so for a lv. 5 (total) pc, what should a monk multiclass into/from?

[samcifer]

Thinking of playing a monk character for a one-shot and am planning on a feral tiefling at lv. 5. To compensate for playing a monk at such a low level, is multiclassing necessary and if so, what other class should I go for? I'm thinking of going Way of the Open Hand, but open to playing some other tradition.

Thoughts?

[sir_argo]

Well, my first thought is that Monks gain Extra Attack at 5th, so I'm not sure I'd multiclass.

[Nidgit]

Don't multiclass. Monks generally don't mesh well with other classes even at higher levels.

[Vorpalchicken]

And stunning strike. And a d6 for martial arts. And more ki.

So I definitely recommend one level of druid and one level of ranger.

[samcifer]

And stunning strike. And a d6 for martial arts. And more ki.

So I definitely recommend one level of druid and one level of ranger.

Later, though, right?

[Alatar]

Later, though, right?

I think he's kidding. Don't multiclass.

Open Hand gives you the best mix of tactical tools. Kensei gives you better melee weapon damage (d8/d10 longsword) and a nice ranged option with longbow and Kensei’s Shot. Those are both good choices: more damage or more fun.

[CircleOfTheRock]

Monk is not kind to multiclassing, as it clashes with... just about everything.

Plus, it's a generally followable rule that if you don't go past level five, don't multiclass. Not always worth following, but often.

[bid]

Thinking of playing a monk character for a one-shot and am planning on a feral tiefling at lv. 5.
Dex16 / Wis14 drops you to AC15.

If you were level 1, you might want a good bow to stay out of melee until you have enough health. That'd be done by starting fighter 1 for mariner style and ranged martial.

But at level 5, you really want to start with extra attack.

[Malifice]

Straight monk 5. Stunning fist and Extra attack man.

Straight monk 5.

From there, if Kensai (I love them) I'd personally go Fighter (BM) for 3 levels, then back to Monk.

Flavorful and effective.

[Laserlight]

Monk 5 is the way to go

[MxKit]

Yeah, if you're starting at lv5, I'd say just have all five of those levels in Monk.

Monks really benefit from having as many levels in Monk as possible, though the occasional small dip isn't bad depending on what you want to get out of it. Two-level dips are best if you don't mind losing Perfect Body and your final ASI; you could also go for three-level dips if you feel like you're fine missing out on Empty Body (which is quite good) and another +5 feet of speed.

Small dips I'd suggest, if you think what you get is worth what you lose:


For Way of the Open Hand, you could grab two levels of Fighter somewhere in there for the Dueling fighting style and Action Surge. If you don't mind losing Empty Body and that little extra movement, you could even take three levels of Battle Master Fighter and grab some maneuvers for even more effects you can attach to your attacks with your monk weapons; just keep in mind that it'll take longer for your monk weapons to do 1d10 damage.
For Way of Shadow, you could grab a few dips pretty easily that would work thematically. You could grab a couple levels of Rogue for Expertise, Cunning Action, and 1d6 Sneak Attack. You could grab a couple levels of Warlock for a little magic ability and the Devil's Sight invocation (especially if you don't have natural darkvision!); you can go with the Fiend, the Great Old One, or the Hexblade for their first-level options depending on what flavor you like best. If you don't mind losing Empty Body and that little extra movement, you a couple more options... Three levels of Gloom Stalker Ranger gets you an extra language and a little utility in the exploration pillar of the game, the Dueling fighting style, a little bit of spellcasting that uses your nice Wisdom score, and +10 feet of speed and an extra attack on your first turn of any combat, and darkvision (or increased darkvision if you already have it) and ability to evade others' darkvision in darkness. Three levels of Scout Rogue gets you the aforementioned Expertise and Cunning Action, 2d6 Sneak Attack, a little utility in the exploration pillar of the game, and the ability to move half your speed as a reaction whenever an enemy ends its turn within 5 feet of you without provoking any opportunity attacks from anyone. Three levels of Shadow Magic Sorcerer gets you a little magic ability, a little bit of metamagic (either for a tiny bit of actual metamagic or just for more spell slots), increased darkvision (again, especially good if you don't start with racial darkvision) and extra ways to cast darkness, and basically the Half-Orc's Relentless Endurance without having to be a Half-Orc.
I will also say that if you don't mind losing Opportunist (and 6 total ki points out of your possible pool of 20, and that +5 feet of speed, and the increase of your Monk weapon damage from 1d8 to 1d10...), Shadow Monk 14/Shadow Sorcerer 6 is about the only actual Monk multiclass, rather than dip, I would really recommend taking. You wind up with a decent smattering of spellcasting (five cantrips and seven spells known that can be 1st, 2nd, or 3rd level spells, and the max number of spell slots for those levels that a Sorcerer ever gets), 6 sorcery points that can be used for metamagic, extra spell slots, or casting darkness, the stuff I mentioned above for the three levels of Shadow Sorcerer, and the thematically enjoyable Hound of Ill Omen. Is it worth losing that Monk stuff? I think that really depends on your starting race, the campaign you're playing in, and how much you like the flavor of those Sorcerer options, especially the Hound.
For Way of the Drunken Master, you could grab two or three levels of (Battle Master) Fighter for the exact same reasons I listed for the Open Hand Monk (enjoy how Action Surge, especially, stacks with Intoxicated Frenzy!), three levels of Gloom Stalker Ranger for the same reasons I listed for the Shadow Monk (movement is great for you and that first-turn extra attack will also stack with Intoxicated Frenzy), or two or three levels of (Scout) Rogue for the same reasons I listed for the Shadow Monk (what I just said about movement for Ranger).
For Way of the Kensei, you could again grab two or three levels of (Battle Master) Fighter, again for the same reasons, or you could grab two or three levels of any kind of Rogue (Scout might still help you most, but Thief could be fun and Arcane Trickster gives you a tiny bit of magic to play with) to get a tiny bit of Sneak Attack that you can reroll on a miss. Strictly speaking you could also go with three levels of Arcane Archer Fighter and pick a longbow for your ranged Kensei weapon at Monk lv3, giving you versatility and power in both long-range and melee combat, which could make for an interesting build!
For Way of the Sun Soul, you could yet again grab two or three levels of (Battle Master) Fighter for the usual reasons. But for thematic builds, you might even grab one, two, or three levels of Light Cleric (for a little magic and Warding Flare, Channel Divinity: Radiance of the Dawn once per short or long rest, and maybe second-level spell slots, respectively). You could take one, two, or three levels of Celestial Warlock for a little casting, a little healing, a few invocations, and maybe a boon. You could even take two or three levels of (Redemption) Paladin for a little Lay on Hands, the Dueling fighting style, a little spellcasting and therefore a little Divine Smiting to play with, and maybe a Channel Divinity you can use to be more persuasive or to Rebuke the Violent (ie enemies take radiant damage for attacking anyone other than you within 30 feet of you)... Paladin is probably a bit too MAD for you, though, unless your stats just happen to shake out that way.
For Way of the Long Death, you could do the usual two or three levels of (Battle Master) Fighter thing if you want. I'd personally go single-classed for Long Death Monk, though, since Touch of the Long Death can completely devour your ki points, buuut two levels of Fighter just to get Action Surge would still be perfectly fine, and Battle Master maneuvers would still give you a little extra utility. I wouldn't bother with Grave Cleric or Necromancer Wizard or anything like that, though. That said, if you're going Long Death in the first place, you might be prioritizing thematic flavor, in which case you might even be willing to go so far as Long Death Monk 12/Grave Cleric 8, or Long Death Monk 10/Necromancer Wizard 10.


Still, most of the time, I'd go to lv5 in Monk before multiclassing into any of those... There are some exceptions, though. If you're in dark places a lot, you might get a lot out of going Shadow Monk 3/Warlock 2, Shadow Monk 3/Ranger 2 (to take another level in Ranger at lv6 and snag Gloom Stalker and its perks), or Shadow Monk 3/Sorcerer 2 (same logic as Ranger). If you plan on doing the Drunken Master Monk/Gloom Stalker Ranger combo, and again if you could use the natural darkvision and evasion from enemies' darkvision, you'd do nearly as well going Drunken Master Monk 3/Gloom Stalker Ranger 2 (to take another level in Ranger at lv6 and snag Gloom Stalker then) as you would going just straight Drunken Master Monk 5. If you plan on doing the Kensei Monk/Arcane Archer Fighter build, you would probably actually be best going Kensei Monk 3/Fighter 2 (to take another level in Fighter at lv6 and snag Arcane Archer and your Arcane Shot options; Action Surge should make your lack of Extra Attack hurt a little less, and you probably want those cool arrows as early on as possible). So you have the flavor just starting out, if you only ever plan on taking one or two levels of Light Cleric or Celestial Warlock anyway, you could go in as a Sun Soul Monk 4/Light Cleric 1, or Sun Soul Monk 4/Celestial Warlock 1, if you don't mind putting off Extra Attack for one level. And if you're going Long Death Monk and prioritizing thematic flavor, no reason not to be some mix of Long Death Monk/Grave Cleric or Long Death Monk/Necromancer Wizard even just at lv5, but again, even for flavor, you might not want to put off getting Extra Attack that much.

[samcifer]

My only gripe is a lack of armor as you have to give up the extra movement to get it and can only get it through a feat or mc-ing. At lv. 5 as a Tabaxi, I have 20 DEX and 12 WIS, but that's only 16 AC for a melee character unless I want to give up the unarmed strikes to attack from range instead. :(

[CircleOfTheRock]

My only gripe is a lack of armor as you have to give up the extra movement to get it and can only get it through a feat or mc-ing. At lv. 5 as a Tabaxi, I have 20 DEX and 12 WIS, but that's only 16 AC for a melee character unless I want to give up the unarmed strikes to attack from range instead. :(
Why in goodness' name would you have only 12 WIS? Especially after an ASI? Dump something else, and dump it hard… Monks just flat out don't need STR or INT, and CHA… Why, just why?

[BobZan]

Lv 5 Monk is one of the best power spikes in the game. Stick to it!

[bid]

At lv. 5 as a Tabaxi, I have 20 DEX and 12 WIS
Don't do monk if you can't have Dex16 / Wis16.

Even a Tabaxi can start 10 16 14 10 14 11, there are no excuse to be any lower.

[samcifer]

Why in goodness' name would you have only 12 WIS? Especially after an ASI? Dump something else, and dump it hard… Monks just flat out don't need STR or INT, and CHA… Why, just why?

Our DM has us use a set arrangement of starting stats: 16, 14, 12, 12, 10, and 10

My character has 12 STR, 20 DEX, 14 CON, 12 WIS, 10 INT, and 10 CHA

[samcifer]

I could swap CON and WIS for 14 WIS and 20 DEX which would give me 17 AC instead of 16, but I couldn't take many hits then. I have no idea what the other players will be using for their characters.

[Aett_Thorn]

+1 to AC is probably better than 5 extra hitpoints. +1 to Stunning Strike DC is also better than 5 extra hitpoints.

[GlenSmash!]

16 AC is fine on a Monk.

Monks should be moving around stunning things, not standing in front of bad guys taking hits.

And if you do have your Monk stand in front of bad guys, for Pelor's sake use Dodge as a bonus action. It's well worth the Ki cost.

[Aett_Thorn]

16 AC is fine on a Monk.

Monks should be moving around stunning things, not standing in front of bad guys taking hits.

And if you do have your Monk stand in front of bad guys, for Pelor's sake use Dodge as a bonus action. It's well worth the Ki cost.

Hard to Stun with only a +1 to Wis.

[samcifer]

So swap WIS and CON scores then for:

STR: 12, DEX: 20, CON: 12, WIS: 14, INT: 10, CHA: 11 (forgot the Tabaxi +1 to CHA above, not that it matters)? (for 17 AC and 33 HP)

Another option would be to go 18 DEX and 16 WIS. What would be the better choice?

[Christian]

So swap WIS and CON scores then for:

STR: 12, DEX: 20, CON: 12, WIS: 14, INT: 10, CHA: 11 (forgot the Tabaxi +1 to CHA above, not that it matters)? (for 17 AC and 33 HP)

Another option would be to go 18 DEX and 16 WIS. What would be the better choice?

Concur. It's hard to definitively quantify, of course, but that matches my experience playing monks. Anytime someone hits you for five or more points of damage on an attack that exactly hit your AC, or the round after exactly making the save DC against your stunning fist, you'd be thinking, "Curses! I wish I'd bumped Wisdom instead of Constitution!" And while you'd say the converse every time you miss a Constitution save by 1, or are hit for more than your remaining hit points but less than your remaining hit points +5 in a fight were there weren't any misses by just 1, if you take the Wisdom up, that just doesn't seem to happen very often.

[samcifer]

Concur. It's hard to definitively quantify, of course, but that matches my experience playing monks. Anytime someone hits you for five or more points of damage on an attack that exactly hit your AC, or the round after exactly making the save DC against your stunning fist, you'd be thinking, "Curses! I wish I'd bumped Wisdom instead of Constitution!" And while you'd say the converse every time you miss a Constitution save by 1, or are hit for more than your remaining hit points but less than your remaining hit points +5 in a fight were there weren't any misses by just 1, if you take the Wisdom up, that just doesn't seem to happen very often.

Well, I've decided to go Kensei, so Agile Parry for +2 AC will help make me harder to hit. That'll help.

[GlenSmash!]

Hard to Stun with only a +1 to Wis.

Yup. Should definitely try to change that +1.

[samcifer]

Okay, so as a Kensei Monk I now have:

STR: 12, DEX: 18, CON: 12 (for 33 hp), INT: 10, WIS: 16, and CHA: 11. AC is 17.

[Aett_Thorn]

Okay, so as a Kensei Monk I now have:

STR: 12, DEX: 18, CON: 12 (for 33 hp), INT: 10, WIS: 16, and CHA: 11. AC is 17.

Looks good to me!

[samcifer]

*sigh* so all that worry and calculating and we never even played the one-shot tonight as the DM and his roommate who is one of the other players arrived to the holiday party late.:( Oh well, we have a regular session with our main characters next weekend.