demonslayerelf
2018-09-30, 11:47 AM
Further than the story, the fact that you put this in Homebrew Design makes me think of mechanical things you might do, and I'm gonna focus on that.
Don't give the Necro actual spellcasting, like a wizard. I know it probably seems like you should, but doing that will bog YOU down with the "What spells should I use" question. Further, necromancy is mostly underexplored in 5e, especially for Wizards, so most of the spells you would cast would be off-theme for a great and terrible necromancer.
So here's what you should do, is you should give it the ability to cast a handful of Necromancy spells that you just choose from any level or spell list, while modifying them in cool, thematic ways. Here are some ideas;
Danse Macabre is a really nice one, and you can make it special to the Necro by removing it's concentration tag. Whenever the party has cleared his minions(Or mostly cleared them), have him cast this version of Danse Macabre. Maybe he can only cast this three or so times, but you might make it at-will mid-fight if the undead are being cleared way faster than you anticipated. You might also make it a sort of phase-thing, where the first time they kill the undead, zombies and skeletons show up, then skeleton knights, then undead knights riding skeletal war horses, or even shadows and nightmares(Yes, I know they're fiendish, oh well) and things. Not necessarily more dangerous, but different and strange compared to the norm.
Life Transference is cool, but not really what a Necro would be doing. Maybe give a modified version of this to all of the undead the necro raises; The zombie/skele/whatever immediately dies, and heals the Necro for it's hit points. Maybe even make it a reaction for the undead(Something like "When the necro is hurt, the undead may die and heal the necro etc.), if you want it to be really tough to deal with.
Those are cool, but on a round-to-round basis, what would the necro be doing? Ideally, he would stay far away from the party and do creepy, dark things to them. He could probably cast Fog Cloud and/or Darkness at-will, but describing them as a blackened mist type of thing. Again, probably no concentration.
He should play with maximum hit points a lot. Maybe give him a Recharge 5-6 ability like "Wither", which causes a creature's maximum health to be reduced to their current hit points(Obviously don't start with this ability :P). He probably has the Chill Touch cantrip, and you should probably call that either 2d8 or 3d8, maybe with potent cantrip so he would add his casting modifier to the damage. He might even have Inflict Wounds(Or something very similar) as an at-will spell(1st level, since 3d10 is quite a bit already), for when they get in close.
Further, to add in some variety, he should have a couple of other caster-things helping him. Maybe talented zombies, maybe some magic traps; Something that poses a threat bigger than the normal undead, but less than the necromancer, and are very much a magical thing.
Don't make the necro too tough, either. He's a wizardly type, him having 1000000 hit points is just weird. Instead, just have him far away from the party, atop a throne of bones on an obsidian pillar. Something very hard to get to(Of course, the Necro could probably cast Fly, so you might even surround it with a 'bottomless' pit for added danger), so they can't just wail on him. Maybe put some sort of force field around him that they might have to break through, or maybe a "Super Zombie" thing using the stats for a Flesh Golem(Albeit toned down a bit) that defends him from all danger. Beyond that, he should be utterly swarmed with little guys; Zombies, skeletons, crawling hands, things like that. They won't do too much(And if they ARE doing too much, lower their damage or attack bonus, or maybe spawn fewer in the future.)
All of that said, let me pitch a crazy necro fight set up, which(Despite being low-level), will make everybody feel like epic heroes.
The field is the mostly-open town square, lit only by the glowing full moon, the players walking in from one of the streets or alleys, or maybe the rooftops. The necromancer has made a literal throne of bone atop a pile of burning skulls and bones. There are two torch sconces burning next to the torch, one on either side, with a sickly black flame with ethereal green and blue sparks occasionally coming off of it. They have four floating, glowing skulls lazily circling the chair. The pile of bones is nearly 20 feet high, implying a mass slaughter, and giving them more than enough bodies to raise a small army.
As the party steps closer, they walk over random corpses and body parts that litter the ground, and the necromancer makes no indication of knowing that they're there. When the party is within a comfortable shooting distance, the necromancer begins to give a small speech, commending the party's efforts as they close in, but pointing out that they have become thorns in the necromancer's side for far too long, and that the necromancer is ashamed with themselves for not dealing with them sooner. The remaining townspeople are either caged or tied off to the sides of the 'arena', likely screaming or crying for help.
Once the party is well within range of the necromancer, the necro says something along the lines of "Well, regardless... I can't say I am glad to have known you... But I am glad to have killed you." Then all of the bodies stand up. Random amalgamations of bone and rotten flesh claw their way out from the bone pile under the throne, forced into unnatural shapes like skeletal minotaurs and warhorses, skeletons with five arms or no hands, with their arms sharpened to makeshift swords, some with bodies cloaked in eternal fire. From behind the throne, a large, frankenstein abomination walks out and stands between the necromancer and the party. Behind them, all of the bodies that the party walked over suddenly spring to life, using pitchforks and two-by-fours as makeshift weapons.
The necromancer and his pet do nothing, just arrogantly watch the party fight for their lives 20 feet below. If someone rushes the necromancer, the necro's pet would try to throw them back down into the bloodbath. Whenever his creations begin to die off, the necromancer waves their hand, and simply twists the broken bodies into more and more unrecognizable shapes.
Sounds cool? Cool. Hope you can get some inspiration from that, here's the mechanics I intended;
"There are two torch sconces burning next to the torch, one on either side, with a sickly black flame with ethereal green and blue sparks occasionally coming off of it."
Lair actions; On initiative count 20, one of the sconces send a 1d10 Firebolt that deals cold, fire, lightning, or necrotic damage(Necro's choice). Only a +5 attack bonus, but it should add up if the fight drags on.
"They have four floating, glowing skulls lazily circling the chair."
The chair produces one each turn, and when a creature steps within 10 feet, one of the skulls flies toward them. DC 15(Or whatever) dexterity save, 2d4 necrotic damage on a failure.
"The remaining townspeople are either caged or tied off to the sides of the 'arena', likely screaming or crying for help."
Guess what the party's time limit is? Things will start attacking and killing random villagers. How many can the party save?
"Random amalgamations of bone and rotten flesh claw their way out from the bone pile under the throne, forced into unnatural shapes like skeletal minotaurs and warhorses, skeletons with five arms or no hands, with their arms sharpened to makeshift swords, some with bodies cloaked in eternal fire."
Homebrew a little bit, here; Skeletons, Zombies, Skeletal Warhorse, Skeletal Minotaur, Skeletons with more attacks(Five arms), Skeletons with extra damage(Sword-hands), Zombies and Skeletons with 1d6 extra fire damage(Burning). Tie the relative strength of the undead(For instance, Skeletons and Zombies would be 1, but the burning or sword etc. undead would be 2, warhorse 3, minotaur 4), and summon a total of 8-ish for the not-really-danse-macabre-effect I mentioned earlier.
"From behind the throne, a large, frankenstein abomination walks out and stands between the necromancer and the party."
Flesh Golem, Undead, probably ~half health, maybe lower the damage a bit. Give it the ability to jump in front of ranged attacks(Which it won't take much damage from, if any) that would hit the necromancer, and the ability to throw people 20 feet(Maybe deal 2d6 falling damage).
"Behind them, all of the bodies that the party walked over suddenly spring to life, using pitchforks and two-by-fours as makeshift weapons."
Just some extra skeletons and zombies. Probably 3 or 4 that are a threat in the beginning, but 1d3 walk into the battlefield each turn at Initiative 20.
"The necromancer and his pet do nothing, just arrogantly watch the party fight for their lives 20 feet below. If someone rushes the necromancer, the necro's pet would try to throw them back down into the bloodbath. Whenever his creations begin to die off, the necromancer waves their hand, and simply twists the broken bodies into more and more unrecognizable shapes."
The necro and flesh golem don't join the fight until the end of the 3rd wave of undead(From that danse macabre effect, which turns normal skeletons into warhorses and minotaurs. The last wave, round 4, turns them all into a single super-skeleton bone golem thing(A Minotaur Skeleton and an Ogre Zombie put together, keeping all of the good traits and throwing out the bad, with a 2 hit multiattack).
At that point, the necro starts casting spells, and the two golem things start attacking the party in force.
Even at that point, the necromancer doesn't bust out big damage spells; Instead, when one of the golems dies, the necromancer just combines the two golems into one giant twisted murder corpse. You could get away with using it as a Clay Golem, but replacing some of the resistances and immunities.
The necromancer doesn't have many hit points, maybe 40 at most. When the party starts hitting them, they die, and their creations also collapse or run off, now free to do whatever they want. The necromancer has that dagger, and probably inflict wounds or something similar, but they aren't a fighter. They keep all of the pointy things away from themselves, and use minions A LOT. They're a necromancer, you know? Let them Counterspell or Shield if they need to(Maybe put CS on a recharge, or maybe just 3/day, but Shield probably at-will, for all it matters).
And all of that in mind; You have the best necromancer boss fight.
demonslayerelf
2018-09-30, 12:29 PM
What if the adventurers just telepounce the necromancer and deal "(oh no)² times 6" damage to it like regular adventurers?
Do the undead starts killing the hostages?
Well, 1- They're 4th level.
2- If they got to the Necro, the flesh golem just throws them back down to the undead(Albeit only 2/turn, but they could still jump in front of the attacks, and the necro can counterspell.)
What are the Necro’s motives? Why is it there, what does it want, etc. This should be your golden opportunity to foreshadow the next adventure/BBEG.
The Necro is after a mask that'll give him what he believes if Oracular powers, upon encountering the mask, he got a snippet of the adventurers after him. He's arrogant and the party want to stop him.
The party is driven by two self-serving types who are relying on a Cleric who has a higher calling to get them the Wish which is the end-game of the plot.
The Necro is also after this wish. He sees the Clerics actions as a challenge and he's accepting it.
He's selfish, sadistic and prone to temper outbursts. When he gets agitated he just lashes at his surroundings with the dagger.
EDIT: The next villains are more people hunting for the Wish, the Necro belongs to a small gathering of 3-5 necromancers who are all working towards a combined goal, though they prefer to work separately.
Further than the story, the fact that you put this in Homebrew Design makes me think of mechanical things you might do, and I'm gonna focus on that.
Thanks so much for your input, I really appreciate it, I will definitely use some, if not all of this. Though I want to make it a bit of a weakness that the necro gets impatient and jumps in and just starts stabbing if things get too hard on the players, given the personality I've set him up with before I even thought of the fight, it's more of a personality-mechanic rather than a combat one.
The party encountered him far too early. They are of insufficient level to defeat an evil necromancer. Here's what I'd do:
The guy they have trapped in the village ia a pawn of equivalent level to the PCs. His power comes from the dagger, which will be the clue that leads the PCs farther in their quest to eventually defeat the BBEG Necrodude.
Disarmed or dispelled, the current BBEG is just a wizard/cleric.
See, I never have the issue of "too early" or "too late" anything can be scaled to fit your adventure at the players current powers, it can be epic or mundane from level 1-20.
But I do like the idea of a general weakening if he loses the dagger. Thank you.
nineGardens
2018-10-06, 11:33 PM
Is there any motivation sending your players INTO the town? What's to stop them walking around? (I assume you have a plan here, but knowing it helps us suggest things)
I mean... one possible answer is to just have it that the town IS plauged.. everyone is sick... or dying... or dead... and if the players enter they will be forced to deal with a horror that can't be stopped via the simple application of a blade....
which could be super cool, but probably isn't the game you want.
Personally, for me when it comes to necromancers, I'd be tempted to invoke a summoned monster of some kind. A zombie made of two hundered corpses stitched together. A shade with no shape or form. The skeleton of a giant. Anything big and scary. The Necro isn't there- they have better **** to do. But they left something behind to deal with their enemies.
Alternatively, just to really screw with the players, they show up, and the whole town is dead, and the necromancer is up in a chapel (recently desecrated), halfway through some dark ritual... and also dead. Or dying. If you really want the boss battle, have some kind of evil "Dead man's switch" type spell that triggers when the Necro dies... but that they don't actually end up fighting the necro.
Possibly... certain "Powers" come to collect the Necro upon their death.
And... now I'm sleepy and just making stuff up. I should stop.
Is there any motivation sending your players INTO the town? What's to stop them walking around? (I assume you have a plan here, but knowing it helps us suggest things)
I mean... one possible answer is to just have it that the town IS plauged.. everyone is sick... or dying... or dead... and if the players enter they will be forced to deal with a horror that can't be stopped via the simple application of a blade....
which could be super cool, but probably isn't the game you want.
Personally, for me when it comes to necromancers, I'd be tempted to invoke a summoned monster of some kind. A zombie made of two hundered corpses stitched together. A shade with no shape or form. The skeleton of a giant. Anything big and scary. The Necro isn't there- they have better **** to do. But they left something behind to deal with their enemies.
Alternatively, just to really screw with the players, they show up, and the whole town is dead, and the necromancer is up in a chapel (recently desecrated), halfway through some dark ritual... and also dead. Or dying. If you really want the boss battle, have some kind of evil "Dead man's switch" type spell that triggers when the Necro dies... but that they don't actually end up fighting the necro.
Possibly... certain "Powers" come to collect the Necro upon their death.
And... now I'm sleepy and just making stuff up. I should stop.
Thanks for the input, I appreciate.
The game is whatever the players make of it, they don't jump straight into combat, but they aren't shy of it. I've left it as an open box they can make what they want and play the game they enjoy, and I'm having fun running that. They avoided a whole arc and the alternative combat sequence by going full stealth and stealing everything they wanted and leaving.
Their motivation is a: The cleric is playing a typical Lawful Good Cleric so he wants to confront the necromancer.
The Rogue and the Fighter saw him early on, have a general sense of wanting to do good and have a "He knows about us, he'll become a problem later if he isn't dealt with now." philosophy.
Yeah I wrote up a custom monster for them to fight, the necro may accompany it or not.
I didn't think of that last scenario about him dying, now I'm conflicted about what to do.
It's game night tonight, whether they screw around in the town or not is something we'll see about soon, wish me luck!
Dang it! Too late to pitch in.
How'd it go?
Went okay, not great, but we were somewhat held back by time constraints, I skipped a lot of the ideas such as the dies to activate his final form thing because even with a streamlined leadup and a few issues we finished at around 2am.
I forgot the villains charactersheet.
I had severe creative block and couldn't design anything ahead of time so I kind of just had different elements of this thread in the back of my head.
I was like "eh, I got through it." Players seemed happy though. So yeah, I told them a week later about my lack of preparation and stuff and said they couldn't tell, so that's a win.
So probably a 7/10 for me. It went okay.
But i got a lot of inspiration for an overarching plot of the game which is in another thread
showthread.php?571425-Spider-Queen-Lolth-5E-Campaign-Ideas-and-Tips-Please
Here. (I'm too low level to post links)
Thanks for all your help guys.
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