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BobVosh
2008-11-02, 07:46 PM
Don't ask me why but I was thinking on this: Theodore Sturgeon once wrote that the intelligence of the mob is the intelligence of its least intelligent member divided by the number of members.

So I was thinking that if this was RAW then a mob with a PC where the number of members is greater than the lowest int score you would come up with a fraction of <1. So then the mob would fall unconscious.

Oh, and the reason it needs a PC is you round down for PCs and up for NPCs.

So here you can either call me crazy, or add something. I don't know why but I had to inform the masses.

GoodbyeSoberDay
2008-11-02, 08:15 PM
How can you inform the masses when they've fallen unconscious?

shadow_archmagi
2008-11-02, 09:02 PM
Don't ask me why but I was thinking on this: Theodore Sturgeon once wrote that the intelligence of the mob is the intelligence of its least intelligent member divided by the number of members.

So I was thinking that if this was RAW then a mob with a PC where the number of members is greater than the lowest int score you would come up with a fraction of <1. So then the mob would fall unconscious.

Oh, and the reason it needs a PC is you round down for PCs and up for NPCs.

So here you can either call me crazy, or add something. I don't know why but I had to inform the masses.


This is why adventurers travel in groups of 3-5.

Starbuck_II
2008-11-02, 09:07 PM
Don't ask me why but I was thinking on this: Theodore Sturgeon once wrote that the intelligence of the mob is the intelligence of its least intelligent member divided by the number of members.

So I was thinking that if this was RAW then a mob with a PC where the number of members is greater than the lowest int score you would come up with a fraction of <1. So then the mob would fall unconscious.

Oh, and the reason it needs a PC is you round down for PCs and up for NPCs.

So here you can either call me crazy, or add something. I don't know why but I had to inform the masses.

Wait, round down for PCs and up for NPCs? Are you sure that isn't a houserule?

UserClone
2008-11-02, 09:48 PM
In D&D, unless otherwise explicitly contradicted, you ALWAYS round down. Even if you are the DM.

Mark Hall
2008-11-02, 09:58 PM
Maybe this explains why our PCs often seem unconscious of their actions...

grinner666
2008-11-02, 10:40 PM
Does a zero INT equal unconsciousness? Hmmmm ... zombies, skeletons, oozes and slimes must be MUCH less dangerous than they've always appeared, then.

Honestly, if you accept Sturgeon's premise (which seems reasonable), then the mob should probably just fall under DM control, not pass out. :smallwink:

On a related note, Heinlein once said,

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

. . . which leads me to believe that RAH thought Bards were the ultimate character class. No other class comes CLOSE to being such a jack-of-all-trades.

:D

Collin152
2008-11-02, 10:43 PM
Does a zero INT equal unconsciousness?

Yes.
It's explicitly stated.
Int - != Int 0

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-11-02, 10:43 PM
Does a zero INT equal unconsciousness? Hmmmm ... zombies, skeletons, oozes and slimes must be MUCH less dangerous than they've always appeared, then. Int of - is not the same as Int 0.
Honestly, if you accept Sturgeon's premise (which seems reasonable), then the mob should probably just fall under DM control, not pass out. :smallwink:

On a related note, Heinlein once said,

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

. . . which leads me to believe that RAH thought Bards were the ultimate character class. No other class comes CLOSE to being such a jack-of-all-trades.

:DEspecially with the Bard feature to make all skills trained at 1/2 ranks. Though other than that, Factotems do it better.

Emperor Tippy
2008-11-02, 11:02 PM
Does a zero INT equal unconsciousness? Hmmmm ... zombies, skeletons, oozes and slimes must be MUCH less dangerous than they've always appeared, then.

Honestly, if you accept Sturgeon's premise (which seems reasonable), then the mob should probably just fall under DM control, not pass out. :smallwink:

On a related note, Heinlein once said,

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

. . . which leads me to believe that RAH thought Bards were the ultimate character class. No other class comes CLOSE to being such a jack-of-all-trades.

:D

Actually Factotums or wizards.

Flickerdart
2008-11-02, 11:04 PM
Actually, Exemplar Wizards with a Nanite horde, but that's beside the point.

BobVosh
2008-11-03, 12:39 AM
Wait, round down for PCs and up for NPCs? Are you sure that isn't a houserule?

I could have sworn it said in the DMG it said to round down when it is beneficial for the pc and round up when it is detremential.

Kurald Galain
2008-11-03, 03:49 AM
Theodore Sturgeon once wrote that the intelligence of the mob is the intelligence of its least intelligent member divided by the number of members.

I thought that was Terry Pratchett who said that?

Coidzor
2008-11-03, 03:53 AM
I thought that was Terry Pratchett who said that?

I think Pratchett went more for mobs actually being organisms.

BobVosh
2008-11-03, 05:17 AM
I think Pratchett went more for mobs actually being organisms.

Or being all the Oggs in the surrounding area.

Tsotha-lanti
2008-11-03, 05:42 AM
I thought that was Terry Pratchett who said that?

I would think that the quotation, like 99% of quotations, is (mis)attributed to so many different people that you can't tell who actually said it first. Usually, the most famous person something is attributed to is the name that gets repeated the most.

Heliomance
2008-11-03, 06:02 AM
And of course 78% of statistics are made up on the spot.

Totally Guy
2008-11-03, 06:32 AM
I remember the first time I picked up a D&D book and thought that some of the description flavour text were rules. "Halflings are Agile, Nimble and quick witted". I thought they were all free feats.

Starbuck_II
2008-11-03, 07:38 AM
On a related note, Heinlein once said,

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

. . . which leads me to believe that RAH thought Bards were the ultimate character class. No other class comes CLOSE to being such a jack-of-all-trades.

:D

Druids are jacks of all trades too, but done better.

Inyssius Tor
2008-11-03, 11:42 AM
Druids are jacks of all trades too, but done better.

That's not a man, that's a bear!

Fenix_of_Doom
2008-11-03, 12:34 PM
And of course 78% of statistics are made up on the spot.

Not to forget that you have lies, big lies and statistics.

Erom
2008-11-03, 12:49 PM
Not to forget that you have lies, big lies and statistics.

Lies, damned lies, and statistics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statistical_deception

Twain popularized a lot of crap like that.

kbk
2008-11-03, 01:53 PM
This is why adventurers travel in groups of 3-5.

And why that one guy playing a ranger with an int of 6 (GO FOR THE EYES BOO!) will always kill the whole party and not just himself.

Yes, round down, even to 0.

As far as unconscious, the question is this:
Does it count as a drain/ability damage effect? If so, they're unconscious.
Does it count as a basic stat for the mob? If so, it means its like undead and constitution, or plants and charisma. There is simply no feasible way to categorize the int score of a mob, they have none!


Both would be fun.