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View Full Version : Maximized Prismatic Spray...?

A.Sondergaard
2007-12-28, 09:07 PM
Say, using Sudden Maximize, what would happen if someone maximized a Prismatic Spray? Would the "variable, numeric" die roll to determine effect somehow be maximized into two violet rays? (being the highest on the die roll ignoring repeated 8s)

Nebo_
2007-12-28, 09:31 PM
I thought about this a while ago and I came to the conclusion that it breaks D&D with an infinite loop.

Azerian Kelimon
2007-12-28, 09:43 PM
Or makes you Pun-Pun.

Saph
2007-12-28, 09:52 PM
I thought about this a while ago and I came to the conclusion that it breaks D&D with an infinite loop.

Sounds right. You roll one 8, which means 'struck by two rays' and have to roll twice more. Each of those results is also an 8, which you have to reroll. You never stop rolling 8s and never get two colours, causing an infinite loop that takes place in a finite amount of time (the six second round duration). I haven't done enough high-level maths to figure out what ought to happen next. Probably either the spell fizzles, or the universe ceases to exist.

- Saph

ShneekeyTheLost
2007-12-28, 09:55 PM
Maximize would not maximize the number to see which ray hit a person, but maximize the numerical variable for the effect. In other words,the only way this would help would be if you rolled up a Green spray, and he makes his Fort save. In this case, he would take the maximized 6 con damage.

Edit: It would also max out the 2d4 rounds of blindness to a flat 8 rounds

Idea Man
2007-12-28, 09:58 PM
The variable is not the result, it determines the result. Maximize would top out any variable results the spell produces. Since it already does that, it has no effect (except for the successful poison save).

I can see how, RAW, you could read it the other way, though.

Kurald Galain
2007-12-28, 10:43 PM
I'd say the obvious result is that the target gets hit by every ray. Since there's only seven of those to begin with, I don't see how that could be so problematic.

Demented
2007-12-29, 02:21 AM
Sounds right. You roll one 8, which means 'struck by two rays' and have to roll twice more. Each of those results is also an 8, which you have to reroll. You never stop rolling 8s and never get two colours, causing an infinite loop that takes place in a finite amount of time (the six second round duration). I haven't done enough high-level maths to figure out what ought to happen next. Probably either the spell fizzles, or the universe ceases to exist.

- Saph

It says you ignore subsequent 8's from the rerolls. Ergo, the spell does nothing. Or, you could pull out the high-level maths, which takes that infinite loop and concludes it, instantly. Which again results in the spell doing nothing, since it can't do anything besides reroll.

merrja666
2007-12-29, 04:55 AM
I would say that you get an infinite amount of rays, and so therefore everything in the Plane you are on gets Planeshifted, and the Plane ceases to exist.

Illiterate Scribe
2007-12-29, 07:26 AM
What about empowered prismatic sprays? Do they end the game universe with 'error:function cannot map to output' if you get six or more?

Kurald Galain
2007-12-29, 07:34 AM
What about empowered prismatic sprays? Do they end the game universe with 'error:function cannot map to output' if you get six or more?

For an empowered spray, if you roll a six, it counts as six and three, which is two rays. If you roll an eight, that counts as a four and a reroll. Easy as pi.

Ne0
2007-12-29, 07:47 AM
MAXIMIZE SPELL [METAMAGIC]
Benefit: All variable, numeric effects of a spell modified by this feat are maximized.

Therefore, like Idea Man said, it doesn't affect the 1d8 roll. It isn't the effect itself, but determines the effect. So Maximizing this spell is rather unuseful.

Saph
2007-12-29, 07:49 AM
It says you ignore subsequent 8's from the rerolls. Ergo, the spell does nothing.

But it also says that if you roll an 8, the target's struck by two rays. So how many hit - two, or none?

- Saph

Kurald Galain
2007-12-29, 08:04 AM
But it also says that if you roll an 8, the target's struck by two rays. So how many hit - two, or none?

If you go by that interpretation, then it follows that you are hit by exactly two rays, that cancel each other out for some reason and don't actually do anything to you. If you roll an infinite amount of 8's, the target is still struck by exactly two rays (because it doesn't say "hit by an additional ray").

That said, I prefer the "maximize = all rays" interpretation.

Saph
2007-12-29, 08:09 AM
That said, I prefer the "maximize = all rays" interpretation.

It is a lot cooler, if only for the looks on everyone else's faces when you say "Now you have to roll seven saving throws."

- Saph

UserClone
2007-12-29, 09:18 AM
As previously stated, Maximize and Empower do nothing to the random roll to determine which rays hit, as that roll is not the effect.