ElHugo
2007-07-31, 12:58 PM
Squad based combat for DnD
In this thread, I'm posting a work-in-progress thingummywut that will hopefully allow people to play out army-vs-army combat while having the PCs participate in the main battle.
I know Heroes of Battle did something similar, but IIRC it suggested that most of the fighting should be narrated. I disagree, and this is my effort to make it doable.
I hope that those who read this will go through this, and point out things that I've missed, good rules suggestions (especially for unit special abilities and such) and comment on wether or not it is balanced/balance suggestions.
Also, non-core classes that would work well with this sort of thing, and deserve to be adapted into it.
Although primarily intended for future use in the campaign I currently play in, it would be nice if it was universally applicable. I didn't go through all of them, but between my friends, I have access to almost all 3.5 books, so mentioning specific things mean I can almost certainly find it.
Furthermore, I've never homebrewed anything before, let alone put it in this forum, so any practical advice on layout and stuff is also appreciated.
Lastly, I don't know if any of this has already been covered in books, and how that tangles with legality. Other then standard DnD terms like BAB and classes and whatnot, I came up with this stuff.
Enough introduction, on to war!
Definitions:
Squad: a group of units, operating as one on the battlefield
Member: an individual member of a squad, that is not a special character
Unit: any member of a squad, including special characters
Officer: a more powerful version of a member, who replaces a single member in a squad, conferring bonuses on the entire squad
Support unit: a unit that replaces a single member, that has a special effect.
(Squad) Strength: the amount of units remaining, compared to the original number of units in the squad.
Combat basics:
Barring officers and support units, squads must be uniform – that is, all members must be identical. Exception to this can be HP, which is only used in squad vs. PC combat.
Squads attack as one, using the attack bonus of the members, plus any bonuses conferred by circumstances, such as charging, flanking or officers. Magical effects only count when applied to the entire squad – every individual unit.
Squad AC is that of the individual members.
Rather then rolling for damage per unit, squads have a single damage die, depending on the strength and type of the squad, and this is not determined by the damage of the weapons they are actually wielding (for example, a unit of 20 peasants with might do less damage then a unit of 6 heavy cavalrists, even if the single members might do more damage individually)
Squads at half and quarter strength take –1 and –2 to damage, to represent there being less people doing hurting.
When a squad is hit, roll for damage. Modify this by any damage multipliers or modifiers that might be in effect (vertain abilities might reduce or increase the damage versus certain types of squads). The damage is the number of flat casualties inflicted upon the enemy squad. Remove this number of units from the squads, members dying first.
Squad members’ HP is either not taken into account at all (being either at alive or dead, no in-betweens) or only used when PCs attack a squad. Personally, I lean towards letting only officers have HP, and this only when confronted by PCs. Other then that, hit = dead.
A unit is considered flanked if at least two-thirds of the units on a single side of the squad have enemy units directly to their side. If the enemy squad has reach weapons, having enemy units directly to the side of these squares also counts, but they cannot thusly ‘double-flank’. On either side, a squad either is or is not flanked, although both sides of the squad can be seperately flanked.
Should, for whatever reason, the flanking squad not threaten the squad concerned, the squad isn’t flanked. Anyone making an attack roll against a flanked squad gain +1 to hit, +2 if both sides are flanked.
A squad is considered attacked from behind if at least half the units at the back of the squad have an enemy unit directly behind them, viewed from the squad attacked, or if the enemy has reach weapons, if they are directly behind these squares, following the logic of flanking attacks.
Anyone making an attack roll against a squad attacked from behind, gain +2 to hit; this stacks with flanking bonuses.
Members should never have more then 4 lvls of a PC class, or more then 5 lvls of a NPC class. Already, those are elite troops and should be very rare. Armies are composed primarily of rank-and-file grunts, they aren’t heroic elite warriors to a man. Exceptions can be made for (high-ranking) officers.
Normally speaking, full casters shouldn’t be fielded on a squad level, although rich and/or arcane kingdoms might send along a handful of wizards with their army.
A fifth-level party of PCs should be a significant force despite their numbers in most armies. 20th level parties should probably be capable of taking out small armies all on their own.
Spells:
Squads, when effected by single-target spells or abilities (such as a concentrated volley from archers), have only a single member affected. Single-target spells that do not inflict damage outright can only be applied to officers, and this doesn’t affect the squad in its entirety. Area-of-effect spells should probably function normally, and as such are particularly devastating… Not sure about this yet.
Spells that affect a limited amount of HD function as following: take the total number of HD that a squad has (adding up the HD of all living units in the squad). The first squad is affected if its total HD isn’t twice that of the spell limit, if the spell can target more HD then the first squad has, other squads are only affected if the spell can affect enough HD to affect the entire squad (over and above the HD ‘spent’ on the first squad).
Regarding saving throws: spells with single targets roll normally, as per the modifier of the unit affected.
Due to the tight formations maintained, area spells that require reflex saves automatically succeed.
Area spells with a fortitude save are made at the modifier of members, officers might add a bonus to this.
When an area spell calls for a will save, it could either be made by member modifier with possible officer boosts, or by the officer in the name of the squad. Not sure of this yet. As these will typically be fear spells, they might call for and/or affect morale rolls instead.
Officers:
Several times so far, officers have been mentioned. These are the various commanding units in armies, from the sergeants that join individual squads to the generals whose skill boost entire armies.
Officers are the exception to the uniformity demand of squads: members with NPC levels might have an officer with PC levels, squads with member that have PC lvls might have a higher levelled officer.
Officers typically should be either one or two levels higher then the rest of the squad, or have PC levels when the members have NPC levels. This should be done logically, at DM discretion. The vast majority of squad-level officers should probably be fighters <Potentially to be revised>.
As a guideline, I recommend:
Level member|Level officer
NPC 1|PC1/NPC2
NPC 2|PC2/NPC4
NPC 3|PC3
NPC 4|PC4
NPC 5|PC5/6
PC 1|PC2/3
PC 2|PC3/4
PC 3|PC4/5
PC 4|PC6
Adding an officer should make a squad more proficient at combat, doing so in the following ways:
Officers always give a +1 on squad attack rolls.
Additionally, officers should be required for various special abilities to be possible, such as
- organised volley fire (for ranged weapons squads)
- shield walls (for weapon+shield combinations)
- double ranked fighting (for reach weapons)
- storm attacks/charges
Furthermore, officers give +2 bonuses to will saves, +1 to fortitude saves, and +2 to morale checks.
I also need advice on how to give officers some sort of rallying ability to be able to negate fear affecting the squad – before the squad breaks.
Officers cannot be individually targetted by normal squad-to-squad attacks, but can be affected by single-target spells and similar abilities. Also, PCs attacking a squad attack individual squad members, and as such can attack officers, provided they can reach them.
Additionally to officers, special support units might be added to armies (bards come to mind. Might also be something that gives rogues something to do)
Morale checks:
A squad has to make a morale check when it is affected by a fear effect that would case its members to flee, it’s down to a quarter of its original strength, it’s attacked from both front and rear (or both flanks and front), loses half of its strength in a single turn or when any of the following two occur:
- unit reaches half strength
- unit is attacked in the flank
- unit adjacent to it routs
- officer falls in battle (not if an officer was never attached)
- suffers casualties equal to at least a quarter of it’s original strength in a single turn
- squad is already shaken
Any time a morale check is required, the squad makes a DC5 + 2 for every previously required check. The save is modified by the will save of the individual members, but the presence of an officer gives a +2 bonus.
When any of the other conditions are also in play, increase the DC by 2 for every one of those.
For example, should a unit be at full strength, but then lose half its strength in a single turn, they must make a morale check (for losing half its strength in a single turn) at a –2 penalty (for having only half strength left).
Morale checks based on the amount of casualties received (½ and ¼ strength remaing) need only be made once, but continue to give these modifiers, which stack.
Should a squad fail a morale check, they become shaken. If they fail another one, or fail it by more then 10, they break and run, departing the battlefield as quickly as they can. However, should a squad be completely pinned, seeing no credible avenue of departure (DMs discretion), it will ‘fight to the death’, taking only the –2 penalty of being shaken, although they will still flee at the first available opportunity.
What is still to come is squad special abilities, which need to be designed. Elite squads might always have +2 on their checks, while unbreakable squads (such as raging barbarians, or unintelligent undead) might be completely immune to morale checks, fighting on until killed entirely.
Abilities like shield wall, bonuses for fighting with ranged weapons, multiple ranks deep, bonuses for spears vs cavalry, double striking berserkers, etc... Need more time to think about this. Suggestions welcome!
In this thread, I'm posting a work-in-progress thingummywut that will hopefully allow people to play out army-vs-army combat while having the PCs participate in the main battle.
I know Heroes of Battle did something similar, but IIRC it suggested that most of the fighting should be narrated. I disagree, and this is my effort to make it doable.
I hope that those who read this will go through this, and point out things that I've missed, good rules suggestions (especially for unit special abilities and such) and comment on wether or not it is balanced/balance suggestions.
Also, non-core classes that would work well with this sort of thing, and deserve to be adapted into it.
Although primarily intended for future use in the campaign I currently play in, it would be nice if it was universally applicable. I didn't go through all of them, but between my friends, I have access to almost all 3.5 books, so mentioning specific things mean I can almost certainly find it.
Furthermore, I've never homebrewed anything before, let alone put it in this forum, so any practical advice on layout and stuff is also appreciated.
Lastly, I don't know if any of this has already been covered in books, and how that tangles with legality. Other then standard DnD terms like BAB and classes and whatnot, I came up with this stuff.
Enough introduction, on to war!
Definitions:
Squad: a group of units, operating as one on the battlefield
Member: an individual member of a squad, that is not a special character
Unit: any member of a squad, including special characters
Officer: a more powerful version of a member, who replaces a single member in a squad, conferring bonuses on the entire squad
Support unit: a unit that replaces a single member, that has a special effect.
(Squad) Strength: the amount of units remaining, compared to the original number of units in the squad.
Combat basics:
Barring officers and support units, squads must be uniform – that is, all members must be identical. Exception to this can be HP, which is only used in squad vs. PC combat.
Squads attack as one, using the attack bonus of the members, plus any bonuses conferred by circumstances, such as charging, flanking or officers. Magical effects only count when applied to the entire squad – every individual unit.
Squad AC is that of the individual members.
Rather then rolling for damage per unit, squads have a single damage die, depending on the strength and type of the squad, and this is not determined by the damage of the weapons they are actually wielding (for example, a unit of 20 peasants with might do less damage then a unit of 6 heavy cavalrists, even if the single members might do more damage individually)
Squads at half and quarter strength take –1 and –2 to damage, to represent there being less people doing hurting.
When a squad is hit, roll for damage. Modify this by any damage multipliers or modifiers that might be in effect (vertain abilities might reduce or increase the damage versus certain types of squads). The damage is the number of flat casualties inflicted upon the enemy squad. Remove this number of units from the squads, members dying first.
Squad members’ HP is either not taken into account at all (being either at alive or dead, no in-betweens) or only used when PCs attack a squad. Personally, I lean towards letting only officers have HP, and this only when confronted by PCs. Other then that, hit = dead.
A unit is considered flanked if at least two-thirds of the units on a single side of the squad have enemy units directly to their side. If the enemy squad has reach weapons, having enemy units directly to the side of these squares also counts, but they cannot thusly ‘double-flank’. On either side, a squad either is or is not flanked, although both sides of the squad can be seperately flanked.
Should, for whatever reason, the flanking squad not threaten the squad concerned, the squad isn’t flanked. Anyone making an attack roll against a flanked squad gain +1 to hit, +2 if both sides are flanked.
A squad is considered attacked from behind if at least half the units at the back of the squad have an enemy unit directly behind them, viewed from the squad attacked, or if the enemy has reach weapons, if they are directly behind these squares, following the logic of flanking attacks.
Anyone making an attack roll against a squad attacked from behind, gain +2 to hit; this stacks with flanking bonuses.
Members should never have more then 4 lvls of a PC class, or more then 5 lvls of a NPC class. Already, those are elite troops and should be very rare. Armies are composed primarily of rank-and-file grunts, they aren’t heroic elite warriors to a man. Exceptions can be made for (high-ranking) officers.
Normally speaking, full casters shouldn’t be fielded on a squad level, although rich and/or arcane kingdoms might send along a handful of wizards with their army.
A fifth-level party of PCs should be a significant force despite their numbers in most armies. 20th level parties should probably be capable of taking out small armies all on their own.
Spells:
Squads, when effected by single-target spells or abilities (such as a concentrated volley from archers), have only a single member affected. Single-target spells that do not inflict damage outright can only be applied to officers, and this doesn’t affect the squad in its entirety. Area-of-effect spells should probably function normally, and as such are particularly devastating… Not sure about this yet.
Spells that affect a limited amount of HD function as following: take the total number of HD that a squad has (adding up the HD of all living units in the squad). The first squad is affected if its total HD isn’t twice that of the spell limit, if the spell can target more HD then the first squad has, other squads are only affected if the spell can affect enough HD to affect the entire squad (over and above the HD ‘spent’ on the first squad).
Regarding saving throws: spells with single targets roll normally, as per the modifier of the unit affected.
Due to the tight formations maintained, area spells that require reflex saves automatically succeed.
Area spells with a fortitude save are made at the modifier of members, officers might add a bonus to this.
When an area spell calls for a will save, it could either be made by member modifier with possible officer boosts, or by the officer in the name of the squad. Not sure of this yet. As these will typically be fear spells, they might call for and/or affect morale rolls instead.
Officers:
Several times so far, officers have been mentioned. These are the various commanding units in armies, from the sergeants that join individual squads to the generals whose skill boost entire armies.
Officers are the exception to the uniformity demand of squads: members with NPC levels might have an officer with PC levels, squads with member that have PC lvls might have a higher levelled officer.
Officers typically should be either one or two levels higher then the rest of the squad, or have PC levels when the members have NPC levels. This should be done logically, at DM discretion. The vast majority of squad-level officers should probably be fighters <Potentially to be revised>.
As a guideline, I recommend:
Level member|Level officer
NPC 1|PC1/NPC2
NPC 2|PC2/NPC4
NPC 3|PC3
NPC 4|PC4
NPC 5|PC5/6
PC 1|PC2/3
PC 2|PC3/4
PC 3|PC4/5
PC 4|PC6
Adding an officer should make a squad more proficient at combat, doing so in the following ways:
Officers always give a +1 on squad attack rolls.
Additionally, officers should be required for various special abilities to be possible, such as
- organised volley fire (for ranged weapons squads)
- shield walls (for weapon+shield combinations)
- double ranked fighting (for reach weapons)
- storm attacks/charges
Furthermore, officers give +2 bonuses to will saves, +1 to fortitude saves, and +2 to morale checks.
I also need advice on how to give officers some sort of rallying ability to be able to negate fear affecting the squad – before the squad breaks.
Officers cannot be individually targetted by normal squad-to-squad attacks, but can be affected by single-target spells and similar abilities. Also, PCs attacking a squad attack individual squad members, and as such can attack officers, provided they can reach them.
Additionally to officers, special support units might be added to armies (bards come to mind. Might also be something that gives rogues something to do)
Morale checks:
A squad has to make a morale check when it is affected by a fear effect that would case its members to flee, it’s down to a quarter of its original strength, it’s attacked from both front and rear (or both flanks and front), loses half of its strength in a single turn or when any of the following two occur:
- unit reaches half strength
- unit is attacked in the flank
- unit adjacent to it routs
- officer falls in battle (not if an officer was never attached)
- suffers casualties equal to at least a quarter of it’s original strength in a single turn
- squad is already shaken
Any time a morale check is required, the squad makes a DC5 + 2 for every previously required check. The save is modified by the will save of the individual members, but the presence of an officer gives a +2 bonus.
When any of the other conditions are also in play, increase the DC by 2 for every one of those.
For example, should a unit be at full strength, but then lose half its strength in a single turn, they must make a morale check (for losing half its strength in a single turn) at a –2 penalty (for having only half strength left).
Morale checks based on the amount of casualties received (½ and ¼ strength remaing) need only be made once, but continue to give these modifiers, which stack.
Should a squad fail a morale check, they become shaken. If they fail another one, or fail it by more then 10, they break and run, departing the battlefield as quickly as they can. However, should a squad be completely pinned, seeing no credible avenue of departure (DMs discretion), it will ‘fight to the death’, taking only the –2 penalty of being shaken, although they will still flee at the first available opportunity.
What is still to come is squad special abilities, which need to be designed. Elite squads might always have +2 on their checks, while unbreakable squads (such as raging barbarians, or unintelligent undead) might be completely immune to morale checks, fighting on until killed entirely.
Abilities like shield wall, bonuses for fighting with ranged weapons, multiple ranks deep, bonuses for spears vs cavalry, double striking berserkers, etc... Need more time to think about this. Suggestions welcome!