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View Full Version : Techniques for playing a undead army type necro?



Whiplord
2008-11-03, 11:05 AM
I'm going to be playing a True Necromancer in an upcoming campaign, but I have never played anything of the type before.

What are some spells/techniques/strategies I need to know to effectively play as this type of character?

And yes I realize True Necro isn't the best choice. But I have it worked out where I'm pleased with the results.

TheCountAlucard
2008-11-03, 11:44 AM
I'm going to be playing a True Necromancer in an upcoming campaign, but I have never played anything of the type before.

What are some spells/techniques/strategies I need to know to effectively play as this type of character?

And yes I realize True Necro isn't the best choice. But I have it worked out where I'm pleased with the results.

Going the Corpsecrafter tree isn't a bad option, especially if you take Destruction Retribution. Regular undead got NOTHIN' on exploding undead.

Keld Denar
2008-11-03, 12:45 PM
Take Deathbound as your other domain, since you need Death for TN. This domian increases the amount of HD you can control with Rebuke. So you don't drive your DM and other players crazy, don't work with hordes of useless undead. Get a couple of big brute skells, or maybe a prize zombie if you can net something like a hydra. You don't want your run in init to be 40 minutes long while you decide where your minions shall go. Also, try to get a couple of incorps. They are a bit more robust with their damage immunity and ability damage/level drain is fun! K has a really great guide over on the wizards forum, look for K's tome of necromancy.

And the obligatory:
TN is bad. Very very bad. It loses caster levels, AND it loses rebuking levels, so while you tend to get more undead, you get less powerful ones. This contradicts the advice I gave above. But I don't think I can talk you out of it.

Check out Dread Necro in Hero's of Horror, its everything a necro should be and more!

Whiplord
2008-11-03, 01:11 PM
I'm doing the spellstitched necropolitan route, which advances a dip in warlock as well as cleric levels. With Practiced Spellcaster: Cleric I can have CL 20 caster level and 6d6 eldritch blast with greater invocations by 20.

Thanks for the advice. That handbook looks really nice.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-11-03, 03:54 PM
Don't play an Undead Army Necro. And don't be a True Necro. You want to be more like a Sergeant, with a small squad of awesome undead that you use as bruisers and heal with Charnel Touch (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=759515). Weaker undead are worthless, but when you can grab a CR10 monster and double it's HD before making it eat everyone else, you can sleep happy.
Top Ten Reasons True Necromancers Are Bad

1. At 14th level, you are five caster levels behind in both classes, so if the party Fighter took Leadership, and his cohort got Leadership, heíd actually be bringing more Necromancy to the table than you. As a fighter.
2. You have to take the Death Domain as a Necromancer Cleric, which is a waste of a Domain Slot when you are trying to be good at Necromancy.
3. In the early levels, you postpone your access to Animate Dead by 4 levels.
4. At 8th level a True Necromancer can create, but not control Ghouls. A Cleric at that level can control but not create Ghouls. Guess which is better? At 11th level, the True Necromancer gets the ability to control Ghouls, and the Cleric gets the ability to create them, so thereís no point at which this is advantageous.
5. The only unique ability of the True Necromancer class is unimpressive. Desecrate is a great spell, but itís also a second level spell.
6. True Necromancers eventually get a bonus to Rebuking Ė at 17th level they have a +1 bonus to their Rebuking level. But at 7th level they have a 3 level penalty to their Rebuking level. So at low levels when rebuking is good they canít use it, and at high levels when Rebuking doesnít matter they donít care.
7. True Necromancers are always going to have underwhelming Save DCs. Between MAD and the fact that they are often forced to use spells that are 3 spell levels lower than what the single-classed casters can use, theyíre going to be out enough Save DC that it shows. A lot.
8. As a True Necromancer you have all the disadvantages of both a Cleric (the gods can take away all your spellcasting at any time), and a Wizard (you have Arcane Spell Failure, preventing you from wearing good armor). Also, your BAB and HPs stink when compared to a Cleric.
9. Control pools from Animate Dead actually donít accumulate between your two classes. Ití right in the spell, if you cast the spell it considers all undead you control from all castings of Animate Dead, not just your Arcane or just your Divine castings of the spell. Some people say differently, and some even quote CustServ, but when was the last time you won an argument with your DM using the line "some guy on a board said that CustServ told him....."?
10. There is almost no synergy between Cleric and Wizard Necromancy. Any synergy you desperately want to find could be replicated by just taking the Apprentice feat at first level and having some Use Magic Device. Get yourself a couple of Wizard Scrolls or something. Itís a better buy than setting 5 caster levels on fire. Smart cookies can even get the right spell effects off monsters for free, no less.

Keld Denar
2008-11-03, 04:07 PM
By being a Spellstitched Necropolitan, you are only lighting 3 caster levels on fire, so only about 8.5 of those reasons apply, but still, then you are only as good as your local Mystic Theurge, and everyone knows how much fun that is. Seriously, straight Cleric or striaght Dread Necro is a ton better, and you don't even have to BE straight, if that's your thing!

wadledo
2008-11-03, 04:08 PM
I'm going to continue the triad against True Necro.

Pale master is better, and that dead level is horrible.

mabriss lethe
2008-11-03, 09:57 PM
Dread necro all the way. One class gets you turningrebuking...sorry, spontaneous casting from a rather nice list and a nifty familiar. And nigh on everything you do works off of one stat. It's pretty much everything you're wanting to do wrapped up into a nice neat, single class package.

tahu88810
2008-11-03, 10:00 PM
kill squirrels and make a zombie squirrel hoard.
Seriously. It'll be awesome.

Sstoopidtallkid
2008-11-03, 10:03 PM
kill squirrels and make a zombie squirrel hoard.
Seriously. It'll be awesome.Only with the Corpsecrafter line. Undead Exploding Squirrel Hoard FTW.

Jack_Simth
2008-11-03, 10:08 PM
Tricks:
1) Very big army of undead:
A clerical Animate Dead spell is a 3rd level spell, which is suitable for production as an oil by way of the Brew Potion feat.
When using an oil, you use the oil's caster level, not your own - so if you don't have a caster level, a 5th caster level Oil of Animate Dead will still let you have a 10 hit dice zombie running around under your control.
Take Leadership (or undead leadership, just make sure to fill up on minimally intelligent undead) and Brew Potion, and have all your followers use Oils of Animate Dead (at your caster level!) to have yourself a truly humongous army of undead under your control.

2) Neigh-Infinite army of undead:
A Wight is a 4 HD corporeal undead with the Create Spawn ability. Any Spawn of a Wight are under the Wight's control, with no cap. Command yourself a single Wight, and fetch a bunch of Commoner-1's to feed to it. You control the Prime Spawn, the Prime Spawn controls the others. You're set (until someone assassinates, or worse, Commands, the Prime Spawn). The limit of your army is the limit of commoner-1's you can find to feed to your army.

Both methods are completely Core.

bosssmiley
2008-11-04, 06:48 AM
The Necromancer's Handbook (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=599129) by K

More dirty tricks than you can shake a stick at, plus an exploration of which classes make the best necromancers. Surprisingly it's not the True Necromancer. :smallconfused: