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Miraqariftsky
2007-10-05, 11:13 AM
Greetings!

One of my current characters is a goblin barbarian wolfrider--- 1st level, 14 Str and 18 Dex. Wields a lance as a primary weapon.

Now, my query to ye august Forum-folk is what would be the best backup weapons for him?

For the ranged weapon though, I'm already set on picking up a composite shortbow as soon as my character can afford it. Why? Because it can be used while mounted and the Str bonus can be applied to damage, that's why.


Thankee kindly, whoever'd be kind enough to help.

PlatinumJester
2007-10-05, 11:16 AM
A short sword since a light weapon is a must and maybe a club so you can do bludgeoning damage.


Get short haft feat from PHB2 so you can use the lance at close range.

Keld Denar
2007-10-05, 11:21 AM
Back-up for what occasion? Dismounting? Do you use a shield with your lance?

If you use a shield, I'd suggest morningstar or shortsword, or light pick. If you don't, use a small glaive for reach or a small greatsword (goodsword?). All decent weapons. Its pretty much a matter of flavor and mixing crit types at that points, since you aren't devoting a lot of feats and/or class abilities toward it.

Yuki Akuma
2007-10-05, 11:21 AM
It's always good to have the following on hand at all times (in order from most important to least important)

Some sort of ranged weapon.

At least one each of the three main damage types (blugeoning, piercing, slashing).

At least one light slashing/piercing weapon, in case you get swallowed.

At least one each of adamantine, cold iron and silver weapons.

If you can afford it, at least one each of the basic energy types (either as alchemical "Quickfrost" stuff or just permanently imbued items).

Yes, this means you end up needing a caddy... Or a Handy Haversack.

Keld Denar
2007-10-05, 11:24 AM
At least one each of mithril, adamantine, cold iron and silver weapons.


Mithril is not a DR type. There is no real advantage to a mith weapon over a normal steel one except weight and hardness/hp, which usually aren't an issue.

Yuki Akuma
2007-10-05, 11:26 AM
Mithril is not a DR type. There is no real advantage to a mith weapon over a normal steel one except weight and hardness/hp, which usually aren't an issue.

I have no idea what you're talking about. *whistles innocently*

:smallwink:

DraPrime
2007-10-05, 11:27 AM
I'd have to go with a morningstar. Maybe a shortsword.

Fax Celestis
2007-10-05, 11:37 AM
Mithril is not a DR type. There is no real advantage to a mith weapon over a normal steel one except weight and hardness/hp, which usually aren't an issue.

Depends on where your DM gets his monsters. Some of us like to homebrew monsters with DR/Mithril. :smallbiggrin:

Miraqariftsky
2007-10-05, 11:43 AM
A short sword since a light weapon is a must and maybe a club so you can do bludgeoning damage.

Get short haft feat from PHB2 so you can use the lance at close range.

A-hmm, this looks good... kind of like the Zulu assengai? But then, with a short haft, will the lance still be a reach weapon?


Back-up for what occasion? Dismounting? Do you use a shield with your lance?

If you use a shield, I'd suggest morningstar or shortsword, or light pick. If you don't, use a small glaive for reach or a small greatsword (goodsword?). All decent weapons. Its pretty much a matter of flavor and mixing crit types at that points, since you aren't devoting a lot of feats and/or class abilities toward it.

Backup for when foes get under the lance's reach.

Yes, I use a shield... If I downgrade my heavy shield to a buckler, would that save on the time usually used in dropping said shield when switching to, say, a greatsword?

Alrighty then... light weapons, which is best? A dagger, a shortsword a handaxe or a club?

Yuki Akuma
2007-10-05, 11:45 AM
As your main form of attack is piercing, handaxe or club. You might as well get both, as clubs are free.

Runolfr
2007-10-05, 11:50 AM
Well, if you want to be traditional, you could pack a scimitar (aka cavalry sabre). Very compatible with the Improved Critical feat, too, if that matters to you.

Tyger
2007-10-05, 11:50 AM
A-hmm, this looks good... kind of like the Zulu assengai? But then, with a short haft, will the lance still be a reach weapon?

Actually, it doesn't change the weapon. Its a feat that allows you to use a reach weapon at close range (i.e. adjacent squares) as well as at full range. Very handy feat actually.

Jasdoif
2007-10-05, 11:53 AM
If you're using a shield, don't forget that you can bash opponents with it. Might be useful if you simply don't have time to switch weaponry.

Keld Denar
2007-10-05, 11:57 AM
Also don't forget that 34 times out of 35, you can just take a 5 foot step back and continue with the pokity-poke poking.

(Disclaimer: All statistics made up on the spot. No pokies were harmed in the making of this post. Some restrictions may apply. Void where prohibited. See stores for details.)

Miraqariftsky
2007-10-05, 12:00 PM
Alrighty... mind ye, 'tis still a low level character...

So, once he gets a proper kit-out, that'll be a lance in one hand, a buckler heavy shield in the other; a club hanging loosely by a strap to the belt and an axe thrust into the other side of the belt; a greatsword slung across the back and a shortbow and arrows in the saddlebags...

Miraqariftsky
2007-10-05, 12:11 PM
Also don't forget that 34 times out of 35, you can just take a 5 foot step back and continue with the pokity-poke poking.

(Disclaimer: All statistics made up on the spot. No pokies were harmed in the making of this post. Some restrictions may apply. Void where prohibited. See stores for details.)

Ha-ha-ha.

Ah, thanks for reminding.


Actually, it doesn't change the weapon. Its a feat that allows you to use a reach weapon at close range (i.e. adjacent squares) as well as at full range. Very handy feat actually.

Really? Means I'll have to switch out some-some in my planned progression of levels.

THOUSAND THANKS FOR THE HELP, Y'ALL!

Yeril
2007-10-05, 12:20 PM
Morning star is useful, 1d8 damage and Bludgeoning ANd peiricng damage. if you want flavour a handaxe suits your goblin more in my opinion, or just go shield bashing.

Remember too, you can duel wield your lance with another weapon while mounted (Even another lance!)

I'd go for a bashing shield with a handaxe in your belt, Don't forget some nice leather barding for your wolf

Maybe even magc weaponry!

"Dude whats is wrong with your wolf hes drooling FIRE!"

"oh yeah thats the new "+2 flaming burst braces" I had installed."

:P

I had a paladin who's horse had +1 holy Horseshoes on, mounted overrun and tramples were devestating against large groups of evil mooks.

Person_Man
2007-10-05, 12:23 PM
I suggest that your backup weapon be another lance. A lance wielded two handed from the back of a mount with Power Attack + Shock Trooper + Spirited Charge gives you a +6 bonus per BAB to damage with no penalty to hit when you charge. Pick up Combat Reflexes and maybe Hold the Line, and your defense should be fine as well. No other weapon is going to give you anything even close to that damage output with the built in defense of a reach weapon.

I suggest Barb 2/Fighter 4/PrC X as your build. Strait Fighter 6 would probably be even better, since mounted builds are VERY feat hungry.

If you're worried about flying enemies, pick up the Leadership feat and get a mount who can fly, or dip into the Beastmaster PrC and ride a dire bat.

Drglenn
2007-10-05, 12:35 PM
To be completely traditional yet functional a knight would have a longsword/scimitar and/or a morningstar/heavy mace

Quick draw is your friend

Roderick_BR
2007-10-05, 01:28 PM
You can use a Duom from Arms & Armament, though it's a 3.0 weapon.
The stats are like that of a Spear, but allows you to pull the weapon back, making the reverse pikes on it "backstab" an enemy in the back, if he is adjacent to you. It's an exotic weapon.
Likewise, you may want to look into some special shields in Races of Stone, like shields with blades.
Or just get a spiked shield. In an emergency, you can drop your shield's shield bonus to don't become unarmed. Later you can get shield specialization/improved shield bash, so you can fight with your shield and keep the defensive bonuses if you want.

Nerd-o-rama
2007-10-05, 01:40 PM
Yes, this means you end up needing a caddy... Or a Handy Haversack.
http://jackofallblades.com/index.php?p=8

Penguin caddy, definitely.

Yeril
2007-10-05, 03:29 PM
Heres two feats that you would find VERY useful, the first one basicly gives you a weak animal companion, although still its much better than just a regular animal. The second is great for you, seriosly, when you rage, so does your wolf :smallamused:

Wild Cohort [General]

You have a special bond with a wild animal, and it is willing to travel and adventure with you.

Benefit: You gain an animal cohort. The animal cohort is generally friendly to you and is willing to follow you and adventure with you. If given proper training, the animal cohort will willingly serve as your mount, guardian, and companion. (See the description of the Handle Animal skill on page 74 of the Player's Handbook for more details on training animals.)

You can use the Handle Animal skill on your animal cohort as a move action rather than as a standard action, and you gain a +2 bonus on all Handle Animal checks made to direct or influence your animal cohort.

Provided the DM gives her approval, at 1st level you can choose from a badger, camel, dire rat, dog, riding dog, eagle, hawk, horse (light or heavy), owl, pony, snake (Small or Medium viper), or wolf. Like a druid, you can choose more powerful animals as you increase in level. These alternative animal cohorts work like the alternative animal companions available to a druid, but they are available as cohorts later than they are available as animal companions. When selecting an alternative animal cohort, use the list of alternative animal companions on page 36 of the Player's Handbook, but treat yourself as a druid three levels lower than your character level. For example, once you reach 7th level, you can choose an animal cohort off the list of animal companions available to a 4th-level druid.

Special: Druids and rangers who take the wild cohort feat gain an animal cohort in addition to their animal companion. Although the two abilities are similar, they follow different sets of rules and must be tracked separately.

You can only ever have one wild cohort at any given time.

Like a druid's animal companion, your wild cohort improves as you gain experience. Although the animal cohort improves significantly compared to others of its kind, its abilities do not rival those of a druid's animal companion.

Character
Level Bonus
HD Natural
Armor Adj. Str/Dex
Bonus Bonus
Tricks Special
1st-2nd +0 +0 +0 0
3rd-5th +1 +1 +0 1 Evasion
6th-8th +3 +3 +1 2
9th-11th +5 +5 +2 3
12th-14th +7 +7 +3 4 Devotion
15th-17th +9 +9 +4 5
18th-20th +11 +11 +5 6 Improved evasion

Animal Companion Basics: Use the base statistics for a creature of the companion's kind, as given in the Monster Manual, but make the following changes.

Class Level: The character's class levels and racial Hit Dice.

Bonus HD: Extra eight-sided (d8) Hit Dice, each of which gains a Constitution modifier, as normal. Remember that extra Hit Dice improve the animal cohort's base attack and base save bonuses. An animal cohort's base attack bonus is the same as that of a cleric or rogue of a level equal to the animal's HD. An animal cohort has good Fortitude and Reflex saves (treat it as a character whose level equals the animal's HD). An animal cohort gains additional skill points and feats for bonus HD as normal for advancing a monster's Hit Dice (see the Monster Manual). The number listed is the current total of extra HD over and above the base creature's total. For example, a creature that normally has 1 HD but that is a wild cohort for a 6th-level character gains an additional 3 HD for a total of 4 HD.

Natural Armor: The number noted here is an improvement to the animal cohort's existing natural armor bonus. For example, a creature that normally has a natural armor bonus of +2 but that is a wild cohort for a 6th-level character gains an additional +3 bonus for a total natural armor bonus of +5.

Str/Dex Bonus: Add this value to the base creature's Strength and Dexterity scores. For example, a creature that normally has a Strength score of 10 but that is a wild cohort for a 15th-level character gains an additional +4 for a total Strength score of 14.

Bonus Tricks: The value given in this column is the total number of "bonus" tricks that the animal knows in addition to any that the character might choose to teach it (see the Handle Animal skill, Player's Handbook page 74). These bonus tricks don't require any training time or Handle Animal checks, and they don't count against the normal limit of tricks known by the animal. The character selects these bonus tricks, and once selected, they can't be changed. For example, a wild cohort that belongs to an 11th-level character has a total of 3 bonus tricks.

Evasion (Ex): If an animal cohort is subjected to an attack that normally allows a Reflex saving throw for half damage, it takes no damage if it makes a successful saving throw.

Devotion (Ex): An animal cohort's devotion to its master is so complete that it gains a +4 morale bonus on Will saves against enchantment spells and effects.

Improved Evasion (Ex): When subjected to an attack that normally allows a Reflex saving throw for half damage, an animal cohort takes no damage if it makes a successful saving throw and only half damage if the saving throw fails.


Mounted Fury [General]

Your fearsome rage spurs your mount to greater heights.

Prerequisites: Mounted Combat, Ride 5 ranks, rage class ability.

Benefit: As long as you are riding a war-trained mount, your mount gains the same benefits and penalties that you do while you rage. This includes improved rage abilities like greater rage, tireless rage, and mighty rage. The mount's rage ends any time you are no longer mounted or when your rage ends. You must be mounted when you initiate your rage ability for the mount to be affected.

Truwar
2007-10-05, 03:36 PM
You need to get yourself a spiked gauntlet because letís face it, goblins are the rabbits of the monster world and it is only a matter of time before you get crammed down the gullet of some swallowing creature. The spiked gauntlet is a handy weapon this is always drawn and ready to go to work for you, be it fighting in close quarters or cutting yourself out of a Tendriculosí stomach.

tahu88810
2007-10-05, 03:53 PM
To go with the whole 'lance'-type theme. You could probably use a short-spear, and for ranged damage while on foot you can also use javelins? That would seem to work out.

Yeril
2007-10-05, 03:55 PM
You need to get yourself a spiked gauntlet because letís face it, goblins are the rabbits of the monster world and it is only a matter of time before you get crammed down the gullet of some swallowing creature. The spiked gauntlet is a handy weapon this is always drawn and ready to go to work for you, be it fighting in close quarters or cutting yourself out of a Tendriculosí stomach.

This reminds me of a Assasin who killed a big swalloing thing after being eaten by it, he had resistance to acid so was taking minimal damage per round and had darkvision, It was only a matter of time (18 seconds) until he managed to find the squishiest bit and made a death attack from the inside, killing the thing instantly.

getting out was the hard part.

Lord Lorac Silvanos
2007-10-05, 04:02 PM
I suggest that your backup weapon be another lance. A lance wielded two handed from the back of a mount with Power Attack + Shock Trooper + Spirited Charge gives you a +6 bonus per BAB to damage with no penalty to hit when you charge. Pick up Combat Reflexes and maybe Hold the Line, and your defense should be fine as well. No other weapon is going to give you anything even close to that damage output with the built in defense of a reach weapon.

I suggest Barb 2/Fighter 4/PrC X as your build. Strait Fighter 6 would probably be even better, since mounted builds are VERY feat hungry.

If you're worried about flying enemies, pick up the Leadership feat and get a mount who can fly, or dip into the Beastmaster PrC and ride a dire bat.

I would like to second this suggestion with the amendment that you wear a spiked gauntlet for close combat (grapple etc.) should the need arise in spite of your defences.

John Campbell
2007-10-05, 04:49 PM
I'm doing something similar, but scaled up a bit, for my next character. Half-orc dire-wolf-rider. A barbarian by fluff, but mostly a Ranger (archery style) by class - though I'll have a level or two of Barbarian for the fast movement and rage, maybe uncanny dodge (and it's my favored class anyway), and levels in Beastmaster and Wild Plains Outrider to buff the mount/animal companion so it won't get killed out from under me every other fight.

Lance for the mounted charge, composite longbow for range. Either a scimitar or a saber (from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting) for close-quarters fighting... I haven't decided yet whether the larger damage die and +1 to-hit while mounted is a good tradeoff for the narrower crit range. The saber'd probably be a better bet for you... you won't have the hefty Str bonus that makes the wider crit range potentially worthwhile for me.

A couple of daggers - cold iron and silver - to cover the various uses of daggers and special-material weapons. Buckler instead of a heavier shield... it means I can use the bow without having to swap the shield in and out. It also means I can two-hand with only a small penalty, but I think the only thing I'm likely to two-hand is the lance when dismounted.

A lot of this is flavor choices and may not be ideally optimized - I'm looking at the sort of gear that historical mounted barbarians used, rather than just going for whatever gives me the biggest numbers.

kpenguin
2007-10-05, 06:11 PM
Get a dagger. Those things are so useful. Grapple weapon, rope hacker, impromptu knife, hidden weapon for formal occasions, etc.

bosssmiley
2007-10-05, 07:26 PM
Mounted Fury [General]

Your fearsome rage spurs your mount to greater heights.

Prerequisites: Mounted Combat, Ride 5 ranks, rage class ability.

Benefit: As long as you are riding a war-trained mount, your mount gains the same benefits and penalties that you do while you rage. This includes improved rage abilities like greater rage, tireless rage, and mighty rage. The mount's rage ends any time you are no longer mounted or when your rage ends. You must be mounted when you initiate your rage ability for the mount to be affected.

Sweeeeeet. :smallbiggrin:

Sourcebook ref for the above feat please? I have a great idea for a dwarven goatrider barb' fermenting away here and that feat sounds perfect.

Generic PC
2007-10-05, 07:52 PM
I agree. Daggers are the best backup ever. one of my characters had at least 5 of each material on him at any time, and he took a methological approach to killing things, so he knew about DR. My curent character has 4 on him right now, along with 2 handaxes.