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sheepofoblivion
2008-03-23, 12:37 PM
I was thinking of making a class which was based off of The assassins in the game Assassin's Creed

I have a few questions, and after they get answered, I'll do my best to make the class!

Should it be a base class of prestige? (does it seem like something that someone could jump into, or would they need to be a higher level to be able to pull off all those cool stunts Altair is capable of)

What are some feats that are essential for this kind of class?

Should the free run/par cour thing be a take 10 for jump checks? or a bonus? (I was sort of thinking that it would progress as they leveled, and they would get better and better bonuses as they leveled) Or should it be like the Acrobatic charge ability of the duelist (I think it's duelist...)

What should I classify the hidden blade as? Should it just be a coup de grace? or Should it be like the death attack of an assassin (see DM's Guide)

More questions may pop up, and I'll add them here!

Peace be with you!
http://www.dejavurl.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/assassins_creed.JPG

Shinton
2008-03-23, 01:01 PM
hidden blade:
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Hidden_Blade_(DnD_Equipment)

Hashshashin -
Altairs group of assassins

http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Hashshashin_%28DnD_Class%29

draw ideas from that... or use it completely

Though, I don't really like that they use intelligence... they seem more dextrous.

I also think that hidden blade use should be like assassins death attack... but somehow better. Maybe what they say "sneak attack + 20 + confirm" is instant kill.

TheLogman
2008-03-23, 01:13 PM
I'd go with a Rogue-Type Prestige Class, with the requirements being skill-based, balance, Acrobatics, stuff like that. Although it might be difficult, perhaps instead of advancing Sneak Attack Dice, it allows fun little tricks while moving, perhaps to the point of Running along and up walls near the end. Perhaps this could be done with skill tricks, but I have no clue about those.

Perhaps a Death Attack, but that probably isn't necessary. I know the first reaction is to go the assassin in the DMG, but in this case, Altair is really nothing like the DMG assassin.

Ya, like a rogue, lots a skills, with class abilities that enhance movement/Skill Tricks. Maybe slow Sneak Attack progression, but I will leave that to you.

sheepofoblivion
2008-03-23, 01:35 PM
(if it is a prestige class) maybe monks would be a good starting class... I looked at the wiki prestige, there are a few ok things, but I want to make my own, also change a few things (like the int --> dexterity instead) If we combined the skills of a rouge, with the acrobatic talents of a monk, that would be awesome!

also, I think it's sort of an initiative thing for the hidden blade assassination, if they see it coming, its not going to happen, but if they're flat footed, (like if they just attacked and they're stumbling) it's the perfect window for an attack. So maybe a roll for initiative instead of the 20 thing, because thats like 1/20 times, and it should be something like 1/2 of the time it works...

Pureflight
2008-03-23, 01:56 PM
The wiki class is interesting, but i don't think it's optimal. I think wis makes more sense than int, and having too many key abilities for a class makes it hard to use. aka monks.
also, slow fall is lame and has no roots in the game.
The tricks of the trade on the wiki is a neat idea, but there's not enough options there to customize you character.
some feats in complete adventurer let you drop sneak attack d6 to deal str or con damage or cut the enemies' speed.

and i actually think the DMG assassin is a good place to start, with the death attack and all. but the creed / lack of poison use is an interesting take. i guess i never felt like the game's assassins were of "good" alignment.

Shinton
2008-03-23, 02:46 PM
So maybe a roll for initiative instead of the 20 thing, because thats like 1/20 times, and it should be something like 1/2 of the time it works...

Actually i like that. Thought it might lead to overpowered.. but then again Altair is overpowered in his own right. I mean the path up to the last guy that you have to kill (sword fight), is full of people... I think there were 12+ in one fight... Rediculous.

Also your right, Altair is nothing like the DMG assassin.

Running up/along walls doesn't need to be higher levels. I think that you should be able to do a limited version from the start. Maybe like 10 feet along and it increases up to your max speed.

Also, maybe a speed increase as well.

Would Improved iniative work with the "Initiative death attack" (for lack of a better name)

Well Hashshashin were "good" but i think only in their own minds. I suppose though you could remove alignment restrictions (i think there was one...).

sheepofoblivion
2008-03-23, 06:33 PM
No alignment restrictions, as long as one follows the creed, they don't need any further restrictions, Not killing Innocents, not compromising the brotherhood, being discreet. (maybe if someone breaks it, they sacrifice eagle vision for 24 hours (like how druids can't wear metal) and other super abilities)

On the topic of eagle vision, should it be a spell like ability? Or should it just be like, pluses to sense motive?
something like
"Similar to detect Alignment, this ability allows the user to blah blah This allows the caster to sense the intentions of those around him? blah blah," OR should it be like +2 to sense motive checks, at level 4, +4, etc...

Shinton
2008-03-25, 07:57 PM
For eagle vision:

I agree with the detect alignment.

Tho this doesn't happen in the game, the game is linear, good guys (altair) vs Bad guys (guards)

So detect alignment has more of a purpose here. Also just because someone has the same alignment doesn't mean they wont attack you.

I think it should also function like it does in game.

Highlight people who are thinking about you (about attacking you?)

And the sense motive wouldn't be bad either.

Krimm_Blackleaf
2008-03-25, 08:06 PM
I made one based on Altair, the Angel of Death (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62659).

sheepofoblivion
2008-03-25, 11:27 PM
Yes, I'm well aware that there are plenty of clases, but I want to get the game aspects (what you can do in the game) like eagle vision, assassination, and all that stuff perfectly down.

I also want to make my own class...

I actually like the sneak attack idea though... Because he just pretty much sneak attacks, and when people are flatfooted (like if he throws them against a wall or jumps on an unsuspecting guard) they don't block it, but if you try it in combat its a little less pretty. (actually it's sorta fun to use it in combat, but you can't block, or you have to step (the a button) out of the way and assassinate people after they attack.) the sneak attack thing isn't really fitting for a *take out hidden blade stick it in a neck* thing. The initiative thing is better than death attack, because you can't death attack some uber powerful warlord in one hit, but instead you need a high dexterity, maybe improved initiative, whatever.


Another critique which you may have recieved... It relies too much on stances. What happens when someone doesn't have the Complete Warrior book. You may have added an explanation, but it makes it just a bit more complex than it need be.

Krimm_Blackleaf
2008-03-26, 12:44 AM
I just posted my class for ideas, for which you are fully allowed to reap for ideas. And chances are you don't want a martial adept, but a lot of the class features are suitable for a non-martial adept. That and I also kinda wanted to show off my class, sorry.

sheepofoblivion
2008-03-27, 09:35 PM
everyone loves to show off, or else I would be making this on paper!

(by the way, do you know em blackleaf?)

I've decided to call it eagle assassin because that sounds cool... (I also don't really like the sound of hashassin)

more questions:

Should climb, balance, and jump be classified as Par Cour, and have it rely on Dexterity instead of Strength, or just both?

Are these good skills? What are other essentials? (I took out swimming and some others because it is never used... (if you fall in the water, you die!!!!))

The Eagle Assassinís class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Climb (Str), Ride (Dex), Balance (Dex), Concentration (Con), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Open Lock (Dex), Profession (Int), Search (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Tumble (Dex) and Use Rope (Dex)

I was thinking of Reflex, Fort, than Will saves, any objections?

Should they get Weapon finesse?

Maybe bonus feats? Like dodge, improved initiative... There are some really good feats for this class... I feel that some are even essentials... Or should it just be granted. I want to give the player some freedom, a roof jumping, blade in the crowd, or a confrontational one, who uses his skill in fighting to take down all witnesses.

How should I do throwing knives? They need to silence enemies too fast, but it can't be something like a death attack... Should it just be a sneak attack like ability?

The Eagle assassin shouldn't be proficient with heavy or medium armor, because dexterity is super important right?

That's a lot of questions, feel free to answer any of them, and I'll continue to work! (I have a very rough outline, but it's still a long way away from where it's headed...)