PDA

View Full Version : Need help with a really weird ToB//Incarnum character build



Swooper
2008-06-03, 07:10 PM
I would post this on the character builder thread, but it tends to get few replies and this is so unusual I doubt I'd get any response over there.

So anyway, I was playing one of those bizarre home-made hero defense maps in Warcraft 3 with my mates during the weekend, and one of the heroes gave me an idea. The hero in question is based on the fel orc blademaster model, and has extremely anime-ish abilities that involve mostly jumping in the air, pausing there for a couple of seconds with sword raised and unleashing massive freaking blasts of energy upon landing. So I got the idea into my head that I want to build (if not play) a wushu/anime-style orcish blade mystic in D&D.

It's been brewing in my head for a couple of days and I think I've settled for a gestalt Swordsage//Totemist class combo (swordsage would do, but I love gestalt - but then, don't we all?), refluffing the incarnum abilities as mystic tattoos. The trouble is, I've never played with incarnum and haven't really given the MoI book more than a couple of glances so far. I have a pretty good idea of what I want with this guy, but a much worse idea on how to do it. So I come to you, playgrounders. Help me make this into a fun build.

Specifications:
Concept: Wushu/anime/wire-fu orc blade mystic. Reddish brown skin, tattooed all over (black lines, forming geometric shapes and tribal patterns). Wears little armour and doesn't carry much gear. Leaps into combat with a two handed curved blade, unleashing supernatural, visually impressive attacks left and right through the sword. Tattoos glow when he 'powers them' (channels essentia into his soulmelds). His backstory is hazy at this point, but it involves a sacred cavern, a vision, his chieftain's daughter and him slaughtering his entire tribe single-handedly. I'm not sure why he'd do that yet, but it was not in a fit of rage, and he does not regret it the least. He's Chaotic Neutral (though with a strong personal sense of honour).
Race: Orc or half-orc. Templates and stuff are OK if it fits the theme (including variant subraces), but don't go crazy on the LA. Houseruled base orc stats are +4 str, +2 con, -2 int, -2 cha - a net +2, but they don't get anything else but darkvision (and light sensitivity, which kind of sucks) so we think it's pretty fair.
Stats: I've rolled 18, 18, 17, 15, 13, 10, and placed into stats that end up as, with orc racial mods: Str 19, Dex 18, Con 19, Int 11, Wis 18, Cha 8. Some will think this is 'overpowered' or something, but it's pretty much par for the course in my group. Use these stats, adjust if you use half-orc for some reason (or if you use a variant orc subrace with different stats).
Classes: As I said above I'm going for Swordsage//Totemist gestalt. It doesn't have to follow this the whole way through, however - I think a barbarian level or two would be nice on the Totemist side. Use whatever fits the concept, including PrCs.
Gear: I'd prefer to be as lightly armoured as possible (staying bare-chested and wearing only baggy trousers and a sash or belt below waist), and to wield a falchion as my weapon of choice. I might rationalize light armour as small plates of armour here and there - bracers, light pauldrons, a steel-plate girdle, a vest etc. - but I'd prefer no armour if this doesn't gimp me too much. Maybe a monk dip would help (or does the Wis mod from Swordsage not stack with the monk's?), though I am loath to use that class normally. I suppose a semi-unarmed swordsage would work, losing armour proficiency for the monk's AC bonus while still using weapons, but it's not exactly official. Other than that, just assume regular WBL.
Feats: No preference here, use what works. Power Attack, Leap Attack and that thing from Dragon Magic whose name eludes me that lets you substitute PA damage for energy damage would fit, but aren't necessary. Oh, and flaws and traits are fine (encouraged even).
Skills: I'd like at least Jump maxed. Some other acrobatic skills like Climb and Tumble should be high, so should Concentration.
ToB disciplines: Desert Wind fits like a glove right from the start with Burning Blade. Diamond Mind works nicely with the two-handed falchion. But then, Swordsage gets so many manoeuvres, they don't really need to stick to one or two do they? - so whatever works. I think the Swordsage side should probably be handling my offensive side and the Totemist incarnum soulmeld thingies be more passive-defensive stuff.
Soulmelds: As I said, I think they should probably be mostly passive and handle the defensive side mainly, but augmenting the offence is ok as well. Feel free to use the Draconic Soulmelds (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp%3Fx%3Ddnd/ex/20060912a%26page%3D4) from Dragon Magic. They fit the theme nicely. Other than that, I have no idea what works well.
Books allowed: I have just about any WotC book you can think of, so anything but 3rd party goes (though if you know of something 3rd party that would be awesome I'll consider it). I'd appreciate staying out of BoED and BOVD though.

...did I miss anything?

Chronos
2008-06-03, 08:00 PM
Let's see... For starters, Akheg Breastplate would be nice (at least at low levels), if you're planning on not wearing armor: It gives an armor bonus of 2+essentia. If you're planning on primarily using your sword, though, I'm not sure what you would bind to your totem chakra, since most totem binds give you a natural weapon... The only one which comes to mind offhand is Blink Shirt: DimDoor at will is nice (and probably fits well with your concept), but all the totem bind does is turns it from a standard action to a move, and you still can't act after using it. So you could use a strike and then blink away, but you couldn't blink into battle.

Swooper
2008-06-04, 07:25 AM
Thanks. I had looked at ankheg breastplate and it looks ok, though the binds are not so interesting. Blink Shirt is mildly unimpressive, since it takes a standard/move action and I can't attack after it, but if it's the only thing for my totem slot then I suppose it's optional mobility. Not bad. Nice out of combat utility there, too (it still needs LoE though, right?).

Anyone else who has experience with MoI who has suggestions for this character? :smallsmile:

McClintock
2008-06-04, 08:09 AM
what are the pre-reqs for the Sun School feat? that one which allows you to dim/teleport & attack. It may allow for what you are going for.

Swooper
2008-06-04, 08:26 AM
what are the pre-reqs for the Sun School feat? that one which allows you to dim/teleport & attack. It may allow for what you are going for.
I think it needs at least Flurry of Blows, meaning a monk level (which I'd like to avoid if possible). Anyway, it's likely I'll have Blink Shirt up most of the time (if Chronos is right about most of the totem binds being natural attacks, which I don't really need), so I can do without it.

Lochar
2008-06-04, 08:33 AM
He means that when you bind a soulmeld to your totem chakra, the benefit given is usually a natural attack.

Swooper
2008-06-04, 08:39 AM
He means that when you bind a soulmeld to your totem chakra, the benefit given is usually a natural attack.
I know. Did I phrase it badly? :s

Lochar
2008-06-04, 08:40 AM
No, I just read your post wrong, thought you were looking for clarification.

Ignore me.

Adumbration
2008-06-04, 09:58 AM
Let me guess. The hero in question is Juggernaut?

Keld Denar
2008-06-04, 10:44 AM
Sounds like you need some way to cast Whirling Blade often or at will. That would manifest your ability to essentially attack with the energy of your weapon at a distance. Could you do something like a reflavored Dragonfire Inspiration Bard/Warblade on one side, then get something like a reflavored Dragon Disciple (for the extra 2nd level spell slots and stats) on the other side. This would give you the ability to channel burning energy through your weapon and then make a powerful slash attack that would wave out from your character.

Sorry, I don't know that much about MoI, I have the book but haven't read it yet. I'm sure you could mix in a few levels while you are qualifying for DD.

Kind of an interesting idea.

BTW, DotA rules!

Adumbration
2008-06-04, 11:00 AM
If I'm right, it's this right here. (http://www.dota-allstars.com/hero/1884/index.html)

Swooper
2008-06-04, 11:48 AM
Adumbration: Nope, it wasn't DotA so not juggernaut. It was this (http://www.epicwar.com/maps/44609/) map, made by some crazy Vietnamese guy with the worst english-fu EVAR. The tooltips alone are hilarious (as well as completely useless...). The hero in question is 'Blade Wizzard' [sic].

Lussmanj: ...You're pretty obsessed with that spell, aren't you? :smallbiggrin: While it would be cool to have and fit the theme, I don't think I want to make major changes to the build I had in mind just to squeeze it in. It's a nice idea though, and a nice angle to my concept, just not what I had in mind.

Are the incarnum feats any good, anyone? Anything that's a 'must have' for a totemist? Anything that looks better than it is and should be avoided?

EDIT: How about PrCs? Is the Totem Rager any good?

Swooper
2008-06-04, 08:31 PM
From what I'm seeing, Totem Rager doesn't look worth it for more than a few levels. It loses access to the higher level bind slots (throat, waist, heart) and delayed access to arms, brow and shoulders, and instead gets improved use out of the Cobalt Rage feat, Extra Rage, minor DR/- and some other minor abilities. Any thoughts on this? :smallconfused:

Chronos
2008-06-05, 12:17 AM
EDIT: How about PrCs? Is the Totem Rager any good?First thought on Totem Rager is that it's probably considered one of those dual-advancement classes that's not allowed in Gestalt. Make sure to check with your DM.

As for losing chakra binds, I wouldn't sweat it too much, since items are usually better than binds, anyway. I see the binds as only being useful for body slots that you happen not to have found a good item for yet. And the totem chakra, of course, since you can't wear an item on your totem.

Swooper
2008-06-05, 05:08 PM
Hmm, point there, although I wouldn't regard it as such any more than Eldritch Knight, although the latter is explicitly mentioned in the gestalt rules. Not that I expect ever playing this guy - a 3.5 game (rare enough now that 4e is out tomorrow) that's not only gestalt, but allows both ToB and incarnum, as well as unconventional races!? Unheard of! :/

Thanks for the insight on chakra binds. I haven't had time to read most of it, so I haven't absorbed this stuff yet. *cough*Also, it's a lot less easy to read pdfs on a laptop than actual books.*cough*

Chronos
2008-06-05, 06:20 PM
Hmm, point there, although I wouldn't regard it as such any more than Eldritch Knight, although the latter is explicitly mentioned in the gestalt rules.Eh, it requires the distinctive and primary class features of two different classes, and then advances both of those primary class features. Admittedly, it doesn't advance rage in quite the same way that Barbarian does, but it does definitely advance it.

Swooper
2008-06-05, 07:03 PM
Eh, it requires the distinctive and primary class features of two different classes, and then advances both of those primary class features. Admittedly, it doesn't advance rage in quite the same way that Barbarian does, but it does definitely advance it.
The question I like to ask myself in cases like this is: "Would allowing this PrC in gestalt be easily breakable?" In this case, I think the answer is no. Totem rager is just a specialised melee Totemist. If you take totemist again on the other side of the gestalt, you're hardly gaining anything except a few meldshaper levels (where the TR doesn't advance it) and some extra essentia etc, which can be done by putting two incarnum classes together anyway. With a barbarian, you get a bit better and more rages and more DR, as well as higher BAB and HP. Nothing broken here, I believe.

Still, let's not get into a power balance discussion here please. Especially over a theoretical fun-build that will likely never be played :smalltongue: