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DrizztFan24
2008-05-07, 08:31 AM
I have been wanting to make a melee character for awhile that can counter attack very well. I was thinking something of a monk mix/fix or an unarmed swordsage (I don't have ToB so I don't know if it would actually fit). I was thinking that the character would use his initiative to wait until he was attacked in melee and then deflect/avoid the incoming attack and offer his own crippling response with deadly force.

Any ideas? Think Janna fighting style and Assassin's Creed. The character would not have time to parley with a guard for two minutes while back-up arrives. He would have to dispatch enemies as fast as possible (no not a wizard) once discovered. Those extra seconds could mean the difference between being caught and getting away completely free.

Help me Oh Great Playground!

Nebo_
2008-05-07, 08:39 AM
Robilar's Gambit, Karmic Strike, Combat Reflexes and Decisive Strike monk variant.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-07, 08:43 AM
I have been wanting to make a melee character for awhile that can counter attack very well. I was thinking something of a monk mix/fix or an unarmed swordsage (I don't have ToB so I don't know if it would actually fit). I was thinking that the character would use his initiative to wait until he was attacked in melee and then deflect/avoid the incoming attack and offer his own crippling response with deadly force.

Any ideas? Think Janna fighting style and Assassin's Creed. The character would not have time to parley with a guard for two minutes while back-up arrives. He would have to dispatch enemies as fast as possible (no not a wizard) once discovered. Those extra seconds could mean the difference between being caught and getting away completely free.

Help me Oh Great Playground!


Look at the level 8 setting sun maneuvers. Yeah, welcome to Fool's Strike.

Really, a Setting sun and diamond mind swordsage with Stance of Alacrity is a counter machine. It's going to turn the tables on the enemy, guaranteed.

TempusCCK
2008-05-07, 08:49 AM
Defensive Throw is always good for fighting multiple enemies, making them prone with an AoO after they attack and miss you is alright. Also, Deflect Arrows is pretty good for when they start using crossbows against you.

Other than that, as Nebo_ said, plus a little Deft Opportunist for that sweet +4 to AoO's.

There was a feat in a Dragon Magazine called Agile Riposte which lets you make a single counter attack against an enemy as a free AoO when they miss you.

Xefas
2008-05-07, 08:54 AM
Swordsages also get Fiery Riposte.

As your enemy's ruthless strike connects with your body, you pivot in place and, like a koala, set your hand on fire and punch them in the face.

Deals 4d6 fire damage as an immediate action whenever you get hit. I think it's a 2nd level maneuver, so you can have it by 3rd level.

Also, most of Setting Sun is like this (see above post by Azerian).

Danzaver
2008-05-07, 10:35 AM
As a matter of fact, I have a character who is very good at countering. He is almost unbeatable in single combats with intelligent humanoids with anatomy.

...kinda average against most other stuff XD

Fighter 3 Rogue 3 Gladiator 3 Elegant Bereaver 5

feats of note: improved trip, improved disarm, expert tactician, expertise

Ok so basically the elegant bereaver class means anytime anyone tries a special maneuver (like disarm or sunder or something) he gets to counter it with another maneuver, also he gets +5 to his AC while using expertise.

Gladiator gives him bonuses when he fights in front of crowds of people (e.g. duel situations), lets him feint as a move-equivalent action, lets him get bonuses against anyone he stand there and takes a full defensive action against for the rest of the combat (the bonuses last the whole combat - he only needs to take a full defense action once), and anyone he attacks three rounds or more in a row starts taking saves or takes subdual damage from exhaustion every round he keeps attacking them.

So: How he fights, an example combat.
Round 1: full defense, mock the opponent and work the crowd. Gains multiple bonuses that last the entire combat.
Round 2: full expertise (+10 AC), and a free feint (if successful he instantly gets a partial action on them to attack with sneak attack), and attempts to disarm
Round 3: full expertise, free feint + sneak attack, and another feint.
Round 3: full expertise, attack + sneak attack from last round's feint, free feint + sneak attack. Opponent starts taking subdual damage from exhaustion.
Round 4: free feint + sneak attack, trip + bonus attack with improved trip. opponent continues to take damage from exhaustion.
Round 5: I'm tired of this fight. Disarm, trip. Demand surrender.

That kinda sums him up. Remember that if anyone else tries any of his tricks on him, he gets to counter their special maneuvers and has pumped up his sense motive as high as he can to resist feints.

An incredibly fun character to play, but I am repeatedly heard to exclaim "ahh ****, undead". XD

KIDS
2008-05-07, 11:40 AM
As your enemy's ruthless strike connects with your body, you pivot in place and, like a koala, set your hand on fire and punch them in the face.

So much genius there :)

Xefas
2008-05-07, 12:01 PM
So much genius there :)

Hehe, it's left over from one memorable antagonist I used against my PCs shortly after the Tome of Battle came out to play off of the "calling your attacks" trope.

He had stances like "Bear Squats in Mountain Stream" (Roots of the Mountain) and "Dance of the Vengeful Turtle" (Punishing Stance).

His maneuvers were things like "Field Mouse Decapitates Buffalo" (Mountain Hammer) and "Butterfly Harvests Organs!" (Drain Vitality). But, the one that inspired the above is his "Koala Unleashes Fiery Death!" (Burning Blade).

As he lay on the ground, beaten and bleeding, his final words were "Truly, as chipmunks preying on the mighty octopus, I have finally met my match and can die in peace."

Swooper
2008-05-07, 01:09 PM
Hehe, it's left over from one memorable antagonist I used against my PCs shortly after the Tome of Battle came out to play off of the "calling your attacks" trope.

He had stances like "Bear Squats in Mountain Stream" (Roots of the Mountain) and "Dance of the Vengeful Turtle" (Punishing Stance).

His maneuvers were things like "Field Mouse Decapitates Buffalo" (Mountain Hammer) and "Butterfly Harvests Organs!" (Drain Vitality). But, the one that inspired the above is his "Koala Unleashes Fiery Death!" (Burning Blade).

As he lay on the ground, beaten and bleeding, his final words were "Truly, as chipmunks preying on the mighty octopus, I have finally met my match and can die in peace."
This had my rolling around with laughter. Brilliant. :smallbiggrin:

sonofzeal
2008-05-07, 01:27 PM
Robilar's Gambit, Karmic Strike, Combat Reflexes and Decisive Strike monk variant.
All good ideas. I'm very fond of Warblade over Swordsage for that style of combat though. At high levels, Battle Mastery + Power Attack + twohanded = BIG boost (Int*3) to damage with no loss in accuracy. Works nicely with Stand Still + Spiked Chain too, since you can choose to either do huge damage or freeze them with a huge DC.