The Fochlucan Lyrist

[etrpgb]

I have a friend that would like to play a Fochlucan Lyrist. As he played one in dnd3.

In dnd 5e there is no direct support of this class. However, since there are both the Druids and the Bards so it should not be difficult to find something that plays similarly. Besides, that player is not particularly a power player or demaning about details. He just would like a usable character with the Fochlucan Lyrist flavor.



The Fochlucan Lyrist is a strange class, its fluff pushes to think that is meant to be a Bard becoming a bit of a Druid. But the mechanics are kinda the opposite.



Warrior, thief, spy, poet, woodland champion -- the Fochlucan lyrist is a legendary figure who serves as the herald and teacher to great kings, the champion of the common folk, and the keeper of lore long forgotten elsewhere. Only the best and brightest are invited to become Fochlucan lyrists, and those who eventually win the approval of the Fochlucan College's masters are remarkable individuals indeed, skilled in swordplay, magic, and diplomacy.

The Fochlucan Lyrist (http://archive.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20050107a&page=2) in dnd 3.5.


In dnd3.5 (without shenanigans) playable builds basically are:

Bard 1/Druid 4/Green Whisperer 3/Spelldancer 2/Fochlucan Lyrist 10
Bard 2/Spell-less Ranger 9/Druid 1/Fochlucan Lyrist 8


The first build is the one the player actually used for a level 15 campaign at the time.


I was thinking to simply make a sub-class of the Bard using the Circle of the Land from the Druid class.
Basically, you are a Bard that takes from Druid spells.


Any suggestion of to manage this old class?

To pass the point: I am not interested in ways to play this class in dnd3.5, but to make something with same flavor in dnd5 with a power comparable with the other classes.

[Unoriginal]

Well, since both of the "playable builds" are more or less Druid/Bard, I would say that a simple Druid/Bard multiclass would work. Sword Bard/Land Druid, even.

[JellyPooga]

Straight Bard accomplishes it. Lore Bard for a more Druidic focus, or Valour for a more Ranger-y feel. Magical Secrets to nab a few Druid spells about does the job.

[Jormengand]

You might consider making a variant multiclass (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showsinglepost.php?p=23129983&postcount=13) version of bard and applying it to druid, or vice versa.

[Atavis]

This is the game already. :)

"Most of its bards study and practice the methods of the College of Lore, as described in the Bard College class feature in the Player's Handbook." Sword Coast Adventure Guide, pg 123

[Quoxis]

Bard should work fine, especially with the „magical secrets“ feature netting you some druid spells (therefore better go lore bard) - if you’re using Xanathar’s or the elemental evil player’s companion, you can also grab the „magic initiate“ feat for some nature/elements style spells from the sorcerer spell list (mainly to still cast them with cha). You could also grab druidcraft with it, as it doesn’t require a casting stat because it’s a mere fluff spell, but if that’s worth a feat is up to your player.
For a bit more of a nature theme i wouldn’t take druid levels - no metal armor (by raw) and wildshape that doesn’t belong in the original inspiration as far as i understand - but instead grab ranger levels, stats allowing*. It adds better weapon and armor proficiencies, lots of nature/spy/stalker flavor and more martial prowess than pure bard or bardruid.

*you should always have at least 13 dex on a non-heavy armor wearer, and if you‘d consider dipping druid you‘d need the 13 wis anyway

[Grod_The_Giant]

There are plenty of Druid-y spells on the base Bard list; grabbing Magic Initiate and a few carefully chosen Magical Secrets should do the rest. Maybe a two- or three-level Druid dip for Wild Shape and some more spells.

[Aett_Thorn]

Based on the criteria, I would think that a Variant Human College of Swords Bard with the Ritual Caster (Druid) feat would do the trick. Take your skills expertise in things like Persuasion and Nature or Animal Handling, and you should be good.

There’s enough overlap of the Bard and Druid list that you can feel a bit Druid-y until level 10 and Magical Secrets to round out the list.

[Naanomi]

A Druid with the Entertainer background is fine, coming out it from the other side

[Nifft]

3.5e Fochlucan Lyrist:
+ Progresses skills (6+Int on a great list).
+ Full BAB.
+ Progresses Bard and Druid casting.
+ Progresses Bardic music.
- Does not progress Wild Shape nor Animal Companion.
- Does not grant Druid features like venom immunity.


So it seems like a Bard chassis is most appropriate.

Maybe create a Bard subclass ("Collage of Fochlucan Lyrics") which grants the Druidic language, and the ability to prepare some Druid spells in addition to the Bard spells you know?

[MeeposFire]

Oddly the 3e fochlucan lyrist was a prc that was an attempt to bring back the original 1e bard feel in 3e. The 1e bard had druid, thief, and fighter abilities to go along with the few bard only abilities (hence why the PRC required evasion for the rogue, druid language and boosting druid abilites, and gave you full attack like a fighter). The reason that it needed to be a prc in 3e is due to how badly it would go if you tried to do it with normal multiclassing rules.

Fortunately we do not have this problem so much in 5e. You can gain the warrior type abilities by taking either valor or sword bard. You can gain druid spells using magical secrets and the normal bard gives you most of what you need from the rogue.

Alternatively you could go with a druid with the entertainer background (or similar) or take a roguish sounding one to get more rogue oriented skills (then pay or otherwise find a way to get your musical instrument prof). You could go with some sort rogue multiclass as well.

Speaking of rogue that is a third option go scout rogue and take magic initiate/ritual casting (druid) to pick up some druid spells and possibly pick up inspiring leader so you have a bardic like ability. Very feat intensive but doable and it feels closer to the rogue/warrior end of the 1e bard with only token spell casting more than likely.

[Nifft]

Oddly the 3e fochlucan lyrist was a prc that was an attempt to bring back the original 1e bard feel in 3e. The 1e bard had druid, thief, and fighter abilities to go along with the few bard only abilities (hence why the PRC required evasion for the rogue, druid language and boosting druid abilites, and gave you full attack like a fighter). The reason that it needed to be a prc in 3e is due to how badly it would go if you tried to do it with normal multiclassing rules.

Back in 1e, the Bard was the original Prestige Class.

You took levels in Fighter and Thief, then you became a Bard and started casting Druid spells.

I think you're 100% correct about the intent of the Fochlucan Lyrist being an attempt to recapture that very specific multiclass weirdness.

[etrpgb]

We spoke about it and we go simple: Lore Bard and he will pick-up as "druidy" features as possible and practical. Thanks everyone!