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View Full Version : Why all the Space Marines?



Stormthorn
2008-05-26, 06:11 PM
Would someone explain to me this sudded...glut...of Space Marines and
WHmr40k related threads on this board?

freerangetroll
2008-05-26, 06:16 PM
Silence heretic!

*coughs*

Just a fad, pretty soon we'll be back to anime and hugging contests I imagine. Either that or LoTR will make its triumphant return. For the fiftieth time.

Neon Knight
2008-05-26, 06:18 PM
I cannot explain the glut of Space Marine topics, nor their inexplicable fascination with soap. I hope this "sudded" glut will soon explain itself. :smalltongue:

LBO
2008-05-26, 06:18 PM
An abundance of 40k fanboys leads to an abundance of 40k fanboy-baiting. I imagine it'll fade now that nobody is taking these seriously.

DraPrime
2008-05-26, 06:18 PM
Because people want to find something that will crush the space marines without any tremendous effort. And they're really badass.

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-26, 06:33 PM
Because people want to find something that will crush the space marines without any tremendous effort. And they're really badass.

Not really, lots of things can crush space marines and the whole 40K universe without any real effort.

It's mostly because 40K is an ok benchmark for power.

Stormthorn
2008-05-26, 06:34 PM
I hope this "sudded" glut will soon explain itself

I apologize for my typo. I will continue to make mny mre nda not crrcet them jst to annoy grammrz Nzais.

Prophaniti
2008-05-26, 06:43 PM
I apologize for my typo. I will continue to make mny mre nda not crrcet them jst to annoy grammrz Nzais.

NNNGGGNNNNNAAAAAHHHH! *has aneurism in grammar/spelling section of brain*

Illiterate Scribe
2008-05-26, 06:45 PM
SPESS MEHREENS

Hey, how come Rutee can type an all caps message and I can't?

EvilDMMk3
2008-05-26, 06:47 PM
Space marines are iconic enough to be known of by non-fans, powerful enough to be fanboyed to indestructibility and varied enough in their depiction to allow mass debates. One large thread spawns dozens of smaller threads in a follow the leader fashion and soon we have a glut of useless threads. Then people get sick of them and they die.

In a week we will be asking why all the XYZ?

Xuincherguixe
2008-05-26, 06:50 PM
Because there aren't enough Chaos Marine fans :P

Innis Cabal
2008-05-26, 06:55 PM
To make you ask questions

Fri
2008-05-26, 06:56 PM
I've told you!


Sigh. Don't tell me that Space Marine is the new Sauron.

Now we just had to wait for the inevitable 'Space Marine vs Naruto' Thread.

*snip*

It was Sauron. Now it's the SMurf.

Why all the space marines? for the inevitable SMurf vs Naruto Thread.

Illiterate Scribe
2008-05-26, 07:05 PM
Because there aren't enough Chaos Marine fans :P

I challenge that pansy the Master Chief to go mano a mano with Khârn.

Callos_DeTerran
2008-05-26, 07:50 PM
Because people want to find something that will crush the space marines without any tremendous effort. And they're really badass.

Space Marines are not even particularly badass in their own setting. People merely prefer picking human/humanish-looking factions (generally speaking here) in table top games like Warhammer 40K, especially if theres bizarre aliens/robits(mispelled on purpose people) since it allows for the image of brave human defenders against unquestionably evil people. As Space Marines are the best of the 'humans' (it's debatable that SMurfs are human) they are propped up on a pedestal more so then they deserve which has lead to this inflated reputation of theirs. It doesn't help that in the fluff authors will take pretty much the same approach of using a SMurf for a protaganist (because there IS nobody better at what they do on the human side, barring psykers and such) and all protaganists must eventually become badass so SMurfs gain a not necessarily earned reputation for being bad ass.

I'd say the same for SPARTANS from Halo but I utterly despise that game and everything connected to it (Except Battle of the FPS Titans) so much that I'm not really un-biased enough to make that claim. Plus I've only played the plotless games, not read the books which apparently is where that series's plot hides.

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-26, 07:55 PM
ILLITERATE, BECAUSE SHE IS SPECIAL LIKE ME. what with our ninja powers and all

Illiterate Scribe
2008-05-26, 08:05 PM
Nah, y'see, Tippy, I can see your white text. But in her post (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4369912&postcount=60):


MOAR IRONY

No lowercase there.

This must be investigated, for SCIENCE.

Emperor Tippy
2008-05-26, 08:13 PM
Nah, y'see, Tippy, I can see your white text. But in her post (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4369912&postcount=60):



No lowercase there.

This must be investigated, for SCIENCE.

OH, WHAT'S IN THE QUOTE BOX COUNTS AS LOWERCASE. SEE?

chiasaur11
2008-05-26, 08:14 PM
Space Marines are not even particularly badass in their own setting. People merely prefer picking human/humanish-looking factions (generally speaking here) in table top games like Warhammer 40K, especially if theres bizarre aliens/robits(mispelled on purpose people) since it allows for the image of brave human defenders against unquestionably evil people. As Space Marines are the best of the 'humans' (it's debatable that SMurfs are human) they are propped up on a pedestal more so then they deserve which has lead to this inflated reputation of theirs. It doesn't help that in the fluff authors will take pretty much the same approach of using a SMurf for a protaganist (because there IS nobody better at what they do on the human side, barring psykers and such) and all protaganists must eventually become badass so SMurfs gain a not necessarily earned reputation for being bad ass.

I'd say the same for SPARTANS from Halo but I utterly despise that game and everything connected to it (Except Battle of the FPS Titans) so much that I'm not really un-biased enough to make that claim. Plus I've only played the plotless games, not read the books which apparently is where that series's plot hides.

Well, the real tough guy is
CIPHAS CAIN, HERO OF THE IMPERIUM
but the fights he's in are kinda one sided.

Also, in Halo, from the start Spartans are said to be better than any human or Covenant guy in a one on one fight. Faster than anyone, stronger than anything but Hunters, and smarter, at least in tactical scenarios, than anyone. In Halo, SPARTAN 2s are the top of the proverbial food chain.

Stormthorn
2008-05-26, 08:15 PM
Because there aren't enough Chaos Marine fans :P

I like teh Chaos mreens. Those dudes are so awesome. And they have varied motives too. None of this cookie-cutter zealotry.


I'd say the same for SPARTANS from Halo but I utterly despise that game and everything connected to it (Except Battle of the FPS Titans) so much that I'm not really un-biased enough to make that claim. Plus I've only played the plotless games, not read the books which apparently is where that series's plot hides.
Ok. Then as someone with the awesome ability to see the plot of the Halo series (it plots up after the first game) i will say it for you. SPARTAN II's are the SMs of their setting.

Lord_Asmodeus
2008-05-26, 08:28 PM
Space Marines are not even particularly badass in their own setting. People merely prefer picking human/humanish-looking factions (generally speaking here) in table top games like Warhammer 40K, especially if theres bizarre aliens/robits(mispelled on purpose people) since it allows for the image of brave human defenders against unquestionably evil people. As Space Marines are the best of the 'humans' (it's debatable that SMurfs are human) they are propped up on a pedestal more so then they deserve which has lead to this inflated reputation of theirs. It doesn't help that in the fluff authors will take pretty much the same approach of using a SMurf for a protaganist (because there IS nobody better at what they do on the human side, barring psykers and such) and all protaganists must eventually become badass so SMurfs gain a not necessarily earned reputation for being bad ass.

They ARE badass, because they're badass in the books, and the books are official fluff. Official Fluff = Canon. So they are in fact badass, why? Because everyone thinks they're badass and makes books depicting them as badass, and those books speak naught but truth

Eita
2008-05-26, 09:29 PM
Space Marines are not even particularly badass in their own setting. People merely prefer picking human/humanish-looking factions (generally speaking here) in table top games like Warhammer 40K, especially if theres bizarre aliens/robits(mispelled on purpose people) since it allows for the image of brave human defenders against unquestionably evil people. As Space Marines are the best of the 'humans' (it's debatable that SMurfs are human) they are propped up on a pedestal more so then they deserve which has lead to this inflated reputation of theirs. It doesn't help that in the fluff authors will take pretty much the same approach of using a SMurf for a protaganist (because there IS nobody better at what they do on the human side, barring psykers and such) and all protaganists must eventually become badass so SMurfs gain a not necessarily earned reputation for being bad ass.

You're forgetting about not only a certain HERO OF THE IMPERIUM, but also Gaunt's Ghosts, Gregor Eisenhorn, and others.

Mr. Scaly
2008-05-26, 09:31 PM
It's to annoy me personally. Whenever I try a discussion with more obscure characters it falls by the wayside, whereas these Space marines are hogging all the attention. Well not for long you miserable SMurfs! You'll be phased out soon enough!

Innis Cabal
2008-05-26, 09:32 PM
the not so earned title of bad ass? Right, because fighting all your life means nothing really.

Callos_DeTerran
2008-05-26, 09:47 PM
the not so earned title of bad ass? Right, because fighting all your life means nothing really.

Fighting your whole life does not make you bad ass. Bad ass is a personal idea of the term and fighting all your life does not earn you the title of badass in my book.

GoC
2008-05-26, 09:53 PM
An abundance of 40k fanboys leads to an abundance of 40k fanboy-baiting. I imagine it'll fade now that nobody is taking these seriously.

*whistles*:smallredface:

Lord_Asmodeus
2008-05-26, 09:59 PM
Fighting your whole life does not make you bad ass. Bad ass is a personal idea of the term and fighting all your life does not earn you the title of badass in my book.

No, but fighting against foes that rip apart armies of well trained soldiers with ease, and coming out bloodily on top, does make you badass. At least in my book.

Callos_DeTerran
2008-05-26, 10:07 PM
No, but fighting against foes that rip apart armies of well trained soldiers with ease, and coming out bloodily on top, does make you badass. At least in my book.

Now see, from what little fluff I HAVE read, they don't always even come out on top. Those well trained (Are the Imperial Guard considered well-trained? I thought they weren't) soldiers who fight even though they KNOW they'll be ripped to pieces are bad-ass. A SMurf? Not so much.

Lord_Asmodeus
2008-05-26, 10:13 PM
Now see, from what little fluff I HAVE read, they don't always even come out on top. Those well trained (Are the Imperial Guard considered well-trained? I thought they weren't) soldiers who fight even though they KNOW they'll be ripped to pieces are bad-ass. A SMurf? Not so much.

1. Of course they don't always come out on top, they're badass, not invincible. An ork Nob smashing an axe through your skull is fatal any way you spell it.
2. It varies, many guardsman are as well trained as American troops, maybe a little better, maybe a little worse, many are just piss-poor conscripts with barely any training, given a lasgun (or an autogun, or a gun type weapon) and shoved out into the frontlines, and if they survive hooray, they get to die somewhere else, or they make our best of the best look like said piss-poor farmers with absolutely no training at all, who can even shape up to SM standards (Kasrkin, Catachans, Krieg Korp, etc...)
3. So... because they're the best of the best, they aren't badass? And many SM often do die, its why they don't live thousands of years, as opposed to the hundreds they often due, not because they die naturally of old age (something so unheard of its debatable as to whether they actually CAN die of old age) but because they fight the deadliest foes the IoM has to offer, and it shows.

Kane
2008-05-26, 10:56 PM
1. Of course they don't always come out on top, they're badass, not invincible. An ork Nob smashing an axe through your skull is fatal any way you spell it.
2. It varies, many guardsman are as well trained as American troops, maybe a little better, maybe a little worse, many are just piss-poor conscripts with barely any training, given a lasgun (or an autogun, or a gun type weapon) and shoved out into the frontlines, and if they survive hooray, they get to die somewhere else, or they make our best of the best look like said piss-poor farmers with absolutely no training at all, who can even shape up to SM standards (Kasrkin, Catachans, Krieg Korp, etc...)
3. So... because they're the best of the best, they aren't badass? And many SM often do die, its why they don't live thousands of years, as opposed to the hundreds they often due, not because they die naturally of old age (something so unheard of its debatable as to whether they actually CAN die of old age) but because they fight the deadliest foes the IoM has to offer, and it shows.

*Highfive* and seconded. I'll agree that the IG are heros, but not badass. You can't be badass when you die by the hundreds. On the other hand, maybe they're not heroic, either. After all, there's a chance the Tyranids/Necrons/Chaos/Orks w/e might lose, but that Commissar will kill you dead.

Talkkno
2008-05-26, 10:57 PM
2. It vathey make our best of the best look like said piss-poor farmers with absolutely no training at all, who can even shape up to SM standards (Kasrkin, Catachans, Krieg Korp, etc...)


Kasrkin are just renamed Imperium stormtroopers, and they are not trained by the Imperial Guard, they recruit orphans and are trained at a young age by the Schola Progrema, which distributes them to Imperial Guard regiments.

Xuincherguixe
2008-05-26, 11:06 PM
There's something almost Viking like about the Space Marines. Wanting to die gloriously and all.


That being said, I totally want to kill them ^_^

Haruspex
2008-05-26, 11:22 PM
These things happen. First those jumping on the XYZ bandwagon will lose interest. Eventually the XYZ fans themselves will get bored. The non-fans who got annoyed will post anything but XYZ-related threads to counter them, and we'll be back to square one.

At least, I sincerely hope so. The novelty's starting to wear thin, even for a 40k fan from the 90s like myself.

Zeful
2008-05-27, 12:12 AM
An abundance of 40k fanboys leads to an abundance of 40k fanboy-baiting. I imagine it'll fade now that nobody is taking these seriously.

This is why I started my thread. Which spawned a thread by GoC

Stormthorn
2008-05-27, 12:46 AM
You can't be badass when you die by the hundreds

What about the Battle of Thermopylae? The spartans and greeks their where pretty badass.

Or Karbala. Or, more extreme still, Shiroyama. The 400 or so samurai who where willing to charge into the massed gatling-gun fire of the 300,000 strong imperial army...those guys died to a man but i doubt you can get more badass than that.

I think its more about attitude. If the SM's had all their normal combat ability but always chose to withdraw from battle i doubt they would be percieved the same.

Bryn
2008-05-27, 05:10 AM
*Highfive* and seconded. I'll agree that the IG are heros, but not badass. You can't be badass when you die by the hundreds. On the other hand, maybe they're not heroic, either.

I am forced to disagree. Look upon this man, and tell me he is not badass.
http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/4711/drivemecloserwi3.jpg

My favourite motivator, ever, aside... there's more to the Guard than charging large numbers of conscripts into the enemy and hoping they die under a mound of bodies. The Guard can indeed be badass. Observe, for example, the Elysian Drop Troops (http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/acatalog/copy_of_ELYSIAN_DROP_TROOPS.html). I'd say it takes guts (and note there is no Commissar model in the Elysian range) to jump out of a plane with a potentially faulty grav-chute on and then fight a war at the bottom.

Alternatively, Catachans (http://uk.games-workshop.com/imperialguard/catachans/1/). I'm not a fan of Catachans, but all their fluff seems to point in a fairly badass direction. Thanks to Dan Abnett's writing, Gaunts' Ghosts could probably also be described as badass. Also, Commissars (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BadassLongcoat).

Right, I've said my bit. Please, feel free to dismiss my opinion as frothing and ranting of a fanboy :smallbiggrin: I've also semi-broken my no-Serious Business rule. I hope it was worth it.

Tengu
2008-05-27, 05:57 AM
Space Marines were cool when I first heard of WH40K, got interested, pondered starting to play the game but never really did, played Dawn of War, learned some of the fluff... and then I met the blind fandom. I miss the times when WH40K was still cool to me.

LBO
2008-05-27, 07:25 AM
Space Marines were cool when I first heard of WH40K, got interested, pondered starting to play the game but never really did, played Dawn of War, learned some of the fluff... and then I met the blind fandom. I miss the times when WH40K was still cool to me.
Bit pathetic that fandom can kill it for you. Firefly fandom terrifies me, but I still like the show.

Tengu
2008-05-27, 12:14 PM
It didn't kill it for me completely. I can still enjoy it, but more tongue-in-the-cheek and without the exaltation 99% of all fans do. You could say that the fandom made me open my eyes and realize that worshiping something completely and treating it as Serious Business is bad.