Why is this spell considered so good when you lose a turn for it?
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Why is this spell considered so good when you lose a turn for it?
I imagine because you lose a lot of turns if you die.
I haven't heard much talk about it on these forums (good or bad), but sometimes you want to absorb a lot of damage. It's like spending a turn using the dodge action except it works on more stuff. My only beef with it is that you lose concentration.
If one attack is going to drop you though, they could just repeat that attack when it melts and kill you anyways. Unless one more turn is what your party needs to burn them, but then it seems a little niche
Well, first off, it's an invocation and not a spell. So there is no spell slot cost, it's just something you get to do once per short rest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Farecry
Secondly, I don't know who considers it "so good" but it's not useless.
Third, because it's a reaction that happens when you take damage, it lets you play closer to the edge and actually SAVE turns that might otherwise be spent on healing or defensive maneuvers. It is basically protection against novas.
Imagine how frustrating it would be to be the enemy (I almost said "DM" but the DM isn't the enemy) of a party of four warlocks, all with the Tomb of Levistus. Even if you manage to get one of them down to 11 HP and are threatening to insta-kill him with a critical hit or breath weapon, he doesn't retreat or fall back or anything. He may not even bother to pause and re-cast Armor of Agathys. Instead he just keeps on attacking you, figuring that when you try to strike a killing blow he will just turn to ice and shrug it off. Novas don't work against these guys. Even if you outright Meteor Swarm the whole party, they will probably just negate it, and now you've wasted your action AND a 9th level spell slot in exchange for... forcing them to waste their action. Net win for the warlock side.
Combine Tomb of Levistus with a decent source of healing (like Healing Spirit or Aura of Vitality) and the warlock becomes (somewhat) immune to BOTH novas and attrition.
Edit: never mind.
Not every enemy has repeatable, huge-damage methods of attack at their disposal. For instance, let's say you're going up against an Ancient Blue Dragon. He breathes on you, and you Tomb of Levistus to save yourself some damage. Sure, you lose a turn, but that Blue Dragon might not have his breath weapon up when you come out of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Farecry
Truthfully it’s pretty great. It’s like a Death Ward that doesn’t get overridden by multiattack. Since you’ll only use it when you’d otherwise drop, the apparent 1-turn loss is actually a many-turn gain.
This for sure. I'm pretty sure the Tomb itself has 10 temp hp per warlock level, so thats 100 damage it can absorb at level 10. Sure at super high levels thats like one big hit, but using an action to absorb 100 damage is nothing to shake a stick at.Quote:
Originally Posted by Renchard
Exactly, it's essentiallyQuote:
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
"Sacrifice your next turn to negate all damage to you until the end of your next turn."
Which is fricking awesome. Disintegrate? Negate it. Ancient white dragon breath attack? Negate it. Assassin hitting you from stealth for 200 damage? Negate it.
It's not so much useful for staying alive when you'd otherwise drop, but amongst panic buttons its one of the best.
Petition to change the name to "Tomb of Legendary Resistance"?
Seriously good. However, since it is a contingent effect, many warlocks will skip it because there are limited invocations and it won't be as reliable as many of the others.
Also, it does give you vulnerability to fire damage during the duration, which is a problem... but you're still getting at LEAST 50 THP from it.
Well, you're only gaining vulnerability AFTER the initial damage. So if a Red Dragon breaths on you, you can still mitigate that initial damage before it becomes a bad option.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vogie
If the assassin is hitting you for 200 points of damage, presumably that means you're surprised. If you're surprised you don't get a reaction, which means you can't use Tomb of Levistus.Quote:
Originally Posted by strangebloke
Not if he's just hitting you from stealth. But yeah, it isn't any good against surprise.Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxWilson
But, like, nothing is.
I don't know how you can get 200 damage out of a single attack if you're not utilizing Assassinate, but perhaps I misunderstood your point.Quote:
Originally Posted by strangebloke
As an aside: things that are good against surprise include Death Ward, Aid, Contingency: Cure Wounds/False Life/Armor of Agathys/Dimension Door/Otiluke's Resilient Sphere (you word the condition differently for all of these), Clone, and the Alert feat.
But Tomb of Levistus is still pretty good at what it does. I think we agree on that point. I personally wouldn't prioritize it but I'd consider it if I had extra invocations left over on a full warlock.
It depends on the type of campaign and dungeon master you play with. In a West Marches style campaign that is very dangerous (lethal) or in a campaign where the dungeon master doesn't conceal or fudge rolls - it is a fantastic invocation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Farecry
If you play in a campaign that doesn't have a lot of combat or a campaign where the dungeon master protects you with plot armor - your mileage may vary and it is probably not a great choice.
Consider a barbarian, the class with the best hit dice (d12) in the game. At level 5, the barbarian will have 12 + (4 x 7) = 40 HP, and let's add a +3 CON bonus for another 15, for a total of 55 hp.Quote:
Originally Posted by Farecry
Tomb will, as a reaction, instantly give you temporary HP, 50 hp at level 5, or nearly as much as the total HP of the class with the best HP in the game. That's a huge amount and it will enable you to survive when that dragon wins initiative and breathes on you, when that rogue crits you or that paladin crit smites you etc. Sure, you lose your next turn, but you don't use Tomb for any random hit. You save it for the hit that would have otherwise dropped you to zero. Losing your next turn as a reasonable price to pay as you would have lost your next turn anyway had you dropped to zero, and possibly never had another turn other than a few turns to roll death saves.
The frequency of this panic button is also something else.
Once per Short Rest, nothing short of divine retribution will kill you, even then Zeus had better hope he rolls well.