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View Full Version : Clone + True mindswitch = Party?



Asheram
2008-08-22, 05:16 PM
A little question I got to think of all of a sudden.
Say that... You made Clone (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/clone.htm) of a target creature, then proceeded to cast True Mindswitch (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/mindSwitchTrue.htm) on the completed clone... Would this work?
Or is it that a "Clone" body doesn't qualify as a living body?

Just curious now because this could be Very interesting if it indeed worked.

Krimm_Blackleaf
2008-08-22, 05:47 PM
I already did that for you. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87837)

Asheram
2008-08-22, 06:04 PM
A nice class and all such.. but not exactly what I were after.
Just wondering if it would work. Using a True mindswitch on a empty clone body...

Beside. Having multiple Me running around out there would be freaky. How could I be sure that they won't stab me in the back? I would if I were a clone :smallbiggrin:

Jack_Simth
2008-08-22, 06:18 PM
A nice class and all such.. but not exactly what I were after.
Just wondering if it would work. Using a True mindswitch on a empty clone body...

Beside. Having multiple Me running around out there would be freaky. How could I be sure that they won't stab me in the back? I would if I were a clone :smallbiggrin:
"A duplicate can be grown while the original still lives, or when the original soul is unavailable, but the resulting body is merely a soulless bit of inert flesh, which rots if not preserved."

As a DM, I'd say that a Clone of a still-living critter does not qualify as a living creature in and of itself, and so is not a valid target for True Mindswitch.

Now, a Simulacrum, on the other hand, is a completely different question....

boomwolf
2008-08-22, 07:36 PM
I already did that for you. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87837)

Clone spell with this class can quickly get out of control. each gathering his own XP from his own adventures, level up to these abilities and reclone himself until hims have the power to take over the world.

Lucky its psionic class, so its hard to have both clone and cap this.
But I don't think even a deity can handle a swarm of epic wizards/psions that keep replicating itself. one of the clones will get a lucky kill eventually.

Heck, if you can make constructs it will do! jest make ones that will have an easy time upgrading this class to max, and build more identical constructs. you will eventually face the "agent smith problem".

Back to topic: clones are not living unless the original dies/reanimated/etc.
But they are also not dead so you can't work with reanimation or resurrection spells.

Icewalker
2008-08-22, 08:21 PM
I would let you do it. In fact, I would probably do it as a plot hook.

Shades of Gray
2008-08-22, 09:02 PM
What would happen if you had a disease when you made a clone?

Or were a lich then got destroyed (you and phylactery) would the clone activate?

hamishspence
2008-08-24, 09:53 AM
Clones + massive messup = Clone War. It happened to Manshoon. Something went wrong and about a dozen "manshoons" came to life. And all started fighting each other.

Lyndworm
2008-08-24, 04:18 PM
RAW, no. This wouldn't work. Mindswitch targets you and a creature, but the Clone spell doesn't create a creature. It creates an inert chunk of flesh identical to the body from which the material component was taken, similar to a corpse. Since Mindswitch cannot target a corpse, it cannot target an inert Clone.

However, I would allow it on one condition. A massive burst of positive or negative energy pumped into the Clone at the precise moment the Mindswitch was to take place. Sort of a magically powered Frankenstein monster.

The reasoning behind this is that I would allow a corpse to be considered a living being for a short period of time if it had enough positive energy flowing through it, or an undead being if it had enough negative energy flowing through it.

A very interesting concept, though.

Zack

Asheram
2008-08-24, 04:27 PM
RAW, no. This wouldn't work. Mindswitch targets you and a creature, but the Clone spell doesn't create a creature. It creates an inert chunk of flesh identical to the body from which the material component was taken, similar to a corpse. Since Mindswitch cannot target a corpse, it cannot target an inert Clone.

However, I would allow it on one condition. A massive burst of positive or negative energy pumped into the Clone at the precise moment the Mindswitch was to take place. Sort of a magically powered Frankenstein monster.

The reasoning behind this is that I would allow a corpse to be considered a living being for a short period of time if it had enough positive energy flowing through it, or an undead being if it had enough negative energy flowing through it.

A very interesting concept, though.

Zack

Hmm. Large amount of positive energy... Time to find a bunch of clerics that research ritual healing!

My thanks. :biggrin:

Lyndworm
2008-08-24, 08:23 PM
I'm always glad to inspire abominations unto the Lord. :smallamused:

Zack

imp_fireball
2008-08-24, 09:13 PM
"A duplicate can be grown while the original still lives, or when the original soul is unavailable, but the resulting body is merely a soulless bit of inert flesh, which rots if not preserved."

As a DM, I'd say that a Clone of a still-living critter does not qualify as a living creature in and of itself, and so is not a valid target for True Mindswitch.

Now, a Simulacrum, on the other hand, is a completely different question....

However, if the purpose of 'true mindswitch' (from what the thread creator was trying to do) is to simply switch bodies, perhaps to avoid death, then the same can be achieved in a d20 sci-fi setting without the spell and instead with technology such as cryo and simultaneous brain grafting after death (a la eve online).

Right now I'm doing a d20 total conversion of eve online, which by the end I hope to have implemented a method for rapid invention in a campaign and the kind of campaigns which stretch over several years in a very short span in real life, with fantastic inventions being introduced to the economy. :P

Or if you really wanted, you could always add necromantic/divine (I wouldn't call it positive, since positive is really just divine intervention) energy into a setting with a ridiculous amount of technological misuse (a la warhammer 40k in which the skin off an ork's back is more durable than that of ceramite armor xD).

magic8BALL
2008-08-25, 02:05 AM
I read the power. Your mind is swapped with the clones mind, not copied into it. The only effect would be reducing your clones level by one.

Verdict: INEFFECTIVE.

Asheram
2008-08-25, 03:38 AM
I read the power. Your mind is swapped with the clones mind, not copied into it. The only effect would be reducing your clones level by one.

Verdict: INEFFECTIVE.

Well. Yeah. But then again, I'm not thinking of switching down with a clone of myself.
"Hello, mr Dragon! You wouldn't mind if I made a clone of you, would you?"

A little nicer way instead of stealing someones body from the beginning.

By the way, it's way easier to coerce a dragon to give up a square inch of flesh instead of trying to overcome that D#¤%#% willsave