PDA

View Full Version : Skirmish on a touch spell like hold person



Charlie Kemek
2008-02-16, 02:09 PM
as the title page, according to skirmish, you gain the damage when you attack after moving 10 ft in the same round. so if you had a high level caster that multi-classed into scout, and took the spell that allows you to move and cast a spell at the same time, basically could you cast hold person and still get skirmish damage?

UglyPanda
2008-02-16, 02:21 PM
If skirmish works anything like sneak attack, then no. Hold person has a touch range, but it is not a touch attack. You can only apply precision damage on things which require attack rolls. You can apply precision damage on rays, though.

Yakk
2008-02-16, 02:24 PM
I googled for the text of skirmish, and got:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fc/20070806a
(which contains a +52 reflex save CR 18 opponent!)


Skirmish (Ex) Athor relies on mobility to deal extra damage and improve his defense. He deals an extra 2d6 points of damage on all attacks he makes during any round in which he moves at least 10 feet away from where he was at the start of his turn. The extra damage applies only to attacks made after Athor has moved at least 10 feet. The skirmish ability cannot be used while mounted. The extra damage applies only against living creatures that have a discernible anatomy. Undead, constructs, oozes, plants, incorporeal creatures, and creatures immune to extra damage from critical hits are not vulnerable to this additional damage. Athor must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. Athor can apply this extra damage to ranged attacks made while skirmishing, but only if the target is within 30 feet. Additionally, Athor gains a +2 competence bonus to Armor Class during any round in which he moves at least 10 feet. The bonus applies as soon as the scout has moved 10 feet, and lasts until the start of his next turn.

It doesn't say "deals damage", but rather "attacks". So yes, spell attacks deal skirmish damage. Probably negative energy, based off the rules for spells that deal sneak attack damage.

RTGoodman
2008-02-16, 02:36 PM
It doesn't say "deals damage", but rather "attacks". So yes, spell attacks deal skirmish damage. Probably negative energy, based off the rules for spells that deal sneak attack damage.

I think the keyword is "attacks." UglyPanda is right, as far as I remember from similar rulings - it only applies if you actually have to make an attack roll.

Hold person requires no attack roll (and, also, isn't a touch spell), so no skirmish damage. But on, say, acid splash, it would work.

Worira
2008-02-16, 02:40 PM
But what about, say, irresistable dance?

KillianHawkeye
2008-02-16, 03:09 PM
Casting a spell isn't the same as making an attack, regardless of what effect the spell has. Certain spells are considered "weaponlike", and qualify for extra damage from Sneak Attack/Sudden Strike/Skirmish/etc., but in order to qualify they need to be spells that require an attack roll (such as rays).

I don't have my books handy, but I believe the spell also has to deal damage in order to be considered "weaponlike" (since dealing damage is a weapon's only purpose), so that would rule out irresistable dance. A touch spell that dealt damage (such as shocking grasp) would be fair game, though.

Draz74
2008-02-16, 03:18 PM
I don't have my books handy, but I believe the spell also has to deal damage in order to be considered "weaponlike" (since dealing damage is a weapon's only purpose), so that would rule out irresistable dance. A touch spell that dealt damage (such as shocking grasp) would be fair game, though.

I believe this is correct. Damage spells, e.g. Shocking Grasp or Vampiric Touch, should work. Even ability damage spells should work (not that Shivering Touch really needs the help). But spells that don't do damage ... not so much.

Mewtarthio
2008-02-16, 03:53 PM
Remember that energy drain and ability damage spells add SA dice as negative energy damage. I'd hope you'd notice something wrong with a Rogue dealing 10d6 negative levels through a wand of enervation on your own, but it still needs to be said.

milo_is
2008-02-16, 06:02 PM
Remember that energy drain and ability damage spells add SA dice as negative energy damage. I'd hope you'd notice something wrong with a Rogue dealing 10d6 negative levels through a wand of enervation on your own, but it still needs to be said.

No you will do Negative energy dgm not extra levels. So you do the 1d4 neg levels and 10D6 if negative energy. page 86 Complete Arcane. However if you Crit on the spell you'll do 2d4 neg levels Also on page 86

Ps They use the spell Enervation as the example.

Swooper
2008-02-16, 07:50 PM
No you will do Negative energy dgm not extra levels. So you do the 1d4 neg levels and 10D6 if negative energy. page 86 Complete Arcane. However if you Crit on the spell you'll do 2d4 neg levels Also on page 86

Ps They use the spell Enervation as the example.
That's precisely what he said...