PDA

View Full Version : [M&M 2e] Power Questions

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 11:57 AM
Well, I just got the M&M book and I've run into some questions on powers.

First, when taking Alternate Power, do power feats for the origional power (excluding Alternate Power feats of course) count towards the cost of the origional power for determining how powerful an ability I can get with Alternate Power? For example, if I have a 10 rank Blast (20 points) and I took the power feats Homing, Improved Range, Precise, and Accurate and then took Alternate Power on it, would I have 20 points or 24 points to spend on the Alternate Power?

Second, if I have a pair of linked powers (such as a lighting Blast and a thunder Dazzle) and then took Alternate Power on one of them (say Elemental Control(Air) as an Alternate Power for the Blast), is the other half of the linked pair also linked to the Alternate Power?

Third, are poweres with a Burst area circular or spherical? i.e. Are they a disk or a ball shaped area? Is it preference?

String
2008-08-09, 12:03 PM
First: You would have24 pp to work with in that example. Power Feats, Extras and Flaws all count.

I' not sure on the second.

Third: Spherical. I believe it's clarified in Ultimate Power. If youre on a flat surface it creates a hemisphere centered on the point of origin

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 12:18 PM
Thanks.

Another Question: If I have the Blast power, do I need to take multiple Alternate Powers to have it use different elemental effects (such as fire and lightning) or can I just take it once and get multiple effects?

Grynning
2008-08-09, 12:21 PM
Fire and Lightning are descriptors, so I believe you would need two different AP's for having a blast of each type. Of course the GM could rule otherwise since it wouldn't affect the rank of the blast, but since immunity powers and such are based on descriptors they are technically two different powers.

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 12:24 PM
Works for me.

String
2008-08-09, 12:26 PM
I also think that there might be a Variable Descriptor Power Feat in one of the books, but I'm not certain.

Cannonball
2008-08-09, 12:31 PM
1. You have 24 points to spend on thet alternate power. As has been said above: ranks, extras, flaws, feats and drawbacks all count towards the final cost.

2. Linked powers are treated as 1 power for the purposes of things like APs. So you essentially add both the first power and the linked power together to determine how many points you can spend on the AP. Of course, nothing is stopping you from from only changing one half of the link and then linking it to the exact same power as in the first one.

3. Sphereical. It is indeed clarified in Ultimate Power.

And yes, there's a variable descriptor feat in Ultimate Power. Really, if you're playing M&M 2nd Edition, Ultimate Power is a must. Excellent resource for the game.

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 01:01 PM
Would a power that only works while playing a musical instrument have the Limited flaw or would it be the Power Loss drawback (since without a musical instrument the power doesn't work)?

String
2008-08-09, 01:05 PM
I would say either is applicable, although I would go with Power Loss, myself.

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 01:27 PM
Do Power Drawbacks reduce the cost of a Power or do they give bonus power points? i.e. Is a 20 point power with a 3 point draw back still 20 points? It matters for the Alternate Power feat.

For a blast effect always centered on you, would that be an Area Power with a range of touch?

String
2008-08-09, 02:06 PM
It reduces the Cost of the power:

Blast 10 [Sonic Boom] (Power Feat: AP1 Power Loss: Without Intrument -1)
AP: Magic 10
Total Cost: 20pp

although if NONE of your powers work without the instrument then you may apply the drawback to the entire suite.

Blast 10 [Sonic Boom] (Power Feat:Ap1)
AP: Magic 10
(Power Loss -1 Without Instrument)
Cost 20pp

With this example its not a difference, but with more Alternate powers it would be.

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 02:16 PM
For a blast effect always centered on you, would that be an Area Power with a range of touch?

Beleriphon
2008-08-09, 04:32 PM

That would of course be correct.

Kyeudo
2008-08-09, 04:34 PM
Probably my last question: Is a superhero generally immune to the effects of his own powers? For example, if a hero is in the area of his own fire blast, does he have to make a save as well?

String
2008-08-09, 04:54 PM
Ohmigod its Beliriphon. Um ,just so you know, Bel, you're the reason I found Atomic Think Tanks (I'm Psiko on there, btw).

Sorry, Kyeudo, back to you.

I believe that in general that a superhero is NOT immune to his own powers, but your example is one of the exceptions. Area Damage (such as a blast with the Area extra) that is centered on the hero creating it does not hurt the hero (although you can apply a flaw to make it hurt you, I think). Otherwise, I don't think that you CAN target yourself with your attacks, so it's all down to someone reflecting it or something, at which point (as I said above) you are NOT immune to your own powers. Although, you can purchase the proper immunity for 1pp

Ecalsneerg
2008-08-10, 09:24 AM
Probably my last question: Is a superhero generally immune to the effects of his own powers? For example, if a hero is in the area of his own fire blast, does he have to make a save as well?
Immunity to your own powers costs 1 pp.

Now the area effect depends on the range. It it's a ranged area attack, like a fireball, you will be damaged if you are in the area. If it's a touch area attack, like fire emanating out from around you, you'll be unharmed.

Talic
2008-08-10, 10:09 AM
Would a power that only works while playing a musical instrument have the Limited flaw or would it be the Power Loss drawback (since without a musical instrument the power doesn't work)?

Both, though I generally use Power Loss, as it's more specific. Limited may be that your Transformations can only assume the shape of sea creatures, or that your Invisibility only works on one opponent at a time.

For instance, while playing the guitar, Jon Bovi gains almost mythical powers.

He can play power chords, producing such a powerful sound that those he plays for fall over, in pain, dazed from the music (Sonic Blast, Linked with Stun).

Alternately, his chord can trigger explosions and pyrotechnic displays (Alternate power: Fire Blast, linked with penetration)

Or, if he slows his rhythm, and plays more softly, he can bring about changes in the most hardened soul, causing them to stop in their tracks from the sheer beauty of it. (Alternate power, Mental transform, emotions, linked to stunning)

Now, if the entire matrix only worked while he had an instrument, that would be a power loss. If however, the power isn't fully available, and only certain aspects of it are usable, then it's limited. For example, if you have the following powers:

Super Strength: But only underwater
Telepathy: But only with sea creatures
Shapeshifting: But only into sea creatures.

Then you'd be aquaman. But you'd also be a hero with Limited powers.

fireinthedust
2008-08-10, 11:24 AM
Fire and Lightning are descriptors, so I believe you would need two different AP's for having a blast of each type. Of course the GM could rule otherwise since it wouldn't affect the rank of the blast, but since immunity powers and such are based on descriptors they are technically two different powers.

They're very much two different powers! Consider hitting a golem, who might have boost activate as a reaction when hit by lightning.

Alternate powers: yeah, you tally up all the pp you spent on that power and just re-spend it on the new one. Keep in mind that the powers have to be from the same source. You can't just have the ability to do blasts, they'd both have to be from your magical ring (ie: both extensions of the ring in different forms) or whatever the power gimmick is.
Superman could make burrowing and spinning APs of his flight, but not of his eye beams, because the burrowing could be seen as his moving and flying fast but not what his eye beams do.
Likewise old school spiderman could have APs on his Snare (webbing) power, for create object (makes propellers or nightvision goggles for some reason); but he obviously couldn't AP off his dexterity.

Linked powers are always together, so they're basically one power with two effects. Ergo, yeah, you'd just cannibalize the one power's pp total and tally your AP.

JMobius
2008-08-10, 11:38 PM
So, I'm looking at GMing this game soon. I'm thinking I must have missed a rule somewhere, because one of my players just pointed out that it costs 21 points for the ability to communicate with and control all machines in the universe... 20 ranks of datalink and the machine control feat. Something about that just seems wrong to me, but so far I haven't been able to find anything to say otherwise.

Kyeudo
2008-08-11, 12:19 AM
He's probably correct. However, such a power would likely violate the power level limits of most games.

Beleriphon
2008-08-11, 12:39 AM
So, I'm looking at GMing this game soon. I'm thinking I must have missed a rule somewhere, because one of my players just pointed out that it costs 21 points for the ability to communicate with and control all machines in the universe... 20 ranks of datalink and the machine control feat. Something about that just seems wrong to me, but so far I haven't been able to find anything to say otherwise.

He's right, but you're the GM. Check the GMing section of the rules. If you think think its broken then say no. Or better say "Yes, but..." and make it take something like an hour or more to perform the action. Keep in mind that being able to do is actually pretty pointless unless you, as the GM, decide that doing so has some function in game. You might want to encourge your player to spend the points on something more useful, although it would make a really cool power stunt.

Note: There are no PL limits on powers that don't force saves, or make attack roles by their nature.

Talic
2008-08-11, 01:23 AM
Yup. For instance, healing factor and the like.

There are limits to the amount of benefit you can garner from an ability, but, so long as a power doesn't touch on any of those areas, the sky's the limit.

It's one of the tricks behind Alternate Form. With enough cheesing, you can design an alternate form with more character points than you started with.

JMobius
2008-08-11, 01:32 AM
He's right, but you're the GM. Check the GMing section of the rules. If you think think its broken then say no. Or better say "Yes, but..." and make it take something like an hour or more to perform the action. Keep in mind that being able to do is actually pretty pointless unless you, as the GM, decide that doing so has some function in game. You might want to encourge your player to spend the points on something more useful, although it would make a really cool power stunt.

Note: There are no PL limits on powers that don't force saves, or make attack roles by their nature.

He wasn't interested in taking it, actually, he was more just pointing out to me that that seemed pretty potent for a relatively inexpensive cost. It just struck me as odd because it seemed like something that PL would address somehow, but your note was what I was looking for. Thanks. :)

Talic
2008-08-11, 02:12 AM
He wasn't interested in taking it, actually, he was more just pointing out to me that that seemed pretty potent for a relatively inexpensive cost. It just struck me as odd because it seemed like something that PL would address somehow, but your note was what I was looking for. Thanks. :)

Nah, you alternate power a bunch of things to it, and just use those as what's happening. Blast? Crash a 747 into the enemy. Gravity control? Alien grav-pulse emitter on a distant world, aimed correctly. That's a funny way to tie it in.