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Vogie
2019-02-14, 03:47 PM
Otherworldly Patron: Hadar
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Novices taken for initiation stand in front of a gap in the fabric of reality, through which could be seen the whole of Hadar. Staring at the raw power of the cinder-red star. Some would be inspired. Some would run away. And some... would go mad.

Expanded Spell List
The following spells are added to the warlock spell list for you



Spell Level
Spells


1st
Entangle, Color Spray


2nd
Blindness, Phantasmal Force


3rd
Blink, Enlarge/Reduce


4th
Grasping Vine, Evard's Black Tentacles


5th
Contagion, Rary's Telepathic Bond




Bonus Cantrips
At level 1, You learn Thorn Whip and Guidance cantrips. They count as warlock cantrips for you, but they don't count against your number of cantrips known.

Mind Raker
Starting at 1st level, as a bonus action, choose one creature you can see within 30 feet of you. That creature must make Charisma saving throw, or become cursed. The curse ends early if the target dies, you die, or you are incapacitated. The target is cursed for 1 minute. Until the curse ends, it has the following effects:

Whenever the cursed creature makes a Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution saving throw, they must roll a d4 and subtract the number rolled
Any creature can use the Help action to aid an ally in attacking the cursed creature, the cursed creature can be within 30 feet of them, rather than within 5 feet of them, if the target can see or hear them.
If the cursed target dies, you gain Inspiration.
The curse die increases to a d6 at 5, d8 at 11, and d10 at 17. It ends early if you curse a different creature, and you must finish a long rest before you can use this invocation on the same creature again.

Herald of Hadar
Starting at 6th level, as an action, you can spawn a pair of dark tendrils for 1 minute. You can attack with both as an bonus action with a reach of 10ft, using your charisma modifier for the attack rolls. When you successfully hit, choose one of the following effects:

The target takes psychic damage from the tendril. Each deals damage equal to 1d6 + your charisma modifier.
You may attempt to grapple with the target, with your spell save DC contested by the targetís Strength (Athletics) or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check (the target chooses the ability to use). On a failed save, the target is grappled and is effected by Mind Raker while the tendril is attached, and the Curse's Die is doubled.
A creature can use its action to make a DC 10 Strength check, to attempt to free itself or another creature from the tendril on a success. Dealing 5 slashing damage to the Tendril (AC 10) also frees the creature without harming it, ending the effect and destroying the tendril.
Once both tendrils have been destroyed, or the duration concludes, you can't use this feature again until you finish a short or long rest.

Abyssal Resilience
Starting at 10th level, You ignore difficult terrain, are immune to the blindness condition, and you can see through the darkness created by any of your spells.
In addition, if the target cursed by your Mind Raker feature targets you with an attack or a harmful spell, you may use a reaction to make that creature to first make a Wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature must choose a new target or lose the attack or spell. This feature doesn't protect you from-area effect spells or attacks. On a success, that creature is immune from this feature for 24 hours.

Hysterical Blindness
Starting at 14th level, you constantly emanate an aura of hysteria and existential dread while you're not incapacitated. The aura extends 30 feet from you in every direction, but not through total cover. Creatures with the blindness condition have their speed reduced to 10 while in the aura, and that creature takes psychic damage equal to half your warlock level if it starts its turn there.




Notes:

This was inspired by Rad.Benchmen on the 5e forums who was asking for it. He wanted a patron that amplified the 2 Hadarian spells, Arms of Hadar, and Hunger of Hadar.
The initial curse is basically a less powerful, single-target mini-Bane, or anti-guidance.
The 6th level ability creates temporary tendrils that act as whips, and can allow a flurry-of-blows-esque attack, as well as wrap up and grapple with it. The ability to be able to target the tendrils directly is lifted directly from the Net rules.
The 10th level ribbon actually creates debuffer playstyle while not being terribly broken. This patron codifies the Darkness/Devil's sight combo using the Shadow Sorcerer's "you can see through the darkness created by any of your spells", but by also expanding it to not only Darkness/Shadows of Moil, but also Hunger of Hadar. It doesn't, however, give darkvision outside of these spells.
By the time you hit 14th level, which is based on the Conquest Paladin's feature, dropping Hunger of Hadar creates a "fish in a barrel" zone. While you can roam through slashing and blasting, and yanking other targets in, you can also use it to effectively remove a 20 ft radius of creatures from the battlefield for a couple rounds, waiting for them to slowly wander through, then yanking them around once they leave. It also empowers the (IMHO underused) blindness spell.


Tell me what you think!

Garfunion
2019-02-14, 04:32 PM
This is what I would change/do.

Black Whip
You gain proficiency in the whip and you can use your Charisma modifier, instead of Strength or Dexterity, for the attack and damage rolls.

Additional you learn the Thorn Whip cantrip, which count as warlock cantrip for you, but does not count against your number of cantrips known.

Bindings of Hadar
Starting at 1st level, as a bonus action, choose one creature you can see within 30 feet of you, shadow tendrils wrapped around the creature. These tendrils disappear if the target dies, you die, or you are incapacitated. The tendrils last for 1 minute. Until the tendrils disappear, the creature gain the following debilities:
ēAt the start of each of its turns, it is blinded, deafened, and silenced. It can use its reaction on its turn to suspend these affects.
ēItís speed is reduced by half.
ēIt gains a penalty to its attack rolls equal to the warlockís proficiency bonus.

You can't use this feature again until you finish a short or long rest

Herald of Hadar
Starting at 6th level, your thorn whip cantrip deals additional psychic damage equal to your charisma modifier.
Additionally if you use your action to perform a melee attack you may use your bonus action to cast thorn whip cantrip.

Abyssal Resilience
Starting at 10th level, You ignore difficult terrain, are immune to the blindness condition, and you can see through the darkness created by any of your spells.

Additionally, if a creature affected by your Bindings of Hadar targets you directly with an attack or a harmful spell that is not an AoE that happens to include you, that creature must make a Wisdom saving throw against your spell save DC. On a failed save, the creature must choose a new target or forfeit targeting someone instead of you, potentially wasting the attack or spell.

Garfunion
2019-02-14, 05:32 PM
Iím not sure about the 14th level feature

Rad.benchman
2019-02-14, 06:00 PM
That is awesome!! I love your incorporating color spray.
I was thinking bane as well in the build somehow. Forcing a negative on their save against the tendrils is a nice addition.
Love the mind raker ability. Mechanicley similar to the Hexblade curse minus the initial charisma save with out using concentration and works for the build as apposed to just dmg.
I would like the 14th ability better if it were something to activate vs a constant.
I am liking thorn* whip(my bad)over lighting lure.
I am confused with the guidance cantrip though. It feels like the entangle spell should be incorporated.
The hysterical blindness feature is epic. That is the staple of the idea. Being trapped in an area constantly bombarded by tendrils with little hope of escape is like a nightmare come true.

Vogie
2019-02-16, 11:43 AM
That is awesome!! I love your incorporating color spray.
I was thinking bane as well in the build somehow. Forcing a negative on their save against the tendrils is a nice addition.
Love the mind raker ability. Mechanicley similar to the Hexblade curse minus the initial charisma save with out using concentration and works for the build as apposed to just dmg.
I would like the 14th ability better if it were something to activate vs a constant.
I am liking vine whip over lighting lure.
I am confused with the guidance cantrip though. It feels like the entangle spell should be incorporated.


Well, Mind Raker is basically Bane, and I added guidance because it's basically the opposite of Mind Raker, giving the build a bit of balance

I like entangle, so I'll swap it out for Bane on the expanded spell list. You can still pick up Thief of the Five Fates to use it on the build though.

I assume you mean Thorn whip, as I can't find a vine whip spell anywhere. I had forgotten that Lightning Lure was already a Warlock spell, so that's in now.

The 14th level has an active portion - You have to blind your targets somehow, which will require a spell slot, limiting it's use to a couple times a short rest (doing anything else with your spell slots nonwithstanding). First, it could be with blindness, Hunger of Hadar, or the Blinding Sickness from Contagion, and second, the target has to be in the aura.

Rad.benchman
2019-02-16, 09:28 PM
Ok, I get it. I missed that mechanic on the hysterical blindness ability. That is freakin awesome. I do miss the loss of bane spell I feel that really added to the core synergy of the build. Although taking it as an invocation is an option as you pointed out. Over all itís a seems a solid build.
Gerfunion has a good idea regarding the whip. Thatís something I was rolling around myself. Would it be possible to put in a feature that playes off of the blade pact that grants some bonus with manifesting a whip? Similar to the Hexblade that grants the use of charisma for attack and dmg. Iíd like to add a bonus attack with it similar to the monk bonus unarmed attack, but that might be a bit much. Putting in something with a weapon attack would add a huge bonus to taking a 3 lv dip to fighter for the battle maneuvers being able to disarm and trip targets wile cursed.

Garfunion
2019-02-17, 12:58 AM
Gerfunion has a good idea regarding the whip. Thatís something I was rolling around myself. Would it be possible to put in a feature that playes off of the blade pact that grants some bonus with manifesting a whip? Similar to the Hexblade that grants the use of charisma for attack and dmg. Iíd like to add a bonus attack with it similar to the monk bonus unarmed attack, but that might be a bit much. Putting in something with a weapon attack would add a huge bonus to taking a 3 lv dip to fighter for the battle maneuvers being able to disarm and trip targets wile cursed.

Are you talking to me or are you talking to Vogie?

My version at 1st level allows you to use charisma for attack and damage of the whip which extends to all whips, even the one you you summon with pact of the blade.

The 6th level feature provides a good boost to damage, with pact of the blade you could make two whip attacks and follow it up with a thorn whip cantrip or cast thorn whip with your action and follow that up with a bonus action thorn whip(if not blade pact).

I was also going to switch up the Entangle spell with Ensnaring Strike spell.

Rad.benchman
2019-02-17, 03:40 PM
The comment was for Vogie pointing out your black whip ability. Rally nice idea. Good point in regarding ensnaring strike, I had forgotten about that spell. And thematically it does really work with the build. Thatís a tough call over which would work best, that or entangle. Especially considering warlocks lack of spell slots. The spells picked hold a considerable importance.
Your bindings of Hadar ability is also pretty clutch with the character. My only hang up is the ď reaction ď to free oneself of the tendrils conditions, blind, defending and silence. On one had it is a way OP ability not requiring an attack or save for. And on the flip side using a reaction to end seems pretty lackluster.
On that same note. Vogieís lv6 ability herald of Hadar is again an amazing ability and themed to the build nicely. However with a DC10 and AC 10 to be freed seems a bit easy to accomplish. I get with the mind raker applied and the curse dice doubled does inadvertently up the difficulty, 10 still seems a bit low.
Iím probably being to nitpicky here. To be honest, both build ideas are themed amazingly well with what I was trying to accomplish. Thank you both for taking the time to flesh out this build.

sandmote
2019-02-18, 12:59 AM
Gerfunion has a good idea regarding the whip. Thatís something I was rolling around myself. Would it be possible to put in a feature that playes off of the blade pact that grants some bonus with manifesting a whip? Similar to the Hexblade that grants the use of charisma for attack and dmg. Iíd like to add a bonus attack with it similar to the monk bonus unarmed attack, but that might be a bit much. Putting in something with a weapon attack would add a huge bonus to taking a 3 lv dip to fighter for the battle maneuvers being able to disarm and trip targets wile cursed.

Alternatively, use the Claw of Acamar invocation. Say you create a whip instead, and don't change the crunch.

Garfunion
2019-02-18, 11:16 AM
Alternatively, use the Claw of Acamar invocation. Say you create a whip instead, and don't change the crunch.
That invocation does not allow charisma for the attack and damage rolls and the eldritch smite invocation provides the same benefit.

Rad.benchman
2019-02-18, 04:02 PM
Alternatively, use the Claw of Acamar invocation. Say you create a whip instead, and don't change the crunch.

Good thinking, but as garfunion pointed out itís a strength based attack not charisma. Would definitely make it too MAD. However adding sentinel feat wile leveling on down the road would make a nice touch given the whip is a reach weapon and the odds of keeping the target in the kill box would increase.

Vogie
2019-02-18, 04:17 PM
That invocation does not allow charisma for the attack and damage rolls and the eldritch smite invocation provides the same benefit.

Yeah, I didn't want to do that because it's kind of Hexblade's thing. Locking the character into a whip just because the theme was tentacles was a bit too on the nose for me. That's why I gave the tentacles whip-ish effects, without making the player say "Hey DM, I need to find a magic whip in this campaign kthnxbai"



On that same note. Vogieís lv6 ability herald of Hadar is again an amazing ability and themed to the build nicely. However with a DC10 and AC 10 to be freed seems a bit easy to accomplish. I get with the mind raker applied and the curse dice doubled does inadvertently up the difficulty, 10 still seems a bit low.

Yeah, I took it straight from the Net equipment stats. I'm not sure it should be a bit more difficult, because of the double Mind Raker (which is now 1d6), which could also stack with things like Bane (1d4) or Bestow Curse (1d6). Also, actual equipment nets - you can use your action to throw a net, then grapple with the tentacles. You could also hit the same target with both tentacles, requiring 2 different attacks or checks to break out of.

Rad.benchman
2019-02-19, 03:57 AM
Yeah, I didn't want to do that because it's kind of Hexblade's thing. Locking the character into a whip just because the theme was tentacles was a bit too on the nose for me. That's why I gave the tentacles whip-ish effects, without making the player say "Hey DM, I need to find a magic whip in this campaign A
Yeah, I took it straight from the Net equipment stats. I'm not sure it should be a bit more difficult, because of the double Mind Raker (which is now 1d6), which could also stack with things like Bane (1d4) or Bestow Curse (1d6). Also, actual equipment nets - you can use your action to throw a net, then grapple with the tentacles. You could also hit the same target with both tentacles, requiring 2 different attacks or checks to break out of.
Good point, that is a lot of dice that could potentially be applied to inhibit the check to break free. However the net when attacking applies the restrained affect as apposed to the grapple affect. But as you pointed out the tendrils attacks as bonus action wile the net is an attack action. This raises a question Iíve been curious about. How do you go from grappled to restrained? I know the feat that allows the grappler to restrain as a bonus action. However I donít see it applying to this scenario. So how could you restrain with this ability? Itís a huge difference in negative disadvantages. Grappled is movement reduces to 0, restrained attacks have disadvantaged attacking is at advantage and DEX saves are disadvantaged.

Vogie
2019-02-19, 08:22 AM
Good point, that is a lot of dice that could potentially be applied to the check to break free. However the net when attacking applies the restrained affect as apposed to the grapple affect. But as you pointed out the tendrils attacks as bonus action wile the net is an attack action. This raises a question Iíve been curious about. How do you go from grappled to restrained? I know the feat that allows the grappler to restrain as a bonus action. However I donít see it applying to this scenario. So how could you restrain with this ability? Itís a huge difference in negative disadvantages. Grappled is movement reduces to 0, restrained attacks have disadvantaged attacking is at advantage and DEX saves are disadvantaged.

By RAW, you can't. The Tavern Brawler feat allows you to grapple as a Bonus action, but that does not apply here.

The tentacles only allow you to grapple or deal damage, and you can only attack with them as a bonus action. However, they have reach, so a range of 10 ft, so it's very similar to having that ability.

If your Hadarlock has 13+ Strength, they can pick up the Grappler feat. That would allow them to grapple as a bonus action via tentacles, then restrain as an action using the following:

You can use your action to try to pin a creature grappled by you. To do so, make another grapple check. If you succeed, you and the creature are both restrained until the grapple ends.However, it would restrain the 'lock as well, even though he's 2 squares away. However, you may still want it, because of the "You have advantage on attack rolls against a creature you are grappling".

If you were to instead do the Net Throw/Grapple with Both Tentacles combo I mentioned above, the target would be restrained (because they're in the net), and the grapples would be redundant - Until the target breaks out of the net. They'd have to use multiple attacks AND roll absurdly well to beat the Net/Grapple/Grapple absurdity. Since the Net is always thrown with disadvantage, you can remove that by using your Chain familiar to provide advantage, or the Grappler feat to grapple first, then throw the net using the above-mentioned bonus.

Rad.benchman
2019-02-19, 09:58 AM
Hell ya. That grappler feat is an awesome idea. Sounds ridiculous as itís intended, but with the mechanics of the build it would be epic.
Ok I was with you up until the last paragraph. Is the befor mentioned attack you were referring to with the grapple feat with the tentacles? Net/throw/attack?

Vogie
2019-02-19, 02:02 PM
Ok I was with you up until the last paragraph. Is the befor mentioned attack you were referring to with the grapple feat with the tentacles? Net/throw/attack?

Yeah. The last paragraph refers to using the 6th level ability to spawn the tentacles at some point:

Herald of Hadar
Starting at 6th level, as an action, you can spawn a pair of dark tendrils for 1 minute. You can attack with both as an bonus action with a reach of 10ft, using your charisma modifier for the attack rolls. When you successfully hit, choose one of the following effects:
ēThe target takes psychic damage from the tendril. Each deals damage equal to 1d6 + your charisma modifier.
ēYou may attempt to grapple with the target, with your spell save DC contested by the targetís Strength (Athletics) or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check (the target chooses the ability to use). On a failed save, the target is grappled and is effected by Mind Raker while the tendril is attached, and the Curse's Die is doubled.

then, the next turn, you use a bonus action to make grapple checks using the tentacles (emphasis mine above)

Then, If you have the grappler feat:

You have advantage on attack rolls against a creature you are grappling.
You then attack with the net - which normally has a range of 5/15, since it is a ranged attack, it is always thrown with disadvantage. However, the grappler feat will negate that.

So it is Grapple (with tentacles) as a bonus action, followed by the attack action - Net

Rad.benchman
2019-02-20, 03:23 AM
Could I conceivably attempt to pin the target with the tentacles alone? The feat states once I have the target grappled I can then attempt to pin the target making another grapple check. By grappling with the tentacles shouldnít I be able to attempt to pin with the tentacles with the prerequisite feat ?

Vogie
2019-02-20, 08:50 AM
Could I conceivably attempt to pin the target with the tentacles alone? The feat states once I have the target grappled I can then attempt to pin the target making another grapple check. By grappling with the tentacles shouldnít I be able to attempt to pin with the tentacles with the prerequisite feat ?

Yes, you can. However, pinning via the feat will restrain both you and the target.

Rad.benchman
2019-02-20, 11:07 AM
Yes, you can. However, pinning via the feat will restrain both you and the target.

Mechanically Iím sure that would be better in combat. Thematicly however it sounds way cooler to picture wrestling down a target with the tentacles wile I strangle or dot them to death with whatever spell I have active at the time like Evards tentacles or hunger of Hadar. Really it sounds like making a nightmare come true. (In the world of Dnd imagination)