PDA

View Full Version : D&D 3.x Other Revised Spell Schools [PEACH]



ShiningStarling
2017-09-23, 02:56 PM
For a while now, Iíve been wondering many things concerning magic, not only how to limit it in terms of exponential growth, but how to make it make more sense, and remove gray areas. I think I have a possible action to take.

There are now 3 spell schools, Universal still exists, and will be expanding slightly, but as usual does not count as a school.

With fewer schools, Wizards in particular, the most infamous of the powerhouses, will have to make real sacrifices if they want to get that extra spell slot


Conjuration
Spells that move or create creatures, objects, and energy. Contains most current Conjuration spells, along with most Evocation, some Necromancy, and some Abjuration

Transmutation
Spells that change creatures, objects, and energy. Contains most current Transmutation spells, along with some Abjuration, Enchantment, Evocation, and Necromancy

Enchantment
Spells that change the perception of creatures as relates to other creatures, objects, and energy. Contains most current Enchantment, Divination, and Illusion spells


The goal is to make everything internally consistent, though I know I may not do a perfect job.

We might need a few more descriptors, with a goal of giving almost every spell a descriptor if we can, possibly narrowing Spell Focus to descriptors rather than schools, but I'll leave that for later.


Below are spells that will change schools from the PHB

Alarm - Enchantment
Analyze Dweomer - Enchantment
Animate Dead - Conjuration
Antilife Shell - Enchantment
Antimagic Field - Universal
Antiplant Shell - Enchantment
Arcane Eye - Conjuration
Arcane Lock - Transmutation
Arcane Sight - Enchantment
Arcane Sight, Greater - Enchantment
Astral Projection - Conjuration
Atonement - Enchantment
Augury - Enchantment

Banishment - Conjuration
Bestow Curse - Enchantment
Blade Barrier - Conjuration
Blasphemy - Enchantment
Blight - Transmutation
Blindness/Deafness - Enchantment
Blur - Enchantment
Break Enchantment - Universal
Burning Hands - Conjuration

Call Lightning - Conjuration
Call Lightning Storm - Conjuration
Cause Fear - Enchantment
Chain Lightning - Conjuration
Chaos Hammer - Conjuration
Chill Touch - Conjuration
Circle of Death - Conjuration
Clairaudience/Clairvoyance - Enchantment
Clenched Fist - Conjuration
Cloak of Chaos - Conjuration
Clone - Conjuration
Color Spray - Enchantment
Command Plants - Enchantment
Command Undead - Enchantment
Commune - Enchantment
Commune with Nature - Enchantment
Comprehend Languages - Enchantment
Cone of Cold - Conjuration
Consecrate - Transmutation
Contact Other Plane - Enchantment
Contagion - Transmutation
Contingency - Universal
Continual Flame - Transmutation
Control Plants - Enchantment
Control Undead - Enchantment
Create Greater Undead - Conjuration
Create Undead - Conjuration
Crushing Hand - Conjuration
Curse Water - Transmutation

Dancing Lights - Conjuration
Darkness - Conjuration
Daylight - Conjuration
Death Knell - Transmutation
Death Ward - Transmutation
Deathwatch - Enchantment
Deeper Darkness - Conjuration
Delayed Blast Fireball - Conjuration
Desecrate - Transmutation
Destruction - Conjuration
Detect Animals or Plants - Enchantment
Detect Chaos - Enchantment
Detect Evil - Enchantment
Detect Good - Enchantment
Detect Law - Enchantment
Detect Magic - Enchantment
Detect Poison - Enchantment
Detect Scrying - Enchantment
Detect Secret Doors - Enchantment
Detect Snares and Pits - Enchantment
Detect Thoughts - Enchantment
Detect Undead - Enchantment
Dictum - Enchantment
Dimensional Anchor - Transmutaion
Dimensional Lock - Transmutation
Discern Lies - Enchantment
Discern Location - Enchantment
Dismissal - Banishment
Dispel Chaos - Universal
Dispel Evil - Universal
Dispel Good - Universal
Dispel Law - Universal
Dispel Magic - Universal
Dispel Magic, Greater - Universal
Displacement - Enchantment
Disrupt Undead - Conjuration
Divination - Enchantment
Divine Favor - Transmutation
Divine Power - Transmutation
Doom - Enchantment
Dream - Enchantment

Earthquake - Transmutation
Endure Elements - Transmutation
Energy Drain - Conjuration
Enervation - Conjuration
Entropic Shield - Conjuration
Explosive Runes - Transmutation
Eyebite - Enchantment

Faerie Fire - Transmutation
False Life - Conjuration
False Vision - Enchantment
Fear - Enchantment
Find the Path - Enchantment
Find Traps - Enchantment
Finger of Death - Conjuration
Fire Shield - Conjuration
Fire Storm - Conjuration
Fire Trap - Conjuration
Fireball - Conjuration
Flame Blade - Conjuration
Flame Strike - Conjuration
Flaming Sphere - Conjuration
Flare - Conjuration
Floating Disk - Conjuration
Forbiddance - Transmutation
Forcecage - Conjuration
Forceful Hand - Conjuration
Foresight - Enchantment
Freedom - Transmutation
Freedom of Movement - Transmutation
Freezing Sphere - Conjuration

Gentle Repose - Transmutation
Ghost Sound - Enchantment
Ghoul Touch - Conjuration
Globe of Invulnerability - Conjuration
Globe of Invulnerability, Lesser - Conjuration
Glyph of Warding - Transmutation
Glyph of Warding, Greater - Transmutation
Goodberry - Transmutation
Good Hope - Enchantment
Grasping Hand - Conjuration
Guards and Wards - Transmutation
Guidance - Enchantment
Gust of Wind - Conjuration

Hallow - Transmutation
Hallucinatory Terrain - Enchantment
Halt Undead - Enchantment
Harm - Conjuration
Helping Hand - Conjuration
Hide from Animals - Enchantment
Hide from Undead - Enchantment
Hold Portal - Transmutation
Holy Aura - Conjuration
Holy Smite - Conjuration
Holy Sword - Transmutation
Holy Word - Enchantment
Horrid Wilting - Transmutation
Hypnotic Pattern - Enchantment
Hypnotism - Enchantment

Ice Storm - Conjuration
Identify - Enchantment
Illusory Script - Enchantment
Illusory Wall - Enchantment
Imbue with Spell Ability
Implosion - Transmutation
Imprisonment - Transmutation
Inflict Critical Wounds - Conjuration
Inflict Critical Wounds, Mass - Conjuration
Inflict Light Wounds - Conjuration
Inflict Light Wounds, Mass - Conjuration
Inflict Minor Wounds - Conjuration
Inflict Moderate Wounds - Conjuration
Inflict Moderate Wounds, Mass - Conjuration
Inflict Serious Wounds - Conjuration
Inflict Serious Wounds, Mass - Conjuration
Interposing Hand - Conjuration
Invisibility - Enchantment
Invisibility, Greater - Enchantment
Invisibility, Mass - Enchantment
Invisibility Purge - Enchantment
Invisibility Sphere - Enchantment

Know Direction - Enchantment

Legend Lore - Enchantment
Light - Transmutation
Lightning Bolt - Conjuration
Locate Creature - Enchantment
Locate Object - Enchantment

Mage Armor - Conjuration
Mage Hand - Universal
Mageís Disjunction - Universal
Mageís Faithful Hound - Conjuration
Mageís Lucubration - Universal
Mageís Magnificent Mansion - Conjuration
Mageís Private Sanctum - Conjuration
Mageís Sword - Conjuration
Magic Aura - Enchantment
Magic Circle against Chaos - Transmutation
Magic Circle against Evil - Transmutation
Magic Circle against Good - Transmutation
Magic Circle against Law - Transmutation
Magic Jar - Enchantment
Magic Missile - Conjuration
Magic Mouth - Enchantment
Major Image - Enchantment
Mark of Justice - Enchantment
Maze - Conjuration
Message - Enchantment
Meteor Swarm - Conjuration
Mind Blank - Enchantment
Minor Image - Enchantment
Miracle - Universal
Mirage Arcana - Enchantment
Mirror Image - Enchantment
Misdirection - Enchantment
Mislead - Enchantment
Mnemonic Enhancer - Universal
Moment of Prescience - Enchantment

Nightmare - Enchantment
Nondetection - Enchantment

Obscure Object - Enchantment
Orderís Wrath - Conjuration

Pass without Trace - Enchantment
Permanent Image - Enchantment
Persistent Image - Enchantment
Phantasmal Killer - Enchantment
Phantom Steed - Enchantment
Phantom Trap - Enchantment
Poison - Conjuration
Polar Ray - Conjuration
Prayer - Enchantment
Prismatic Sphere - Enchantment
Prismatic Spray - Enchantment
Prismatic Wall - Enchantment
Produce Flame - Conjuration
Programmed Image - Enchantment
Project Image - Enchantment
Protection from Arrows - Transmutation
Protection from Chaos - Transmutation
Protection from Energy - Transmutation
Protection from Evil - Transmutation
Protection from Good - Transmutation
Protection from Law - Transmutation
Protection from Spells - Transmutation
Prying Eyes - Enchantment
Prying Eyes, Greater - Enchantment

Rage - Enchantment
Rainbow Pattern - Enchantment
Ray of Enfeeblement
Ray of Exhaustion - Enchantment
Ray of Frost - Conjuration
Read Magic - Universal
Remove Curse - Conjuration
Remove Fear - Enchantment
Repel Metal or Stone - Enchantment
Repel Vermin - Enchantment
Repel Wood - Enchantment
Repulsion - Enchantment
Resilient Sphere- Conjuration
Resistance - Transmutation
Resist Energy - Transmutation

Sanctuary - Enchantment
Scare - Enchantment
Scintillating Pattern - Enchantment
Scorching Ray - Conjuration
Screen - Enchantment
Scrying - Enchantment
Scrying, Greater - Enchantment
Sculpt Sound - Enchantment
Searing Light - Enchantment
See Invisibility - Enchantment
Seeming - Enchantment
Sending - Enchantment
Sequester - Enchantment
Shades - Enchantment
Shadow Conjuration - Enchantment
Shadow Conjuration, Greater - Enchantment
Shadow Evocation - Enchantment
Shadow Evocation, Greater - Enchantment
Shadow Walk - Enchantment
Shatter - Enchantment
Shield - Conjuration
Shield of Faith - Conjuration
Shield of Law - Conjuration
Shield Other - Transmutation
Shocking Grasp - Conjuration
Shout - Enchantment
Shout, Greater - Enchantment
Silence - Enchantment
Silent Image - Enchantment
Simulacrum - Enchantment
Slay Living - Conjuration
Soul Bind - Enchantment
Sound Burst - Enchantment
Speak with Animals - Enchantment
Speak with Dead - Enchantment
Speak with Plants - Enchantment
Spectral Hand - Conjuration
Spell Immunity - Transmutation
Spell Immunity, Greater - Transmutation
Spell Resistance - Transmutation
Spell Turning - Transmutation
Spiritual Weapon - Conjuration
Status - Enchantment
Stoneskin - Transmutation
Stone Tell - Enchantment
Sunbeam - Enchantment
Sunburst - Enchantment
Sympathetic Vibration - Enchantment
Sympathy - Enchantment

Telekinesis - Universal
Telekinetic Sphere - Conjuration
Telepathic Bond - Enchantment
Tiny Hut - Conjuration
Tongues - Enchantment
Touch of Fatigue - Enchantment
Trap the Soul - Enchantment
True Seeing - Enchantment
True Strike - Enchantment

Undeath to Death - Conjuration
Undetectable Alignment - Enchantment
Unhallow - Transmutation
Unholy Aura - Transmutation
Unholy Blight - Conjuration

Vampiric Touch - Conjuration
Veil - Enchantment
Ventriloquism - Enchantment
Vision - Enchantment

Wail of the Banshee - Enchantment
Wall of Fire - Conjuration
Wall of Force - Conjuration
Wall of Ice - Conjuration
Waves of Exhaustion - Enchantment
Waves of Fatigue - Enchantment
Weird - Enchantment
Whirlwind - Transmutation
Wind Wall - Conjuration
Word of Chaos - Enchantment

Zone of Silence - Enchantment
Zone of Truth - Enchantment



Please give a look and lemmie know what you think

rferries
2017-09-23, 07:33 PM
On the one hand you remove a lot of flavour (goodbye, Necromancy!), on the other hand you've done it in a logical way (Conjuration (healing) already absorbed half of Necromancy, so might as well take the other half). Some of your choices are a bit confusing though - why is Searing Light an Enchantment spell?

ShiningStarling
2017-09-24, 05:17 AM
On the one hand you remove a lot of flavour (goodbye, Necromancy!), on the other hand you've done it in a logical way (Conjuration (healing) already absorbed half of Necromancy, so might as well take the other half). Some of your choices are a bit confusing though - why is Searing Light an Enchantment spell?

Sensory based, Light, same reason Shout is enchantment, Sound. Balance-wise, gives a handful of damage spells to an otherwise damage-free school (putting aside shadow evocation, which is so good its basically cheating), but i feel like its flavorful, too.

Also, Necromancy had a lot of spells that were really just... evil, instead of actually dealing with the undead. Fear should have been an enchantment in the first place, but it was necromancy. As for the negative energy stuff, it only makes sense, basically treating both the negative and positive planes as energy types rather than their own separate things, and thus necromancy is history (though necromancers can definitely still be conjuration specialists! Demon summons and undead animation are generally pretty thematically linked anyway).

I personally always find more flavor in being given a template to make my own than being given a label and told, "Here, this defines you." No one played diviners to cast divination spells (well, infrequently anyway), it was all about having more options open. Limitations drive creativity, IMHO. :smallwink:

Eldan
2017-09-24, 05:21 AM
You know, my first instinct was really skeptical, but I think this actually works. You can argue that some spells could be in other places, but you can always do that.

Would you force wizards to specialize under that system? Because it seems to me not specializing would always be the superior choice, given that banning a school is a third of all spells.

Terra Reveene
2017-09-25, 09:40 AM
I've done something similar, though I took those three schools of magic (I call them 'Mind Magic' 'Elemental Magic' and 'Spiritual Magic') and further divided them into spellcaster archetypes. So, for example, you have the Pyromancer in the School of Elemental Magic, gaining all of the fire type related spells, the Jinxter in the School of Mind Magic, gaining all the spells that influence a creature's mind, and so on.
I then replaced spell lists with the simple choice of each class choosing a number of archetypes depending on the class (and, for some, how far into the archetype you go).

EDIT: I've had discussions with a friend of mine regarding this. Our general consensus is that you could theoretically dumb it down into two schools. One for material things and one for the mind.
Another thing we concluded was that the more we limited down the number of schools of magic, the more inclined we were to just say "If we're limiting everything down into as few schools of magic as possible, we may as well just put everything into one school".
Which is why I've done a combination of the two: a few schools of magic that gave clear answers as to what goes where and then specialized areas within said schools of magic.

Lanth Sor
2017-09-25, 09:42 AM
Point of note this would bring necromancy to the point of no real reason for it to exist. You'd be better off killing it as its own school or breaking all the schools down in similar manners.

I'd be very interested in seeing that Terra

Terra Reveene
2017-09-25, 10:07 AM
I'd be very interested in seeing that Terra

I've done it for 5e, so the spells might not tell you anything at all. I'll post the different archetypes if you'd like though, under each of their respective schools.

School of Mind Magic

Jinxter: Has all the mind affecting magic. They get spells such as Charm Person, Suggestion, Enthrall, Hideous Laughter.

Shaper: Controls other creatures' minds. They get spells such as Command, Hold Person, Sleep, Blindness/Deafness, Agony.

Illusionist: Gets all the illusion spells. I think you know what this does.

Seer: Essentially all the Divination spells.

School of Elemental Magic

Pyromancer: Gets all the fire related spells. (doesn't matter if they're from evocation, conjuration, etc.)

Electromancer: Gets all the lightning related spells.

Geomancer: Gets all the earth related spells.

Hydromancer: Gets all the water and ice related spells.

Aeromancer: Gets all the air and sound related spells (sound as in thunder damage spells).

Venomancer: Gets all the poison and acid spells.

School of Spiritual Magic

Sojourner: Can control the velocity of matter, even to the point of teleportation. Gets spells such as Misty Step, Catapult, Feather Fall.

Conjurer: Can summon creatures and objects with the main goal of helping you complete a task (summoning fireballs and such wouldn't be a conjurer thing to do, as that is the Pyromancer's expertise). They get spells such as Mage Hand, Color Spray, Web, Unseen Servant, Find Familiar.

Mender: Menders can cure other creatures of diseases and heal their wounds. They get spells such as Spare the Dying, Cure Wounds, Warding Bond, Aid.

Morpher: Can change creatures and objects in various ways. Essentially all the transmutation spells that don't belong in some other archetype already.

Warder: Can stave off forces of different kinds and ward creatures, objects, and areas. They get spells such as Alarm, Shield, Protection from: X, Resistance.

Thaumaturge: Creates wonders no other spellcaster archetype can. They get spells such as Darkness, Thaumaturgy, False Life, Inflict Wounds, Knock, Animate Dead, Revivify.


It's still a work in progress, but I think this should cover everything there is.

EDIT: I should not that classe DO gain class specific spells as well. For example, Geomancy does not cover plantlife and the likes, those'd be druid specific spells. Magic Missiles (for what it's worth) is a wizard/sorcerer specific spell, as that's pure arcane magic.
So it's a bit more complex than I had originally stated.

ShiningStarling
2017-09-27, 04:54 PM
You know, my first instinct was really skeptical, but I think this actually works. You can argue that some spells could be in other places, but you can always do that.

Would you force wizards to specialize under that system? Because it seems to me not specializing would always be the superior choice, given that banning a school is a third of all spells.

I would, yes. Or possibly give more incentive to specialize, like maybe -1 general slot, +3 of your school, or something to that effect. Requiring specialization is easier, so i would probably stick with that.

Also I should mention, rferries revised Evocation fits really well in the "energy" section of conjuration. Just wanted to shout that out, i didnt comment on his thread, but i liked it.

rferries
2017-09-27, 10:39 PM
I would, yes. Or possibly give more incentive to specialize, like maybe -1 general slot, +3 of your school, or something to that effect. Requiring specialization is easier, so i would probably stick with that.

Also I should mention, rferries revised Evocation fits really well in the "energy" section of conjuration. Just wanted to shout that out, i didnt comment on his thread, but i liked it.

Ha yeah, it always seems that either conjuration swallows up evocation or vice versa.