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olelia
2007-12-21, 12:29 AM
You must have a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement (such as difficult terrain or obstacles). Hereís what it means to have a clear path. First, you must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent. (If this space is occupied or otherwise blocked, you canít charge.) Second, if any line from your starting space to the ending space passes through a square that blocks movement, slows movement, or contains a creature (even an ally), you canít charge. (Helpless creatures donít stop a charge.)

Soo according to this you can't charge through a friendly square. But...


Overrun

You can attempt an overrun as a standard action taken during your move. (In general, you cannot take a standard action during a move; this is an exception.) With an overrun, you attempt to plow past or over your opponent (and move through his square) as you move. You can only overrun an opponent who is one size category larger than you, the same size, or smaller. You can make only one overrun attempt per round.

If youíre attempting to overrun an opponent, follow these steps.
Step 1

Attack of Opportunity. Since you begin the overrun by moving into the defenderís space, you provoke an attack of opportunity from the defender.
Step 2

Opponent Avoids? The defender has the option to simply avoid you. If he avoids you, he doesnít suffer any ill effect and you may keep moving (You can always move through a square occupied by someone who lets you by.) The overrun attempt doesnít count against your actions this round (except for any movement required to enter the opponentís square). If your opponent doesnít avoid you, move to Step 3.


With overrun couldn't you just go through your allies squares because they just opt to avoid you?

Inyssius Tor
2007-12-21, 12:32 AM
Yes, you could do that. But it takes a standard action, and charging is a full-round action, so you can't do it while charging. You also can't double-move or run while doing so, because that would also be a full-round action.

... so you'd be way, way better off just double-moving or running through their square.

Frosty
2007-12-21, 11:43 AM
Or, you can buy the boots of the battle-charger from MiC, and be able to charge through friendlies twice a day (and it's a standard action to boot) and all for 1500 gold.

olelia
2007-12-22, 05:03 PM
Ok...this is strange..Is there two types of 3.5 players handbooks?

I have two different ones in front of me and each one says something different about overun.


You can attempt an overrun as a standard action taken during your move, or as part of a charge. (In general you cannot take a standard action during a move; this is an exeption...

snippet from lets just say 3.5 Players handbook A

From the other...


You can attempt an overrun as a standard action taken during your move. (In general, you cannot take a standard action during a move; this is an exception)...

Is there a way to tell which one is right? :smalleek:

Iku Rex
2007-12-22, 05:33 PM
Errata: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/er/20040125a .


Overrun
Player's Handbook, page 148
It’s not possible to overrun as part of a charge.
Delete “or as part of a charge” from this paragraph.

Aquillion
2007-12-22, 06:06 PM
However, if your allies have a way to render themselves temporarily helpless, you can use that to charge past them... which is sort of silly.

Bag_of_Holding
2007-12-22, 08:39 PM
However, if your allies have a way to render themselves temporarily helpless, you can use that to charge past them... which is sort of silly.

They be chargin'!! Get yerself a sap and hit yerself silly! :smallbiggrin:

Curmudgeon
2007-12-23, 01:01 AM
You can use Tumble during a charge, if you've got enough skill. Land movement is "normal movement", as confirmed in Rules Compendium.

Magnor Criol
2007-12-23, 01:54 AM
I'm clearly missing or forgetting something here, since no one else has commented about this, but it seems to me like the answer lies in the quoted lines above somewhat clearly.

The line in the bit about overrun states:

(You can always move through a square occupied by someone who lets you by.)

Which, to me, is indicated by the parentheses and the verb "move" (versus using "overrun") as a general statement clarifying overall rules. In other words, this is stating or re-stating a rule that applies in general to combat, not just to overrun.

Which in turn means that "you can always move through," including when you're charging, a square if the occupant lets you do so. Why can your allies simply not declare that they're letting you by?

Though the bit in the charge rules states that you must clear a path, and occupied squares count against that, it also says that helpless creatures don't block a charge. Why wouldn't they? Because if they're helpless, they can't do anything to stop you as you run by them. So it seems logical that the allies could simply not do anything to stop you as you went by, in the same fashion. (And it similarly doesn't seem like they'd need to become helpless to do so.)

Shhalahr Windrider
2007-12-23, 08:51 AM
Though the bit in the charge rules states that you must clear a path, and occupied squares count against that, it also says that helpless creatures don't block a charge. Why wouldn't they? Because if they're helpless, they can't do anything to stop you as you run by them. So it seems logical that the allies could simply not do anything to stop you as you went by, in the same fashion. (And it similarly doesn't seem like they'd need to become helpless to do so.)
Yes, and a helpless character that could be smack in the middle of your path and totally unable to move—making the character doing the charging do all the work to get around him or her—would certainly be a bigger obstacle than a friend that can actively move out of the way to let you by.

Seems to me to be one of those "not coordinated in the slightest" places in the rules to me.

Kiirseva
2007-12-23, 10:48 AM
Charging through Friendly's (http://www.friendlys.com)?!

Renegade Paladin
2007-12-23, 11:01 AM
There's a teamwork benefit that allows charging through allies' squares. I forget what book it's in; I only know this because one of the groups I run a campaign for wanted to take it, and I had the book handed to me while it was open to read it; I didn't look at the cover.

Shhalahr Windrider
2007-12-23, 02:04 PM
There's a teamwork benefit that allows charging through allies' squares.
I don't think Teamwork Benefits are in any books other than DMG2 and PH2.

In any case, the Teamwork Benefit under discussion is Crowded Charge, which appears on page 159 of PH2.

Renegade Paladin
2007-12-23, 02:25 PM
I don't think Teamwork Benefits are in any books other than DMG2 and PH2.

In any case, the Teamwork Benefit under discussion is Crowded Charge, which appears on page 159 of PH2.
Au contraire; they appear in Dungeonscape as well. :smalltongue: