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Xuldarinar
2018-08-04, 08:30 AM
Gestalt Advancement
In this campaign variant, characters essentially select two classes at first level and advance with their tracks combined at each level, generally selecting the best elements of each.

Building a Gestalt Character

To make a 1st-level gestalt character, choose two classes. Build your character according to the following guidelines.

Key Ability: For your Class Ability Boost, you may select between any listed as the Key Ability. A Cleric//Sorcerer. for instance, may elect to choose either Charisma or Wisdom.

Hit Points: Select the higher value between the two. A Barbarian//Wizard would gain 12 plus their Constitution modifier.

Perception and Saving Throws: Select the better proficiencies.

Skills: You are trained in all skills automatically trained in both classes. In addition you are trained in a number of skills equal to the average of the two plus your intelligence modifier, rounded down if necessary. A Champion//Sorcerer would be trained in 2 + their Intelligence modifier, but a Rogue//Sorcerer would be trained in 4 + Intelligence modifier.

Attacks, Defenses, and Spells: You are proficient with all listed at the levels they are listed at. Take the better where two lists show the same at different levels.

Class Features: A gestalt character gains all the class features of both classes and functionally combines all respects of those two classes. There are, however, exceptions to this rule:

-You do not gain additional feats, skill increases, or ability increases as part of advancement. When you would gain a class feat you may select from any valid list. IF one of your classes picks a class feat for you at a level, such as first, you still must choose that one. If both classes make that choice for you, you must pick between them and gain the class feature and feat associated with it at 2nd level instead. For example, at 1st level a Barbarian//Champion may select from the Barbarian list of class feats or the Champion list of class feats, but not from both. However, a Champion//Druid will still be compelled to take a feat based on their Druidic Order. A Bard//Druid must decide whether they gain their Muse and its associated feat at 1st level or their Druidic Order and its associated feat. They will acquire the other at 2nd level as their class feat at that level.

-If you gain more than one source of focus spells, you get all focus spells known of their respective types, but they share a pool.

-When you take two classes that can cast spells, take the better casting advancement. You still keep track of prepared spells and spells known separately.


Multiclass Feats: While using this system, you may not utilize multiclass archetype feats.



As an example, here are the first five levels of advancement for a Fighter//Sorcerer



Your Level
Class Features


1
Ancestry and background, initial proficiencies, attack of opportunity, bloodline, shield block, sorcerer spellcasting, spell repertoire


2
Skill feat, fighter or sorcerer feat


3
2nd-level spells, bravery, general feat, signature spells, skill increase


4
Skill feat, fighter or sorcerer feat


5
3rd-level spells, ability boosts, ancestry feat, fighter weapon mastery, magical fortitude, skill increase




And here is one for a Cleric//Druid


Your Level
Class Features


1
Ancestry and background, initial proficiencies, deity, divine spellcasting, primal spellcasting, anathema, divine font, Druidic language, doctrine or druidic circle*, wild empathy


2
Skill feat, doctrine or druidic circle*


3
2nd-level spells, general feat, second doctrine, skill increase


4
Skill feat, cleric or druid feat


5
3rd-level spells, ability boosts, ancestry feat, alertness, skill increase


*You choose one of these options at first level and acquire the other at second level.

khadgar567
2018-08-04, 10:13 AM
for asmodeus sake mate try to at least read the f ing book before poping the first homebrew of the damn thing its out for only two whole days and you literally pop the cap on playtest by introducing gestalt rules for pathfinder 2e. even in paizo forums there is no one with playtest review treat and you jump the gun on lets improve the game that not yet published caravan. slow down will ya.

Xuldarinar
2018-08-04, 12:52 PM
for asmodeus sake mate try to at least read the f ing book before poping the first homebrew of the damn thing its out for only two whole days and you literally pop the cap on playtest by introducing gestalt rules for pathfinder 2e. even in paizo forums there is no one with playtest review treat and you jump the gun on lets improve the game that not yet published caravan. slow down will ya.


Ordinarily I would agree with you. Ordinarily.

That said, I learn a system and its limitations in two manners: Creating characters, and seeing how the rules take to modification. I like seeing the hypothetical. How old ideas function under new systems. Now, I've already read the book, toyed with the rules, and through brewing and similar testing I can see what actually makes a class. What is actually needed, what isn't. What points can exist to be balanced around. You'll notice I've not drawn up an adaptation of any number of older classes to be used in the playtest. I could of started off with bringing the Shadowcaster over, or the Binder, Incarnates, ect. I could of updated my Alloprax into the new system, but I'm starting with saner more open points. That sort of stuff, stuff really about improving the game and giving more tools, can wait till the game is finalized and out for a bit. This is also a public forum through which I can also consider how they change things are set up between now and when the game is formally released.


Amusingly, you evoke Asmodeus and another thing I've been toying with are how paladins would function with non-paladin deities, and by extensions how clerics could function if you let them follow whomever regardless of their alignment. A paladin of asmodeus actually turns out to be mechanically interesting, and surprisingly there is actually no deity that is impossible to follow between the Paladin code and the Anathema of the different deities. Some are more difficult, granted, but none are actually impossible. They excluded rules for associates, which seemed to bar it most. That said, since we don't see any spell that raises undead yet (that I could find), we don't know if that remains an evil act in of itself which could then lead to conflict with one: Urgothoa. But even then, when is a paladin going to be a spot where raising a creature from the dead is an option for them?


I understand the remark and frustration. You are right, it only just started. Almost no one has had a chance to actually bring things to the table which really is what matters most in the playtest. I'm not one in that position, so I test and entertain ideas in my way. This isn't a: "Lets make this better" matter. This is to see how older parts and notions function, and see what the new parts do. This also raises awareness on these forums that the playtest even exists (Any interested: Click here (http://paizo.com/pathfinderplaytest))


I could also argue you that the ability to brew for a system, its flexibility and ease of development, is extremely important for a system's growth and continued support both from the company and the community. Look at 4E. You ever try brewing a class for that system? Too many parts to consider, too much boxed up, and I don't know of many people who liked it over other versions (not to say they do not exist). 3e and its descendants, and 5e are adored and they are much easier to create for and shape as desired. So would it not then make sense as part of testing a system also test ease of creation for said system?

khadgar567
2018-08-04, 01:58 PM
okay okay i get it you want raise awareness then do me favor and throttle down a couple of notches so people can get their idea by them selfs.

Digitalfruitz
2018-08-04, 03:05 PM
okay okay i get it you want raise awareness then do me favor and throttle down a couple of notches so people can get their idea by them selfs.

Someone has to be the first person to brew something up. Also if we canít homebrew stuff for the system when it comes out on the play test how long do we have to wait before we can get started?

inuyasha
2018-08-04, 06:53 PM
Heck, I need to start brewing again. I look here for the first time in a while, and of course you're the one making the first brew for Pathfinder 2e :smallamused:.

I've only looked at the new PDF a little bit, but it looks like a fun system.

Xuldarinar
2019-08-06, 01:53 PM
Since Pathfinder 2E is now out, I thought i'd come back and update this.

Xzoltar
2019-08-18, 08:36 AM
I think theses Gestalt rules are nice. You are still less powerful than a Gestalt from other edition as Pathfinder 2nd rely heavly on your Class Feats. You gain more versatility with your choice of feats, but you don't gain more of them.

I won't use that for my player right now, but its a good template for Powerful NPC and Boss Monster