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Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 06:04 PM
Many times, the playground has seen ridiculous versus threads with grossly outmatched sides, or posters grasping at straws through the use of one off powers and informed abilities. The point of this small compendium is to make versus threads easier and help determine a victor. Consider it a "Gentleman's Agreement", AKA Cold War prelude, if you might. Here goes a first draft:

1) All sides are operating at their highest efficiency and highest power level, except for...
2) No side has setting specific (Such as a monster being vulnerable only to a particular sword of Arthurian Legend) immunities or Deus Ex/I Win powers (Such as reality benders or protections that kill anybody inside a certain range).
3) The sides are all facing off in a neutral battlefield. Said battlefield can contain advantages for a side, but they must be counteracted by advantages of equal magnitude for the other side.
4) Only abilities displayed and with a first hand account may be used. Informed abilities do not work. Neither do possible or probable abilities. All abilities used must have been defined by the author and demonstrated, not implied. A few exceptions may apply, but that must not be the norm.
5) One off tricks do not work and do not count.
6) Neither side is conscious of the other side and they have no previous knowledge of each other unless they hail from the same setting and know each other in canon.
7) Catgirl Rule: If you try to use physics against a setting that doesn't explicitly deal with them, you lose.
8) Optional Rule: At the discretion of all the playgrounders, cathegories of power may be created, to facilitate the creation of reasonable versus threads for playgrounders. Examples could be, in inverse order of power:

Low power: Normal Earth, in an appropriate period.
Low magic/low technology settings with fantastic characters, Badass Normals: Watchmen.
Tweaked Magic, tech above the current Earth techonology, completely cinematic and heroic: Artemis Fowl, Lord of the Rings, Conan.
Plentiful magic, Cyberpunk, clearly superhuman heroes, who are not supers or the like: Warhammer.
High magic, ultratech, supers: D&D, current DC comics without reality benders, Shadowrun.
Over The Top, superpowerful tech, Gross Magic: Star Wars, WH40K, Exalted, Epic D&D without total reality benders, Ender's Game.

Any ideas? Comments?


PS: Of course, this is subject to change by the OP of a thread. But this should serve as a universal template, a base.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 08:10 PM
Nether side is aware of the other's powers from the start. This might be negated if the situation requires it, or woudl be impossible otherwise, or more to the point one could logicaly figure out other's powers (mind reading ect) but generally each one is fighting the other for hte first time
from
EE

Innis Cabal
2008-05-16, 08:17 PM
figured EE would be one of the first on this one, honestly, making rules for these things onlly will make more of then.......do you want that?

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 08:22 PM
figured EE would be one of the first on this one, honestly, making rules for these things onlly will make more of then.......do you want that?

I thought you liked vs. threads, you were rather good at them

Generally it is more misconceptions taht come about actually
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EE

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 08:27 PM
EE has a point about neither side knowing. Adding that as we speak.

Heh, I feel this is going to like that little book known as The Mythical Man Month. In the author's words: "It's like the programming team's bible! Everyone has read it, but no one Applies it!"

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 08:30 PM
EE has a point about neither side knowing. Adding that as we speak.

Heh, I feel this is going to like that little book known as The Mythical Man Month. In the author's words: "It's like the programming team's bible! Everyone has read it, but no one Applies it!"

and soon everybody start interpreting it in different manners and then we can have infighting and schisms. Hurray
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EE

Innis Cabal
2008-05-16, 08:31 PM
i do like Versus threads EE, i like -good- versus threads, not Dust v Soot.....the Ultimate showdown!

That and i was being snarky.......

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 08:33 PM
i do like Versus threads EE, i like -good- versus threads, not Dust v Soot.....the Ultimate showdown!

That and i was being snarky.......

Oh i agree actually, an snark is always amazing. Good vs. threads are great, through i admit there are a lot of bad ones. Executor very good ones however
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EE

Guildorn Tanaleth
2008-05-16, 08:55 PM
4) Only abilities displayed and with a first hand account may be used. Informed abilities do not work. Neither do possible or probable abilities. All abilities used must have been defined by the author and demonstrated, not implied. A few exceptions may apply, but that must not be the norm.

What about abilities explicitly stated & described by the author or omniscient 3rd person narrator that are never actually seen being used? What about abilities observed by a reliable source & relayed to others, yet never actually seen first hand by the protagonist?

Other than that, though, I don't think this is really going to have any effect on the threads.

Innis Cabal
2008-05-16, 08:55 PM
while they are all good rules, i just mean there isnt a need for them, they are a self regulating system. It would work if people could handle the topics maturely, untill that time Azerian Kelimon, i think your before your time.

Rutee
2008-05-16, 09:00 PM
I think Informed ability is something to value, and that's as someone who despises its use in tales, but eh.

I dunno, I'd rather the rules as a whole just be in individual versus thread.


7 also has a few problems; For instance, WH40k. It's nigh-insurmountable as a setting, but individuals within it are hardly so.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 09:04 PM
I think Informed ability is something to value, and that's as someone who despises its use in tales, but eh.

IF a character has some sort of special ability to learn about their foes, like Sauron's eye maybe, or mind reading it makes sense. Other wise both sides should just act on assumptions, because many vs. thread characters rely on their element of surprise




7 also has a few problems; For instance, WH40k. It's nigh-insurmountable as a setting, but individuals within it are hardly so.
Meh, i'm not going to really use 7, it is just an option
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EE

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 09:05 PM
If with seven you mean the optional one, yeah, it's kinda problematic. But it's still on the top step, because even a mook like a space marine has almost superhero powers.

As for informed ability, let's say, for example, how a Faux Action Girl is said to be extremely dangerous but never wins a fight, out of 10 or so. Or how Cyclops the X-man once says he once used enough Beam Power on the Juggernaut to split a small planet in half. Or how some badass feats are informed of, but not seen.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 09:07 PM
Ok fair enough. So if we are told that Arya is a great fighter, we can assume she is good, but if every time she appears on screen she is bad whe just don't go with it

Or a better example is Seph, how we are told he is an amazing sword fighter, then when you watch Avant's Children, you laugh horrible, then cry
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EE

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 09:10 PM
Yeah, or how some famous characters (No names) are hailed as master manipulators, but act very brashly or hotheadedly, never showing signs of being chessmasters or the like.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 09:11 PM
Yeah, or how some famous characters (No names) are hailed as master manipulators, but act very brashly or hotheadedly, never showing signs of being chessmasters or the like.

Heh, i know a few of those
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EE

Jayngfet
2008-05-16, 09:11 PM
What about marvels mister immortal, his only power is that he can out immortal the god's themself, and maybe see the grim reaper, but you can beat him into submission and he has no offensive abilities.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 09:13 PM
What about marvels mister immortal, his only power is that he can out immortal the god's themself, and maybe see the grim reaper, but you can beat him into submission and he has no offensive abilities.

we don't talk about him
from
EE

Xefas
2008-05-16, 09:13 PM
Or a better example is Seph, how we are told he is an amazing sword fighter, then when you watch Avant's Advent Children, you laugh horrible, then cry
from
EE

He's probably a lot better when employing a weapon small enough to be used effectively.

I mean, if he can pull off basic maneuvers with a sword the size of a barn, just thing how fast and intuitive he'd be with a wakizachi, gladius, or similarly sized shortsword.

Though, it speaks reams about his intelligence that he hasn't figured this out yet...

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 09:16 PM
What about marvels mister immortal, his only power is that he can out immortal the god's themself, and maybe see the grim reaper, but you can beat him into submission and he has no offensive abilities.

Eternal torture would count as a loss. Else, he will probably win by attrition if he doesn't suffer insanity causing pain.

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-16, 09:23 PM
1) All sides are operating at their highest efficiency and highest power level, except for...
No problems with this, but what about mixing time periods?


2) No side has setting specific (Such as a monster being vulnerable only to a particular sword of Arthurian Legend) immunities or Deus Ex/I Win powers (Such as reality benders or protections that kill anybody inside a certain range).
Utterly stupid. Some settings have things like Nova Bombs that make stars go super nova. Or Dr. Device. Both are "I win" buttons but they are also things that should be allowed.


3) The sides are all facing off in a neutral battlefield. Said battlefield can contain advantages for a side, but they must be counteracted by advantages of equal magnitude for the other side.
Again, negates a lot of the point of vs. threads. Sure it makes sense if you are going with small groups of people or individuals, but frankly those are boring vs. threads in the first place. And if you go with large scale vs. threads all of that stuff becomes very important (who has the initiative, who can go longer without resupply, who has the fewest number of absolutely critical points, etc.).


4) Only abilities displayed and with a first hand account may be used. Informed abilities do not work. Neither do possible or probable abilities. All abilities used must have been defined by the author and demonstrated, not implied. A few exceptions may apply, but that must not be the norm.
Again, it may work for small unit vs. threads (and even then its iffy) but it doesn't work at all when talking about full scale vs. threads.


5) One off tricks do not work and do not count.
Again, it depends on the trick and the circumstances of its use. Is it only used once because the creator has only ever been in a situation where he needed to use it once (say making a star go Nova for instance), or is it a once off trick because the user found some Deus Ex Machina tech made by Q and got to use it.


6) Neither side is conscious of the other side and they have no previous knowledge of each other unless they hail from the same setting and know each other in canon.
Sure, it could make things interesting.


7) Optional Rule: At the discretion of all the playgrounders, cathegories of power may be created, to facilitate the creation of reasonable versus threads for playgrounders. Examples could be, in inverse order of power:

Low power: Normal Earth, in an appropriate period.
Low magic/low technology settings with fantastic characters, Badass Normals: Watchmen.
Tweaked Magic, tech above the current Earth techonology, completely cinematic and heroic: Artemis Fowl, Lord of the Rings, Conan.
Plentiful magic, Cyberpunk, clearly superhuman heroes, who are not supers or the like: Warhammer.
High magic, ultratech, supers: D&D, current DC comics without reality benders, Shadowrun.
Over The Top, superpowerful tech, Gross Magic: Star Wars, WH40K, Exalted, Epic D&D without total reality benders.
You aren't supposed to make vs. threads with that kind of power discrepancy (Warhammer 40K vs. current day earth for example).


Any ideas? Comments?


PS: Of course, this is subject to change by the OP of a thread. But this should serve as a universal template, a base.

The rules should be up to the OP and the other participants in the thread.

chiasaur11
2008-05-16, 09:25 PM
Eternal torture would count as a loss. Else, he will probably win by attrition if he doesn't suffer insanity causing pain.

If he did, he'd be nuts by now. Poor guy dies all the time. In the most humiliating manner, even.

He's not the only bad example from the GLI. Two words. Squirrel Girl.

Rutee
2008-05-16, 09:32 PM
If with seven you mean the optional one, yeah, it's kinda problematic. But it's still on the top step, because even a mook like a space marine has almost superhero powers.

As for informed ability, let's say, for example, how a Faux Action Girl is said to be extremely dangerous but never wins a fight, out of 10 or so. Or how Cyclops the X-man once says he once used enough Beam Power on the Juggernaut to split a small planet in half. Or how some badass feats are informed of, but not seen.

I have consistently stood in favor of informed ability (FYI: Sephiroth /is/ a powerful sword fighter. It's not everyday someone creates explosions with sword swings) Not everything a /character/ says may be sacrosanct (For instance, unless Scott is a physicist, I doubt he's completely aware of how much energy is needed to slice through a small planet), but I will go with informed ability as a whole.

I am also going to go ahead and say "If at any point your argument uses physics in settings that don't care, you lose".


The rules should be up to the OP and the other participants in the thread.
Seconded.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 09:41 PM
Rutee: Actually, we have proof sephiroth is a masterful swordfighter, when he fights as a guest in one fight in the flashback. He does 5000 damage per strike, pretty badass for a time before the saga.

Also, you've given me a new rule to add.

Chia: As in, Deadpool like, or I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream Ending type? Wiki it up, it's horrific.

Tippy: In order.

1) 'Splain in detail.

2) Doctor Devices are counterable, they have a pretty short radius. They're REALLY strong, I considered putting Ender's game on WH40K level, but they're not instant I Wins, no exceptions allowed.

3) I don't really get why. Starting on the base assumption of equal footing is a good idea. Of course, and OP can modify because he wants to see one side with disadvantages, but this compendium aims for a default.

4) Read up the follow ups on WHAT informed ability means. The chief example is the Cyclops example. That's informed ability, while, say, the Witch King's immunity, is not, even if it is extremely vague.

5) Freak happenings, like the one use Forgotten Superweapon, or the envirnoment based Superpower, do not count. Really, just about EVERY long running character got an I Win button that was a one off sometime in their lives, but we do not mention them because they're used up and make threads moot.

7) Funny thing, I still see lots of 'em. :smalltongue:

Conclusion: As said before, this compendium aims to be a template, a base. Modifications are expected, it's just that this saves a lot of time detailing the specifics.

Jayngfet
2008-05-16, 09:46 PM
If he did, he'd be nuts by now. Poor guy dies all the time. In the most humiliating manner, even.


You mean like the time they walked in on hum impaling himself, drunk, and when he referenced this he was all "oh whatever".

maybe he did go mad, I'm fairly sire he did the above in his dead girlfriends clothes.

Lord_Asmodeus
2008-05-16, 09:47 PM
I think the only real rule should be "don't make stupid versus" and let peoples better judgment work that out, if it really is stupid, don't respond and it will just pass on naturally.

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 09:48 PM
You mean like the time they walked in on hum impaling himself, drunk, and when he referenced this he was all "oh whatever".

maybe he did go mad, I'm fairly sire he did the above in his dead girlfriends clothes.

I mean, cripplingly mad, not Deadpool mad. As in, so shocked into madness, you don't react anymore, you enter your own world in a form of mental catatonia.

Innis Cabal
2008-05-16, 09:50 PM
sadly it seems that most people want to comment on the stupid threads to validate themselves, which is what keeps most of them alive. Either that, or they get so long (/cough Link v. Sephi) that they gain an int score

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 09:52 PM
And Ego, never forget the full Sentient Weapon Rules.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 10:05 PM
He's probably a lot better when employing a weapon small enough to be used effectively.

I mean, if he can pull off basic maneuvers with a sword the size of a barn, just thing how fast and intuitive he'd be with a wakizachi, gladius, or similarly sized shortsword.

Though, it speaks reams about his intelligence that he hasn't figured this out yet...

1) Yeah, but even then he tends to attack with somewhat absurd moves, but your right, he wouldn't be that bad if it wasn't for his weapon
2) Yeah, he should realize that giant katana actually isn't good for anything



I have consistently stood in favor of informed ability (FYI: Sephiroth /is/ a powerful sword fighter. It's not everyday someone creates explosions with sword swings) Not everything a /character/ says may be sacrosanct (For instance, unless Scott is a physicist, I doubt he's completely aware of how much energy is needed to slice through a small planet), but I will go with informed ability as a whole.

Actually we know he is a crap sword fighter, at least in terms of tactics, he just lucks out because every other character is crap as well. Using a katanna at such a size is simply moronic, particularly with the way he uses it. Also his explosion powers are generally overrated



I am also going to go ahead and say "If at any point your argument uses physics in settings that don't care, you lose".

Well that is like saying logic isn't allowed



Again, negates a lot of the point of vs. threads. Sure it makes sense if you are going with small groups of people or individuals, but frankly those are boring vs. threads in the first place. And if you go with large scale vs. threads all of that stuff becomes very important (who has the initiative, who can go longer without resupply, who has the fewest number of absolutely critical points, etc.).

by neutral battle field, i assume he means one that doesn't directly favor one side over the other. For example, should i do Aragorn vs. Drizzt, but it takes place in teh underdark it isn't really fair. If it took place on top of a raft however it would be good.
from
EE

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-16, 10:09 PM
Tippy: In order.

1) 'Splain in detail.
Take Starcraft and Starcraft 2. The Protoss had moons filled with combat robots back in SC 1 and just never bothered to use them. So what tech is in in a Starcraft vs. thread? The Protoss's most powerful point would be right before the zerg take out Auir and with all of the SC 2 tech that they are stated as having but never using (mother ships, war bots).


2) Doctor Devices are counterable, they have a pretty short radius. They're REALLY strong, I considered putting Ender's game on WH40K level, but they're not instant I Wins, no exceptions allowed.
Enders Game is no where near Warhammer 40K level. Sure they have a great tactical offensive weapon, but they loose strategically in ever category.


3) I don't really get why. Starting on the base assumption of equal footing is a good idea. Of course, and OP can modify because he wants to see one side with disadvantages, but this compendium aims for a default.
Because there is no such thing as an equal footing. One of two things in true in any vs. thread above the small unit level; one side is attacking the other or both sides are fighting it out in some random location with limited forces.

If the first is true then things like supply lines, strategic weak points, fixed defenses, moral, building times, etc. become very, very important. If the second is true then none of those factors matter and you get some really strange results in vs. threads.


4) Read up the follow ups on WHAT informed ability means. The chief example is the Cyclops example. That's informed ability, while, say, the Witch King's immunity, is not, even if it is extremely vague.
And if a nuclear warhead is stated as having a yield of 5 megatons by a person who should know said weapons yield yet when it is detonated onscreen its blast radius only matches that of a 3 megaton warhead? Or when it is stated that a ship can travel 1200 C in hyperspace but we never actually see it happen?

Should one believe everything that is said? No. But just because something is stated but not shown doesn't make it worthless or useless information.


5) Freak happenings, like the one use Forgotten Superweapon, or the envirnoment based Superpower, do not count. Really, just about EVERY long running character got an I Win button that was a one off sometime in their lives, but we do not mention them because they're used up and make threads moot.
Again, your dealing with small unit vs. threads. I'm dealing with vs. threads on the scale of The IoM vs. The Systems Commonwealth.


7) Funny thing, I still see lots of 'em. :smalltongue:
You can never cure stupidity.


Conclusion: As said before, this compendium aims to be a template, a base. Modifications are expected, it's just that this saves a lot of time detailing the specifics.
It's a template that is utterly useless for most any vs. thread above the small unit level.

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-16, 10:12 PM
by neutral battle field, i assume he means one that doesn't directly favor one side over the other. For example, should i do Aragorn vs. Drizzt, but it takes place in teh underdark it isn't really fair. If it took place on top of a raft however it would be good.
from
EE

Again, relevant and useful in small unit vs. threads. Not useful in all up military vs. military vs. threads.

Rutee
2008-05-16, 10:16 PM
Well, there /are/ vs. threads that exist on the micro level. I get where you're coming from, though.

...Actually that leads an interesting question. You're concerned with the Macro level; WHat do you do with the setting? Do you retain or toss out third parties?

Azerian Kelimon
2008-05-16, 10:20 PM
Take Starcraft and Starcraft 2. The Protoss had moons filled with combat robots back in SC 1 and just never bothered to use them. So what tech is in in a Starcraft vs. thread? The Protoss's most powerful point would be right before the zerg take out Auir and with all of the SC 2 tech that they are stated as having but never using (mother ships, war bots).


Enders Game is no where near Warhammer 40K level. Sure they have a great tactical offensive weapon, but they loose strategically in ever category.


Because there is no such thing as an equal footing. One of two things in true in any vs. thread above the small unit level; one side is attacking the other or both sides are fighting it out in some random location with limited forces.

If the first is true then things like supply lines, strategic weak points, fixed defenses, moral, building times, etc. become very, very important. If the second is true then none of those factors matter and you get some really strange results in vs. threads.


And if a nuclear warhead is stated as having a yield of 5 megatons by a person who should know said weapons yield yet when it is detonated onscreen its blast radius only matches that of a 3 megaton warhead? Or when it is stated that a ship can travel 1200 C in hyperspace but we never actually see it happen?

Should one believe everything that is said? No. But just because something is stated but not shown doesn't make it worthless or useless information.


Again, your dealing with small unit vs. threads. I'm dealing with vs. threads on the scale of The IoM vs. The Systems Commonwealth.


You can never cure stupidity.


It's a template that is utterly useless for most any vs. thread above the small unit level.

In order, again:

Your example? In fact EVERYTHING is produced in Aiur. No moons, no nuthin'. Everything's in Aiur, unless there was a massive retcon, and apparently guardians 'n stuff are new tech. Thus, yes, they get Aiur Pre-zerg, but they only have ONE production world, albeit and incredibly good one.

Well, that's a matter of opinion. Guerilla will probably end in Ender's favor, and if you give him a star system, the IoM would probably suffer defeat.

Yes there is. In a galactic empire, versus galactic empire scenario, for example it can be a relatively new galaxy, where only some bases and structures are built.

Because an informed never has the testing on a smaller scale that a nuke has to back up it's potency. In the chief example I mentioned Cyclops CAN do extremely strong optic blasts, but his most powerful onscreen blast doesn't even come CLOSE to being planet splitting. He could be bragging, he could be saying the truth. It's inverifiable, unlike what happens with an nuke's payload.

Last point: Then, link me to Commonwealth's info. I'll see if anything needs to be modified after I see hard info.

tyckspoon
2008-05-16, 10:20 PM
Well that is like saying logic isn't allowed
EE

Well, no. Logic is nothing more than a means of proceeding from true statement to true statement to arrive at a true conclusion (it also helps if normal causality is functional). Anything which has reasonably consistent rules can be approached logically. That has just about nothing to do with physics, which are cheerfully abused or completely ignored by a great number of fictions. Consider Dragon Ball: It can be thought of with logic simply, eg:

Axiom: A character with a higher Power Level will defeat a character with a lower Power Level in normal combat.
Statement: Goku's power level is over 9000.
Statement: Radditz's power level is under 9000.
Statement: Goku's power level is above that of Radditz.
Conclusion: Goku will defeat Radditz in normal combat.

An unassailable argument, unless the founding axiom or one of the statements is proven untrue. That's logic. The fight will be largely outside the bounds of real-world physics, but it will operate logically.

There are fictions that don't operate with logic either; they're mostly comedy. We don't include them because of that. There's no way to consider them in a fight with any sort of rational basis. They essentially are Step 2 of the Profit chart.

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 10:20 PM
Well, there /are/ vs. threads that exist on the micro level. I get where you're coming from, though.

...Actually that leads an interesting question. You're concerned with the Macro level; WHat do you do with the setting? Do you retain or toss out third parties?

Normally you assume third parties aren't there, because it causes interference.

Tippy, that varies. I in LK vs. Sauron both sides had their own lands, so in large scale both sides would normally have their forts and such
from
EE

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-16, 10:35 PM
In order, again:

Your example? In fact EVERYTHING is produced in Aiur. No moons, no nuthin'. Everything's in Aiur, unless there was a massive retcon, and apparently guardians 'n stuff are new tech. Thus, yes, they get Aiur Pre-zerg, but they only have ONE production world, albeit and incredibly good one.
Um no. The Protoss had a lot more than just Auir as far as production went.


Well, that's a matter of opinion. Guerilla will probably end in Ender's favor, and if you give him a star system, the IoM would probably suffer defeat.
Again, no. Ender has not FTL travel. Ender has (even in Speaker for the Dead) something like 3,000 worlds total. The IoM just virus bombs everyone of Enders worlds and leaves them alone.


Yes there is. In a galactic empire, versus galactic empire scenario, for example it can be a relatively new galaxy, where only some bases and structures are built.
Again, not really. The reason the IoM is so strong is because of the vast amount of planets and people under their control. A lot of that becomes irrelevant in a new galaxy. And how long term are we talking?


Because an informed never has the testing on a smaller scale that a nuke has to back up it's potency. In the chief example I mentioned Cyclops CAN do extremely strong optic blasts, but his most powerful onscreen blast doesn't even come CLOSE to being planet splitting. He could be bragging, he could be saying the truth. It's inverifiable, unlike what happens with an nuke's payload.
Sure, comics lie. The point is that you can not make absolute statements about such things.


Last point: Then, link me to Commonwealth's info. I'll see if anything needs to be modified after I see hard info.
They control 3 galaxies and 3 satellite galaxies, have intergalatic FTL that takes days at most, have pretty much the strongest AI of any setting, had genetically engineered supersoliders for most of their ground forces, used 20+ megaton weapons for point defense, and considered the ability to blow up 40 star systems to be the standard load out on front line combat units. They can turn gas giants into suns and can fly around the outer layers of stars (where temperatures can exceed 1,000,000 degrees Fahrenheit).

chiasaur11
2008-05-16, 11:16 PM
Chia: As in, Deadpool like, or I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream Ending type? Wiki it up, it's horrific.
.\

More Deadpool, but a low level embodiment of death murdered his nearest and dearest for years while he survived, including his girlfriend dying in a suicide pact with him while he survives. Plus, he recovers from mutilation too, so at least the ending of "I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream" is out. (I read about it before after TV tropes mentioned it).

Gotta count for something.

Echowinds
2008-05-16, 11:35 PM
Is it just me, or is there too many X vs Y threads currently?

EvilElitest
2008-05-16, 11:35 PM
Is it just me, or is there too many X vs Y threads currently?

not really
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EE

Silver2195
2008-05-23, 02:42 PM
By the way, the Enderverse has Jane, who is more or less a Reality Bender. She can teleport small spaceships, effectively a form of FTL travel.