Sugestions for 5th party member on a 3.0 campaign?

[Oslecamo]

So, one old friend of mine is starting a new campaign. I'll be joining it next thursday, but still not sure what I'm gonna play.

The details:
-3.0 core only.
-1st level.
-25 point buy or roll stats.
-Party composed of
.Rogue halfling focused in being a skill monkey.
.Dwarf cleric with godly stats, including a 16 in strenght and wisdom.
.Human sorceror nuker, with magic missile and burning hands.
.Half orc barbarian with 19 str, 11 con and 12 dex.
-Druids don't automatically get an animal companion at start. You go out there and befriend something yourself.
-Campaign mostly for light hearted fun. The group just wants some good old school bashing and laughing togheter, whitout spending too much time optimizating.


So, I look at the party, and I see that what we really need is some kind of tank/controler.

I think a wizard will be fun. Specialized in transmutation because I love the school. Spam sleep, color spray and glitterdust around. Enlarge the barbarian, ect, ect.

What I haven't yet decided is the race. Human would be the most optimal in the long run, but well, we're starting level 1, and wizards are really squishy there. Plus the party isn't really that optimized, so I tought of some goofier choices:

1-Goblin. Buffs my AC, 30 base speed, and helps me hit stuff with my crossbow when I run out of spells. Dump charisma as well as strenght. Some kind of mad ugly scientist who uses the party and the enemies as his guinea pigs.

2-Kobold. Buffs my AC, 30 base speed, but I also lose CON, wich I really don't want to. Same backstory as goblin.

3-Gnome. Slower, but slight buff to AC and CON, wich is nice, plus minor random abilities. Well, our groups always treats those little guys as a joke and we never actually see one on the whole camapaigns so a gnome would also be goofy.

So, my question for you, do you think this kind of character would fit well in the current party, from a party balance point of view? Sugestions on the final race are also welcome.

[Harp]

Transmutation is the fun school, I have to agree.

Strength shouldn't be a major concern as a wizard. Of the races listed, you should either choose Human or Gnome. Kobold stats are horrible besides and while the goblin may appear attractive now down the road the move speed and dex bonus won't be doing much for you, whereas the extra feat or gnome abilities can remain somewhat useful, save the +1 bonus to your Illusion save DCs.

I realize move speed may be something of a concern, but very few people take advantage of mounts. You can easily get your move speed on par with your teammates with a riding dog. After a few levels when the dogs start dying at a fair rate a magical solution to your move speed should be available.

[Who_Da_Halfling]

Well, personally, a Bard is always a fun, goofy character to play. I did one that was a full Supporter, so I had Weapon Finesse: Whip and just spent the entire battle Disarming our enemies (or Tripping them, occasionally), all while singing "The +1 Song" (so named b/c of how often I had to remind everyone to add the +1 bonus for the Inspire Courage bardic song). Human works well here, although Elf or Half-Elf would work just as well. Just remember that Trip is a Strength check for you opposed by your opponent's STR or DEX check, so Weapon Finesse doesn't help. It also helps to hope your DM forgets that a Whip is technically Small in 3.0....

However, a Wizard seems perfectly reasonable, although as I recall they're a little on the weak side at level 1.

-JM

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Depending on the rolling method, you may want to risk the roll. IMO feats are more valuable to a wizard at higher levels, so I'd go Gnome. Here is one potential stat array, Gnome racial adjustments included:

Str 7, Dex 14, Con 16, Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 8

If you're going transmuter, I'd ban abjuration and evocation. Your nuker has evocation covered (among X other reasons you shouldn't take evocation), and abjuration only really comes into its own at much higher levels. Shield is great, but not great enough. Besides, you want enchantment for sleep, illusion for color spray (your favorite spell), necromancy for ray of enfeeblement, and conjuration for grease.

Also, once you get some XP, I suggest making good use of Scribe Scroll. Making backup spells ups your durability and versatility, something a Wizard needs a bit more of at level 1. The XP cost is negligible, and 3e lets you catch up pretty easily.

... Of course, I've lost my familiarity with 3.0, but I believe everything I just said applies.

[Eldariel]

If you're not going Illusion-heavy, Human is the way to go. Core has a wealth of metamagic, craft, spell foci and penetrations, all of which are feats you'll probably want sooner or later - Humans don't need to settle for half the story. Transmutation is awesome in 3.0 (I mean, even Teleportation is Trans!) and you only have to ban Evocation for it (you already have the blaster, no? Not to mention, you can cover that part in your repertoire with Conjurations and Transmutations). Besides, you get to be that guy who remakes matter into whatever suits him.

8/14/14/17/8/8 seems like a decent enough array at 25pb. Gnomes indeed have the awesome Con-pump, so out of the options you presented, I'd go with them. Illusion-bonus is great for your Color Sprays too. You may actually want to go with the stupid Toad-familiar for those 10 HP on the first level (if you play from the first level), to increase the likelihood of your survival (or being dropped to high negatives instead of dying to that crit). You'll also probably want to wear at least a light armor before you can afford Mage Armor, ACF be damned. You should get your AC in the range of 15-16 this way. Crossbow is a decent weapon for those without racial proficiencies. Obviously, you still don't want to get shot at though.


Anyways, this seems exactly the kind of character the party wants along. Someone who makes everyone's life easier for them.

EDIT: I forgot, 3.0 Toad is nuts. Welcome to Con 18-ville :D (although worse first level - gets better as you level up).

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Holy crap, Toads with +2 Con, needlessly complicated school specialization, borked Haste... And I had been bummed about the shift to 3.5.

[Medic]

3.0 cleric with animal domain ftw.

Cleric spells + animal companion is insane.

[Oslecamo]

OK, thanks everybody for the replies.

Some facts to remember from old 3.0:
-Toad familiar grants awesome +2 UNTYPED con bonus.
-I can ditch only evocation to specialize in transmutation.
-Shield spell rocks since it grants me 3/4 cover, meaning +7 AC and +3 reflex saves.
-Gnomes don't get a +1 DC to illusion spells.
-Sleep is just a standard action to cast, meaning in my humble opinion it's considerably better than color spray, since I don't need to worry about hiting allies and stuff.

So I think gnome it is for the race. The party already has an halfling, dwarf, human and half-orc, so a gnome seems good to keep the race variety theme.

I already have the spells worken out, more or less:
-All cantrips(duh, wizard)
-Sleep(will or die)
-Shield(+7 AC and reflex saves? Yes please)
-Grease(ref or die)
-Silent Image(overall utility)
-Spider climb(transmutation spell. Yes, it's 1st level in 3.0!)

Now, sugestions for the 1st level feat?

Improved iniative is always nice, but I could start planning to the future, either taking craft wondrous item to build stuff for the party or some metamagic wich I won't use so soon.

So, what do you say?

[Mushroom Ninja]

Some facts to remember from old 3.0:
-Toad familiar grants awesome +2 UNTYPED con bonus.
-I can ditch only evocation to specialize in transmutation.
-Shield spell rocks since it grants me 3/4 cover, meaning +7 AC and +3 reflex saves.


Ahh, good 'ole 3.0 :smallbiggrin:

When it comes to feats, I've always been partial to Improved Init.

[Draz74]

When it comes to feats, I've always been partial to Improved Init.

QFT ... it's not like you'll ever regret having a good Initiative, even at high levels.

Spell Focus (Transmutation or Conjuration) is good too.

[Oslecamo]

Spell Focus (Transmutation or Conjuration) is good too.

Wich reminds me, in 3.0 spells focus gives a flat +2 bonus to the DCs:smallbiggrin:

But unfortenately still neither conjuration or transmutation offer me much in save or dies, so I'll wait to take the feat later.

[Mushroom Ninja]

Wich reminds me, in 3.0 spells focus gives a flat +2 bonus to the DCs:smallbiggrin:

But unfortenately still neither conjuration or transmutation offer me much in save or dies, so I'll wait to take the feat later.

I had forgotten how good 3.0 spell focus was. That's going to be pretty awesome whenever you take it.

Good 'ole 3.0 :smallwink:

[holywhippet]

Consider a single level of something other than your intended class to start with. A level of bard can be handy - bard song, bardic knowledge, knowledge skills. The last two might not be so useful for a straight up "hit the monster" campaign though. The main benefit is getting cure * wounds on your spell list. That means you can buy scrolls of cure light wounds and act as a backup healer - it's cheaper than using potions.

[Draz74]

Wich reminds me, in 3.0 spells focus gives a flat +2 bonus to the DCs:smallbiggrin:

But unfortenately still neither conjuration or transmutation offer me much in save or dies, so I'll wait to take the feat later.

Er. Maybe I'm forgetting some more stuff that changed between 3.0 and 3.5, but Conjuration has a lot of great low-level save-or-suck spells. Grease, Glitterdust, Web, Stinking Cloud.

[Egiam]

I have to admit, I have only played 3.5, but I have some Ideas.
-I think bard would be cool, considering your group is low on utility spell casters.
-Your group is already fairly well set up, so I would be tempted to play a monk as a "fifth wheel" character with all those awesome class abilities (3.0?)
maybe a ranger?

25 point buy rocks!

[Eldariel]

Has anyone ever actually used Potions? My experience with them is that you end up paying more than for the sword that would've allowed you to not get hit in the first place. Anyways, the party already has Rogue and Cleric so healing should be covered. If you feel like being a Loremaster (seems pretty right for a Transmuter - as you're the guy who basically just is focused on changing any type of matter to another, you'd also be the guy who really wants (and needs) to know what basically everything is composed of so effectively, you'd just want to max all Knowledges...not to mention, you're a Gnome and curiosity is in their blood), you'd get UMD at that point too. Awesome if you pick up Improved Familiar too, then you could have an alignment-appropriate intelligent animal slinging spells from Wands (or healbotting, if you feel like it), and allows the use of Healing wands anyways.

Anyways, I'd definitely start with a Spell Focus. Transmutation is natural, but since the offensive Transmutation comes later on, so first level might see some use in Conjuration or Enchantment. Enchantment is probably the strongest at this point, while Conjuration scales better (although many of the higher level Conjurations don't allow save at all). I don't know if you really want Improved Initiative at this point - it's useful, but you'll really want to ensure the efficiency of your few spells on those levels, and maximizing the saves goes a long way towards that. Picking Extend Spell for the future could also be a good choice, but that can wait until level 3 or 6. Craft Wondrous Items should likely wait a bit too - I'd take something with an immediate payoff right now. Conjuration only works for Grease, but in two levels, it'll explode with Glitterdust and Web. Enchantment only gets Tasha's Hideous Laughter, which is a fine spell, but doesn't versatilize you at all. Ultimately, I'd go with Conjuration to target Ref now, Ref and Will on the next level (Sleep without boost is plenty good on level 1), and Fort a bit later. Transmutation is the other option if you feel you can make do without immediate benefits, as in a few levels, you'll get Slow, Bestow Curse, Polymorph Other, etc.

Don't forget that Craft Wondrous Items has the prerequisite of Spellcaster Level 3, so it isn't really an option. Options I'd consider:
1. Spell Focus: Conjuration/Extend Spell
3. Craft Wondrous Items/Extend Spell/Spell Focus: Transmutation
5. Extend Spell/Craft Wondrous Items
6. A second Spell Focus, prerequisite or feat for the future (if going Loremaster, one of the secrets gets you this feat back, so you can still pick the second Spell Focus or Improved Familiar or whatever).
9. Open (Spell Penetration, perhaps?)
12. Quicken Spell

I'd consider Still Spell if adding one more metamagic to the mix simply for the Still Dimension Doors to get out of Hard Places™. Second Craft would probably be Craft Wands, Craft Rods (METAMAGIC RODS!) or Craft Staffs. Forge Ring has unfortunately small returns for the investment. Craft Magic Arms and Armor is good for someone to pick up, but more natural for the Cleric than for you since he can use it himself too.

I'd go:
1. Spell Focus: Conjuration
3. Craft Wondrous Items
5. Extend Spell (Wizard bonus)
6. Skill Focus: Knowledge (Arcana)
8-9. Spell Focus: Transmutation (Loremaster bonus)
9. Spell Penetration
12. Quicken Spell
15. Craft Staffs (Wizard bonus)
15. Craft Rods
18. Improved Initiative or whatever


EDIT:
25 point buy rocks!

Huh? What do you mean?

Anyways, 25pb gets you all the stats you need, although you'll be 1 short of the 18 in Int. Rolling has a relatively poor chance of generating that 1 18 though, and is much more likely to split your points in an unbeneficial fashion, forcing you to put excess points into Cha, Wis and Str; 4d6b3 tends to result in strongly midrange results with anything under 8 and over 14 being very rare. 25pb gets you 17 Int, 14 Dex and Con and 8 in everything else, which is quite decent for a Wizard; 18 in Int and 16 in Dex and something in Wis (and Cha) would really be optimal, but can't have everything, especially not on a roll/25pb game.

[Oslecamo]

I'd consider Still Spell if adding one more metamagic to the mix simply for the Still Dimension Doors to get out of Hard Places™. Second Craft would probably be Craft Wands, Craft Rods (METAMAGIC RODS!) or Craft Staffs. Forge Ring has unfortunately small returns for the investment. Craft Magic Arms and Armor is good for someone to pick up, but more natural for the Cleric than for you since he can use it himself too.


Yeah, that would be awesome...If metamagic rods existed at all in 3.0.

Sorry, but free metamagic only started apearing in 3.5.:smallfrown:

I'm also not sure if the DM allows the basic prestige classes. Gotta ask that.

[Eldariel]

Ok, scratch Rods then :P Sorry, I haven't played 3.0 in years, my memory is fuzzy at best.

[Noneoyabizzness]

Yeah, that would be awesome...If metamagic rods existed at all in 3.0.

Sorry, but free metamagic only started apearing in 3.5.:smallfrown:

I'm also not sure if the DM allows the basic prestige classes. Gotta ask that.

Tome & blood pg 75 metamagic rods first appearance in d20, and tis 3.0

edit only issue is its not core 3.0. so the limit to core will still keep it from beign valid to the issue at hand