Mass Effect 3 - 13: Bet you could really go for a bottle of cool, refreshing Tupari!

Mass Effect 3, thread 13
or
"Bet you could really go for a bottle of cool, refreshing Tupari! "


***

This is the thirteenth thread for discussion of Mass Effect proper, currently on its third installment and final DLC, the final game in the ballad of Shepard. Here we discuss gameplay, mechanics, multiplayer, and anything at all from Mass Effect 1 &2. Spoilers are still spoilers, at least for the DLC. Main game is fair game though. As of this thread, the Reckoning Multiplayer DLC is is open, but people would still prefer spoiler boxes on Citadel in the single player, to allow for pleasant surprises.


Prior threads:
Thread 1: [Spoilers!]
Thread 2: We Fight and We Whine. That's the Plan.
Thread 3: The Important Thing is not Whining, it's Participosting.
Thread 4: Would've Liked to Perform Experiments on Seashells
Thread 5: Does This Thread Have a Soul?
Thread 6: Are You Engaging in Reproductive Behavior With This Thread?
Thread 7: "Now all we need is a gun that fires thresher maws!"
Thread 8: "That was for Thane!"
Thread 9: "How things begin isn't nearly as important as how they end."
Thread 10: Stood Fast, Stood Strong, Stood Together
Thread 11: "Black tie required"
Thread 12: "12 whole Kirrahes"

INCOMPLETE
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Spoiler: XBOX 360:

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Character builder complete with numbers compiler. Some damage calculations are off.
BioWare page archiving useful information

So... as #12 was closed down (and I stubbornly refuse to quit) here's thread 13.

(I pretty much copy/pasted the opener for the last one and picked the first title that I thought of. Suggestions for improvement are welcome. :smallsmile:)

I don't have any fun pictures to start this thread (sorry) but one question that bugged me since my first ME2 playthrough:

Why would anyone (in character!) pick Morinth over Samara? They're of equal power level and while Samara is a stern but dependable soldier who has sworn by her (impeccable) honor to support you on your mission, Morinth is a minipulative sociopathic killer. I found BioWare's "punishment" for those who picked Morinth in 3 more than deserved, but that's just me being me...

I could envision a Shepard that would pick Morinth. From a certain perspective, Samara is boring while she's your subordinate, and a threat the second she stops. Morinth is dangerous too, but in an exciting way, and struggling with her for dominance would be better than facing Samara's constant judgment. Be difficult to play out this character across the rest of the series, though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bit Fiend

Why would anyone (in character!) pick Morinth over Samara? They're of equal power level and while Samara is a stern but dependable soldier who has sworn by her (impeccable) honor to support you on your mission, Morinth is a minipulative sociopathic killer. I found BioWare's "punishment" for those who picked Morinth in 3 more than deserved, but that's just me being me...

---

I don't get it either... The fun thing is that the two Let's Plays I have seen with people picking this and having a reason other than "I need one playthrough where I do it" are Paragon or at least Paragade:

The first player just have very strong feelings (IRL) against "Vigilantes" and outright loathes Samara due to her code, which you can tell on his voice makes him really uneasy IRL. The other was getting nervous because of his heavy Paragade actually thought he would have to fight Samara if he didn't pick Morinth.

But yes, I don't get it either. Even a full Renegade would pick Samara just because she is the clearly better choice (disciplined, sworn to follow Shep etc etc).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Math_Mage

I don't. I delay the hell out of Miranda's loyalty mission.

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Any specific reason why?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey

Any specific reason why?

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Mostly because Liara and Thane are more interesting than Miranda, I guess.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Math_Mage

Mostly because Liara and Thane are more interesting than Miranda, I guess.

---

Well I actually like her. Plus unlike Thane she regularly comes with me on missions. Her passive bonuses are great, plus her powers are helpful.
Plus, as I said, from an role-playing perspective I do the most "urgent" missions first (her sister, Morinth etc).

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of Thane either. He's practically worthless on missions, and his characterization is almost completely generic assassin guy who is dying and trying to atone for his sins. I've seen it 100 times before, and usually better done. My typical team is Garrus and Miranda. Miranda because her squad damage bonus is often the difference between wasting an extra sniper round or not, and Garrus because he's a great character (even though Legion is objectively better in combat.)

Also, Miranda's character didn't bother me like it does some. People play it off as "boo hoo, I'm so perfect" but in reality, what person wouldn't have issues if they found out everything about them was genetically engineered in a lab?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anteros

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of Thane either. He's practically worthless on missions, and his characterization is almost completely generic assassin guy who is dying and trying to atone for his sins. I've seen it 100 times before, and usually better done. My typical team is Garrus and Miranda. Miranda because her squad damage bonus is often the difference between wasting an extra sniper round or not, and Garrus because he's a great character (even though Legion is objectively better in combat.)

Also, Miranda's character didn't bother me like it does some. People play it off as "boo hoo, I'm so perfect" but in reality, what person wouldn't have issues if they found out everything about them was genetically engineered in a lab?

---

EXACTLY.

However, if you play on the lower difficulties (aka normal) Thane is VERY good to have against collectors if he has his bonus power activated. His ammo powers do TONS of damage against them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anteros

[Thane's] characterization is almost completely generic assassin guy who is dying and trying to atone for his sins. I've seen it 100 times before, and usually better done.

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Heh, had to think of my favirite dying assassin guy: Gen from the Street Fighter series.

Spoiler: Off topic

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For those who don't know, his age and condition (according to one of the series' biggest badasses) are the only things that make it remotely fair for others to fight him. He's an active death seeker who wants to die in battle and kinda frustrated that no one manages to actually kill him. He even has a win-quote about it in IV: A very disappointed "...this was supposed to be a fight to the death!" :smallbiggrin:

EDIT: Although I have to say, the scenes with Thane at the Huerta hospital were really well done. He wasn't planning on fighting for one last time, just quietly meet his end in peace. He's in no condition to help Shepard, knows and accepts it, and just wants to write and chat with an old friend every once in while. I liked it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bit Fiend

EDIT: Although I have to say, the scenes with Thane at the Huerta hospital were really well done. He wasn't planning on fighting for one last time, just quietly meet his end in peace. He's in no condition to help Shepard, knows and accepts it, and just wants to write and chat with an old friend every once in while. I liked it.

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Indeed, I have always liked Thane the Man, but never liked Thane the Teammate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey

Indeed, I have always liked Thane the Man, but never liked Thane the Teammate.

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As I can't be bothered to try ME2 on anything higher than normal, I quite like him as a teammate too. :smalltongue:

I guess I will go ahead and add my multiplayer information. I only play about once a month these days, usually on a weekend, but here it is anyway:

- GitP: KillianHawkeye
- System: Xbox 360
- User Name: AwesomeGuy4730
- Classes: Any, although my favorite is the Krogan Battlemaster

Yay new thread!

I never brought Thane with me on a mission. I guess His power set just wasn't interesting enough to me.

As far as delaying missions: I hit Kasumi's first because Locust. I usually do Thane's ASAP since it's quick, easy, and has no actual fighting or difficult morality checks. Either Miranda's or Jack's gets put off as long as possible, too due to the high morality check to break them up. Tali's gets delayed so I can bring Legion.

Also, I... don't get the subtitle:smallredface:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Krade

Also, I... don't get the subtitle:smallredface:

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It's a reference to James Vega's dumb pull-ups challenge from the Citadel DLC.

They really should have given you something for doing all those pull-ups. A 5% boost to HP or SOMETHING to make it worth while. I was pretty mad when I sat there mindlessly pressing buttons for 30 minutes and all I got was 2 generic lines of dialogue.

Then again, maybe I can headcannon it that the only reason my Shep survived the explosion in the crucible at the end was because he was in top shape from all those pull ups. :smallbiggrin:

I got ME1 and ME2 through Steam some time back, but neither came with much of the additional DLC content (not that ME1 really needs it). How best to approach ME3, assuming I'll likely end up buying the Deluxe Digital edition once a sale shows up?

I've heard that the following are must-have DLC:

ME2

• Lair of the Shadow Broker
• Arrival (maybe)

ME3

• Citadel
• Leviathan (maybe)

Also, I noticed that in the third game Bioware decided to go the route of:

• Option A helps Faction A, screws Faction B.
• Option B helps Faction B, screws Faction A.
• Option C is only available if you purchased a DLC pack in the previous game, but gives happy ending to everyone. Buy DLC, guys!

I'm assuming it doesn't make a huge difference (hard choices were a big part of the first game) in terms of game completion, but does knowing that a perfect resolution is available behind a (essentially) paygate ruin the game experience for anyone?

Eh. Most of the really big decisions are in the core of 2, like the Quarians vs Geth situation, it's just that the counter is a bit weird. DLC from previous games adds a bit and gets carried over, but I was happy with how it was handled by someone who didn't do most of the major DLC for 2(becaise seriously screw the Bioware store. I'm drawing the line at that).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mobius Twist

I got ME1 and ME2 through Steam some time back, but neither came with much of the additional DLC content (not that ME1 really needs it). How best to approach ME3, assuming I'll likely end up buying the Deluxe Digital edition once a sale shows up?

I've heard that the following are must-have DLC:

ME2

• Lair of the Shadow Broker
• Arrival (maybe)

ME3

• Citadel
• Leviathan (maybe)

Also, I noticed that in the third game Bioware decided to go the route of:

• Option A helps Faction A, screws Faction B.
• Option B helps Faction B, screws Faction A.
• Option C is only available if you purchased a DLC pack in the previous game, but gives happy ending to everyone. Buy DLC, guys!

I'm assuming it doesn't make a huge difference (hard choices were a big part of the first game) in terms of game completion, but does knowing that a perfect resolution is available behind a (essentially) paygate ruin the game experience for anyone?

---

Seriously all non-item DLC's are worth it (I bougt all those as well and didn't regret it, but that's me). I would definitely add Stolen Memories to the ME2 list, for example. I also consider Omega worth the cash and From Ashes a MUST in ME3.
That said, where did you get the idea that "option C" only is doable if you have bought a DLC?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mobius Twist

Also, I noticed that in the third game Bioware decided to go the route of:

• Option A helps Faction A, screws Faction B.
• Option B helps Faction B, screws Faction A.
• Option C is only available if you purchased a DLC pack in the previous game, but gives happy ending to everyone. Buy DLC, guys!

I'm assuming it doesn't make a huge difference (hard choices were a big part of the first game) in terms of game completion, but does knowing that a perfect resolution is available behind a (essentially) paygate ruin the game experience for anyone?

---

Uh, I have zero purchase DLC and never had this problem at any point in ME3. Elaborate, please?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Math_Mage

Uh, I have zero purchase DLC and never had this problem at any point in ME3. Elaborate, please?

---

One example.

Spoiler: Text from Mass Effect wiki, plotline spoilers

Show

If the player did not have Kasumi in Mass Effect 2 or she did not survive the suicide mission, or if the player is starting a fresh Mass Effect 3 game, Shepard will have no interaction with her during this quest. During the final scene with Bau and Zymandis, you must choose between saving Bau (using a Renegade interrupt) or stopping the upload. Saving Bau grants you the Spectre Unit War Asset, while stopping the upload grants you the Hanar and Drell Forces War Asset. Since the Spectre Unit has a Military Strength of 40, while the Hanar and Drell Forces have a Military Strength of 50 which can be further upgraded to 58 if the player completes Citadel: Alien Medi-Gel Formula, players hoping to maximize War Assets without Kasumi around to enable them to save both assets are advised to save the Hanar and Drell Forces.

I've seen several resolutions much like this in my overindulgence of the wiki. I suppose I have only myself to blame for the spoilers.

Oh, forgot about that one. Shrug. So small I didn't really care.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mobius Twist

I got ME1 and ME2 through Steam some time back, but neither came with much of the additional DLC content (not that ME1 really needs it). How best to approach ME3, assuming I'll likely end up buying the Deluxe Digital edition once a sale shows up?

I've heard that the following are must-have DLC:

ME2

• Lair of the Shadow Broker
• Arrival (maybe)

ME3

• Citadel
• Leviathan (maybe)

Also, I noticed that in the third game Bioware decided to go the route of:

• Option A helps Faction A, screws Faction B.
• Option B helps Faction B, screws Faction A.
• Option C is only available if you purchased a DLC pack in the previous game, but gives happy ending to everyone. Buy DLC, guys!

I'm assuming it doesn't make a huge difference (hard choices were a big part of the first game) in terms of game completion, but does knowing that a perfect resolution is available behind a (essentially) paygate ruin the game experience for anyone?

---

Shadow Broker, Arrival, and Leviathan are all plot central. Especially the first 2. Honestly all the non-item DLCs are probably worth it except perhaps Kasumi and Zaeed. I would especially recommend the Citadel and Shadowbroker DLC. They're both excellent, and Arrival is central the beginning plot of ME3. Leviathan is fairly boring (to me) but it does give some exposition on the Reapers that you'd otherwise miss.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mobius Twist

One example.

Spoiler: Text from Mass Effect wiki, plotline spoilers

Show

If the player did not have Kasumi in Mass Effect 2 or she did not survive the suicide mission, or if the player is starting a fresh Mass Effect 3 game, Shepard will have no interaction with her during this quest. During the final scene with Bau and Zymandis, you must choose between saving Bau (using a Renegade interrupt) or stopping the upload. Saving Bau grants you the Spectre Unit War Asset, while stopping the upload grants you the Hanar and Drell Forces War Asset. Since the Spectre Unit has a Military Strength of 40, while the Hanar and Drell Forces have a Military Strength of 50 which can be further upgraded to 58 if the player completes Citadel: Alien Medi-Gel Formula, players hoping to maximize War Assets without Kasumi around to enable them to save both assets are advised to save the Hanar and Drell Forces.

I've seen several resolutions much like this in my overindulgence of the wiki. I suppose I have only myself to blame for the spoilers.

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Those things are very minor in the grand scheme of things. For instance, in this example all you're really missing is like 10 lines of dialogue from a character you've never met and a small number of war assets. You'll still be able to get whatever ending you want even without any DLC.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KillianHawkeye

I guess I will go ahead and add my multiplayer information. I only play about once a month these days, usually on a weekend, but here it is anyway:

- GitP: KillianHawkeye
- System: Xbox 360
- User Name: AwesomeGuy4730
- Classes: Any, although my favorite is the Krogan Battlemaster

---

Added to the list.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anteros

They really should have given you something for doing all those pull-ups. A 5% boost to HP or SOMETHING to make it worth while. I was pretty mad when I sat there mindlessly pressing buttons for 30 minutes and all I got was 2 generic lines of dialogue.

Then again, maybe I can headcannon it that the only reason my Shep survived the explosion in the crucible at the end was because he was in top shape from all those pull ups. :smallbiggrin:

---

I honestly completely expected it to give you nothing but a line of dialogue. But where I'm from that's the standard for loco challenges in games... :smallbiggrin:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anteros

Shadow Broker, Arrival, and Leviathan are all plot central. Especially the first 2. Honestly all the non-item DLCs are probably worth it except perhaps Kasumi and Zaeed. I would especially recommend the Citadel and Shadowbroker DLC. They're both excellent, and Arrival is central the beginning plot of ME3. Leviathan is fairly boring (to me) but it does give some exposition on the Reapers that you'd otherwise miss.

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Also Overlord. The Hammerhead parts are tedios but the finale is absolutely brilliant. Of course that's just me being a big fan of Sci-Fi-Horror... ^^
I'd recommend you play Citadel after your first playthrough though. It's best when it doesn't distract you from the actual story anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mobius Twist

I got ME1 and ME2 through Steam some time back, but neither came with much of the additional DLC content (not that ME1 really needs it). How best to approach ME3, assuming I'll likely end up buying the Deluxe Digital edition once a sale shows up?

I've heard that the following are must-have DLC:

ME2

• Lair of the Shadow Broker
• Arrival (maybe)

ME3

• Citadel
• Leviathan (maybe)

Also, I noticed that in the third game Bioware decided to go the route of:

• Option A helps Faction A, screws Faction B.
• Option B helps Faction B, screws Faction A.
• Option C is only available if you purchased a DLC pack in the previous game, but gives happy ending to everyone. Buy DLC, guys!

I'm assuming it doesn't make a huge difference (hard choices were a big part of the first game) in terms of game completion, but does knowing that a perfect resolution is available behind a (essentially) paygate ruin the game experience for anyone?

---

Add Kasumi and Overlord to the ME2 list, and that's what I'd recommend. All other DLCs (yes, including Zaeed) aren't worth it.

Can we change the title to the Tupari one from the other thread? I could really go for a refreshing Tupari.
"Commander Shepard drinks Tupari, don't you want to be like Commander Shepard?" "Commander Shepard is referenced under Alliance Military Recruitment Services."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Landis963

Add Kasumi and Overlord to the ME2 list, and that's what I'd recommend. All other DLCs (yes, including Zaeed) aren't worth it.

---

Even if you don't like Zaeed (why wouldn't you? Robin Sachs was brilliant), Zaeed is part of Cerberus Network - which also gets you the awesome Arc Projector (worth it all on its own) and Firewalker (Hammerhead) packs, so just get that or buy the game new, it's cheap enough now.

The Cerberus pack and Firewalker, and Zaeed's character stuff are all included with the Steam purchase of ME2.

I fully expect the nature of Bioware (and by extension EA) DLC has been discussed to death here and elsewhere. Cosmetic packs and additional weapons are easily overlooked, but $7-$15 for minor storyline extensions is frequently seen out of balance in terms of cost-to-effort. Stuff like Day1 DLC (From the Ashes) also leaves a bad taste in some people's mouths.

I've reached that point in my life where time is more precious than money, but it still makes me uneasy to consider that minor additions to gameplay are possibly worth more combined than the actual game on release, and Bioware has apparently zero sales on Bioware points, making their prices actually static regardless of age or demand of a particular DLC.

If I had to pick between Zaeed and Kasumi's DLC...hmm, that's a very tricky one.

On the one hand, the gameplay in Kasumi's DLC is far superior and there's more of it.

On the other hand, I don't particularly like Kasumi, whereas Zaeed is made of awesome.

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For the "mustbuy DLCs to get results in ME3", the only ones where that matters at all is Kasumi and Zaeed's. There is extra dialogue if you do Overlord and Arrival, but there's no option C in those cases.

From what I recall, it's also nothing disastrous - it isn't a "save race A or save race B" scale of decision.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Psyren

Can we change the title to the Tupari one from the other thread? I could really go for a refreshing Tupari.
"Commander Shepard drinks Tupari, don't you want to be like Commander Shepard?" "Commander Shepard is referenced under Alliance Military Recruitment Services."

---

Done. Because I really need a cool, refreshing Tupari right now... :smallcool:

I am going to say that From Ashes is worthwhile, and glad I got the Collector's Edition when I did for it. I can't comment on the rest of the ME3 DLC since I have only bought citadel and never played it.

For ME2 however I Lair is the only absolutely needed one since you are buying new and will have the Cereberus Network DLC. I recommend Overlord and Kasumi, especially if you are a class dependent on SMG's. But Arrival....eh I don't think it's good enough to warrant a purchase. But that's just my opinion.

I will also say I bought the first alternate look pack and the mattock and phalanx pistol in ME2 and loved the guns and the option to put something on Jack before her loyalty mission, but thats just cosmetic.

The funny thing is that Origin (EA) screwed up their prices somehow when the game was released here...
I got all the stuff (that I wanted) from the collector's edition CHEAPER by pre-ordering the Regular Release (since in Europe (unlike in America) the Pre-order Regular Release included the N7 gear and two armors) + Ashes separately :smallbiggrin: