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View Full Version : OOTS #280 - The Discussion Thread



The Giant
2006-02-11, 01:02 AM
Comic is up now.

WeaponMasterLDO
2006-02-11, 01:04 AM
Yay! great comic giant. The lawyer jokes are classic, and the giant boot was really something. Isn't the evidence locker fun?

The Giant
2006-02-11, 01:04 AM
Whoops, there's a transparency issue with the boot....I'll fix it.

EDIT: Fixed now.

GamingBuddha
2006-02-11, 01:05 AM
Very punny!

Edit: Poor Giant, this court plotline keeps messing with his transparency settings ;D

Bozidar
2006-02-11, 01:05 AM
that joke has been done to death... but it still makes me giggle :)

soni
2006-02-11, 01:06 AM
unlikely hero defense.. Riddle v Board of Education... LOL!

Godhand
2006-02-11, 01:06 AM
Well I thought an OJ reference would get here eventually, excellent as usual Giant.

A team up of Elan and Rodr. was hilarious.

Edit: And there's even a Dragonlance reference, that made my week.

Deuce
2006-02-11, 01:06 AM
If the strip makes me laugh, I'm better by half . . . ;D

theKOT
2006-02-11, 01:08 AM
Yay! two minutes late though! the giant is losing his edge ::) .
I loved Elan's inability to resist assisting someone in need of his special bardic brand of help.
I don't see what help "citing precedent" will be. Can someone explain?

Reptile
2006-02-11, 01:08 AM
Whoops, there's a transparency issue with the boot....I'll fix it.

It's the amazing see-through boot!

...but I'm with WeaponMasterLDO. Does the giant boot have anything to do with the giant space cats? Giant booted space cats?

EDIT:

I don't see what help "citing precedent" will be. Can someone explain?
Well, the plaintiffs in the cases cited are the BBEGs who were bested by unlikely heroes. If they subsequenly took the heroes to court and won, and Celia is casting the OOTS as the unlikely heroes, then the precedent may be relevant.

ragingmaro
2006-02-11, 01:10 AM
Nice.

Dhavaer
2006-02-11, 01:11 AM
Assisting the enemy with their rhyming scheme... fanstastic...

Euphemism
2006-02-11, 01:12 AM
Beautiful. Just beautiful.

Winged One
2006-02-11, 01:14 AM
;D

"Riddle vs. Board of Education"

But what's wrong with West? She wasn't so bad until the end, really.

Tetralemma
2006-02-11, 01:15 AM
I can't think of rhymes
to do this comic justice
haiku will suffice

Great comic!

Koury
2006-02-11, 01:15 AM
I don't know how I feel about not having noticed the transparency thing until you pointed it out, Giant.

Oh, while on the subject of minor glitches, I was curious, were you aware of/planning on fixing the thing in # 271 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=271). The Celia speachbubble thing not being blue/white.

Actually, do you have any sort of policy on things like that at all? Like do you fix them if you get the time and feel motivated to do so or do you just let them be provided they dont mess up anything or what?

Sorry if I'm prying or if you've answered these questions a million times before, I'm just curious.

bluewurm
2006-02-11, 01:17 AM
"if you help with their verse, you'll just make things worse" was my favorite line since Varsuvius giving that long speech that put the goblins to sleep.

The Giant
2006-02-11, 01:18 AM
It all depends on how much time I have. I change these things before they go to print in the book, so don't be surprised if a bunch of comics get fixed right around when I announce the next compilation book.

Annalia
2006-02-11, 01:19 AM
And another hooray for Elan! ;D
This was fantastic.

SumGuy
2006-02-11, 01:20 AM
lol, it appears that Roy has some ranks in Perform(Ryhme Scheme) as well if he was able to come up with Elan's warning.

Also, I dont get the Riddle v. Board of Ed. joke...could someone please explain?

oh, and great comic as usual Giant.

mec
2006-02-11, 01:20 AM
I wonder if Rodriguez has a magic portfolio (or whatever you call his big leather thingy). Jones expects that Rodriguez can pull any desired case file out of there.

Elan and Rodriguez are so cute together!

gizmo_mathboy
2006-02-11, 01:20 AM
The voices in my head for the lawyers are done by Terrence and Phillip from South Park.

That's just weird.

Koury
2006-02-11, 01:21 AM
It all depends on how much time I have. I change these things before they go to print in the book, so don't be surprised if a bunch of comics get fixed right around when I announce the next compilation book.

Sweet!
Thanks!

Eriol
2006-02-11, 01:22 AM
How many Harry Potter references is that now? ;)

gizmo_mathboy
2006-02-11, 01:22 AM
Also, I dont get the Riddle v. Board of Ed. joke...could someone please explain?

I think it's a Harry Potter reference. Tom Marvolo Riddle aka Lord Voldemort.

Ilaun_Undil
2006-02-11, 01:23 AM
yay for suspence yay for me being to slow for being on the second page and yay for rhyming couplets

kriklaf
2006-02-11, 01:26 AM
hee! "If you help with their verse, you'll just make things worse"--well worth staying up for! I especially like the downcast look to Elan's face when he says it, too. You just know he's heard it from Roy so many times.

I also really liked the Comedically Large Boot, as well. Couldn't tell you why--it just tickled me. Ah well, going to bed happy. Giant, as always, thanks for the laughs.

Django
2006-02-11, 01:27 AM
Is there any particular reason why Celia's mouth is agape in panel one? not to be accusatory, but it seems like she was copy/pasted for the first three panels and Rich forgot the first one.

The_Ducky_Ninja
2006-02-11, 01:30 AM
Yet another great comic, filled with enough jokes to knock me off my chair.

Just curious though: Who's Everman? I don't remember any Evermans in Dragonlance...

Annalia
2006-02-11, 01:30 AM
The voices in my head for the lawyers are done by Terrence and Phillip from South Park.

That's just weird.

You know, my voices are quite similar to that too... And you're right, it's weird.

The Giant
2006-02-11, 01:34 AM
Is there any particular reason why Celia's mouth is agape in panel one? not to be accusatory, but it seems like she was copy/pasted for the first three panels and Rich forgot the first one.

Whoops! Well, looks like in the hurry to try to get this up at midnight, I messed up Panel 1. Fixed now.

Tariskat
2006-02-11, 01:39 AM
TheDuckyNinja: *Everman, in Dragonlance, was the guy that could not die, with a large green gem embedded in his chest. *Takhisis needed him to open the portal to the abyss because that stone was part of the pattern of gems on the portal, I beleive. *He ended up actually dying, and Takhisis didn't get through (for long). *This was in Dragons of Winter Night, I believe. *

Edit: *Dragons of Spring Dawing. *I couldn't remember the trilogy name at the moment, I guessed at which one it was. *My bad! :)

Edit, Again: Does anyone else find a lawyer (or a man in a very expensive suit) in a boot extremely funny??

Caledonian
2006-02-11, 01:39 AM
So awesome! I rather like Mr. Rodriguez - he seems to be the perfect foil for the humorless, dour, and competent Mr. Smith.

Rather like Elan and Roy, actually. (Does anyone else think that, along with Vaarsuvius, they're the Kirk, Bones, and Spock of the OOTSverse?)

Please be sure to get enough sleep, Giant. We need your funny brain to be in top fighting shape for Monday's strip.

(A legion of fans stumble towards the Giant. "Comics...", they moan. "Having found your work amusing, we possess the right to dictate details of your personal life so that we might be further amused. Comics, comics, brains -- er, comics..."

humanpylon
2006-02-11, 01:41 AM
Just out of curiosity, why is Durkon testifying about why they went into the dungeon seeing as it was Roy's quest? Shouldn't he be the one to say why they were there?

Eriol
2006-02-11, 01:44 AM
TheDuckyNinja: Everman, in Dragonlance, was the guy that could not die, with a large green gem embedded in his chest. Takhisis needed him to open the portal to the abyss because that stone was part of the pattern of gems on the portal, I beleive. He ended up actually dying, and Takhisis didn't get through (for long). This was in Dragons of Winter Night, I believe.
/nitpick

It was Dragons of Spring Dawning that had that event. Same trilogy though.

;)

Eriol
2006-02-11, 01:45 AM
Just out of curiosity, why is Durkon testifying about why they went into the dungeon seeing as it was Roy's quest? Shouldn't he be the one to say why they were there?
Credibility. Even Miko trusts him.

Caledonian
2006-02-11, 01:45 AM
I'm sure that all of the party members will testify in time. Best to ask the questions in the proper order, don't you think? That means that the members who can best answer the really big questions need to testify when those questions will best fit into the legal narrative.

In other words, Roy will testify about the stuff that he's most qualified to explain - likely about his order to Elan to try to open the gate and the "death" of Xykon.

humanpylon
2006-02-11, 01:48 AM
Oh crap that's right! Roy did order Elan to touch the gate!

slowly_insane
2006-02-11, 01:52 AM
Tom Riddle was Voldemort's name during school (ref. HP and the Chamber of Secrets).
My five year old daughter LOVES the comedically large boot. She wanted to know what it was for. Gotta go make pancakes now-great comic Rich, I laughed so loud I woke up the slumber party!

Caledonian
2006-02-11, 01:53 AM
Oh crap that's right! Roy did order Elan to touch the gate!
No, no, that's good! It establishes that they had no idea what the gate was or what Xykon was trying to do with it. Then, when Haley stopped Elan from opening it, Elan got the idea that it would be a very bad thing if the gate were to be opened... which leads naturally to his activating the self-destruct rune.

humanpylon
2006-02-11, 02:00 AM
oho! I see your plot now, devious one ;)

Lyc
2006-02-11, 02:00 AM
In the first shots with Durkon in the truth chair, compared in size to Celia he almost looks like a baby in a high chair.

(who knows, maybe dwarven babies have beards)

afflictedkender
2006-02-11, 02:01 AM
I love the Dragonlance reference. That pretty much made my day 100 times better. ;D

Nerd-o-rama
2006-02-11, 02:02 AM
Some of the more random jokes in a while, but you can't go wrong with Riddle v. Board of Education. Or the last panel.

But seriously, a giant boot? As Roy would say, *questioningly arches eyebrow to well above the top of his head*.

Leo_Forestclaw
2006-02-11, 02:03 AM
Yeah! I've got my OotS fix!

I'm just wondering if we're going to see a pattern of one Miko v. Belkar strip and half a dozen court room strips, one Miko v. Belkar strip... etc.

I'm just amazed at how many silly jokes Rich can fit into these panels and then upon review you pick on the in-jokes. Just Brilliant.

And I feel a certain amount of shame at the fact that I laugh out loud at, " If you help with their verse..." The best part was imagining the first time Roy and Elan had that conversation and the scenario that might have given rise to it.

...so, does this mean I gotta wait until Monday now for the next strip? .. After The Crayons of Time saga and an almost daily fix I dunno if I can go back to 3 times a week...

But Rich, thy will be done, thy kingdom be illustrated...

*sigh*

Count-Tyr
2006-02-11, 02:03 AM
Great strip there...the last panel is the first one in ages thats actualy made me laugh out loud

theKOT
2006-02-11, 02:05 AM
No, no, that's good! It establishes that they had no idea what the gate was or what Xykon was trying to do with it. Then, when Haley stopped Elan from opening it, Elan got the idea that it would be a very bad thing if the gate were to be opened... which leads naturally to his activating the self-destruct rune.

Logically(crazy-rules wise) sound! I like it! Although I don't think that that is the direction the giant will take the strip.

manscatha
2006-02-11, 02:10 AM
I am now absolutely dying to find out how the cases cited went down. Did Sauron really sue Frodo... I mean, Frudu, for destorying his Ming and win? Etc.

Zaruthustran
2006-02-11, 02:12 AM
Loved the Riddle vs. Board of Education. But I don't get the Witch vs. Gale. What's up with that? Is that a Wizard of Oz reference?

-z

Crud
2006-02-11, 02:14 AM
A giant WOOT! for Phil Rodriguez Attorney at law. All of Elan's panache (or elan *;) ) and a very expensive suit to boot!
http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=268

Winged One
2006-02-11, 02:14 AM
Yeah. Dorethey's last name was Gale. If more explaination is needed, get it from somebody other than myself.

xaourcav
2006-02-11, 02:21 AM
Dragonlance reference wo0ts and just when im rereading the books
yes eveman was a young boy who pryed a gem out of the pillar despite his sisters insistance his sister was killed but he survived he died by impaling himself on said pillar and locking takhisis in the abyss

humanpylon
2006-02-11, 02:24 AM
Oh I thought Gale referred to the tornado that dropped the house on the witch. Mind you I haven't seen the Wizard of Oz in about 20 years...

DOOM2099
2006-02-11, 02:35 AM
Hah, I didnt get the gale thing either ... how do you sue a tornado?

The Giant
2006-02-11, 02:36 AM
Oh I thought Gale referred to the tornado that dropped the house on the witch. *Mind you I haven't seen the Wizard of Oz in about 20 years...

It's an intentional pun in the Wizard of Oz; Dorothy Gale gets carried on a tornado to Oz.

humanpylon
2006-02-11, 02:38 AM
First Hentai, now Wizard of Oz. *Once again my ignorant buffoonery is exposed *:-[

However many thanks to the Giant for clarifying * :)

By the way, I have an excuse for being on a computer at this hour since I'm working (sort of).

What are you doing up this late?

Daerthax
2006-02-11, 02:45 AM
Better late than never. Good legal-ese and the up and coming Cochran wannabe. Great stuff Giant.

Doshi
2006-02-11, 02:57 AM
Another great comic. I'm really enjoying the courtroom humor. But I think the word Precedent was misspelled in the fourth panel.

Vengeful_Hand
2006-02-11, 03:03 AM
That..was wonderful. * Phil just gets better. *I loved the "Riddle vs." pun. *
What was the O.J. reference Godhand mentioned? *I'm too young to have followed the trial.

I doubt Sauron sued Frodo. Banished into the Timeless Void, he would be unable to attend court procedings. Lacking any physical form, he would be unable to write outrageously large checks to his high-powered lawyer team. Given that Barad-Dur held his treasuries (a guess), he probably would have to resort to his dwarven no-questions-asked Bank account, draining his remaining funds.

Eriol
2006-02-11, 03:08 AM
That..was wonderful. Phil just gets better. I loved the "Riddle vs." pun.
What was the O.J. reference Godhand mentioned? I'm too young to have followed the trial.
A fairly famous quote from one of his lawyers is "If the glove doesn't fit, you must aquit", referring to the fact that the bloody glove found on the property where the murder occurred did NOT fit O.J. Hence the statement.

And I would recommend (though I have no binding power whatsoever on this board) that we don't debate the trial here. That could get ugly... fast.

AmoDman
2006-02-11, 03:14 AM
I love everyone catches the Harry Potter reference of Riddle v. Board of Education, but not the play on words with the famous Brown v. Board of Education that, no doubt, inspired it's name...

ElfLad
2006-02-11, 03:17 AM
The reason I loved Riddle vs. Board of Education is that it's not just "Riddle vs. Potter" so it sounds like an actual lawsuit.

And the rhymes were great.

Argus
2006-02-11, 03:20 AM
I doubt Sauron sued Frodo. Banished into the Timeless Void, he would be unable to attend court procedings. Lacking any physical form, he would be unable to write outrageously large checks to his high-powered lawyer team. Given that Barad-Dur held his treasuries (a guess), he probably would have to resort to his dwarven no-questions-asked Bank account, draining his remaining funds.
Alternately, he could have asked GRIMHELM WORMTONGUE, The son of late Counsellor Gríma
Wormtongue of the Kingdom of Rohan to help retrieve a deposit from the Bank of Gondor.

TechnoGuyRob
2006-02-11, 03:27 AM
Oh man, great stuff! I was laughing out loud for minutes, this one's gold.

Norri_Windwalker
2006-02-11, 03:40 AM
Wahahahaha Elan's last sentence ... *rolling on the floor* that one was pretty pretty cool! "if you help with their verse... " - that was so amazing, it got me laughing for several minutes!

Curunir
2006-02-11, 04:00 AM
I read the strip twince and I still can`t get over the "Riddle vs. Board of Education" . And the boot. we can`t forget the BOOT


Great comic:)

Eriol
2006-02-11, 04:15 AM
I read the strip twince and I still can`t get over the "Riddle vs. Board of Education" . And the boot. we can`t forget the BOOT
The boot reminded me of two things:

1. That Simpsons episode where they go to Australia, and they were going to boot Bart with that massive boot.

2. SMB3. That place where there's goombas in big boots like that, and once you get them out of it, you can use the boot yourself. You get in it with your character. So the boot is on the same scale as the boot here.

JDMSJR
2006-02-11, 04:19 AM
Hmmm...Is the Boot supposed to be a variation of the Chewbacca Defense? And if so, maybe Mr. Rodriguez is really a legal genius. :o

omikapsi
2006-02-11, 04:52 AM
The last comic ended up with 29 pages of posts.
At 15 posts a page, there's an average of a post every 7 minutes. (3300 minutes, 435 posts, approx)
Assuming that everyone who posts has read the comic in question, and posting and reading the comic takes a total of seven minutes per person, that means that the Giant is responsible for removing the equivalent of one person from the workforce every week. To do this, he spends a measly 1.5 hours a day.
Theoretically, if he stopped trying so hard to do quality stuff, and just started producing comics full time, he'd be able to crank out 2.5 comics in a 7.5 hour day, increasing their regularity by a factor of 5. Let's be honest, none of us would stop reading or posting if his quality dropped to 1/5th it's current, it'd still be head and shoulders above most of the stuff out there.
Under those circumstances, he'd be removing the equivalent of 5 people from the workforce on a regular basis.
Canada currently has a population of about 32 million.
If one third of them stopped working, I'm confident that the economy would collapse.
I could bring my countries industry to a grinding halt with two million Giant clones.

Draco_06
2006-02-11, 04:57 AM
You know, somehow I just can't find myself to being surprised that Rodriguez and Elan get along, I can just imagine those two getting together and sharing notes.

but anyways great comic all the way
now I just can't wait until Monday

Winthur
2006-02-11, 04:59 AM
Mwahahaha! Genious strip!
Lawyers roolah ;)

Curunir
2006-02-11, 05:08 AM
The boot reminded me of two things:

1. That Simpsons episode where they go to Australia, and they were going to boot Bart with that massive boot.



Funny. that was my first thing in my mind to, when I read it :P

Evik
2006-02-11, 05:20 AM
hehe bad Elan...no donut for you!

divine
2006-02-11, 06:23 AM
simply brilliant as usual -- have a good weekend everyone <3

Matuse
2006-02-11, 06:32 AM
Chewbacca defense was what came to mind when the boot first showed up.

And I never knew Dorothy's last name...I thought it was in reference to suing the tornado itself.

But shouldn't it be Sauron vs Smeagol? It was Gollum's carelessness that let Bilbo get ahold of the ring in the first place and led to Sauron's downfall. Forseeable consequence of losing an item is that it would fall into the hands of do-gooders. If Gollum had kept a tighter hold on that ring, then Smaug would have been available for Sauron to use, and the Dwarven defenses in the north would have been much weaker. Plus that whole ring-fall-into-mt-doom bit.

mec
2006-02-11, 06:44 AM
But shouldn't it be Sauron vs Smeagol? It was Gollum's carelessness that let Bilbo get ahold of the ring in the first place and led to Sauron's downfall. Forseeable consequence of losing an item is that it would fall into the hands of do-gooders. If Gollum had kept a tighter hold on that ring, then Smaug would have been available for Sauron to use, and the Dwarven defenses in the north would have been much weaker. Plus that whole ring-fall-into-mt-doom bit.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what Frodo said in Sauron vs Baggins. That defense doesn't seem to have worked because Jones thinks that Sauron vs Baggins is a favorable precedent for the plaintiff's side. :)

Reaver225
2006-02-11, 06:52 AM
So... distracted... by... Giant... boot... cannot... defend... against... zombies...

AARGH, MY BRAIN!

ekedolphin
2006-02-11, 07:15 AM
It's suddenly obvious to me-- Mr. Rodriguez and Elan are the source of all comedy in the universe. ;)

Surprisingly, though SMB3 is one of my favorite games, maybe even my favorite game of all-time, I didn't get the Kuribo's Shoe connection until it was brought up earlier in this thread. D'oh.

But it *did* remind me of a Daily Show skit with Rob Corrdry, in which he's distracted by a giant ball of tin foil in front of the White House.

barongas
2006-02-11, 07:23 AM
I must say that I find the level of the latest two strips rather low. First the anticlimax with the soup and now banter about a giant boot. Silly is often good but not today.
However the lawyer jokes in the beginnning were sweet.

Eva_of_Sirrion
2006-02-11, 07:57 AM
Sauron v. Baggins: great

Takhisis v. Everman: awesome

Riddle v. Board of Education: teh r0xx0rz!!!11! ;D

"If you help with their verse, you'll only make things worse:" Priceless!

Sc00by
2006-02-11, 07:57 AM
But... halflings in soup is always funny! Isn't it? ???

Though for me the Boot brought back images of Monty Python! Overlarge footwear is always funny. ;)

Leveller
2006-02-11, 08:40 AM
English is not my native language so please forgive me for asking. What does Phil mean with "Unlikely heroes Defense" and "citing precedent"?

evileeyore
2006-02-11, 08:42 AM
Okay I can follow the case precedents as such:

Sauron v. Baggins - Blowing up villian's House
Takhisis v. Everman - Keeping villian's house from being built
Witch v. Gale - Dropped house on villian
Riddle v. Board of Ed - I have no idea...

The first three are obvious tie in with Xykon's House (possession is 9/10 of the law) being blown up by the heroes. *Also Frodo, Dorothy, and Berem were all Unlikely Heroes. *But Riddle v Board of Ed.... *I'm just not getting the connection.

So help a brother out! *Throw me a bone over here...


English is not my native language so please forgive me for asking. What does Phil mean with "Unlikely heroes Defense" and "citing precedent"?
Unlikely Heroes is a literary device in which the hero is not a likely candidate for heroism. *Dorothy Gale just wants to home, not defeat the Wicked Witch of the West. *Frodo Baggins and Samwise Gamgee just want to go home, not trek across the entire continent into Evil filled lands, short on food, no comforts, and finally destroy the One Ring. *Berem Everman just wanted to stop living, stop being tormented by his *one and only one mistake* and in the end sacrifices himself to save the world. *They were are not what is expected in a hero.

Case precedent is a legal term in which the way a case ends can set precedent for future cases. *Thus later trials can cite that one as "evidence" of legal precedent. *Or something. *I'm not a fancy big city lawyer* *but that's how I see it...

*Gasp! *He's not!

Dark_Nemesis
2006-02-11, 09:11 AM
Hmmm...

Why does the giant boot seem a clear reference to the creator of the webcomic?


Oh hey - first post. Darn.

Lightman
2006-02-11, 09:11 AM
I guess "Giant in the Playground" really means "Giant Boot in the Playground!" ;D

Alfryd
2006-02-11, 09:41 AM
Quite amusing.
"Elan! What have I told you about assisting the enemy with their rhyming scheme?"
I'm sure he can kick the habit. *B-dum chish*!


I rather like Mr. Rodriguez - he seems to be the perfect foil for the humorless, dour, and competent Mr. Smith.
Jones, I believe.

In the first shots with Durkon in the truth chair, compared in size to Celia he almost looks like a baby in a high chair.
I think that's perspective, since he's in the background.

I could bring my countries industry to a grinding halt with two million Giant clones.
Damn the fool! He KNOWS! Flee, my brothers, and continue the operation!

...citing precedent"?
Saying that a case like this has happened before, therefore, if the judgement in that case was a mistake, you must make it twice.

soni
2006-02-11, 09:55 AM
I was thinking Chewbacca defense at first, too, but it's the persecutoers... err.. prosecutors who are bringing in the boot...


Durkon is the one testifying because he's the only one who REALLY takes the proceedings seriously. Roy and V think they're BS, Haley can't speak properly, Elan is an idiot, and Belkar hasn't made his entrance yet (and it would probably take The Giant a day just to do Haley's speech if she were to testify...LOL)

captheather
2006-02-11, 09:55 AM
When I read this last night, I laughed out loud for the first time in a long time about the last panel. Normally, there's big smiles, some chuckling, but the last panel cracks me up still! There's just something about how it's happened enough before that Elan has a rhyme to try and remember *not* to do it.

I am now having fun imagining what Rick may do with Elan and the Creature in the Darkness when the plotlines converge again. The way the plotline appears to be going though, I believe I'll have to be patient for a long time. Curses!

Albion
2006-02-11, 10:29 AM
;D Good ol' eager Elan.

Didn't get all the jokes yet, but maybe I will!

It's hilarious how Roy is being Elan's dad!

Lucca_Majere
2006-02-11, 10:54 AM
Hehe. Awesome! I love comics where I can actually get all the references for once. ^^ And since I love Dragonlance, Lord of the Rings, and Harry Potter, and everyone has seen Wizard of Oz in their childhood (or should have)...then this comic=awesome!
And the giant boot kind of reminded me of Super Mario 3 too...at least it would have if I'd thought of it. :P
Anyway this was a great comic. ^^ Hoping for another good one on Monday.

Devoured_Dude
2006-02-11, 10:56 AM
Elan and Rodriguez are so cute together!


I agree, They would be a really fun duo, prosecuting crime, composing couplets, kind of like a Law & Order: Poetic Intent.

Podkayne
2006-02-11, 11:05 AM
Giant boots are always funny. Who could form a defense against one?

Lucca_Majere
2006-02-11, 11:09 AM
Mario! Or a giant snake!!! (you know...snake in my boots?) Ok nevermind...XD Not sure where I was going with that.

Finwe
2006-02-11, 11:26 AM
Overanalysis of trials incoming :D


Frodo was commaned to destroy the ring by Elrond, the legitiment ruler of Rivendel, a nation at war with mordor, and by Gandalf, an emessary from the Gods (or as close to "gods" as anything gets in LoTR), giving him infinite jurisdiction. So far as I know, you can not sue someone for an act of war, since you're, you know, at war, nor can you sue someone for following divine will. Furthermore, one could use "Thief Vs. Lich King" (see 8-bit theatre) for precedent: the Ring corrupted and polluted whatever it touched, and thus its destruction was legally sanctioned. Furthermore, he travelled to the western lands, making him out of the Juristdiction of Middle-Earthen law, correcect?

Zeekar
2006-02-11, 11:26 AM
Dorothy's name is never mentioned in the movie; you wouldn't know that unless you've read the book. Which everyone should do. :)

Loved the combined HP/Brown v Board ref. Nice touch. Also a little continuation of the earlier jabbing at HP: he isn't Voldemort's problem, it's that damn school!

Had to google for the DL ref. I never got the appeal of those books, really. Second rate at best compared to real fantasy works that aren't franchise tie-ins...

Taelas
2006-02-11, 11:45 AM
Loved the DL, LOTR and HP references (didn't notice the rest).

If this were any other board, I'd ask you to explain your stance on the Dragonlance series, Zeekar, but it has no relevance to this thread.

Ebon_Drake
2006-02-11, 11:46 AM
Dorothy's name is never mentioned in the movie; you wouldn't know that unless you've read the book. Which everyone should do. :)
Doesn't that headless witch say it in the sequel? Not that that's particularly relevant, I just have this childhood memory of being totally creeped out at someone shrieking Dorothy Gale in the freakiest way possible, but I can't remember exactly which character it was.

As for the strip, meh, it was OK. Most of the references were lost on me (thank the gods for the forums.) The last panel was great though. I could really imagine Elan saying that like a sulky child, and I liked the suggestion that the same situation had happened often enough to merit having its own rhyme created.

Shhalahr Windrider
2006-02-11, 11:56 AM
Doesn't that headless witch say it in the sequel? Not that that's particularly relevant, I just have this childhood memory of being totally creeped out at someone shrieking Dorothy Gale in the freakiest way possible, but I can't remember exactly which character it was.
It was indeed the evil witch Mombi that shrieked, "Dorothy GAAAALLLLE!!" in Return to Oz. ;D


But shouldn't it be Sauron vs Smeagol? It was Gollum's carelessness that let Bilbo get ahold of the ring in the first place and led to Sauron's downfall. Forseeable consequence of losing an item is that it would fall into the hands of do-gooders. If Gollum had kept a tighter hold on that ring, then Smaug would have been available for Sauron to use, and the Dwarven defenses in the north would have been much weaker. Plus that whole ring-fall-into-mt-doom bit.
Yeah, but Gollum was dirt poor. What compensation could Sauron have gotten? The Baggins were well off. I don't recall if it was addressed how much treasure was left from the Dragon incident (;D), but he certainly could have sued for the estate of Bag End.

You sue the people with money. It's the same reason people always sue a company even though the situation revolved around an employee clearly acting out of line of company policy.

Oh, yeah, and Gollum was dead and unavailable for suit.

;D

Ebon_Drake
2006-02-11, 12:22 PM
It was indeed the evil witch Mombi that shrieked, "Dorothy GAAAALLLLE!!" in Return to Oz. * ;D
I thought so! And then her collection of heads all start screaming, and then her headless body starts running around and...GAH! I've said it before and I'll say it again: The horror! Parents who care about their children don't let them watch Return to Oz, even if it does enable them to recall minor trivia when reading webcomics years later. :)

Starbuck_II
2006-02-11, 12:30 PM
A fairly famous quote from one of his lawyers is "If the glove doesn't fit, you must aquit", referring to the fact that the bloody glove found on the property where the murder occurred did NOT fit O.J. *Hence the statement.

And I would recommend (though I have no binding power whatsoever on this board) that we don't debate the trial here. *That could get ugly... fast.
Technically, he tried to put the bloody skin-tight glove over a glove he had on so it wouldn't fit anyone that way. I blame the prosecuting lawyers: that should have been obvious.

But you are right, we shouldn't get into the trial here.

Witch versus Gale? Is the Witch suing the gale for dropping a house on her sister?

Is the boot offense: a version of the Wookie defense?



The first three are obvious tie in with Xykon's House (possession is 9/10 of the law) being blown up by the heroes. Also Frodo, Dorothy, and Berem were all Unlikely Heroes. But Riddle v Board of Ed.... I'm just not getting the connection.

So help a brother out! Throw me a bone over here...

Riddle wanted to become a teacher at Hogwarts, but the mean Mr. Dumbledore wouldn't let him so he sued I'm guessing. He didn't hire him because he was evil: that is prejudice against their client.

zibeck
2006-02-11, 12:48 PM
It's an intentional pun in the Wizard of Oz; Dorothy Gale gets carried on a tornado to Oz.

It should be Gale vs. Thropp. Get with the times, Rich. :-)

Godhand
2006-02-11, 12:51 PM
Had to google for the DL ref. *I never got the appeal of those books, really. *Second rate at best compared to real fantasy works that aren't franchise tie-ins...





...! *Whoa whoa whoa now, I know everyone is entitled to their own opinions but Dragonlance is not a second rate fantasy realm. *If that series has been cranking out books for over 15 years I'm pretty sure they are doing something right. *I've read almost every book in the series and I know these books are written extremely well. *Dragonlance is one many books that even has deep lessons for the readers within it so please do not call it 2nd rate.

Edit: And to anyone asking about the OJ reference, His lawyer was famous for making ryhmes like "If the glove doesnt fit, you must acquit." or some such nonsense.

Cheiromancer
2006-02-11, 01:31 PM
And to anyone asking about the OJ reference, His lawyer was famous for making ryhmes like "If the glove doesnt fit, you must acquit."

But why a giant boot instead of a glove?

Sylian
2006-02-11, 01:31 PM
More evidence that Rich knows something about Dragonlance. Maybe we'll see a kender someday. ;)

Chewbakka
2006-02-11, 01:42 PM
Isn't the Boot the OOTS's version of the Chewbakka defence?

Check it out on Wikipedia

That Does Not Make sense. Think about it, why would a wookie, an 8 foot tall wookie, be living with a bunch of 2 foot tall ewoks? Does it make sense? More importantly, why am I talking about a wookie in a court case...?

I don't know. It does not make sense.
If chewbakka was a wookie and lived with the ewoks then you must acquit/ convict

Romalar
2006-02-11, 01:55 PM
...! Whoa whoa whoa now, I know everyone is entitled to their own opinions but Dragonlance is not a second rate fantasy realm. If that series has been cranking out books for over 15 years I'm pretty sure they are doing something right. I've read almost every book in the series and I know these books are written extremely well. Dragonlance is one many books that even has deep lessons for the readers within it so please do not call it 2nd rate.
Compared to what, though? IMO, much of it's among the best you can get of the various fantasy RPG fiction around. However, comparing it to the whole fantasy genre, it just pales in comparison to anything I'd consider first-rate.

So, in the comic, why would they prefer the Witch of the East's case, and not the Witch of the West? Which was which? (Sorry about that ;) ) Is there something in the movie or books that makes one better than the other, or is this just Giant's idea of one case having set a better precedent than the other?

AmoDman
2006-02-11, 02:12 PM
...! *Whoa whoa whoa now, I know everyone is entitled to their own opinions but Dragonlance is not a second rate fantasy realm. *If that series has been cranking out books for over 15 years I'm pretty sure they are doing something right. *I've read almost every book in the series and I know these books are written extremely well. *Dragonlance is one many books that even has deep lessons for the readers within it so please do not call it 2nd rate.

Edit: *And to anyone asking about the OJ reference, His lawyer was famous for making ryhmes like "If the glove doesnt fit, you must acquit." or some such nonsense.

I shall add in my expert opinion - Dragonlance sucks. It may have some (and I further stress some) good books, but on the whole it's mostly the equivalent of fantasy junk food. You know, garbage. In fact, the majority of the fantasy markey is such, so I guess you say it's the top o' the line junk.

Personally, the only franchise books I like are a few of the FR books, but a only a precious few. Mostly Salvatore, really, and not as much his new stuff. FR is about the same quality as DL on average.

Want some excellent fantasy? Delve into Robin Hobb, Geourge R.R. Martin, R. Scott Bakker, Fritz Leiber, Neil Gaiman, Gene Wolfe, Ursula Leguin, etc.

Sylian
2006-02-11, 02:24 PM
amodman, how many of the Dragonlance books have you readed?

Ebon_Drake
2006-02-11, 02:24 PM
Compared to what, though? *IMO, much of it's among the best you can get of the various fantasy RPG fiction around. *However, comparing it to the whole fantasy genre, it just pales in comparison to anything I'd consider first-rate.

So, in the comic, why would they prefer the Witch of the East's case, and not the Witch of the West? *Which was which? *(Sorry about that *;) *) *Is there something in the movie or books that makes one better than the other, or is this just Giant's idea of one case having set a better precedent than the other?
The Witch of the East was the one crushed to death by Dorothy's house and then had her ruby slippers stolen by Dorothy, the Witch of the West was the green one with the flying monkeys who wanted the slippers for herself, also killed by Dorothy but only after kidnapping her and IIRC trying to kill her in order to get the slippers. Killing the Witch of the West could therefore probably be argued as self defence, whereas killing the Witch of the East was accidental and unprovoked.

I'm getting slightly concerned about my knowledge of the Wizard of Oz films now. I don't know quite how I'm so familiar with them.

GeekLordAragorn12
2006-02-11, 02:52 PM
FUNNY!! I laughed so hard! Thanks for the comic :)

nightfire8199
2006-02-11, 02:56 PM
sweet comic. giant boot lol :D.

rebellioussong
2006-02-11, 03:06 PM
Lawyer jokes at teh root
and a giant boot
good rhyming scheme
and some hope for the OOTS team

okay... i'll leave this to the lawyers and the bards...

Abard would make a very good lawyer (is a lawer a class?)

Steward
2006-02-11, 03:07 PM
Abard would make a very good lawyer (is a lawer a class?)

Not to my knowledge but there's a push for it to become one in this very forum.

zibeck
2006-02-11, 04:00 PM
So, in the comic, why would they prefer the Witch of the East's case, and not the Witch of the West? *Which was which? *(Sorry about that *;) *) *Is there something in the movie or books that makes one better than the other, or is this just Giant's idea of one case having set a better precedent than the other?

The Wicked Witch of the East, or Nessarose Thropp according to Wicked, was the one that Dorthy's house landed on. The Wicked Witch of the West, Elphaba Thropp, was the one that melted.

zibeck
2006-02-11, 04:02 PM
The Witch of the East was the one crushed to death by Dorothy's house and then had her ruby slippers stolen by Dorothy, the Witch of the West was the green one with the flying monkeys who wanted the slippers for herself, also killed by Dorothy but only after kidnapping her and IIRC trying to kill her in order to get the slippers. Killing the Witch of the West could therefore probably be argued as self defence, whereas killing the Witch of the East was accidental and unprovoked.

I'm getting slightly concerned about my knowledge of the Wizard of Oz films now. I don't know quite how I'm so familiar with them.

Both were accidental. Dorothy threw the water on the Witch of the West to actually save her because her robes had caught on fire, not realising that the water would melt the witch.

The Lady Auneredra
2006-02-11, 04:22 PM
In the first shots with Durkon in the truth chair, compared in size to Celia he almost looks like a baby in a high chair.

(who knows, maybe dwarven babies have beards)

That's exactly what I was wondering about. In fact, I'm surprised that you were the first one to bring it up; considering all the talk about errors (like transparency), you'd think this would be all the rage on the forums.
I think Rich was trying to portray that Durkon was a dwarf that was much to short for a human chair, but had already had Celia at a set size in the previous comics that was compatible with the chairs. So, he made shrinked Durkon.
That's what I'm inferring, anyway. Dunno if I'm right, as usual. :)

Kish
2006-02-11, 04:33 PM
Not to my knowledge but there's a push for it to become one in this very forum.
A profession, I'd think. Profession (Lawyer).

fwiffo
2006-02-11, 05:11 PM
Riddle vs Board of Education bit was amusing, but I have difficulty seeing Board of Education as the unlikely hero. Probably should've remained Potter, except that it would give away part of the joke which was using Riddle's name to obscure what that case was.

Duskrider_Moogle
2006-02-11, 05:15 PM
Pure awesome. I wonder if that was an intentional Super Mario Bros 3 reference...maybe Rodriguez will stomp Belkar with it :p

Eriol
2006-02-11, 07:31 PM
Is there a problem with Durkon's size in the comic? I'm serious: Celia looks like a giant next to him. Now he IS shorter than her, but he's not smaller too. Like look at them both in the same panel in #269 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=269). They both have about the same "head size" in that panel, and Durkon reaches to just above her chin level.

Then look in #280 (today), and he seems to be scaled down, mouth size and all. In particular in #269, they both have their mouths open in the same panel, and they seem just-about equivalent, whereas in this one, they seem DRASTICALLY different.

More graphical errors, or am I just looking too much into this? Durkon's size just FEELS wrong in this one for some reason.

Eldhrin
2006-02-11, 07:36 PM
I shall add in my expert opinion - Dragon;ance sucks. It may have ome (and I further stress some) good books, but on the whole it's mostly the equivalent of fantasy junk food. You know, garbage. In fact, the majority of the fantasy markey is such, so I guess you say it's the top o' the line junk.

Personally, the only franchise books I like are a few of the FR books, but a only a precious few. Mostly Salvatore, really, and not as much his new stuff. FR is about the same quality as DL on average.

Want some excellent fantasy? Delve into Robin Hobb, Geourge R.R. Martin, R. Scott Bakker, Fritz Leiber, Neil Gaiman, Gene Wolfe, Ursula Leguin, etc.

I agree. I devoured DragonLance Chronicles when I was little. DragonLance Legends also went down well at the time, although not as well.

Unfortunately DragonLance Tales never lived up to my expectations, and on re-reading Chronicles and Legends later on I just felt... disappointed. Further reading the introductions to the collectors' editions by the authors, it's obvious why this is the case. They were handed the setting and the characters on a platter, and just left to fill in the gaps. That is not the way to write good stories, unless you're an absolute literary genius, and even then you're probably not going to be allowed to do the really good things, because the thing exists in order to sell the DragonLance campaign setting. The rigid class boundaries for each character are painful, their roles are wince-inducingly stereotypical.

I can't read the start of Time of the Twins now without wanting to throttle Astinus and throw Crysania out of the highest convenient window. I've been introduced to good writing since then, and it's spoiled me for life.

Not that I'm saying all D&D franchise tie-in literature is this poor. I've not read it all; I'd be surprised if there aren't one or two good books in there somewhere. I just don't think any of them were written by Weis and Hickman.

ibitak84
2006-02-11, 07:59 PM
So... Everman is the guy with the green jewel stuck inside his thorax? It's a long time ago that I touched a Dragonlance book, but I would have sworn that his name was Brian, or something else starting with B.

Phil, seems to have lower Inteligence but higher Charisma then Mr Jones. That might even make him a better lawyer, since the Int check connected to a trial are probably for research etc. Those would be made before the actual holding of the trial, so he could Take 20 against fixed DCs anyway. (Unless he does it like Celia and makes it all up as he goes along.)

Kish
2006-02-11, 08:05 PM
His given name was Berem. He became known as Everman because he became immortal.

*tosses a vote on the anti-Dragonlance side of the ballot*

Edna
2006-02-11, 08:10 PM
*tosses a vote on the anti-Dragonlance side of the ballot*

And here's another vote. I tried a Dragonlance book, years ago. Never had the desire to pick up a second one.

Edna

Swordster
2006-02-11, 08:11 PM
So...interrupting the no-doubt important argument over Dragonlance.

I don't see the how the lawyers plan to cite precedence. Granted, this is an Unlikely Heroes situation, but they are not representing Xykon, they are representing the Saphire Guard. This isn't villain vs. hero, like the others. This is Saphire Guard vs. OOTS. Whatever they were going to say about the other cases, it can't be relevant to this case.

Loved the comic. "Riddle vs. Board of Education." ROFL!!!

Ilanin
2006-02-11, 08:28 PM
I don't see the how the lawyers plan to cite precedence. *Granted, this is an Unlikely Heroes situation, but they are not representing Xykon, they are representing the Saphire Guard. *This isn't villain vs. hero, like the others. *This is Saphire Guard vs. OOTS. *Whatever they were going to say about the other cases, it can't be relevant to this case.


It depends about the precedent which was set. If the judiciary has previously ruled that testimony about a villain's past is inadmissable, or admissable only in mitigation, it has a bearing on the current case. However, since Mr. Jones apparently needs to go over the case files, he may not have anything specific in mind and is just looking for anything he can find from cases which have some bearing on the current situation.

EDIT: Oh, yeah, and it's "Sapphire". Normally I ignore misspellings but the aforemetioned mineral is one of the lesser banes of my life.

And yes, I too am amused by "Riddle vs. Board of Education", and caught the reference to the landmark USSC case. Pedantically, given the location of the school in question, and its probable fee-paying nature, there would probably not be a "board of education" to file against, but what the hey.

Reptile
2006-02-11, 09:56 PM
I agree. I devoured DragonLance Chronicles when I was little. DragonLance Legends also went down well at the time, although not as well.

Unfortunately DragonLance Tales never lived up to my expectations,

...

Not that I'm saying all D&D franchise tie-in literature is this poor. I've not read it all; I'd be surprised if there aren't one or two good books in there somewhere. I just don't think any of them were written by Weis and Hickman.

I think this is a common sentiment, and is summed up nicely by this (http://rinkworks.com/bookaminute/b/weishickman.chronicles.shtml) and then this (http://rinkworks.com/bookaminute/b/weishickman.legends.shtml). :)

But this thread is for the comic, not the merits of various fantasy literature. So a few random comments:
-I agree that Durkon looks a bit small.
-The giant boot was...unexpected silliness. Somewhat agreeing with barongas here--the punch line was quite funny, but with the dramatic tension of the trial (not to mention the fight in the background) it seemed a bit out of place.
-I definitely see some reflections of the Roy/Elan interaction in Rodrigues/Jones--one is reasonably competent and generally serious and professional, and is probably wondering why they're stuck with this random goofball...
-I might have been the only reader to get every reference except Riddle v. Board.

NEO|Phyte
2006-02-11, 11:06 PM
I just now got the Riddle vs. board part.

Athanatos
2006-02-11, 11:54 PM
I agree with the Dragonlance Sucks idea, but not with the Durkon's Too Small idea. He's just farther in the distance than Celia.

Steward
2006-02-11, 11:57 PM
-I might have been the only reader to get every reference except Riddle v. Board.


I think it might be the unfair hiring policies of Hogwarts because they refused to hire a criminal Dark Lord (but they were perfectly willing to hire lesser criminal Dark wizards.) Or it might be that killing thing.

Aiani
2006-02-12, 12:44 AM
Oh man that was a good one. I loved the giant boot and of course Elans verse at the end. Once again I laughed out loud at a comic at work and made my coworkers look at me all crazy. Good stuff.

Yamara
2006-02-12, 01:01 AM
"Riddle v. Board of Education"--

Now that's L-O-L funny.

-Chris

Tariskat
2006-02-12, 01:37 AM
C'mon now guys, don't be so hard on DragonLance. Those links, Mythical Reptile, were actually really funny, and I'm an avid DL fan. The chronicles (dragons of.. *season*) weren't the hottest, but they were the first and yes they overplayed the alignments. But they are pretty good for just a "something to do" book, and I think the Tales were some of the better DL books. Where everyone meets everyone/rescues others, etc. Simple novels, but well written at least.
And, to stay partly on topic, where do you ride a boot in mario? I remember riding clouds, but I may be thinking a different system. But I've played at least one mario bros on each of the earlier systems but don't recall that...

Piedmon_Sama
2006-02-12, 03:33 AM
OK, I admit the Dragonlance books are somewhat simplistic and basic in both plotting and style. But dammit, they're effective. I remember being thirteen and just being crushed by Sturm's death. I think they're really good for kids of middle school age. Somewhat like the Potter books today, the Chronicles are easy to follow but have enough twists and turns so a young reader is challenged.

All this discussion makes me want to go back and read the original trilogy again....

Godhand
2006-02-12, 03:38 AM
Perhaps I was too hasty, Tariskat made most of the points I was trying to get across, and many of the dragonlance stories are very well written. Some, (Elf and Dwarf Nations Trilogy sets Im looking at you) were...lacking. Dragonlance was the first fantasy novel I read way back in the day so I was not amused when people said it was 2nd rate.

ANYway, the giant boot the people are taking about is from the 3rd NES mario game. Somewhere on the 5th world (I think its 5-2, dunno exactly but its scary I remember the world) you can knock an enemy out of a boot and get in it. The boot can jump on spiny enemies to hurt them AND walk on places that would normally hurt you. Pretty cool eh?

Jothki
2006-02-12, 04:15 AM
Is there a problem with Durkon's size in the comic? *I'm serious: Celia looks like a giant next to him. *Now he IS shorter than her, but he's not smaller too. *Like look at them both in the same panel in #269 (http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/GiantITP/ootscript?SK=269). *They both have about the same "head size" in that panel, and Durkon reaches to just above her chin level.

Then look in #280 (today), and he seems to be scaled down, mouth size and all. *In particular in #269, they both have their mouths open in the same panel, and they seem just-about equivalent, whereas in this one, they seem DRASTICALLY different.

More graphical errors, or am I just looking too much into this? *Durkon's size just FEELS wrong in this one for some reason.

It could be that she is just standing closer to the 'camera'. Sort of a perpective thing.

ARMOURERERIC
2006-02-12, 06:05 AM
I agree, They would be a really fun duo, prosecuting crime, composing couplets, kind of like a Law & Order: Poetic Intent.



And their 2 network spinoffs:

L&O: Iambic Pentameter

L&O: Haiku Victims Unit

ARMOURERERIC
2006-02-12, 06:09 AM
[quote author=Zeekar link=board=comics;num=1139634165;start=90#94 date=02/11/06 at 10:26:49]Dorothy's name is never mentioned in the movie; you wouldn't know that unless you've read the book. Which everyone should do. :)


/quote]

It is in the movie when it's uncut on cable, but on network it's cut out to make room for a Hostess or Dolly Madison commercial

Alfryd
2006-02-12, 11:41 AM
A bard would make a very good lawyer (is a lawer a class?)
Bards can't be Lawful.

I think Rich was trying to portray that Durkon was a dwarf that was much to short for a human chair...

It could be that she is just standing closer to the 'camera'. Sort of a perpective thing.
See, this is the problem with Stick Figures.

Give in to your anger, Rich!

L&O: Iambic Pentameter
It is in dire need of succour asking
That I am made subpoena your behind.
For if the testimony be in question?
The witness and the killer. One in mind.

L&O: Haiku Victims Unit
Alliteration
Of suspicious invention
Was fatal to all.

You may be on to something here.

Sylvius
2006-02-12, 04:54 PM
I immediately thought of the Chewbacca defense. Brilliant work, Giant.

A few years ago, I made a point of reading the really iconic D&D novels because I never had, and I missed a lot of references made to them.

I couldn't find the Gord the Rogue books, so I still haven't read those. I first read Salvatore's Dark Elf trilogy, which honestly isn't bad. The Icewind Dale trilogy followed, and it was really weak. I then tried the Dragonlance Chronicles, but I couldn't get more than about 100 pages in without giving up.

Honestly, the best D&D books I've found were the final series of Greyhawk novels by Paul Kidd. White Plume Mountain, Descent into the Depths of the Earth, and Queen of the Demonweb Pits. Those are well-written.

humanpylon
2006-02-12, 07:11 PM
not only written but really funny as well! Actually the first book when they make fun of adventuring gear almost reminds me of Order of the Stick.

infiniteviking
2006-02-12, 07:24 PM
Trial's going great.... I love the lawyers' tactics. And the giant boot! And Elan's, er, cheery helpfulness. And 'Riddle vs. Board of Education' is simply hysterical. Great comic!


Overanalysis of trials incoming :D

Frodo was commaned to destroy the ring by Elrond, the legitiment ruler of Rivendel, a nation at war with mordor, and by Gandalf, an emessary from the Gods (or as close to "gods" as anything gets in LoTR), giving him infinite jurisdiction. So far as I know, you can not sue someone for an act of war, since you're, you know, at war, nor can you sue someone for following divine will. Furthermore, one could use "Thief Vs. Lich King" (see 8-bit theatre) for precedent: the Ring corrupted and polluted whatever it touched, and thus its destruction was legally sanctioned. Furthermore, he travelled to the western lands, making him out of the Juristdiction of Middle-Earthen law, correcect?

Lol! I'd like to see what that Being of Pure Law and Good would make of this argument.

Lyc
2006-02-12, 08:51 PM
Honestly, the best D&D books I've found were the final series of Greyhawk novels by Paul Kidd. White Plume Mountain, Descent into the Depths of the Earth, and Queen of the Demonweb Pits. Those are well-written.

Hmm, so what do you think the Justicar would do at the trial? A "Big Ass Sword"(tm) weilded by a bald manaic tends to trump clever legal strategies such as 'the boot'. And Escella would put Thog to shame in the sugar rush department. ;D

As for peoples preferences on books, it all boild down to personal preference really. For example I like DL chronicles and legends, but the Belgariad and Earthsea series was like having a root canal.

But here, there should only be two books to worry about - "Dungeon crawling fools" and "Origin of the PC's".

ElfLad
2006-02-12, 09:22 PM
This is the first lawyer strip that really "clicked" with me. The others were funny, but this inspired a sense of humor that reached me deeply. Like Thog's first "Thog likes puppies."

Vengeful_Hand
2006-02-12, 10:20 PM
I love everyone catches the Harry Potter reference of Riddle v. Board of Education, but not the play on words with the famous Brown v. Board of Education that, no doubt, inspired it's name...
People caught it, I'm sure. The Riddle part isn't funny unless you have the Brown vs Board reference in the back of your mind. That was most of why I thought it was funny. I mean, when you think about it, most of the school board (between Lucius and his bullying) works for Voldemort, so why would he be against them? ;)

nightfire8199
2006-02-12, 10:48 PM
Black vs board you mean

Arturo
2006-02-13, 12:33 AM
I agree, They would be a really fun duo, prosecuting crime, composing couplets, kind of like a Law & Order: Poetic Intent.




Law & Order: Poetic Justice

humanpylon
2006-02-13, 01:09 AM
Law & Order: Poetic Justice

Oh god! *throws rotten fruit at Arturo*

I wish I'd come up with that!

Albion
2006-02-13, 07:46 AM
It could be that she is just standing closer to the 'camera'. Sort of a perpective thing.

Yes, obviously. It adds to an appearance reminiscent of any TV law show, with the "lawperson" ;D close to the camera. Like Matlock or just about any lawyer. I think that's the idea and I would be surprised to find out that I was far from the truth.

(Still working to get some of the jokes...)

Adeptus
2006-02-13, 08:02 AM
...! Whoa whoa whoa now, I know everyone is entitled to their own opinions but Dragonlance is not a second rate fantasy realm. If that series has been cranking out books for over 15 years I'm pretty sure they are doing something right. I've read almost every book in the series and I know these books are written extremely well. Dragonlance is one many books that even has deep lessons for the readers within it so please do not call it 2nd rate.



Ugh... I'd say 2nd rate is pretty high praise to any AD&D book, and others of their ilk (like Warhammer, or Battletech books).

Dragonlance is one of those that really doesn't impress. Especially the endless sequels. But as they say, to each their own.

carabaldo
2006-02-13, 09:00 AM
Bards can't be Lawful.


Neither lawyers

IRSWalker
2006-02-13, 09:15 AM
Hmmm, could Sauron not bring court proceedings against Isildur, for theft, or indeed robbery?

Alfryd
2006-02-13, 09:26 AM
...Earthsea series was like having a root canal.
I can conceive no adequate response to this comment, so I'll settle for utter stupefaction.

Neither lawyers [are lawful]
Lawful = organised, which Lawyers are.

Bozidar
2006-02-13, 10:06 AM
Hmmm, could Sauron not bring court proceedings against Isildur, for theft, or indeed robbery?Nah, it was a time of war.

Steward
2006-02-13, 10:12 AM
Thou canst conserve rye etiquette cheese to this flea, so Illiad nettle while for utter blingeditywhoop.
Lawful = organised, which Lawyers are.

I agree.

late
2006-02-13, 10:30 AM
Can anybody shed light on a phrase I just don't understand?

The lawyer (not the man in the very expensive suit) comments on the giant boot "...I think it's due.". What does that mean?

And perhaps a pointer to the origin of the cited files
Takhisis vs. Everman, Riddle vs. Board of Education and Witch vs. Gale?


thanx

drw4d
2006-02-13, 10:37 AM
Can anybody shed light on a phrase I just don't understand?

The lawyer (not the man in the very expensive suit) comments on the giant boot "...I think it's due.". What does that mean?

And perhaps a pointer to the origin of the cited files
Takhisis vs. Everman, Riddle vs. Board of Education and Witch vs. Gale?


thanx


Of these 3, Witch vs. Gale is the only one I know off hand. This is the Wizard of Oz. Dorothy's last name was Gale, so it's a referance to Dorothy killing the Wicked Witch of the East (?) when the house fell on her.

Steward
2006-02-13, 10:59 AM
Can anybody shed light on a phrase I just don't understand?

The lawyer (not the man in the very expensive suit) comments on the giant boot "...I think it's due.". What does that mean?


Mr. Rodriguez says that the boot will never ever fail. Mr. Jones says that the boot is irrelevent to the current trial and that 'it's due' (to fail).

Silverblaze
2006-02-13, 11:38 AM
Can anybody shed light on a phrase I just don't understand?

The lawyer (not the man in the very expensive suit) comments on the giant boot "...I think it's due.". What does that mean?

And perhaps a pointer to the origin of the cited files
Takhisis vs. Everman, Riddle vs. Board of Education and Witch vs. Gale?


thanx


The name Berem Everman comes from the book Dragons of Autumn Twilight: Volume 1 of the DragonLance Chronicles by Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman. Takhisis is the Queen of Darkness (an evil Godess) and he played a key part in messing up her plans of Krynn (world) domination.

As for Riddle vs Board of Edu - First of all Rich is once again messing with Harry Potter - Riddle aka Voldemort versus Hogwarts School; the further point on this is an underhanded reference to Brown vs Board of Edu - a crucial case in the history of afroamericans - see http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_versus_board_of_education

Godhand
2006-02-13, 12:07 PM
The amusing thing about Takhisis vs. Everman is Takhisis is Dragonlance's version of Tiamat. Takhisis is a 5 headed dragon with each head being a different color to represent a different type of evil dragon (color coded for your convenience I know I know). Tiamat is, of course, Tiamat the choas beast from ancient ?Babylonian? myth. Tiamat's avatar was that of a five headed serpent.

And now you know. (and knowing is half the battle)

*steps off soap box*

Zeekar
2006-02-13, 12:26 PM
Of these 3, Witch vs. Gale is the only one I know off hand. This is the Wizard of Oz. Dorothy's last name was Gale, so it's a referance to Dorothy killing the Wicked Witch of the East (?) when the house fell on her.

Actually, there are apparently separate cases for each of the Wicked Witches, which is why Mr. Jones specified that he would be willing to cite East, but not West.

But yes, it was East who Dorothly smooshed with the house. West was the one chasing her throughout the book/movie. The good witch who helped them out in Munchkinland was Glinda, the Good Witch of the North; based on this trio, one might assume that Glinda has a sister Good Witch of the South.

Totally OT: I don't consider Wicked to be informative here; it has very little to do with the original other than trying, IME vainly, to make it all seem more plausible. It gave the Witch a motivation beyond just being Evil, and made Oz more three-dimensional, but in the process I feel it destroyed almost everything that made the original so great.

Of course, I'm also the one who referred to Dragonlance as "second-rate", so what do I know? ;)

Max_Sinister
2006-02-13, 12:54 PM
In the version of the book I read, Dorothy meets at first in Munchkinland the good witch of the North, who is not identical to Glinda, the good witch of the South.

Douglas
2006-02-13, 01:57 PM
I wonder what Elan will say when he gets called to testify. Something like this maybe?:

Celia: Did you know what the gate was?
*Elan rolls bardic knowledge and gets a nat 20*
Elan: Yeah, I learned all about the gates a while back, swapping tales with a deserter from the Holey Brotherhood...

20+bard level (12)+int mod (-1 or -2)+Knowledge(history) synergy(+2) = 32 or 33, enough for "Extremely obscure, known by very few, possibly forgotten by most who once knew it, possibly known only by those who don’t understand the significance of the knowledge", which seems to describe knowledge of the Gates and the Snarl pretty well.

Edna
2006-02-13, 02:11 PM
But yes, it was East who Dorothly smooshed with the house. West was the one chasing her throughout the book/movie. The good witch who helped them out in Munchkinland was Glinda, the Good Witch of the North; based on this trio, one might assume that Glinda has a sister Good Witch of the South.

In the movie, Glinda is the Good Witch of the North, and there is no mention of her southern counterpart. In the original book, Glinda is the Good Witch of the South, and I'm not sure what the name of the Good Witch of the North was. Oh, and Dorothy's slippers were silver in the book.

Edna

Devoured_Dude
2006-02-13, 02:17 PM
Law & Order: Poetic Justice

Next year's summer replacement, to be cancelled after only two episodes because Elan keeps calling the lawyer "Tubbs"

Melnor
2006-02-13, 02:40 PM
Haha, oh yeah, Giant! Everybody loves the idiotic rhyming bard! Haha, yeah, I actually really do...
This just came to me, as I've never said it before: amazing job on coming up with the characters! The OoTS is full of fully different personalities, and that's what makes the story great!

Theodoxus
2006-02-13, 03:00 PM
As for peoples preferences on books, it all boild down to personal preference really. For example I like DL chronicles and legends, but the Belgariad and Earthsea series was like having a root canal.


At first I was kinda miffed by that statement, but I thought about it for a bit, and I think it comes down to when you first encountered the books, what age you were, how much previous reading you'd done in the genre, etc.

My first 'real' Fantasy books were the Earthsea trilogy, I was 9, so it was 1980, I was in the 4th grade, and the image of Ged being all powerful yet kindly has always stuck with me. In 7th grade, I was introduced to the Thomas Covenant series, and that confused me, but I loved the giants, so I kept at it. I never understood until I reread them in my late 20s why Covenant was so reluctant to use his power.

I didn't read the Belgariad until after I'd read the Mallorian - so it was fun watching Garion grow up and having all the relationships I'd seen already mature start from the beginning. But then, I love Eddings writings - have all their books... their humor (not sure if it's David or Leighs or both) matches mine perfectly - which always makes for enjoyable reading.

Another series of 'children' fantasy literature is John Christopher - "The White Mountain" series and the "Sword of the Spirits" which I both read as a young teenager.. Both are futuristic yet medieval in feel, and while would be considered 'light' for an adult, left another impact on me of human struggle for independance and recognition.

In my own personal experience, I think reading childrens literature as a child, and then rereading it as an adult has a far greater inpact than reading it just as an adult. I've read a number of pieces of fantasy, both childrens and adult in my adult life and some was rather difficult to really get into - but I'm positive that in my youth I would of devoured it readily.

I'm glad I read LotR in my youth - tackling it now is much more difficult.

Anyway, that's my interpretation of why some people like some books and others don't... of course, theres always the whole 'just plan don't like it' too... fortunately there are more books available than we'd ever be able to read :)

Theo

Supagoof
2006-02-13, 03:28 PM
A message board full of rhymes?
That really is sublime.
Riddle vs. Board of Education,
Has brought much celebration.
Elan's help with the boot.
All the readers go w00t!
So let's give three cheers to Rich,
For giving us everything from Durkon to the evil Lich,
So get your food and wine to gather round,
And enjoy some Oots from the Giant in the Playground. ;D

(Sorry to everyone, my best rhyming is still sub par.)

late
2006-02-13, 05:07 PM
Thank you all for your explanations of the second look jokes which are hidden within this comic. I wonder how much of those I would have missed the 279 strips ago... :(

Especially the east/west witches passed my mind without any idea what Rich meant.

Maybe I should start an "OotS for dummys" series....

rwald
2006-02-13, 05:28 PM
Black vs board you mean

I'm not sure if this was your intent, but "Black v. Board of Education" would have been an even better pun, since Sirius Black actually did have problems with the mainstream Ministries in the HP universe.

The_Weirdo
2006-02-13, 05:30 PM
True, but his situation didn't involve any unlikely heroes...

Daerthax
2006-02-13, 05:30 PM
I'm not sure if this was your intent, but "Black v. Board of Education" would have been an even better pun, since Sirius Black actually did have problems with the mainstream Ministries in the HP universe.

I think we just have to go back a little ways in the strip to see the Giant's views on ol' Harry Potter.

spectralphoenix
2006-02-13, 06:38 PM
Awesome comic.

I don't suppose someone could clue me in on the "Chewbacca Defense" that's been mentioned?

Eriol
2006-02-13, 07:03 PM
Awesome comic.

I don't suppose someone could clue me in on the "Chewbacca Defense" that's been mentioned?
Chewbacca Defense (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chewbacca_Defense) from Wiki.

zibeck
2006-02-13, 07:07 PM
Of course, I'm also the one who referred to Dragonlance as "second-rate", so what do I know? *;)

Indeed.

Nitrof
2006-02-13, 07:18 PM
real funny.. gotta get my sis to rad the LOTR books.. she missed the reference entirely. when I asked, astonished, she said ' oh yeah sauron, isn't that that guy in the LOTR books?" I just don't know how i'll be able to force her to read it...

Sylvius
2006-02-13, 07:20 PM
At first I was kinda miffed by that statement, but I thought about it for a bit, and I think it comes down to when you first encountered the books, what age you were, how much previous reading you'd done in the genre, etc.

This is an excellent observation.

My girlfriend read Eddings's Belgariad when she was younger, and liked it very much. I never had, so I read her copies just last year. To me, they're very paint-by-numbers fantasy, and largely uninteresting. Plus, my earlier experience with Tad Williams made me despise reluctant heroes.

Similiarly, when I was younger, I loved Feist's Riftwar saga, but when I recommended it to my girlfriend she gave up after Magician: Apprentice on the grounds that it was dull.

As such, we now aren't terribly receptive to suggestions from each other when they're about books the other read years earlier. She liked Xanth - I'll probably never read it. I liked Melanie Rawn's Dragon Prince trilogy - she'll probably never read it.

Duraska
2006-02-13, 08:30 PM
This is an excellent observation.

My girlfriend read Eddings's Belgariad when she was younger, and liked it very much. I never had, so I read her copies just last year. To me, they're very paint-by-numbers fantasy, and largely uninteresting. Plus, my earlier experience with Tad Williams made me despise reluctant heroes.

Similiarly, when I was younger, I loved Feist's Riftwar saga, but when I recommended it to my girlfriend she gave up after Magician: Apprentice on the grounds that it was dull.

As such, we now aren't terribly receptive to suggestions from each other when they're about books the other read years earlier. She liked Xanth - I'll probably never read it. I liked Melanie Rawn's Dragon Prince trilogy - she'll probably never read it.

I can relate to this. When I was younger, I loved playing the old Sierra adventure game "Quest for Glory" (known as Hero Quest for a while). I thought those games were so incredibly detailed and fun (I still do).

Looking back, however, I'm not so sure that I would be quite as receptive now if I encountered a fantasy world were there was a Baron Stephan who ruled over a town called Spielburg. :)

That entire series is great, and I highly recommend it... that is, if you can find it online for less than $200 and actually get it to run on XP....

The Giant
2006-02-13, 09:08 PM
Comic ETA: Less than 1 hour

theKOT
2006-02-13, 09:24 PM
Comic ETA: Less than 1 hour
But that's assuming a favorable tailwind, right? Also, isn't there a snow problem up in NY? I wonder how that might affect the ETA.... ;)
Heh, Well, thanks for letting us know Giant!

evileeyore
2006-02-13, 09:46 PM
can relate to this. *When I was younger, I loved playing the old Sierra adventure game "Quest for Glory" (known as Hero Quest for a while). *I thought those games were so incredibly detailed and fun (I still do)
I prefer Peasant's Quest...

"You don't look like a peasant..."
"You don't smell like a peasant..."
"Your not on fire like a peasant..."

theKOT
2006-02-13, 09:50 PM
I prefer Peasant's Quest...

Gotta love that 8 bit glory. And that internal PC stereo sound. That little dinging sound when I score some points just lights up my day.....

Gralamin
2006-02-13, 09:59 PM
ah old video games and ones made to look old those things rock.