A tad intimidating...

[TheShadowSage]

I'm not that intelligent, I'm not that good of a designer, and I'm certainly not very creative. So I'm rather intimidated by all of you here. While I would like to try and run a 4E game with a bunch of people that actually know stuff and in a place where it might stay alive, I'm also incredibly scared of screwing up in front of the gamers I admire the most for their ingenuity and being ten times more intelligent, creative, and in general good with systems than I am.

Any advice?

[Don Julio Anejo]

Uhm.. yeah.. I should probably have something better to say, but still.. Suppose you do screw up. So what? It's not the end of the world. Your life isn't going to get any worse. The people you're playing with won't suddenly start hating you. Chances are you're just going to learn from your mistakes and not repeat them when you host the next game.

You're probably afraid because you think they're going to mock you, call you stupid and lose respect for you. Well guess what? It's not going to happen unless they're complete jerkasses, but if they are I doubt you would speak that highly of them. Crap, I could use a course in cognitive therapy right about now.

[Bor the Barbarian Monk]

Do exactly what you're doing. :smallsmile:

Only some of us are scary. The rest of us...are even scarier than that. :smalltongue:

In all seriousness, I commend you for asking. I've been known to say quite often that your dumbest question is the one you don't ask. By making the inquiry, you're already having a shining moment.

As for advice on running a game...No clue. I don't go into the PbP area. I hear they eat barbarian monks for breakfast. :smalleek:

[Thanatos 51-50]

As for advice on running a game...No clue. I don't go into the PbP area. I hear they eat barbarian monks for breakfast. :smalleek:

Nope, only the occasionaly Sunday brunch or so, if we're really, really hungry.
And I'd consider ones named "Bor" immune. I mean, am I gong to be snacking on Bacon or a Barbarian Monk? Its confusing!:smallyuk:

As to the OP: I haven't gotten to run any PbPs for any significant length of time, (and indeed, don't have my 4e books, yet), but I would recomend either playing a few, or prefacing the whole recritment thread with "I'm new at PbP". Also, try to recruit beginers, or beginers to 4e. Beginners threads get heaps of responses from beginners and PbP vets alike.:smallbiggrin:

[Nychta]

Good on you for asking. I realise that in the realm of gaming, everyone would probably outshine me, but stick around here for a while, everyone is ever so nice and you'll learn heaps.

[Glyphic]

I have two or three pieces of advice.

Keep it simple; you'll be able to focus on what matters most to you (weather it is story, combat, or whatever else.), and still have some good fun.

Remind yourself that it's okay to make mistakes; everyone does it, and the goal is to learn from them.

Think positive.

And lastly.. "Bust a Move!"

[Jade_Tarem]

Well, I have confidence in my intelligence and creative abilities, have been DMing for a long time, and recently started DMing for PbP here, and I was also intimidated by the prospect. Started anyway and it's been great.

A few things that help make it easier, even than normal DnD:

1. Preparation. You don't have to make a snap call. Ever. And if you do post something and decide that you don't like it, there's still the good ol' edit button, which you can use with impunity up until any of your players posts. Also, this means that if you do make a mistake, you have a lot of time to try to figure out an in-game solution that will fix it without your players ever knowing.

2. The OOC threads. Just be sure to have one - this is where players post as players rather than characters, and tends to be much more informal - players also frequently put out-of-character comments in the in-character threads like so:

Example

Konnor pushes past the warforged on the way out. "'Scuse me, big guy."

OOC:
So, like, what happened to Tim_SlayerMan? We haven't heard from him in a while.

3. Finally, most players are pretty nice. In the event that you do screw up horribly, put a note in the IC thread to check the OOC one, and in the OOC thread, just say, "Sorry guys, but I screwed this up real bad, and I need to fix it." Your players won't mock you (or if they do, you need to find some new players, because most aren't like that). Some may even offer helpful suggestions. Most of the players are in this to have fun too, and getting pissy at the DM does not help with that.

A couple of tips that I can think of:

1. Read the moderators' thread on running pbp games first - it clears up a few questions.

2. Be careful with combat. It goes much slower in PbP than it does in "RL." I'm not saying don't do it, I'm saying you probably want to use it sparingly.

3. Remember that the entire point is to have fun.

4. Also remember that sometimes bad things happen to good games. I ran two groups in the same campaign (with different goals) at the same time, and everyone in one group just stopped posting, all at once, with no explanation given. There was one player who didn't, and he assured me that there were no obvious flaws with the campaign, and that he was enjoying himself, and that he'd love to continue. So I'm going to move him to the other group, which is still going strong.

5. And also, the fact that you've posted here to ask in the first place and admit that you're not all that confident shows that at least you care enough to try to improve. My final advice is to take your campaign and your final boss and run it through Rich Burlew's Campaign and Villian Workshop threads in the gaming section (not the gaming section of the forum, the gaming section of the site - it's on the tab to the left). Burlew seems to have a ton of gaming experience, and has helpfully put up alot of what he's learned on the site for your free perusal. If your campaign and villain reasonably fit most of what he has there, you're good to go. There's also a thread in the d20 gaming section of the forums on DMing (it's pretty good) that you can read if you want.

I hope this helps, and that I haven't put you off of the idea even more. Who knows, perhaps I'll end up playing in one of your games. :smallsmile:

[TheShadowSage]

First off:

Wow, thank you all for such kind, helpful, encouraging, and speedy responses. You definitely have made me feel a bit better about the idea of running a game here. ^^

Secondly, thanks for the advice on actually making/running the game. I'll be sure to check all of the helpful tools mentioned out, though my campaigns do end up a bit combat-heavy when I design them, that might be a thing worthy of looking into toning down a bit. ^^; (But it's such fun combat, in 4th edition with the new power system that I love ever so much.)

[Tempest Fennac]

If you're worried about something going wrong, getting someone to co-DM it would probably help. I'd say the rest of the advice is good as well. (Incidentally, how do I class as scary?:smalltongue:)

[Jade_Tarem]

(Incidentally, how do I class as scary?:smalltongue:)

Grey Elf Wizard 3, Master Specialist 4, Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil 7, Archmage 5, Geometer 1. At least, that's how you do it in 3.5.

Trust me, it's scary. :smalltongue:

[Tempest Fennac]

Ironically, I'd never play mas that sort of character (I prefer half animal races, I don't really like PrCs anyway, and I prefer to avoid anything that's too broken due to not wanting to spoil the game for other players). That would be pretty scary to a DM who was willing to allow it for some reason, though. (What would tha barred schools be for that combination, and what would it's specialist school be?).

[RTGoodman]

That would be pretty scary to a DM who was willing to allow it for some reason, though. (What would tha barred schools be for that combination, and what would it's specialist school be?.

Specialized school would probably be Divination (it's a good school, and you only have to initially give up one school), and barred schools would probably be Evocation, Enchantment, and/or Necromancy.


Anyway, on topic, if you're looking to run a PbP, just mention in the initial post what you said here and ask that people go easy if you screw up. No one will flame your or anything (well, maybe a couple...), and you'll probably end up attracting a few people in similar circumstances.

[Jade_Tarem]

Well, I mean, I never play as anything like that either, but you did ask...

Um, Specialty school would probably be conjuration, if all the splatbooks were allowed. I don't think you have to bar more than two schools for that build, and I would pick Necromancy and Enchantment. The only spells that you're really, really going to miss (out of dozens of enchantment and necromancy spells) are the Power Words, Magic Jar, Ray of Enfeeblement, and at lower levels, Sleep and Hold Person. The problem is with IotSFV, which has some rather harsh prerequisites. You have to have several of many different kinds of spells, and two different Spell Focus feats. It can be done though.

To be fair, in 3.5 anything with a full caster progression is going to be terrifying at high levels. In 3.0 Arcane Archer probably takes the cake as the DM's nightmare. Either that, or the TWF Ranger with the twin keen vorpal bladed gauntlets and the improved crit range feat. He automatically kills anything that bleeds on an attack roll of 2 or higher, and he gets a ridiculous number of attacks per round.

Ok, I'm done derailing the thread... :smalltongue:

[UserClone]

I'm not. What's a Geometer?

Also, OP, if you'd like, PM me when you get started with your PbP, and I'd be happy to join/be helpful.

[Player_Zero]

Only some of us are scary. The rest of us...are even scarier than that. :smalltongue:




And lastly.. "Bust a Move!"


Well played you two.... Well played...

...Oh crap! I just remembered that I have a campaign to write!

...And if it's any consolation then you're undoubtedly going to be playing with the socially awkward types, this is D&D afterall. :smalltongue:

[Jade_Tarem]

I'm not. What's a Geometer?

Ok, you win. :smalltongue:

Geometer is a prestige class from the Complete Arcane. It pales in comparison to the Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil, but it has easy prerequisites and you don't lose any casting progression, which is the important part.

The fluff is basically that it's a wizard who has figured out how to substitute "Spellglyphs" for normal spellcasting. Mechanically, a two level dip in this (meaning that I put one too many levels in archmage and one two few in Geometer) gives you the ability to cast any spell as a silent spell (no level increase) if you're willing to pay a little money to do so, and it also replaces your spellbook with a newer, better book where spells only take up one page per spell - so that you don't end up with this problem. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0306.html)

It's a couple of things to help your wizard out economically. If you just want to go with pure firepower, you might be better off dropping the two levels in geometer and replacing them with two levels in fatespinner, so that you can boost the save DCs of your spells and make enemies reroll good saves (or your friends reroll bad saves).

Although it occured to me that there is one thing that's worse - the recent Complete Champion has a prestige class called mystic exemplar, where if you read the book word-for-word, you end up with this:


You gain +1 level of an existing arcane spellcasting class.

or, if you choose a different path (there are six):


You gain +1 level of an existing divine spellcasting class.

Read that carefully. That's right, it's a prestige class, and one of the class features is bonus levels. Never mind that it doesn't have a full casting progression - it doesn't need one! You get two, and they stack!

This can't possibly be what was intended. The text doesn't match the table, either, so if you take the book exactly at face value, it's possible that a situation could arise where the party is level 11, the M.E. player is level 15, and he's casting 9th level spells. At ECL 11.

Fixing the wording (and it's obvious what was actually intended) gives you a much more balanced PrC, but it's still pretty funny.

[Arameus]

Jesus, Lord of Oranges, this is not 4chan for crying out loud; if you screw up, there will probably be a warm blanket, back-patting and hearty stew forthcoming, not the iron-cold damnation of one thousand accusing fingers, whispered recriminations, and dubious links to rectal horrors.

You shouldn't worry so much about your ability. I really don't see any basis for them anyway; you strang your sentences together with a mastery one should reasonably master by 4th grade, which puts you in at least the 60th percentile of posters, sadly, and I think if you were actively gaming and had a bit of warm, organic inspiration from the setting and the other players you'd find you had quite a bit more tricks up your sleeve than you realized.

Let loose, enjoy yourself, and just have fun. :smallbiggrin:

[UserClone]

You shouldn't worry so much about your ability. I really don't see any basis for them anyway; you strang your sentences together with a mastery one should reasonably master by 4th grade, which puts you in at least the 60th percentile of posters, sadly, and I think if you were actively gaming and had a bit of warm, organic inspiration from the setting and the other players you'd find you had quite a bit more tricks up your sleeve than you realized.(Emphasis mine)
LoL @ "strang," especially given the context. It's strung, or, rarely, stringed. I <3 irony. Also, yes, this is an especially good place for a fledgling DM to try his/her hand at PbP.

[Arameus]

See also my location at the left. As a natural-born Tennessean, I am allowed one blatant grammatical or elecutory foul-up, whether deliberate or otherwise, no more than once every six hours, up to three instances a day, without such a slip-up constituting a violation of the rules of the English language. It's a Racial ability, you see, and along with my prestige class, Southern Gentry, I can actually use it for a +2 bonus to any applicable Charisma-based check, to which you yourself have fallen victim.

Which means you have triggered my Xanatos Gambit, and helped me to prove that this is indeed a forum home to playful, good-natured players who enjoy good, nerdy fun and don't take themselves too seriously. Thanks, pawn!

Of course, this is all ignoring the fact that I do not play Dungeons & Dragons.

[Burrito]

...Your life isn't going to get any worse..... Best line ever (when taken out of context):smallwink:

DMing is a talent that takes practice. There is nothing wrong with letting the players know that your new. Anybody that gives you a hard time for it is just jealous that they don't have the brass-balls needed to be a DM themselves.

Co-DMing is always a good option too, expecially when one handles the combat and dice rolls, and the other handles the storytelling and NPC, etc. Some can do the number crunching better, and some can tell a story better.

[Illiterate Scribe]

Jesus, Lord of Oranges, this is not 4chan for crying out loud; if you screw up, there will probably be a warm blanket, back-patting and hearty stew forthcoming, not the iron-cold damnation of one thousand accusing fingers, whispered recriminations, and dubious links to rectal horrors.

You shouldn't worry so much about your ability. I really don't see any basis for them anyway; you strang your sentences together with a mastery one should reasonably master by 4th grade, which puts you in at least the 60th percentile of posters, sadly, and I think if you were actively gaming and had a bit of warm, organic inspiration from the setting and the other players you'd find you had quite a bit more tricks up your sleeve than you realized.

Let loose, enjoy yourself, and just have fun. :smallbiggrin:

Actually, the blessing of anonymity means that such imageboards are probably more easy to screw up on without worrying; you simply lol and bear it.

[Lord Fullbladder, Master of Goblins]

Run, child. Run before they lure you in with their kind words and their delicious cake. Flee before they get you. 'Tis a trap. You cannot get out. They'll come for you.

Run now while you can, before they home in on your location. Run.

[ForzaFiori]

See also my location at the left. As a natural-born Tennessean, I am allowed one blatant grammatical or elecutory foul-up, whether deliberate or otherwise, no more than once every six hours, up to three instances a day, without such a slip-up constituting a violation of the rules of the English language. It's a Racial ability, you see, and along with my prestige class, Southern Gentry, I can actually use it for a +2 bonus to any applicable Charisma-based check, to which you yourself have fallen victim.

Which means you have triggered my Xanatos Gambit, and helped me to prove that this is indeed a forum home to playful, good-natured players who enjoy good, nerdy fun and don't take themselves too seriously. Thanks, pawn!

Of course, this is all ignoring the fact that I do not play Dungeons & Dragons.

Does any southerner get that, or just the Tennesseans?

[Vella_Malachite]

It's OK, ShadowSage, as has been iterated and reiterated repeatedly through this thread, no-one is going to massacre you if you screw up. We're all pretty good and easygoing here, and I assure you that you will have at least 4/5 of your party supporting you if you mess up.

I've just recently started my first DMing campaign too, only it's in RL, not PbP, but I've made too many mistakes to even count them, for instance, I've put the BBEG in front of the party to do some taunting and I'd thought I'd made him high-level enough to get them, but it seems that he wasn't that strong compared to the party after all, and he nearly died right then and there (I got one of his spellcaster minions to cast Teleport on him and fudged the die roll so he succeeded, but I'm leveling up that evil master as soon as I get the chance...). No-one even commented on it, except the fact that I'd better make him a little tougher. See, they don't hate you, they help you!

I'd just like to point out that DMing is at least as fun as being a PC. I just love the control and making sadistic scenarios to annoy them, imagining their faces as they come to terms with what I've just inflicted on them...:smallamused:
But I'm not a horrible person, really...:smalltongue:

[Jade_Tarem]

Does any southerner get that, or just the Tennesseans?

Mostly, those in the SEC get the rage ability once per football encounter, if their team is losing.

I took a racial substitution instead and joined the nerd culture.

[Lord Tataraus]

Well, aside from the other advice people have given you (especially, don't worry about screwing up) I have one thing to say: read. Read other PbP games, see how the DM runs it, read many different DMs and maybe even different genres and systems, glean as much as you can. To me, this is one of the great things about PbP, I can run a game and others (besides the players) can read and get ideas for their games or improve their DMing from my methods and mistakes. As you are browsing the forum, look in the posters' sigs for links to games and read a few pages, that's what I did :smallbiggrin:

Here are a few of mine: The Crimson Rose (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59714) and Valdar, World of Elemental Leylines (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=66004)
On a different forum which has amazing PbP tools: Psyberpunk - Night City Renegades (http://www.myth-weavers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7918).

Oh, and alwas have an OOC thread, I like to call mine "Random Talk" since my players like to post all sorts of banter.