Dragonborn and Lizardfolk kissing cousins

[ZenBear]

So in my homebrew setting, the majority of humanoid races exist on an island continent in the west, cordoned off from the main continent by the power of an archfey known as the Stormfather. There they were allowed time to grow from simple primitives into the civilized races we get to play as. On the main continent, an ongoing war between fey and aberrations escalated into a clash of titans, with dragons and dinosaurs battling shoggoths and other monstrosities, leaving little room for smaller, weaker beasts to live with the exception of those races favored by the dominant species. Among these are the dragonborn and kobolds, having obvious familial relation to the dragons. After a turning point in the war, dragons came to dominate the continent, driving the aberrations away. The chromatics and metallics soon began to fight among themselves, and after another pivotal moment the chromatics gained the upper hand, driving the metallics to the western edge of the continent and into near extinction. Through divine inspiration, a few metallic dragons and their dragonborn followers constructed an enormous ark that could survive the brutal storms in the western sea, seeking refuge in a land only ancient legends spoke of. They succeed, and thus are dragonborn and kobolds introduced to the main campaign setting.

Now all of this was conceived before Volo's Guide was released, and now lizardfolk and yuan-ti are playable races. In an effort to make my campaign setting as inclusive as possible, I want to incorporate these races as well. The trouble I'm having, and why I'm posting to the playground, is how best to incorporate their disparate lore. Lizardfolk, for example, are cold-blooded with an alien mindset, having no emotions in the way other humanoids, including dragonborn, do. So I don't think they should be too closely related as for example chimps are to humans, which is what I imagine kobolds are to dragonborn. Should they be simply a divergent reptilian offshoot, closely related to yuan-ti but very distantly to dragonborn and kobolds, and leave it at that? Or perhaps they are a branch of the species that has been partly corrupted by aberrant manipulation, warping their minds in ways that make them seem alien, but they are technically a cousin species? This isn't unprecedented in my setting since orcs are similarly corrupted elves, like in Tolkien's setting.

Just curious to hear other people's ideas that might inspire me. Has anyone else built a custom setting that they struggled to fit a playable race into? Has anyone else come up with a clever way to explain similar races with oddly disparate lore?

[strangebloke]

Quick version of my take on races in 5e:

First came dragons. Full-on, chromatic metallic dragons.

Then came humans. Some of them dedicated their lives to magic and changed, becoming elves. Others took to living in great caverns beneath the earth and grew short and narrowly-focused and we call them dwarves. Some humans are very diminutive, and we call them halflings. Gnomes are an offshoot of dwarves who study magic a lot, but they're rare.

Then came orcs. Orcs were given the gift of transformation. When an orc is born, he is small, mean, and disgusting (goblin) as he grows and becomes a man, his personal philosophy and way of life will determine what he becomes. An orc raised by humans will become like them (half-orc). An orc who upholds society as the greatest good becomes strong and capable of complex thought (hobgoblin). An orc who views strength as the greatest good becomes big and strong (orc). An orc raised entirely on the idea of self-sufficiency becomes a bugbear. One who prizes endurance becomes a goliath.

The greatest of the orcs never age, and never stop growing. That's where giants come from. A hill giant represent a regression into a lesser form.

Kobolds, Dragonborn, and Lizardfolk were created by dragons as slaves, diplomats, and scouts, respectively.

Most other races are squarely in the camp of 'a wizard did it.' There might be a single tribe of kenku somewhere, but they're not really an established species.

[Millstone85]

I don't see anything wrong with the evolution of species in a fantasy world, but I think you should keep the yuan-ti out of it. They are humans who practice sacrificial rituals to acquire ophidian traits, and divide themselves in castes depending on how successful the transformation is. Changing their origin would completely change the concept.

[ZenBear]

Awesome stuff guys! Thanks for the replies.


Then came humans. Some of them dedicated their lives to magic and changed, becoming elves. Others took to living in great caverns beneath the earth and grew short and narrowly-focused and we call them dwarves. Some humans are very diminutive, and we call them halflings. Gnomes are an offshoot of dwarves who study magic a lot, but they're rare.

I have it work similarly in my setting. The primary struggle of my setting is nature (fey) vs extra-dimensional invaders (aberrations). Humans are the baseline, all other races have been warped by either fey or aberrant magic. Dwarves are the underground warriors, gnomes their magically gifted cousins, halflings their diplomats. Partially laid out here. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?562590-Dwarves-Gnomes-and-Halflings-oh-my!) A fun place this lets me go is humans believing themselves to be the pure, superior race. Heil humanity! :P


Then came orcs. Orcs were given the gift of transformation. When an orc is born, he is small, mean, and disgusting (goblin) as he grows and becomes a man, his personal philosophy and way of life will determine what he becomes. An orc raised by humans will become like them (half-orc). An orc who upholds society as the greatest good becomes strong and capable of complex thought (hobgoblin). An orc who views strength as the greatest good becomes big and strong (orc). An orc raised entirely on the idea of self-sufficiency becomes a bugbear. One who prizes endurance becomes a goliath.

The greatest of the orcs never age, and never stop growing. That's where giants come from. A hill giant represent a regression into a lesser form.

Very cool! I have a similar idea in that I'm incorporating Warmachine factions into my setting and the Trollbloods (https://warmachineuniversity.com/mw/index.php/Trollbloods) are replaced by Giantkin (goblins, orcs, ogres, giants). My original idea was that they were simply born one way or another, small babies becoming goblins, medium orcs, large ogres or giants. I might have to steal your idea though.


Kobolds, Dragonborn, and Lizardfolk were created by dragons as slaves, diplomats, and scouts, respectively.

So would you do away with the cold-blooded alien mindset, or just chock it up to genetic manipulation/drift?


I don't see anything wrong with the evolution of species in a fantasy world, but I think you should keep the yuan-ti out of it. They are humans who practice sacrificial rituals to acquire ophidian traits, and divide themselves in castes depending on how successful the transformation is. Changing their origin would completely change the concept.

Good point, I was more focused on the lizardfolk but it makes sense that the few humans that exist in the east would be forced to extreme lengths to survive, including performing such dark rituals.

[strangebloke]

So would you do away with the cold-blooded alien mindset, or just chock it up to genetic manipulation/drift?


No, keep the mindset. It's a mindset that the Dragons gave them. Kobolds are designed as perfect slaves (industrious, self-sacrificing, little personal needs) and lizardfolk are perfect scouts (built-in scavenging skill, 100% pragmatic outlook, enhanced perception ability.) DRagonborn are made like humans, because they're diplomats and high-ranking servants.

[Unoriginal]

You could have the Lizardfolk come from the dinosaurs who are fighting where the dragons are, rather than form the dragons themselves.

[Millstone85]

Dragonborn and kobolds could have been created by dragons from enslaved lizardfolk, using a mix of selective breeding and magical infusion. Dragonborn were made to be soldiers and kobolds to be servants.

[ZenBear]

You could have the Lizardfolk come from the dinosaurs who are fighting where the dragons are, rather than form the dragons themselves.

Another good idea. I'm also taking inspiration from Warhammer Lizardmen (http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Lizardmen) for this setting, and I view the Dragonborn as Saurus (http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Saurus) and originally the Kobolds filled the role of the Skinks (http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Skinks), but now I guess Lizardfolk will be Skinks and Kobolds will be something else entirely. Sort of the goblins of the reptilian race. The Lizardfolk are the earliest attempt by the fey at a humanoid species derived from the older and less intelligent dinosaurs, Kobolds were the failed first attempt at a humanoid race derived from the superior dragons that still serve a purpose as servants, and the Dragonborn are the successful attempt that serve as warriors and diplomats.

[JoeJ]

So would you do away with the cold-blooded alien mindset, or just chock it up to genetic manipulation/drift?

I would (and do) get rid of that completely. Volo was not just wrong, the truth is nearly the exact opposite. Lizardfolk are creatures of overwhelming emotion that they have very little ability to control or overcome, but it's the emotions of aggression and fear and anger and hunger and lust, rather than of bonding or empathy. They are the embodiment of "lizard brain" thinking.