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Yakk
2008-09-12, 03:35 PM
Implement Focus (Heroic): Requires the ability to use an Implement.
When using a power through a particular type of implement, the character gains a +1 bonus to all damage rolls. This feat may be taken multiple times, and each time a different implement must be chosen.

Wicked Curse (Heroic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
Roll an extra die for your Warlock's Curse damage, and discard the lowest die you roll for Warlock's Curse damage.

Selective Curse (Heroic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
You may choose to ignore up to your int bonus (min 1) targets when deciding who is cursed by your Warlock's Curse.

Eldritch Glaive (Heroic): Requires Warlock, Eldritch Blast at-will power.
You can now use Eldrich Blast as a Melee 2 power instead of a Range power, and it counts as a basic melee attack.

Hexing Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
A Warlock may remove the curse from a target to force the target to reroll a successful save. If the Warlock does so, the Warlock may not curse any target on the Warlock's next turn.

Staggering Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
Instead of dealing damage with a Warlock's Curse, the Warlock may slide the target 1 square. This counts as dealing damage with Warlock's Curse for the purpose of not being allowed to use Warlock's Curse more than once in a turn, or other related purposes.

Burning Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature, Infernal pact.
When you deal damage with your Warlock's Curse, you may choose to ignite the target with the flames of hell. Remove the Warlock's Curse from the target, and the target takes the Warlock's Con modifier continuing fire damage (save ends). The Warlock may not curse the target again until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.

Star-crossed Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature, Star pact
When you deal damage with your Warlock's Curse, you may choose to bend fate to a less than perfect shape for the target. Remove the Warlock's Curse from the target, and a defense of your choice on the target by a -3 power penalty until the end of the Warlock's next turn. The Warlock may not recurse the target until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.

Dream-tortured Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature, Fey pact.
When you deal damage with your Warlock's Curse, you may choose to entrap the target in a dream of madness. Remove the Warlock's Curse from the target. Until the end of the Warlock's next turn, whenever the target willingly leaves a square, you may as an immediate reaction slide the target charisma bonus squares (min 1) and deal 5 psychic damage to the target. The Warlock may not recurse the target until the end of the Warlock's next turn.

Twice Hexed Curse (Epic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
If you have already dealt curse damage once this round, you may choose to deal it a 2nd time on a different target you have just damaged. Deal your Warlock's Curse damage, and remove the curse from the damaged target. You may not Curse the target again until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.

Sympathy for the Devil (Epic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
When the Warlock is dealing Curse damage to a target, they may choose to instead remove the Curse and deal the curse damage to a different target which has been Cursed by the Warlock. The target whose curse was removed may not be cursed again by the Warlock until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.

...

These do need some balance work. But I've noted that the Arcane casters don't have nearly the same depth of feat choices that Martial classes do.

"Implement Focus" is for all implement users.
--- Heroic:
"Wicked Curse" is a basic damage-increasing power.

"Selective Curse" gives some nice flexibility.

"Glaive" is from 3e, and I think it works nicely.
--- Paragon:
"Hexing Curse" gives the Warlock a nice sub-control option

"Staggering Curse" works likewise. I intended it to consume your use of damage -- was that clear?

"Burning Curse" is a Paragon-tier damage boost. (save ends) powers deal about 1.8 times their base value -- so this deals about 9, plus 1 for every Con above 10. You do lose the ability to deal curse damage on the target the next round, which sucks if you are in "I really want to drop this creature" mode.
--- Epic:
"Twice Hexed Curse" lets a Warlock hit 2 targets in a single round for a minor cost. This leverages the fact that the Warlock can curse more than 1 opponent, unlike the other strikers.

"Sympathy for the Devil" is my favorite. You curse both a minion and a bad guy, then you burn the curse off of the minion (while killing it), and deal the curse damage to the big bad. Or vice versa -- burn a curse off of a normal opponent to kill a cursed minion.

The Sympathy is the Sympathic damage you spread between two enemies (damage one, another feels hurt). For the devil is ... well, we are talking warlocks. :-)

---

The "remove the curse, and no doing it again" is intended as a minor cost for the Warlock. They lose some single-target chain-curse damage power, and gain the secondary effect.

In some cases, you can have lots of fun combining these. Curse 2 opponents. :-)

You do have to be careful about how many targets that end up curse-immune. But if you are willing to switch targets frequently, you can up your damage per round significantly with these powers. And in some cases, you can up your damage per target in a single round a bunch too.

Imagine you have 5 targets cursed, including one you really want dead. Toss out an area attack, and even if you miss the one you want dead, you can Sympathy the damage over to it.

Edit: Modified Burning curse, added Star-Crossed curse and Dream-tortured curse.

chronoplasm
2008-09-12, 03:39 PM
I most certainly agree. Casters do need more feats.

I like implement focus, but I don't see the point of Sympathy for the Devil. Can you explain that one to me a little more?

Yakk
2008-09-12, 03:50 PM
Added commentary to the end of my original post.

That help? :)

Gralamin
2008-09-12, 04:19 PM
I most certainly agree. Casters do need more feats.

I like implement focus, but I don't see the point of Sympathy for the Devil. Can you explain that one to me a little more?

Say the target is almost dead for some reason or another, or is a minion. If you choose to remove the curse from that creature (Say because you know they will die, or your curse won't really matter after that point) then you can deal it to another cursed target anywhere on the battlefield (May want to say in 5 or 10 squares Yakk).

Effectively, this lets a single attack roll kill two distant minions, kill a minion and hurt a big thing, or hurt two big things. It helps spread the damage around in an interesting fashion.



Implement Focus (Heroic): Requires the ability to use an Implement.
When using a power through a particular type of implement, the character gains a +1 bonus to all damage rolls. This feat may be taken multiple times, and each time a different implement must be chosen.
Its weapon focus for an implement. Fairly basic feat.


Wicked Curse (Heroic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
Roll an extra die for your Warlock's Curse damage, and discard the lowest die you roll for Warlock's Curse damage.
This is quite good, and I like it a lot. Running some stats on it...


1 in 36 chance to roll 1
3 in 36 chance to roll 2
5 in 36 chance to roll 3
7 in 36 chance to roll 4
9 in 36 chance to roll 5
11 in 36 chance to roll 6


Which makes it a quite good choice even at low levels.


Selective Curse (Heroic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
You may choose to ignore up to your int bonus (min 1) targets when deciding who is cursed by your Warlock's Curse.
So you can curse someone who isn't the closest your aware of? Neat.


Eldritch Glaive (Heroic): Requires Warlock, Eldritch Blast at-will power.
You can now use Eldrich Blast as a Melee 2 power instead of a Range power, and it counts as a basic melee attack.
Quite good, Since it still doesn't target AC.


Hexing Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
A Warlock may remove the curse from a target to force the target to reroll a successful save. The Warlock may not curse that target again until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.
Very Nice


Staggering Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
Instead of dealing damage with a Warlock's Curse, the Warlock may slide the target 1 square.
Pretty bad.


Burning Curse (Paragon): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
When you deal damage with your Warlock's Curse, you may choose to ignite the target with the flames of hell. Remove the Warlock's Curse from the target, and the target takes 5+Warlock's Con modifier fire damage (save ends). The Warlock may not curse the target again until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.
Should note its ongoing damage. Also may want to require the infernal pact.


Twice Hexed Curse (Epic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
If you have already dealt curse damage once this round, you may choose to deal it a 2nd time on a different target you have just damaged. Deal your Warlock's Curse damage, and remove the curse from the damaged target. You may not Curse the target again until after the end of your next turn.
So this only has an effect on Area or Close attacks?


Sympathy for the Devil (Epic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
When the Warlock is dealing Curse damage to a target, they may choose to instead remove the Curse and deal the curse damage to a different target which has been Cursed by the Warlock. The target whose curse was removed may not be cursed again by the Warlock until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.
Love it.

Yakk
2008-09-12, 11:47 PM
Which makes it a quite good choice even at low levels.
It works out to be similar in impact to the HQ d6->d8, but has a nice fun crunch. ;-)

2d6 drop lowest is about +0.9 average over 1d6
3d6 drop lowest is about +1.5 average over 2d6
4d6 drop lowest is about +1.744 average over 3d6

It is slightly weaker than the HQ upgrade, especially on crits. Notice how it falls off at the Paragon->Epic tier. That also justifies some more "room" for Quarry power upgrades in Paragon/Epic, as a plus...


So you can curse someone who isn't the closest your aware of? Neat.

Yes. It does require a reasonably high int to work well, and (barring really high int) it still requires some moving around to get your target cursed. I'm a bit concerned about that feat, actually, because it can remove some of the incentive for the Warlock to "run in and engage" to get the right targets cursed.


Quite good, Since it still doesn't target AC.
Eldirch Glaive might be too good. It might be balanced as a power-swap feat even...


Pretty bad.
Re staggering curse -- you mean pretty bad-ass, or a bad feat to pick, or?


Should note its ongoing damage. Also may want to require the infernal pact.
*nod*, if I made it infernal pact, I'd have to write 3 of them -- one for each pact. ;)


So this only has an effect on Area or Close attacks?
Warlocks have many ways to deal damage twice in a turn, other than Area or Close attacks. Up to and including OAs. Any of those work with Twice Hexed.


Say the target is almost dead for some reason or another, or is a minion. If you choose to remove the curse from that creature (Say because you know they will die, or your curse won't really matter after that point) then you can deal it to another cursed target anywhere on the battlefield (May want to say in 5 or 10 squares Yakk).

Hmm. As it stands, a monster that runs away is vunerable to sympathy for the devil damage until the encounter ends (ie, 5 minutes). That is pretty ... evil.

"Come out come out whereever you are... I have your friends, and I will kill eacn and every one of them. And you'll feel it. Yes, yes you will."


Effectively, this lets a single attack roll kill two distant minions, kill a minion and hurt a big thing, or hurt two big things. It helps spread the damage around in an interesting fashion.

*nod* -- the "splat a minion, don't waste curse damage", or "hit a target, splat a minion", or "hit an easier to hit target, burn the big guy" are all uses for Sympathy for the Devil. It's a ... very flexible ability.


Its weapon focus for an implement. Fairly basic feat.
Not quite -- it is an untyped bonus to damage, and it doesn't scale. Casters already get damage-type specific feats that are weapon-focus like.

This is .. well, sort of two-weapon fighting like feat, but with weapon-focus like fluff.

Grabbing it at level 1 means that there is a use to using a non-magical implement, as a side fluff benefit.

I'll edit it to say continuing damage.

KKL
2008-09-13, 12:11 AM
Re staggering curse -- you mean pretty bad-ass, or a bad feat to pick, or?

As in it's a really bad feat.

Gralamin
2008-09-13, 02:37 AM
re: Staggering Curse
I don't think Slide 1 is worth 2d6 points of damage, at all.

KKL
2008-09-13, 07:03 PM
re: Staggering Curse
I don't think Slide 1 is worth 2d6 points of damage, at all.

It could be worth it if it slid more, and was combined with Blood Pulse...

Yakk
2008-09-13, 07:48 PM
It isn't always worth it to swap damage for slide 1. But the ability to slide targets when you want to in exchange for doing a bit less damage can be a very nice option to have -- but not something you do on every attack.

As an aside, I did some crunching on Burn. At (Con mod) continuing damage, it is worth it (on average) if the Warlock doesn't change targets on a non elite/solo. And if the warlock changes targets, it is extra bonus good.

So I'm gonna tweak it downward.

Shadow_Elf
2008-09-13, 10:04 PM
For the sliding power, maybe you can slide them one square for every 3 damage you would have dealt (i.e., you roll for damage, and then decide whether you'd rather push them or hurt them)

Example: 2d6 warlocks curse damage. You roll 2 + 5, so that's 7. You can either slide them 2 squares or deal 7 damage. I think that's fair, since sliding things off of cliffs, or reigning in fleeing foes is often very useful, and has the potential for much more that 7 damage.

Yakk
2008-09-17, 12:41 PM
However, I suspect I might have made the other feats too good, as opposed to the slide feat being not good enough. ;-)

I might make it slide 1 per tier (ie, slide 1 at heroic, 2 at paragon, 3 at epic)? That is close to 1 slide for every 3 damage the attack would have dealt, without rolling.

Burley
2008-09-17, 01:36 PM
*Snip*Sympathy for the Devil (Epic): Requires Warlock, Warlock's Curse class feature.
When the Warlock is dealing Curse damage to a target, they may choose to instead remove the Curse and deal the curse damage to a different target which has been Cursed by the Warlock. The target whose curse was removed may not be cursed again by the Warlock until after the end of the Warlock's next turn.
*snip*
"Sympathy for the Devil" is my favorite. You curse both a minion and a bad guy, then you burn the curse off of the minion (while killing it), and deal the curse damage to the big bad. Or vice versa -- burn a curse off of a normal opponent to kill a cursed minion.

Emphasis mine, of course.

Since you didn't roll an attack roll to hit the minion, the minion is immune to this damage. If you are speaking of an actual "minion." That is the way minions work, is it not? If you don't roll, you don't kill?

Yakk
2008-09-17, 01:48 PM
You can kill a minion without an attack roll.

However, minions are immune to miss damage, which is different than automatic damage.

Shadow_Elf
2008-09-17, 05:25 PM
You can kill a minion without an attack roll.

However, minions are immune to miss damage, which is different than automatic damage.

^ Very true. This is wh Wall of Fire and Wall of Ice are great at killing minions, as well as Cloud of Daggers.

erikun
2008-09-17, 11:39 PM
Implement Focus (Heroic):
Is this a feat bonus to damage, or just a generic bonus? If it is a feat bonus, it should probably stack with tier, like Weapon Focus.

Eldritch Glaive (Heroic):
Does it require Eldritch Blast to be an at-will power? That is, if you multiclass into Warlock, can you use your Eldritch Blast encounter power to pull out an Eldritch Glaive for one round?
(Please note that there is some confusion as to what, exactly, the multiclass feat gives you. At least, there was last I heard.)

Staggering Curse (Paragon):
I agree that this should stack by tier. Forced movement is nice, but shifting only 1 square? Occasionally useful, but you'd need to have no good feats left to pick up to consider it.

Burning Curse (Paragon):
CON can get pretty high, especially into epic tier. Is this supposed to wear down targets? Because repeatedly dealing ongoing damage will do that.

Star-crossed Curse (Paragon):
Why just -3? I would think that -INT would be more appropriate, although you might want to limit it to the next attack roll against that defense.

Dream-tortured Curse (Paragon):
I would probably say "teleport" rather than "slide". Fey-packed powers feel more... teleporty... than sliding around.

Twice Hexed Curse (Epic):
Sympathy for the Devil (Epic):
Interesting combo. You can use Sympathy for the Devil to remove the curse from one target, deal damage to a second target, then trigger Twice Hexed Curse to deal curse damage again to the second target - even if you don't know where they are. And if I'm reading it right, you and AoE two hexed targets, then transfer the damage out to two others.


The "remove the curse, and no doing it again" is intended as a minor cost for the Warlock. They lose some single-target chain-curse damage power, and gain the secondary effect.
I will admit, that looks like a nice way to balance it. You trigger the ability, but can't curse the target again for 2 turns. (the current one, and your next one) I don't think you can worry about curse-immuning many targets, though, unless you try to trigger them all at once. Perhaps limit the triggers to immediate actions (limited to one per round)?