly different flavor would be to alter the spell level and the amount of time it takes for the mutations to occur. I'm also allowing it to be cast on unwilling creatures. Making it a willing target only removes some capacity for evil with it.

Is it okay if I add this spell to my list (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50443)?

Jack_Simth
2007-07-31, 08:18 PM
wow... how would you get 13 mutation points? O.o

Anyway, it's true that some of the mutation point values are a little off from the value of the ability in a D&D setting. I like the mutations that are already there though. There are already plenty of methods for getting spells. There aren't methods for getting fun things like the mutation effects that are already there. I think I'd rather work with my players to adjust MP costs for some of the mutations than change mutations into another method of getting spells though.
Lots of bad mutations - two Ability Decays into stats you don't really need (e.g., Str and Cha for a Wizard - 4 each), Festering Sores (again, for the Wizard - can't wear armor anyway...; 2 points), and Fraility (as a Wizard, if you need to make a Fort save, you've already lost; 3 points). 4+4+2+3=13

But then you've got a Swift Fireball at will, that doesn't permit SR, and can be used in the middle of an antimagic field.

Joltz
2007-07-31, 08:37 PM
lol... I can picture the frail and ugly wizard belching fireballs at will, and it's very funny.

@Dunke Malagigi--I'd love to be included in your list. It means that you like the spell right? :smallbiggrin:

Duke Malagigi
2007-07-31, 08:55 PM
@Dunke Malagigi--I'd love to be included in your list. It means that you like the spell right? :smallbiggrin:

Yes, I like your spell. Besides not every necromancer needs to be like this guy.
http://images.wikia.com/marveldatabase/images/b/b2/Black_Talon_001.jpg

Not even the evil ones need to be like this guy.