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NOMster
2019-02-26, 06:22 PM
Very first Homebrew attempt. Made it on DND beyond so I could keep up.

Please see bottom of post for improved version


Base Class:
Barbarian

There are those who do not suffer from fear, those who believe paradise can only be won by fearlessly and savagely fighting their way to the top, and if death comes it must be found gloriously in battle. In ancient times some of these warriors were known as Vikings. They followed warrior gods and had magic symbols that made them nigh invincible in battle. When you follow the Path of the Viking, these same symbols fuel your battle prowess and these gods help you in times of need.

Helm of Awe
The Helm of Awe is inscribed on weapons and shields to inspire fear in ones enemies. When you choose this path, the gods mark your body with it, making you a living weapon of fear. Beginning at level 3 you use your STR bonus as your intimidation check and you have advantage on intimidation rolls. When raging any creature hostile toward you within 10 feet must succeed a constitution saving throw (DC= 10 + your Intimidation bonus) at the beginning of their turn or they become frightened. If a spellcaster fails the throw, they lose the ability to concentrate until succeeding or moving out of range on their next turn.

Shield Wall
At 6th level, The Einherjar appear and create a shield wall around you and your allies. Standing guard against attacks while you rage and rewarding your bravery. From now on once per short rest If you are not carrying a shield while you rage in battle, these warriors give you and allies within 5 feet of you who aren't using shield a +1 AC bonus and 1d6+2 temporary Hit Points. this increases to +2 AC and 1d8+4 Temp HP at level 10, and +3 AC and 1d12+6 Temp HP at level 14.

Vegvisir
The Vegvisir is the Viking compass. One can never be lost while using it. When you reach level 10, the gods emblazon you with it and from now on, you are always aware of your surroundings. You gain proficiency with dexterity saving throws and your DangerSense works even if you are blind or deafened. Being incapacitated still nullifies this ability. Also you gain resistance to Trap damage. Additionally, Odin's Ravens help you find your way. If you need guidance, once per long rest you can cast commune with nature as a ritual. Constitution is your spellcasting ability.



Gifts of the Gods
You have been recognized as a great warrior in the Halls of Asgard and Valhalla has a seat with your name engraved on it. In honor of your bravery, the gods each have a gift that you can choose to aid you in vanquishing your enemies.

As a chosen warrior of Asgard you become hardened against the elements in preparation to battle Giants at Ragnarok. You gain resistance to cold, fire, and force damage. In addition you receive one of these gifts:

Gleipnir -Tyr grants you access to the chains that bound Fenrir and makes you an intelligent warrior.

Gulinbursti -Frey invigorates you when raging with the power of his boar.

Gungnir- You become Odins' living spear, moving faster and more accurate than a common warrior.

Idunnas Enchanted Apples- Idunna gives the gift of restoring vitality.

Mjiolnir- Thor makes you a Hammer of furious destruction.

Option details:

Gleipnir
Tyr gives the ability to bind enemies with the power of the mystical chains that held Fenrir the wolf. When you choose this option, your rage calls Tyr to help you with an enemy. when you target and enemy in rage, they become bound by the chains and are unable to move until your next turn. While bound They are counted as 1 size smaller and give up 1d6 AC. the enemy can try to shake off the chains on their turn by succeeding a strength saving throw. DC 12+1/2 your level. While Raging, you gain proficiency with wisdom and intelligence saves, but lose strength bonus.

Gullinbursti
Frey's mount was given by the dwarves and is said to be able to run faster than a horse through air or water and it is never dark where he goes. When you choose this gift, Frey grants you abilities from the same font. you recieve Darkvision and Blindsight and your overall speed increases 10'. While raging, you gain the toughness of a Boars hide and recieve a bonus +2 to your AC and Temporary Hit Points equal to 1d12+double your constitution modifier .

Gungnir
Odin's Spear - Odin's wisdom protects you as you gain advantage on wisdom saving throws. You become a living spear: your base speed increases by 10' and dash can be used as a bonus action. Additionally, when you use your action to make a melee attack after a dash or charge, double your proficiency bonus to attack and double Strength damage on a successful hit. Odin's spear doesn't miss.

Idunna's Apples
Idunna is the guardian of the sacred tree that grows in the garden of Asgard. the fruit of this tree grants everlasting life to the gods. When you choose this gift, Idunna gives you a small taste of that gift. If you fall to 0 Hp while your raging, as a reaction before you stop, you can call on Idunna. She will bring you a single bite of one of her apples restoring 3d12 HP and giving you temporary resistance to all damage until Rage ends. This can only be used once per long rest.

Mjiolnir
When raging Thor gives you power from Mjiolnir and your hands are like living hammers. You gain an extra +2 bonus to Strength Attacks and Your unarmed strike deals 3d12 bludgeoning damage as long as you rage. additionally, you gain resistance to lightning and thunder damage while raging.

I can't use use it in my group but maybe someone will like it.

Version 2

The Path of The Viking Warrior is for those Barbarians who fear not death, but delight in the battle fury that comes from wanting a warriors death.

Lo there do I see my Father

Lo there do I see my Mother, my Sisters, and my Brothers

Lo there do I see the Line of my people back to the beginning

Lo they do call to me, they bid me take my place among them in the Halls of Valhalla

Where the brave may live forever!

Some barbarians reach deep into their spirit to find the rage that comes from a connection to magical symbols used to empower them and their allies. As they become one with the magic, the gods mark their bodies with these symbols and unlock the powers they hold.

Path of The Viking Warrior Features

Barbarian Level Feature
3rd ∆gishjŠlmr
6th Valknut (1)
10th Vegvisir, Valknut (2)
14th Yggdrasil, Valknut (3)

∆gishjŠlmr
The Helm of Awe is inscribed on weapons and shields to inspire fear in ones enemies. When you choose this path at 3rd level, the gods mark your body with it, making you a living weapon of fear. When you want to intimidate a creature or when you begin raging, the mark ignites in a burst of lightning and burns brightly on your skin.

You have advantage on intimidation checks.

When you are raging, the first creature you hit with an attack on your turn takes an extra 1d6 lightning damage. Until the start of your next turn, the creature is frightened of you.


Valknut
The Valknut appears as 3 intertwined triangles and is a sacred symbol of Odin. After a battle, he chooses the bravest among the dead to be in his personal army or Einherjar . Odin has marked your body with this symbol to show that when you die, you will be among his warriors. When you rage, If an ally is in danger, the symbol on your body glows with a cold blue light and the Einherjar appear in spiritual form to defend nearby friends with a shield wall.

Beginning at 6th level, when you are raging, if a friendly creature is within 10' of you and an enemy starts it turn or moves into a space that gives it melee range on the ally, then you can use a reaction to give the ally a bonus 1d4 to their armor class until the end of their next turn while the spectral warriors encircle and shield them.

At level 10 the warriors can protect up to 2 creatures within 20' and at level 14 they can protect up to 3 creatures within 30'.


VegvŪsir
The Vegvisir is the Viking compass. The gods emblazon you with it and you can magically find your way. The mark gives of a faint sea colored glow when you trace its' lines.

Beginning at level 10, once per long rest you can spend ten minutes tracing the mark on your body. At the end of the ten minutes, you can cast commune with nature or find the path as a ritual. You can cast these without any other components except the tracing of the mark.


Yggdrasil
Yggdrasil is a massive tree that holds together the nine realms of existence with its branches and roots. It represents life, growth, and connection between all living things. Your body is marked with the symbol of the great tree. it shines a bright green and appears to move in the wind when you rage. Yggdrasil gives you a special bond to the allies protected by the Einherjar shield wall and you send strength to each other through the roots and branches of the great tree.

Beginning at 14th level, while you are raging, If a creature you have protected by the Valknut shield wall takes damage, then until the end of your next turn, you can add a d4 to your damage rolls when you take the attack action. You can have one bonus d4 from each ally shielded, up to a maximum of 3. These bonus dice deal force damage on a hit and each creature within a shield wall recovers hit points equal to the force damage you roll.

Bjarkmundur
2019-02-28, 03:12 PM
Hi, I'm an Icelandic DM.

I'm in.

whiplashomega
2019-02-28, 04:18 PM
As far as I'm concerned this looks pretty awesome and very thematic, I love your descriptive text, it provides a great image of the flavor of each ability.

NOMster
2019-03-03, 10:26 AM
Hi, I'm an Icelandic DM.

I'm in.


As far as I'm concerned this looks pretty awesome and very thematic, I love your descriptive text, it provides a great image of the flavor of each ability.

I appreciate it. Let me know if you use it, how it works out. I'd love to hear about it in action and if it proves useful.

Composer99
2019-03-04, 10:14 AM
Very first Homebrew attempt. Made it on DND beyond so I could keep up.

Definitely an interesting subclass. Very thematic and flavourful.

If you intend to play in a game where other subclasses are buffed up, it's fine. If it's meant to be comparable to regular barbarian primal paths, however, it's very overpowered at higher levels, and it would make the barbarian who plays it out of line with other front-line characters unless they also are getting buffed.



Helm of Awe
The Helm of Awe is inscribed on weapons and shields to inspire fear in ones enemies. When you choose this path, the gods mark your body with it, making you a living weapon of fear. Beginning at level 3 you use your STR bonus as your intimidation check and you have advantage on intimidation rolls. When raging any creature hostile toward you within 10 feet must succeed a constitution saving throw (DC= 10 + your Intimidation bonus) at the beginning of their turn or they become frightened. If a spellcaster fails the throw, they lose the ability to concentrate until succeeding or moving out of range on their next turn.

This ability is fine, more or less, when you compare it to, say, the wolf or bear totem barbarian features at 3rd level, although you should (a) specify that a creature affected by it is frightened of you (that matters because of how the frightened condition works), and (b) what its duration is. Since creatures must make the saving throw at the start of each of their turns, the duration should probably be until the start of their next turn.

Also, you needn't call out spellcasters: you just have to note that any creature affected by this feature is unable to concentrate on spells while it is frightened of you as a result of this feature.

I will say that the saving throw DC is simply wrong: saving throw DCs for player character features in 5e are, almost without exception as far as I am aware, 8 + proficiency bonus + applicable ability modifier.

There is also the matter that this ability is vastly superior to the 10th level berserker feature. But I don't think that's particularly important. The berserker's 10th level feature is simply terrible, and I wouldn't recommend that primal path without it being buffed.


Shield Wall
At 6th level, The Einherjar appear and create a shield wall around you and your allies. Standing guard against attacks while you rage and rewarding your bravery. From now on once per short rest If you are not carrying a shield while you rage in battle, these warriors give you and allies within 5 feet of you who aren't using shield a +1 AC bonus and 1d6+2 temporary Hit Points. this increases to +2 AC and 1d8+4 Temp HP at level 10, and +3 AC and 1d12+6 Temp HP at level 14.

This is fine, although a few nitpicks:
- You should specify that you can use this ability when you enter a rage
- once per short rest PC abilities in 5e are almost always worded in some manner like: "After using this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a short or long rest" or "After using this feature, you must finish a short or long rest before you can use it again", or similar. After all, if you read the text plainly, leaving out a long rest means you don't recover this feature on a long rest.

I think having the ability be a straight-up +2 to AC all the way through would be better. I'm also not super keen on the temporary hp - maybe make it 1d6, 2d6 at 10, and 3d6 at 14, and add your Strength modifier to them?

Having said all that, I wonder if you'd consider making this an ability you could use as a bonus action, say, once per rage, that bestowed the benefits until the start of your next turn? Then you could have it extend out further, I think.


Vegvisir
The Vegvisir is the Viking compass. One can never be lost while using it. When you reach level 10, the gods emblazon you with it and from now on, you are always aware of your surroundings. You gain proficiency with dexterity saving throws and your DangerSense works even if you are blind or deafened. Being incapacitated still nullifies this ability. Also you gain resistance to Trap damage. Additionally, Odin's Ravens help you find your way. If you need guidance, once per long rest you can cast commune with nature as a ritual. Constitution is your spellcasting ability.

Here's where we start getting out of line with other barbarian primal paths. This feature gives:
- can never be lost/always aware of your surroundings
- proficiency with one of the good saving throws
- improved danger sense
- resistance to damage from traps
- once/long rest casting of commune with nature

Other primal paths give:
- berserker... well, let's not worry about that one, it's just so bad
- totem barbarian gives only commune with nature, although you can cast it at will
- ancestor barbarian gives augury or clairvoyance once per short or long rest
- storm herald gives resistance to your storm soul damage to creatures you choose within 10 feet of you
- zealot gives advantage on attack rolls and saving throws until the start of your next turn, once per long rest

This feature needs a re-tooling if it's meant to be in line with other primal paths


Gifts of the Gods
You have been recognized as a great warrior in the Halls of Asgard and Valhalla has a seat with your name engraved on it. In honor of your bravery, the gods each have a gift that you can choose to aid you in vanquishing your enemies.

As a chosen warrior of Asgard you become hardened against the elements in preparation to battle Giants at Ragnarok. You gain resistance to cold, fire, and force damage. In addition you receive one of these gifts:

[I]Gleipnir -Tyr grants you access to the chains that bound Fenrir and makes you an intelligent warrior.

Gulinbursti -Frey invigorates you when raging with the power of his boar.

Gungnir- You become Odins' living spear, moving faster and more accurate than a common warrior.

Idunnas Enchanted Apples- Idunna gives the gift of restoring vitality.

Mjiolnir- Thor makes you a Hammer of furious destruction.

It doesn't explicitly say so, but I'm presuming this is the 14th-level feature.

Before looking at each option in turn, from a layout/format/presentation perspective, it's better not to have a list of each feature and then a separate description of each feature. It's a bit annoying. (With the spell lists, it's okay, because there are so many spells.) Better to keep them together.

Also, let's look at what the other primal paths give, for sake of comparison:
- berserker gives a reaction melee attack when you take damage from a creature within 5 feet of you
- totem gives, while raging, soft-taunt tankiness (bear), flight (eagle), knocking creatures prone as a bonus action (wolf), and other stuff (I don't have SCAG so I don't know the options)
- ancestor lets you "reflect" damage reduced by your spirit shield back at attackers
- storm herald gives you a reaction to inflict fire damage (desert), a reaction to knock a creature prone when you hit it (sea), or reducing a creature's speed to 0 when you activate your aura (tundra)
- zealot gives you the ability to stay up and fighting at 0 hit points

Some of these features are better than others, but I don't think any of them stand up to most of the features this primal path bestows, with one notable exception.

I'm mostly at a loss as to how to suggest toning these down, presuming that keeping this primal path in line with others is something you want to do. I would suggest coming up with a single, core thing you want each option to represent, and bestowing a benefit related to that. Like the 10th level feature, a big problem with most of these is that they just do too many things.


Option details:

Gleipnir
Tyr gives the ability to bind enemies with the power of the mystical chains that held Fenrir the wolf. When you choose this option, your rage calls Tyr to help you with an enemy. when you target and enemy in rage, they become bound by the chains and are unable to move until your next turn. While bound They are counted as 1 size smaller and give up 1d6 AC. the enemy can try to shake off the chains on their turn by succeeding a strength saving throw. DC 12+1/2 your level. While Raging, you gain proficiency with wisdom and intelligence saves, but lose strength bonus.

This option is ridiculously overpowered, in addition to having some pretty big ambiguities:
- When do you get to use the binding ability? And what sort of action does it require? How far away can a target be?
- giving up 1d6 AC is one of those fiddly things that 5e tends to dispense with, IMO. Better to treat a target as restrained, which does for its movement and gives advantage on attacks against it
- Save DC is wrong, as per previous remarks
- what does "lose strength bonus" mean?
- yes, it's only while you're raging, but that's 5 rages per long rest at 14th level, and unlimited rages at 20th level, when you'll have proficiency with two additional saving throws! That's just nuts.


Gullinbursti
Frey's mount was given by the dwarves and is said to be able to run faster than a horse through air or water and it is never dark where he goes. When you choose this gift, Frey grants you abilities from the same font. you recieve Darkvision and Blindsight and your overall speed increases 10'. While raging, you gain the toughness of a Boars hide and recieve a bonus +2 to your AC and Temporary Hit Points equal to 1d12+double your constitution modifier .

So you're getting a permanent increase to your speed, along with darkvision and blindsight, and on top of that you get temporary hp and bonus AC while raging. Not as over-the-top as other options here, but still overpowered.

Ambiguities/nitpicks:
- Darkvision must have a range limit specified, and what happens if you already have darkvision? Is your range limit increased?
- Blindsight must have a range limit specified
- You need to specify when you get the temporary hp - is it when you enter the rage? At the start of each of your turns?

It doesn't help that this feature is coming on top of already getting temporary hp and a bonus to AC with your shield wall feature.


Gungnir
Odin's Spear - Odin's wisdom protects you as you gain advantage on wisdom saving throws. You become a living spear: your base speed increases by 10' and dash can be used as a bonus action. Additionally, when you use your action to make a melee attack after a dash or charge, double your proficiency bonus to attack and double Strength damage on a successful hit. Odin's spear doesn't miss.

The score here:
- permanent advantage to Wisdom saving throws
- permanent increase to speed
- permanent ability to take the Dash action as a bonus action
- permanent upgrade to (first) melee attack after dashing/charging (there is no mechanical standard charge attack in 5e as in previous editions, so that's a pretty dangerous ambiguity)

Need I say more?


Idunna's Apples
Idunna is the guardian of the sacred tree that grows in the garden of Asgard. the fruit of this tree grants everlasting life to the gods. When you choose this gift, Idunna gives you a small taste of that gift. If you fall to 0 Hp while your raging, as a reaction before you stop, you can call on Idunna. She will bring you a single bite of one of her apples restoring 3d12 HP and giving you temporary resistance to all damage until Rage ends. This can only be used once per long rest.

This feature is actually not overpowered at all. In fact, it might even need some buffing. However, it is a bit redundant seeing as you have Relentless Rage at 11th level. (Speaking of redundant, you don't need the word "temporary" in there - it's implied by the maximum duration of the damage resistance.)

I think you'd be fine having this ability (a) work once per short or long rest, and (b) usable as a reaction whenever you take damage.


Mjiolnir
When raging Thor gives you power from Mjiolnir and your hands are like living hammers. You gain an extra +2 bonus to Strength Attacks and Your unarmed strike deals 3d12 bludgeoning damage as long as you rage. additionally, you gain resistance to lightning and thunder damage while raging.

Back to overpowered.

"+2 bonus to Strength Attacks" is meaningless in 5e. Do you mean attack rolls? Damage rolls? Both? Given you're already getting a big buff to damage rolls because you're raging, it's just too much.

3d12 bludgeoning damage on unarmed strikes is simply over-the-top.

The damage resistances are fine. Those plus some additional benefit that evokes the idea of using Mjolnir would be suitable, as long as it's not what's here now.

All that's to say that this primal path starts out fine, as far as it goes, and then sort of gets out of hand as it goes on.

Assuming you're aiming to have it in line with other primal paths, you just have to tone down the 10th and 14th level features, and it'll be an interesting and thematic choice.

NOMster
2019-03-04, 11:57 AM
Definitely an interesting subclass. Very thematic and flavourful.

If you intend to play in a game where other subclasses are buffed up, it's fine. If it's meant to be comparable to regular barbarian primal paths, however, it's very overpowered at higher levels, and it would make the barbarian who plays it out of line with other front-line characters unless they also are getting buffed.




This ability is fine, more or less, when you compare it to, say, the wolf or bear totem barbarian features at 3rd level, although you should (a) specify that a creature affected by it is frightened of you (that matters because of how the frightened condition works), and (b) what its duration is. Since creatures must make the saving throw at the start of each of their turns, the duration should probably be until the start of their next turn.

Also, you needn't call out spellcasters: you just have to note that any creature affected by this feature is unable to concentrate on spells while it is frightened of you as a result of this feature.

I will say that the saving throw DC is simply wrong: saving throw DCs for player character features in 5e are, almost without exception as far as I am aware, 8 + proficiency bonus + applicable ability modifier.

I can replace it with the Menacing feat wording. The enemy makes an insight check against your intimidation check


There is also the matter that this ability is vastly superior to the 10th level berserker feature. But I don't think that's particularly important. The berserker's 10th level feature is simply terrible, and I wouldn't recommend that primal path without it being buffed.



This is fine, although a few nitpicks:
- You should specify that you can use this ability when you enter a rage

I do. It says "if you are not carrying a shield while you rage"



- once per short rest PC abilities in 5e are almost always worded in some manner like: "After using this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a short or long rest" or "After using this feature, you must finish a short or long rest before you can use it again", or similar. After all, if you read the text plainly, leaving out a long rest means you don't recover this feature on a long rest.

Noted



I think having the ability be a straight-up +2 to AC all the way through would be better. I'm also not super keen on the temporary hp - maybe make it 1d6, 2d6 at 10, and 3d6 at 14, and add your Strength modifier to them?

Having said all that, I wonder if you'd consider making this an ability you could use as a bonus action, say, once per rage, that bestowed the benefits until the start of your next turn? Then you could have it extend out further, I think.



Here's where we start getting out of line with other barbarian primal paths. This feature gives:
- can never be lost/always aware of your surroundings

No, it's the fluff wording for the abilities it grants in the following sentences. Each level has fluff to open then an explanation of how it achieves that.


- proficiency with one of the good saving throws
- improved danger sense
- resistance to damage from traps
- once/long rest casting of commune with nature

Other primal paths give:
- berserker... well, let's not worry about that one, it's just so bad
- totem barbarian gives only commune with nature, although you can cast it at will
- ancestor barbarian gives augury or clairvoyance once per short or long rest
- storm herald gives resistance to your storm soul damage to creatures you choose within 10 feet of you
- zealot gives advantage on attack rolls and saving throws until the start of your next turn, once per long rest

This feature needs a re-tooling if it's meant to be in line with other primal paths



It doesn't explicitly say so, but I'm presuming this is the 14th-level feature.

Before looking at each option in turn, from a layout/format/presentation perspective, it's better [I]not to have a list of each feature and then a separate description of each feature. It's a bit annoying. (With the spell lists, it's okay, because there are so many spells.) Better to keep them together.

It's copied from DND beyond and the way descriptions work it kind of needs a snippet for each one. Then you have a drop-down to see the details all in the character builder.



Also, let's look at what the other primal paths give, for sake of comparison:
- berserker gives a reaction melee attack when you take damage from a creature within 5 feet of you
- totem gives, while raging, soft-taunt tankiness (bear), flight (eagle), knocking creatures prone as a bonus action (wolf), and other stuff (I don't have SCAG so I don't know the options)
- ancestor lets you "reflect" damage reduced by your spirit shield back at attackers
- storm herald gives you a reaction to inflict fire damage (desert), a reaction to knock a creature prone when you hit it (sea), or reducing a creature's speed to 0 when you activate your aura (tundra)
- zealot gives you the ability to stay up and fighting at 0 hit points

Some of these features are better than others, but I don't think any of them stand up to most of the features this primal path bestows, with one notable exception.

I'm mostly at a loss as to how to suggest toning these down, presuming that keeping this primal path in line with others is something you want to do. I would suggest coming up with a single, core thing you want each option to represent, and bestowing a benefit related to that. Like the 10th level feature, a big problem with most of these is that they just do too many things.



This option is ridiculously overpowered, in addition to having some pretty big ambiguities:
- When do you get to use the binding ability? And what sort of action does it require? How far away can a target be?
- giving up 1d6 AC is one of those fiddly things that 5e tends to dispense with, IMO. Better to treat a target as restrained, which does for its movement and gives advantage on attacks against it
- Save DC is wrong, as per previous remarks
- what does "lose strength bonus" mean?
It means you lose your rage strength bonus in exchange for the others? I don't know why that's confusing


- yes, it's only while you're raging, but that's 5 rages per long rest at 14th level, and unlimited rages at 20th level, when you'll have proficiency with two additional saving throws! That's just nuts.



So you're getting a permanent increase to your speed, along with darkvision and blindsight, and on top of that you get temporary hp and bonus AC while raging. Not as over-the-top as other options here, but still overpowered.

Ambiguities/nitpicks:
- Darkvision must have a range limit specified, and what happens if you already have darkvision? Is your range limit increased?
- Blindsight must have a range limit specified
- You need to specify when you get the temporary hp - is it when you enter the rage? At the start of each of your turns?


I don't know man. It literally says, "while raging". It works the same as temp hp granted by something like the shifting racial feature. It says "while shifted". Some of these nitpicks make sense but some are weird in that you're very specific about knowing how DC works but then something like this you don't understand.



It doesn't help that this feature is coming on top of already getting temporary hp and a bonus to AC with your shield wall feature.



The score here:
- permanent advantage to Wisdom saving throws
- permanent increase to speed
- permanent ability to take the Dash action as a bonus action
- permanent upgrade to (first) melee attack after dashing/charging (there is no mechanical standard charge attack in 5e as in previous editions, so that's a pretty dangerous ambiguity)

Need I say more?

That's my bad. It should only be while raging




This feature is actually not overpowered at all. In fact, it might even need some buffing. However, it is a bit redundant seeing as you have Relentless Rage at 11th level. (Speaking of redundant, you don't need the word "temporary" in there - it's implied by the maximum duration of the damage resistance.)

I think you'd be fine having this ability (a) work once per short or long rest, and (b) usable as a reaction whenever you take damage.



Back to overpowered.

"+2 bonus to Strength Attacks" is meaningless in 5e. Do you mean attack rolls? Damage rolls? Both? Given you're already getting a big buff to damage rolls because you're raging, it's just too much.
Attack rolls



3d12 bludgeoning damage on unarmed strikes is simply over-the-top.
Suggestion? I mean it needs to be on par with living forever.


The damage resistances are fine. Those plus some additional benefit that evokes the idea of using Mjolnir would be suitable, as long as it's not what's here now.

All that's to say that this primal path starts out fine, as far as it goes, and then sort of gets out of hand as it goes on.

Assuming you're aiming to have it in line with other primal paths, you just have to tone down the 10th and 14th level features, and it'll be an interesting and thematic choice.

I will think on all this but I'm not trying to make it in line with the other paths necesaarily.

Composer99
2019-03-04, 11:17 PM
I will think on all this but I'm not trying to make it in line with the other paths necesaarily.

If you don't feel it needs to be comparable to other barbarian primal paths, then you probably don't need to change the mechanics much - although in that case the Idunna's Apples needs a buff rather badly. After all, there's nothing wrong with high-power options per se. I was pretty emphatic on overpowered options because of the presumption that the primal path was intended to be around the same power level as the others.

Anyway, if the rest of the post below seems a bit testy, just keep in mind that I think this subclass concept is interesting enough/cool enough/fun enough to spend the time on digging into it for problems. If I didn't like it, I wouldn't have made the effort.



Shield Wall
At 6th level, The Einherjar appear and create a shield wall around you and your allies. Standing guard against attacks while you rage and rewarding your bravery. From now on once per short rest If you are not carrying a shield while you rage in battle, these warriors give you and allies within 5 feet of you who aren't using shield a +1 AC bonus and 1d6+2 temporary Hit Points. this increases to +2 AC and 1d8+4 Temp HP at level 10, and +3 AC and 1d12+6 Temp HP at level 14.




This is fine, although a few nitpicks:
- You should specify that you can use this ability when you enter a rage
[...]




I do. It says "if you are not carrying a shield while you rage"


Maybe we're just parsing words differently, but as far as I can see, "while you rage" does not mean the same thing as "when you enter a rage"/"when you begin raging", or similar. Instead, it's synonymous with "for the duration of your rage" or "while you are raging".

"While you rage" is fine for the AC benefit. But when are you supposed to actually get the temporary hit points? "While you rage" doesn't really say.

"While you rage" also opens up an ambiguity for how long you get to keep the temporary hit points. Do they vanish at the end of the rage, because you are given them "while you rage"? Or do they work normally - that is, they last until depleted or until you finish a long rest?

Since you bring up shifters later, and the UA text is quoted below, it's probably helpful to see how Wizards wrote out that feature with respect to how yours is worded. But more on that later.



Vegvisir
The Vegvisir is the Viking compass. One can never be lost while using it. When you reach level 10, the gods emblazon you with it and from now on, you are always aware of your surroundings. You gain proficiency with dexterity saving throws and your DangerSense works even if you are blind or deafened. Being incapacitated still nullifies this ability. Also you gain resistance to Trap damage. Additionally, Odin's Ravens help you find your way. If you need guidance, once per long rest you can cast commune with nature as a ritual. Constitution is your spellcasting ability.



Here's where we start getting out of line with other barbarian primal paths. This feature gives:
- can never be lost/always aware of your surroundings
- proficiency with one of the good saving throws
- improved danger sense
- resistance to damage from traps
- once/long rest casting of commune with nature


No, it's the fluff wording for the abilities it grants in the following sentences. Each level has fluff to open then an explanation of how it achieves that.

Well, "Thor gives you power from Mjolnir and your hands are like living hammers" is a really well done flavour text - evocative and descriptive. The text tells you what the ability does, but not in a way that makes sense mechanically. That way, you know it's flavour text. It helps that the mechanics support the flavour: the Mjolnir ability as you've written it grants 3d12 bludgeoning damage unarmed strikes.

"One can never be lost while using it" is very specific. It's also a statement that makes sense both as a game-mechanic feature and in-universe. It's not unlike having an ability that says "you do not need to eat, sleep, or breathe". There's no reference to game mechanics as such in that sentence, but you don't need any: the phrase stands on its own. So does "one can never be lost".

I would say, then, that the flavour text needs some clearing up. It also doesn't help that the only mechanical effect of this feature that's related to "not getting lost" is the once-per-long-rest casting of commune with nature.




Gleipnir
Tyr gives the ability to bind enemies with the power of the mystical chains that held Fenrir the wolf. When you choose this option, your rage calls Tyr to help you with an enemy. when you target and enemy in rage, they become bound by the chains and are unable to move until your next turn. While bound They are counted as 1 size smaller and give up 1d6 AC. the enemy can try to shake off the chains on their turn by succeeding a strength saving throw. DC 12+1/2 your level. While Raging, you gain proficiency with wisdom and intelligence saves, but lose strength bonus.




This option is ridiculously overpowered, in addition to having some pretty big ambiguities:
- When do you get to use the binding ability? And what sort of action does it require? How far away can a target be?
- giving up 1d6 AC is one of those fiddly things that 5e tends to dispense with, IMO. Better to treat a target as restrained, which does for its movement and gives advantage on attacks against it
- Save DC is wrong, as per previous remarks
- what does "lose strength bonus" mean?
- yes, it's only while you're raging, but that's 5 rages per long rest at 14th level, and unlimited rages at 20th level, when you'll have proficiency with [I]two additional saving throws! That's just nuts.



It means you lose your rage strength bonus in exchange for the others? I don't know why that's confusing

See, in the first place, you didn't write "rage" strength bonus, and in the second place, there's no such thing as a "rage strength bonus" to begin with.

The barbarian rage feature states:



When you make a melee weapon attack using Strength, you gain a bonus to the damage roll that increases as you gain levels as a barbarian, as shown in the Rage Damage column of the Barbarian table.



The additional damage is not referred to as a "rage strength bonus" or a "strength bonus".



Gullinbursti
Frey's mount was given by the dwarves and is said to be able to run faster than a horse through air or water and it is never dark where he goes. When you choose this gift, Frey grants you abilities from the same font. you recieve Darkvision and Blindsight and your overall speed increases 10'. While raging, you gain the toughness of a Boars hide and recieve a bonus +2 to your AC and Temporary Hit Points equal to 1d12+double your constitution modifier .



So you're getting a permanent increase to your speed, along with darkvision and blindsight, and on top of that you get temporary hp and bonus AC while raging. Not as over-the-top as other options here, but still overpowered.

Ambiguities/nitpicks:
- Darkvision must have a range limit specified, and what happens if you already have darkvision? Is your range limit increased?
- Blindsight must have a range limit specified
- You need to specify when you get the temporary hp - is it when you enter the rage? At the start of each of your turns?

It doesn't help that this feature is coming on top of already getting temporary hp and a bonus to AC with your shield wall feature.




I don't know man. It literally says, "while raging". It works the same as temp hp granted by something like the shifting racial feature. It says "while shifted". Some of these nitpicks make sense but some are weird in that you're very specific about knowing how DC works but then something like this you don't understand.

Here's how the Races of Eberron Unearthed Arcana describes the temporary hit points gained from shifting:

Shifting. As a bonus action, you can assume a more bestial appearance. This transformation lasts for 1 minute, until you die, or until you revert to your normal appearance as a bonus action. When you shift, you gain temporary hit points equal to your level + your Constitution modifier (minimum of 1 temporary hit point). [Emphasis mine.]

So, no, it doesn't say that you gain temporary hit points "while shifted". It says that you gain them "when you shift" - at the moment you use your bonus action to shift, you gain the temporary hit points. Some of the shifter subraces have other effects that happen "when you shift" (such as extra temporary hp), and others have ongoing benefits that apply "while shifted" (such as AC bonuses, or the ability to make claw attacks). But it's always very precise and clear which is which. Saying that you get temporary hit points "while you rage" or "while raging" is neither precise nor clear.

(Apropos of an earlier part of this post, the UA text tells you precisely when you gain the temporary hit points, but says nothing about how long they last, meaning they work as per the default rules for temporary hp. There's no ambiguity there.)



Mjiolnir
When raging Thor gives you power from Mjiolnir and your hands are like living hammers. You gain an extra +2 bonus to Strength Attacks and Your unarmed strike deals 3d12 bludgeoning damage as long as you rage. additionally, you gain resistance to lightning and thunder damage while raging.




Back to overpowered.

"+2 bonus to Strength Attacks" is meaningless in 5e. Do you mean attack rolls? Damage rolls? Both? Given you're already getting a big buff to damage rolls because you're raging, it's just too much.

3d12 bludgeoning damage on unarmed strikes is simply over-the-top.

The damage resistances are fine. Those plus some additional benefit that evokes the idea of using Mjolnir would be suitable, as long as it's not what's here now.




Suggestion? I mean it needs to be on par with living forever.

I'm not aware of there being any barbarian subclass feature that allows you to live forever. Perhaps you can clarify?

GavinC
2019-03-05, 12:35 PM
I'm running a sword/shield Goliath Marauder Barbarian guy, and this sounds perfect. I'd love to try it and see how it balances! The flavor text is awesome, too!

NOMster
2019-03-05, 02:25 PM
If you don't feel it needs to be comparable to other barbarian primal paths, then you probably don't need to change the mechanics much - although in that case the Idunna's Apples needs a buff rather badly. After all, there's nothing wrong with high-power options per se. I was pretty emphatic on overpowered options because of the presumption that the primal path was intended to be around the same power level as the others.

Anyway, if the rest of the post below seems a bit testy, just keep in mind that I think this subclass concept is interesting enough/cool enough/fun enough to spend the time on digging into it for problems. If I didn't like it, I wouldn't have made the effort.







Maybe we're just parsing words differently, but as far as I can see, "while you rage" does not mean the same thing as "when you enter a rage"/"when you begin raging", or similar. Instead, it's synonymous with "for the duration of your rage" or "while you are raging".

"While you rage" is fine for the AC benefit. But when are you supposed to actually get the temporary hit points? "While you rage" doesn't really say.

"While you rage" also opens up an ambiguity for how long you get to keep the temporary hit points. Do they vanish at the end of the rage, because you are given them "while you rage"? Or do they work normally - that is, they last until depleted or until you finish a long rest?

Since you bring up shifters later, and the UA text is quoted below, it's probably helpful to see how Wizards wrote out that feature with respect to how yours is worded. But more on that later.







Well, "Thor gives you power from Mjolnir and your hands are like living hammers" is a really well done flavour text - evocative and descriptive. The text tells you what the ability does, but not in a way that makes sense mechanically. That way, you know it's flavour text. It helps that the mechanics support the flavour: the Mjolnir ability as you've written it grants 3d12 bludgeoning damage unarmed strikes.

"One can never be lost while using it" is very specific. It's also a statement that makes sense both as a game-mechanic feature and in-universe. It's not unlike having an ability that says "you do not need to eat, sleep, or breathe". There's no reference to game mechanics as such in that sentence, but you don't need any: the phrase stands on its own. So does "one can never be lost".

I would say, then, that the flavour text needs some clearing up. It also doesn't help that the only mechanical effect of this feature that's related to "not getting lost" is the once-per-long-rest casting of commune with nature.








See, in the first place, you didn't write "rage" strength bonus, and in the second place, there's no such thing as a "rage strength bonus" to begin with.

The barbarian rage feature states:


The additional damage is not referred to as a "rage strength bonus" or a "strength bonus".







Here's how the Races of Eberron Unearthed Arcana describes the temporary hit points gained from shifting:


So, no, it doesn't say that you gain temporary hit points "while shifted". It says that you gain them "when you shift" - at the moment you use your bonus action to shift, you gain the temporary hit points. Some of the shifter subraces have other effects that happen "when you shift" (such as extra temporary hp), and others have ongoing benefits that apply "while shifted" (such as AC bonuses, or the ability to make claw attacks). But it's always very precise and clear which is which. Saying that you get temporary hit points "while you rage" or "while raging" is neither precise nor clear.

(Apropos of an earlier part of this post, the UA text tells you precisely when you gain the temporary hit points, but says nothing about how long they last, meaning they work as per the default rules for temporary hp. There's no ambiguity there.)






I'm not aware of there being any barbarian subclass feature that allows you to live forever. Perhaps you can clarify?

well the zealot comes close

anyway, I get what you're saying from your 1st post also, it does seem like word parsing in some of it. the shifter feature "while shifted" AC is where i got the idea for "while raging" as apposed to "when you start raging". it's meant to say while raging, you have this temp HP. So while you rage, you have them, temp HP is used first, so taking damage would use them up before getting into your normal HP, and they would go away while not raging if you have not used them all. but i can see how thats confusing and it's easy enough to fix.

the first few lines in vegvisir could be seperated so that it's clear where the fluff is and where are the mechanics of the feature. But it's meant, just like the other openings, to be a fluff descriptor with the lines following as an explanation of how that translates into the game. you're still in the "lore" of what a vegivisir is in that sentence. then it begins telling you how the feature emulates that power. maybe it would help to say "The Vegvisir is a viking compass, it is said one can never be lost while using it. When you reach level 10, the gods give you abilities to help you always be aware of your path. as a symbol of this gift, somewhere on your body the gods emblazon the image of a vegvisir." then i could depower it some. "gaining an exceptional sense of your surroundings, your DangerSense now works even if you are blind or deafened, although Being incapacitated still nullifies this ability. If you feel you are losing your way and need guidance, Odin's ravens can help you. once per long rest you can cast commune with nature as a ritual. Constitution is your spellcasting ability.

the overall idea of lvl14 being OP, i can certainly understand when compared to some of the other barbarian paths. I can reword some and specify the raging aspect since that's just my mistake anyway. Although, to be fair, I was going more for something to give barbarians abilities a little closer to level with spellcasters like chain of lighting and such without the need for magical weapons. also, I was trying to make specialized fighting styles for them. someone choosing Mjiolnir is throwing away the need for weapons and could build his character from level 1 accordingly. someone taking Gullinbursti would be going for speed and toughness, someone going Gleipnir would want to not dump INT and WIS as much as CHA, but also wouldn't be as dependent on STR as a"normal" barbarian or someone taking Mjiolnir or Gungnir, etc. Each option is meant to play up to different play styles. But there are some key words i left out that as written make them stronger than intended. I'll keep this all in mind and maybe rework it some.

NOMster
2019-03-05, 02:26 PM
I'm running a sword/shield Goliath Marauder Barbarian guy, and this sounds perfect. I'd love to try it and see how it balances! The flavor text is awesome, too!

awesome thanks! please do.

NOMster
2019-10-07, 12:43 PM
after some time playing 5e now, I've gone back and redone this whole thing. I'm going to redo the god specific paths for a different subclass and i devoted this one just to using symbols instead. tried to be a little more balanced, keeping in mind the input i got here (thanks everyone even when it seems i'm being argumentative, i am listening). so here is the redone version. I may add it to the first post so the comparison can be made and hopefully it can be seen how i tried to bring down the power level based on the input i got here.



The Path of The Viking Warrior is for those Barbarians who fear not death, but delight in the battle fury that comes from wanting a warriors death.

Lo there do I see my Father

Lo there do I see my Mother, my Sisters, and my Brothers

Lo there do I see the Line of my people back to the beginning

Lo they do call to me, they bid me take my place among them in the Halls of Valhalla

Where the brave may live forever!

Some barbarians reach deep into their spirit to find the rage that comes from a connection to magical symbols used to empower them and their allies. As they become one with the magic, the gods mark their bodies with these symbols and unlock the powers they hold.

Path of The Viking Warrior Features

Barbarian Level Feature
3rd ∆gishjŠlmr
6th Valknut (1)
10th Vegvisir, Valknut (2)
14th Yggdrasil, Valknut (3)

∆gishjŠlmr
The Helm of Awe is inscribed on weapons and shields to inspire fear in ones enemies. When you choose this path at 3rd level, the gods mark your body with it, making you a living weapon of fear. When you want to intimidate a creature or when you begin raging, the mark ignites in a burst of lightning and burns brightly on your skin.

You have advantage on intimidation checks.

When you are raging, the first creature you hit with an attack on your turn takes an extra 1d6 lightning damage. Until the start of your next turn, the creature is frightened of you.



Valknut
The Valknut appears as 3 intertwined triangles and is a sacred symbol of Odin. After a battle, he chooses the bravest among the dead to be in his personal army or Einherjar . Odin has marked your body with this symbol to show that when you die, you will be among his warriors. When you rage, If an ally is in danger, the symbol on your body glows with a cold blue light and the Einherjar appear in spiritual form to defend nearby friends with a shield wall.

Beginning at 6th level, when you are raging, if a friendly creature is within 10' of you and an enemy starts it turn or moves into a space that gives it melee range on the ally, then you can use a reaction to give the ally a bonus 1d4 to their armor class until the end of their next turn while the spectral warriors encircle and shield them.

At level 10 the warriors can protect up to 2 creatures within 20' and at level 14 they can protect up to 3 creatures within 30'.

VegvŪsir
The Vegvisir is the Viking compass. The gods emblazon you with it and you can magically find your way. The mark gives of a faint sea colored glow when you trace its' lines.

Beginning at level 10, once per long rest you can spend ten minutes tracing the mark on your body. At the end of the ten minutes, you can cast commune with nature or find the path as a ritual. You can cast these without any other components except the tracing of the mark.



Yggdrasil
Yggdrasil is a massive tree that holds together the nine realms of existence with its branches and roots. It represents life, growth, and connection between all living things. Your body is marked with the symbol of the great tree. it shines a bright green and appears to move in the wind when you rage. Yggdrasil gives you a special bond to the allies protected by the Einherjar shield wall and you send strength to each other through the roots and branches of the great tree.

Beginning at 14th level, while you are raging, If a creature you have protected by the Valknut shield wall takes damage, then until the end of your next turn, you can add a d4 to your damage rolls when you take the attack action. You can have one bonus d4 from each ally shielded, up to a maximum of 3. These bonus dice deal force damage on a hit and each creature within a shield wall recovers hit points equal to the force damage you roll.




Somebody give this a whirl in it's new form and let me know how it plays please.