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TGWG
2007-12-06, 02:25 PM
hi, me again. Now me and my friend a having a dispute about the rules concerning spring attack. I say that any movement you make during the spring attack doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity from the person you attack. he says that it doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity if you don't move in a certain way (such as encircling them) and if you do you need make tumble checks. Grammaticaly I'm right but he has to make sure.

Quietus
2007-12-06, 02:38 PM
You're correct. The text of Spring Attack clearly states that :


When using the attack action with a melee weapon, you can move both before and after the attack, provided that your total distance moved is not greater than your speed. Moving in this way does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender you attack, though it might provoke attacks of opportunity from other creatures, if appropriate. You canít use this feat if you are wearing heavy armor.

Emphasis mine. You don't have to move in a particular way to spring attack freely.

Person_Man
2007-12-06, 02:38 PM
When using the attack action with a melee weapon, you can move both before and after the attack, provided that your total distance moved is not greater than your speed. Moving in this way does not provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender you attack, though it might provoke attacks of opportunity from other creatures, if appropriate. You canít use this feat if you are wearing heavy armor. You must move at least 5 feet both before and after you make your attack in order to utilize the benefits of Spring Attack.

I think its pretty strait forward. As long as you move at least 5 feet before and after your attack, you don't provoke an AoO from your target.

Keld Denar
2007-12-06, 02:59 PM
How does it work if your target changes position mid spring? From an example that I posted in my Dread Wraith thread:

Player A is a 2hand power attacking fighter with ghost touch
Player B is a wizard with a wand of Benign Transposition
Player C doesn't know it, but he's about to get sprung attack by a Dread Wraith

So, player B, on her initiative, readies an action to use her wand of BT to swap the DWs target with Player A when the DW attacks.

Player A readies an attack action declaring that he may wish to take a 5' step as part of his action if the Dread Wraith comes within reach of his attack or attack+5' step. (legal because he hadn't moved prior to the ready.

Dread Wraith pops out of the ground, moves toward Player C with the intent of a spring attacking incorporial touch with 10' reach (Mmmmm, life essence)

B's readied action goes off, she uses her wand and swaps A and C.

A's readied action goes off, and he 5' steps and power attacks the DW

Dread Wraiths turn again. His origional target that he was spring attacking is now out of reach. Can he attack A? When he moves away from A as part of the rest of his spring attack, does he provoke from A? Can he spontaneously redirect his target to A since A is where his former target was? Should he, as an intelligent creature, persue C to try to make the touch before retreating underground? How would this work?

Stupid rules and turn based combat and grumble grumble grumble.

Theli
2007-12-06, 03:14 PM
Incidentally, you have to use a move action in conjunction with a standard (attack) action to use spring attack, right?

Or do you get movement equal to your speed as part of the standard (attack) action?

I've always thought the former, but I could be wrong, rereading the feat text. And if you can do a move action and then follow up with another spring attack movement, it could make the feat more useful.

tyckspoon
2007-12-06, 04:41 PM
Incidentally, you have to use a move action in conjunction with a standard (attack) action to use spring attack, right?

Or do you get movement equal to your speed as part of the standard (attack) action?

I've always thought the former, but I could be wrong, rereading the feat text. And if you can do a move action and then follow up with another spring attack movement, it could make the feat more useful.

It could be more cleanly worded, yes.. I'm fairly certain it's the first one. The attack action itself does not provide for movement; in order to use Spring Attack, you have to take a move action in order to be moving and may then use the feat to interrupt your own action with another action instead of being forced to end the move action entirely before you can make the attack action.

zippy
2007-12-06, 04:46 PM
On a related note, since you do not incite AoOs from the Spring Attack target, Acrobatic Strike does nothing for a Spring Attack monkey, right? This feat grants +4 to hit against any opponent where you tumble to avoid an AoO, even if you choose to tumble past him. Since there's no AoO possible, the +4 never kicks in.

Is this correct?

Vael Nir
2007-12-06, 08:22 PM
I think its pretty strait forward. As long as you move at least 5 feet before and after your attack, you don't provoke an AoO from your target.



When using the attack action with a melee weapon, you can move both before and after the attack, provided that your total distance moved is not greater than your speed.


As far as I see it, you don't have to move afterwards.

tyckspoon
2007-12-06, 08:29 PM
As far as I see it, you don't have to move afterwards.

There's one more line to the feat:

You must move at least 5 feet both before and after you make your attack in order to utilize the benefits of Spring Attack.

Vael Nir
2007-12-07, 06:35 PM
There's one more line to the feat:

Aye, but you don't necessarily need to move away from your opponent... :-)