You just gained a level in real life! What class would you take?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Red Fel

That alone makes you like a god. You can soak a gunshot to the face and walk it off.

---

All right, let's not go overboard.
First off, "to the face" is probably a critical hit. Not necessarily; I don't know that there are any rules regarding what such a hit would be, but it makes sense. It's also how I'd coup de grace somebody with a gun. So the chances of walking it off are significantly dampened.

Secondly, it's rare, but people have walked away from gunshots to the head before. That alone doesn't make you anything more than a parlor trick. Doing it reliably is better, but without knowing how much damage the gun would do I wouldn't count on it being reliable.

Third, you have one HD. Maybe 2. That is, at most, 32 HP, if you can get 18 Con and take something with D12 hit die. That's pretty darned tough, but it's not godly levels of tough; I'd say a SWAT team would still have little trouble making short work of you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thaneus

You can and will always die with a shot through your brain or a broken neck. Which can be done with a aimed punch or strong grapple. This counts the same for bears (51hp) and tigers (41hp). But to be fair such moves need to be done by soldiers and specialists.

---

RAW citation please?

We know coup de graces exist. And they deal massive damage. But unless there are specific rules for broken necks or shots through the brain, these are treated as any other source of HP damage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Strigon

All right, let's not go overboard.
First off, "to the face" is probably a critical hit. Not necessarily; I don't know that there are any rules regarding what such a hit would be, but it makes sense. It's also how I'd coup de grace somebody with a gun. So the chances of walking it off are significantly dampened.

---

Well, first off, shooting someone point blank in the face is only good if it would be a coup de grace in any other situation - that is, if the target is helpless. Otherwise, you've overlooked the primary aspect of a firearm, which is that it is a ranged weapon, and using it in close quarters against anyone but a helpless opponent is a bad idea.

Second, "to the face" is a called shot, not a critical hit. Called shots are not part of core D&D rules. There is a PF variant on called shots, but again, not part of the core rules. So, technically, they're not a thing - shots to any part of the body deal damage, as normal. They may be a critical hit, true, but that simply means they deal more damage.

And it's also worth noting that the massive damage rules (i.e. Fort save or die from the shock) are likewise variant rules.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Strigon

Secondly, it's rare, but people have walked away from gunshots to the head before. That alone doesn't make you anything more than a parlor trick. Doing it reliably is better, but without knowing how much damage the gun would do I wouldn't count on it being reliable.

---

Doing it reliably is better. Doing it consistently is solid. Being able to consistently survive gunshot wounds does turn a man into a myth pretty quickly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Strigon

Third, you have one HD. Maybe 2. That is, at most, 32 HP, if you can get 18 Con and take something with D12 hit die. That's pretty darned tough, but it's not godly levels of tough; I'd say a SWAT team would still have little trouble making short work of you.

---

That's fair. I'm not saying you could survive a SWAT team. But the comment was on a "stray bullet." Even if you have middling HP, at level 1, that bullet would probably put you into the negatives at worst; it's unlikely that the shot would instantly drop you below -10, unless you have fewer than 10 HP to begin with.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Red Fel

And it's also worth noting that the massive damage rules (i.e. Fort save or die from the shock) are likewise variant rules.

---

Technically, although nobody actually seems to use this rule, it's not a variant rule, it's right in core.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SRD: Injury and Death: Loss Of Hit Points

Massive Damage
If you ever sustain a single attack deals 50 points of damage or more and it doesn’t kill you outright, you must make a DC 15 Fortitude save. If this saving throw fails, you die regardless of your current hit points. If you take 50 points of damage or more from multiple attacks, no one of which dealt 50 or more points of damage itself, the massive damage rule does not apply.

---

Unearthed Arcana offers alternative rules on the subject, but the above quoted rule is the default, not the alternative.


But that rule is still not really relevant to this discussion -- as Strigon says, we're dealing with at most 32 hp here, so 50 damage will kill you by taking you to -10 (or -18, if we're playing with PF's "die at -con" rule) already.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malimar

Technically, although nobody actually seems to use this rule, it's not a variant rule, it's right in core.



Unearthed Arcana offers alternative rules on the subject, but the above quoted rule is the default, not the alternative.


But that rule is still not really relevant to this discussion -- as Strigon says, we're dealing with at most 32 hp here, so 50 damage will kill you by taking you to -10 (or -18, if we're playing with PF's "die at -con" rule) already.

---

So get some DR. Heck, take troll blooded and just sleep it off in a few hours.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thaneus

This logic wont work mate.
Some ppl have survived stabs with a dagger 29 times, which would be at least 29 dmg in game term up to 116 dmg and average of 58 dmg. Even as a 10th Level Commoner you would be most likely very dead in D&D logic.
Also falling 20 Feet is nearly certain death for D&D Commoners, for us, as long as you are not falling direct face first, its some broken bones at worst.

You can and will always die with a shot through your brain or a broken neck. Which can be done with a aimed punch or strong grapple. This counts the same for bears (51hp) and tigers (41hp). But to be fair such moves need to be done by soldiers and specialists.

---

Sure it does. You're attempting to define average with examples of extreme. That's what doesn't work. Can a normal person regularly survive 29 stab wounds? No. No they can't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thaneus

This logic wont work mate.
Some ppl have survived stabs with a dagger 29 times, which would be at least 29 dmg in game term up to 116 dmg and average of 58 dmg. Even as a 10th Level Commoner you would be most likely very dead in D&D logic.
Also falling 20 Feet is nearly certain death for D&D Commoners, for us, as long as you are not falling direct face first, its some broken bones at worst.

You can and will always die with a shot through your brain or a broken neck. Which can be done with a aimed punch or strong grapple. This counts the same for bears (51hp) and tigers (41hp). But to be fair such moves need to be done by soldiers and specialists.

---

Wrong. Even in modern times a lot of people have survived bullet wounds that pierced their brains. And what do you think neck braces are actually for? They're not worried about keeping dead people's necks immobilized. Usually.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malimar

Technically, although nobody actually seems to use this rule, it's not a variant rule, it's right in core.

Unearthed Arcana offers alternative rules on the subject, but the above quoted rule is the default, not the alternative.


But that rule is still not really relevant to this discussion -- as Strigon says, we're dealing with at most 32 hp here, so 50 damage will kill you by taking you to -10 (or -18, if we're playing with PF's "die at -con" rule) already.

---

Neither of those things would be modeled as 50+ damage anyway. A point blank shot to the head or knife through the neck would be a coup de grace.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Celestia

Sure it does. You're attempting to define average with examples of extreme. That's what doesn't work. Can a normal person regularly survive 29 stab wounds? No. No they can't.

---

Actual attack rolls in D&D aren't the only attacks per round, they're the decisive attacks. A person can survive 29 stabs if only a handful of them did any real damage.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shalist

I'll bite. I mean, either you assume fixed values (1 lb of salt = 5g) or assume that everything is different, including gold being hundreds of times rarer. It amounts to the same thing, and since 'salt crafting' is funnier...

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dhasenan

It pretty much only works with salt. (Maybe a couple other trade goods -- iron, perhaps?)

(You also have the question of why magic would care about market values.)

---

Just to clarify, by 'everything is different' I'm referring to how the price/scarcity of everything (not just trade goods) is drastically and inconsistently different, such that determining a simple $ to GP exchange rate based on apples-to-apples comparisons of their relative, native spending powers, at the very least, a bit more complicated.

Even assuming you ignore all the things that are readily available today (8gp for an ink cartridge, 100g for a magnifying glass, 20g for a pack of matches, etc.) and focus on more basic goods and services, there's still the matter of different RL economies to consider -- i.e. a minimum wage of $0.03/hr in Sierra Leone vs. $18/hr in Australia.

tl;dr: Pricing can either be arbitrary, complicated, or both. Given those options, I prefer arbitrary

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Troacctid

You should assume that any monetary costs use real-world currency at sensible exchange rates.

---

Thanks, this simplifies theory-crafting. Given the various opportunities to profit from magic, the specific details are somewhat moot, but naturally it's interesting to think about.

Barring salt shenanigans, I was originally thinking of an $10-50/gp exchange rate based loosely on relative spending power in the US, but now I'm thinking in the same ballpark as dhasenan, with $0.25-1.00/gp. If magic items were available, they would still be unobtainable for large swaths of the world, though commoners from wealthy countries (who're practically adventurers money-wise) would merely find them expensive, which seems about right.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dhasenan

Thanks for providing a ruling, and this one makes sense.

To translate it into concrete terms, we need to come up with magic items that have real-world equivalents.

---

In addition to asking "Why does magic care about market values," one could also ask "Why would magic care how useful someone finds it," as such thinking also tends to be subjective :smallwink:

Don't worry too much about the math. Just assume that it's all handwaved to be sensible on a case-by-case basis.

D&D prices are set based on the needs of the game. Real-world prices are set based on economics and the laws of supply and demand. They're never going to line up exactly, but in general, expensive things will probably be expensive, and cheap things will probably be cheap.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zanos

Actual attack rolls in D&D aren't the only attacks per round, they're the decisive attacks. A person can survive 29 stabs if only a handful of them did any real damage.

---

Well, sure. You could survive a thousand paper cuts, but that's not what Thaneus was referring to. I'm not going to needlessly complicate the issue by bringing up irrelevant technicalities.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Red Fel

Well, first off, shooting someone point blank in the face is only good if it would be a coup de grace in any other situation - that is, if the target is helpless. Otherwise, you've overlooked the primary aspect of a firearm, which is that it is a ranged weapon, and using it in close quarters against anyone but a helpless opponent is a bad idea.

Second, "to the face" is a called shot, not a critical hit. Called shots are not part of core D&D rules. There is a PF variant on called shots, but again, not part of the core rules. So, technically, they're not a thing - shots to any part of the body deal damage, as normal. They may be a critical hit, true, but that simply means they deal more damage.

---

You misunderstand. I'm saying that since a critical hit is simply a hit that deals much more damage than usual, I'd say a headshot counts. And since a coup de grace does critical hit damage, and you'd be shooting them in the head, I'd say that any shot to the head would be a critical hit; it requires the successful marriage of real-world logic and RAW, which is dicey, but it seems to hold up pretty well.

Quote:

---

Doing it reliably is better. Doing it consistently is solid. Being able to consistently survive gunshot wounds does turn a man into a myth pretty quickly.

...

That's fair. I'm not saying you could survive a SWAT team. But the comment was on a "stray bullet." Even if you have middling HP, at level 1, that bullet would probably put you into the negatives at worst; it's unlikely that the shot would instantly drop you below -10, unless you have fewer than 10 HP to begin with.

---

Agreed; stray shots aren't much of a problem, and consistently surviving gunshot wounds is mythical.
But it isn't godlike, let's be clear. And, honestly, I don't even think you'd take bullets often enough to become a myth; chances are, once they see you're still standing, they'll just keep shooting - that's what I'd do if the first bullet didn't work.

Just how often do you think you'll take exactly one bullet, and then be out of danger? By the time you can consistently tank multiple, chances are you'll have much cooler powers anyway.

To clarify, though, we're on the same page; you're much more beefy than any natural human, and a lone gunshot isn't much of a threat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by King539

In all seriousness though, I'd probably say pathfinder wizard. Lots of useful spells for life. Like Unseen Servant.

---

Actually nevermind. Druid. Speak with animals is the best.

Hmm, now here's a real question. What Craft or Profession skills would be best to invest skill points IRL?

I'd say probably something like Craft: Electronics or Craft: Computer Hardware, but I'm not sure if we'd be able to get around all of the equipment requirements easily without basically having some kind of lab or factory for it. Also, a lot of those things depend heavily on brand name for people to be willing to buy them, so one might have to combine that with Forgery or Linguistics?

Craft: Automotive Parts might run into similar issues, but maybe have less barriers to entry on the equipment side, since I think a fair number of them are things that a person with skill, raw materials, and access to a metal shop could make.

Profession: Welder is, IIRC, probably the most profitable trade, especially if one is able to specify Profession: Underwater Welder or something.

I suppose Profession: Builder or Profession: Handyman might be able to be used for home improvement, though that might be one of those cases where one would need to invest in Craft: Carpentry and Craft: Drywall and Profession: Electrician and the like.

Of course, Profession: Barrister ranks would probably let one pass the BAR at level 1, if one has access to taking it in one's area.

I know Linguistics would be highly useful in a PF character context, since by learning the major languages of the world, one also becomes better at forgery. Although how using the skill system to forge things with anti-forgery things in them would work out would be a bit of a question, I suppose. Legal documents don't usually have that sort of thing, I suppose, but IIRC, the modern legal system would make it difficult to employ that if parties are interested in contesting them, and if one employs mind control to avoid that sort of thing, one wouldn't need to have forged anything in the first place.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Celestia

So we know its size and weight, but that doesn't say anything about the actual gold content or purity.

---

Well, having the density would help with determining at least a rough idea of the purity.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Troacctid

You should assume that any monetary costs use real-world currency at sensible exchange rates.

---

So, what, making a magic item costs about as much as buying a house or car or the like in unspecified magical materials?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Red Fel

That alone makes you like a god. You can soak a gunshot to the face and walk it off.

---

I still wouldn't want to put that theory to the test against a high-powered rifle aimed at my head. Especially at 1st level with somewhere south of 10 HP.

Especially if we're going with any kind of combination of human health and healing combined with the HP system like we are with our ability to learn things both organically in the usual human fashion and through the investment of skill points. Unless we lose our ability to learn things organically and can only learn via investment of skill points upon gaining our first level? :smallconfused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Troacctid

Don't worry too much about the math. Just assume that it's all handwaved to be sensible on a case-by-case basis.

D&D prices are set based on the needs of the game. Real-world prices are set based on economics and the laws of supply and demand. They're never going to line up exactly, but in general, expensive things will probably be expensive, and cheap things will probably be cheap.

---

Interestingly enough, assuming that coins, gems, and anything labeled a trade good contain some form of 'magical essence' that crafters harvest to craft magical items would result in fixed prices under the law of supply and demand with just one additional assumption:
Enough magic item crafting goes on that the crafters have a meaningful impact on the consumption of such things.

If that's the case, then:
What happens when one trade good on the list goes below the 'standard' cost?
The demand for it goes up. It's suddenly a strictly better choice of resource than all of the other crafting material sources, so crafters stop getting the rest and get just that one... until the prices equalize again.
What happens when one trade good on the list goes above the 'standard' cost?
The demand for it plummets, It's suddenly a strictly worse choice of resource than all of the other crafting material sources, so crafters stop getting that one and get the rest... until prices equalize again.
When it comes to the coins themselves, the same applies: If the value of coins go down relative to other crafting materials, coins get pulled out of the economy until it goes back up to standard (relative to other crafting materials). If the value of coins goes up relative to other crafting materials, the other crafting materials get pulled out of the economy until the value of those materials matches that of the coins.

The result? Prices become effectively fixed based on the magical essence content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coidzor

I'd say probably something like Craft: Electronics or Craft: Computer Hardware

---

At that point, you're doing bespoke hardware for one-off specialty projects. But without certifications, you aren't landing big projects.

Quote:

---

Craft: Automotive Parts might run into similar issues

---

Go for the antique car restoration market, maybe?

My heart would say "take a level in Sorcerer" because I like the idea of being able to cast spells because you are just. that. cool.

But if it was based on real-life stats I have to admit reluctantly that my primary stat would be too low to be doing me any favours and I'd be more sensible to take a level in Wizard. At least I have written evidence to suggest that my Intelligence is above average. :vaarsuvius:

It's not so bad, because I'd be mostly getting mileage out of the cantrips, and first-level Wizards know 'em all, even if it does mean lugging a spellbook about the place.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malacandra

... even if it does mean lugging a spellbook about the place.

---

Spellkindle. *nods*

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Celestia

Spellkindle. *nods*

---

That is basically what a Blessed Book is.... although it is an interesting question if pictures of a spellbook's pages would work for preparing spells...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jack_Simth

That is basically what a Blessed Book is.... although it is an interesting question if pictures of a spellbook's pages would work for preparing spells...

---

I would think so. A spellbook isn't like a scroll and doesn't have any magic within its pages. It's merely a bunch of arcane words and mathematical equations detailing how to cast the spell. That's why higher level spells take up more pages in a spellbook but still only occupy one scroll.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coidzor

Hmm, now here's a real question. What Craft or Profession skills would be best to invest skill points IRL?

I'd say probably something like Craft: Electronics or Craft: Computer Hardware, but I'm not sure if we'd be able to get around all of the equipment requirements easily without basically having some kind of lab or factory for it. Also, a lot of those things depend heavily on brand name for people to be willing to buy them, so one might have to combine that with Forgery or Linguistics?

Craft: Automotive Parts might run into similar issues, but maybe have less barriers to entry on the equipment side, since I think a fair number of them are things that a person with skill, raw materials, and access to a metal shop could make.

Profession: Welder is, IIRC, probably the most profitable trade, especially if one is able to specify Profession: Underwater Welder or something.

I suppose Profession: Builder or Profession: Handyman might be able to be used for home improvement, though that might be one of those cases where one would need to invest in Craft: Carpentry and Craft: Drywall and Profession: Electrician and the like.

Of course, Profession: Barrister ranks would probably let one pass the BAR at level 1, if one has access to taking it in one's area.

I know Linguistics would be highly useful in a PF character context, since by learning the major languages of the world, one also becomes better at forgery. Although how using the skill system to forge things with anti-forgery things in them would work out would be a bit of a question, I suppose. Legal documents don't usually have that sort of thing, I suppose, but IIRC, the modern legal system would make it difficult to employ that if parties are interested in contesting them, and if one employs mind control to avoid that sort of thing, one wouldn't need to have forged anything in the first place.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dhasenan

At that point, you're doing bespoke hardware for one-off specialty projects. But without certifications, you aren't landing big projects.

---

This. Thing is, taking skill ranks in real-world skills or professions just means you have the skills to do things that people ordinarily have the skills to do. Even being really good at one of these things barely rises to the level of noteworthiness of, say, creating the magical manufactory.

More importantly, though, in the developed world, having skills isn't enough. Frequently, someone will be exceptionally skilled and arguably unhirable because he is self-taught, and thus never received certification. And not just any certification, distinguished certification. You could have, for example, 50 ranks in Profession: Barrister, but if you didn't go to one of the most distinguished law schools to get your degree, the biggest firms won't even look at you.

Now, if you're lucky, you find an employer who will hire you for your awesome skills, provided that you attend a certification program and get the degree or certificate. And at that point, you're doing what you'd do in real life anyway. Having skill levels from an adventuring class isn't helping you, because you still have to attend years of schooling.

And even once you have that job, you're entry-level, which means you still aren't making the big bucks appropriate for someone of your talents. You'll have to work for several more years to earn that raise. And at that point, you're doing what you'd do in real life anyway. Having skill levels from an adventuring class isn't helping you, because you still have to work for years to get the salary you deserve.

I mean, if your ambition is simply, "Do what I would do ordinarily, but be extremely competent on you," I applaud your dedication. Me, I want flying invisible laser murder.

I agree wholeheartedly with Red Fel.

It's like the Beguiling Influence/Baleful Utterance discussion earlier in the thread. Yes, you can have really good social skills, and that's helpful, but there are many people with really good natural social skills anyway.

On the other hand, there isn't anyone who can shatter any inanimate object with a word, or, for that matter, fly around invisibly blasting magic and mentally controlling people, although that might take a few more incarnations of this thread to happen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coidzor

So, what, making a magic item costs about as much as buying a house or car or the like in unspecified magical materials?

---

Well, of course, it depends on the item, but that's a reasonable assumption, yes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malacandra

My heart would say "take a level in Sorcerer" because I like the idea of being able to cast spells because you are just. that. cool.

But if it was based on real-life stats I have to admit reluctantly that my primary stat would be too low to be doing me any favours and I'd be more sensible to take a level in Wizard. At least I have written evidence to suggest that my Intelligence is above average. :vaarsuvius:

It's not so bad, because I'd be mostly getting mileage out of the cantrips, and first-level Wizards know 'em all, even if it does mean lugging a spellbook about the place.

---

As part of this exercise, you get a standard array (13, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8) that you can rearrange as you like.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Troacctid

As part of this exercise, you get a standard array (13, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8) that you can rearrange as you like.

---

*modest harrumph*. I feel I'd be losing on that deal. :smallbiggrin:

I will go with the simple route and say Warlock. I can't count on any of my stats to be a real caster, but having at-will abilities is just too fancy to skip. Plus, by 2030 I will be creating wondrous items!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coidzor

Hmm, now here's a real question. What Craft or Profession skills would be best to invest skill points IRL?

---

Craft(Alchemy).

I can't put my finger on them right now, but there's rules for custom alchemical items that emulate spells up to 3rd level.

There's also a ton of "man I wish we had something that convenient" items in there for various trades. If you wanted to make money, cheating physics with alchemy is the ticket.

Craft(Traps)

This one largely depends on if it actually lets you trivially create Self resetting trapsperpetual motion machines.

My nonelite array would place the two highest scores in Strength and Intelligence, though I'm not sure which gets which. My two lowest scores would probably go into Constitution and Dexterity, as I am fairly inflexible and can't hold my breath for more than a minute. Charisma and Wisdom would get the middling scores.

This is NOT an ideal array for any class that I know of. My low Con makes me a less-than-worthy melee combatant, my low Dex makes me a sub-par ranged combatant and tanks my AC. My Int could work for a SAD class, but I surely don't want to be poring over books all day to learn spells.

My top choices would be Factotum (I'd describe myself as more of a dabbler than a specialist), Psion, or Beguiler. At first level, I'd say Beguiler is my best option for the sheer flexibility of having access to its whole spell list.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by prufock

My nonelite array would place the two highest scores in Strength and Intelligence, though I'm not sure which gets which. My two lowest scores would probably go into Constitution and Dexterity, as I am fairly inflexible and can't hold my breath for more than a minute. Charisma and Wisdom would get the middling scores.

This is NOT an ideal array for any class that I know of. My low Con makes me a less-than-worthy melee combatant, my low Dex makes me a sub-par ranged combatant and tanks my AC. My Int could work for a SAD class, but I surely don't want to be poring over books all day to learn spells.

---

You can rearrange them, if that helps.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Troacctid

You can rearrange them, if that helps.

---

The little problem with this (at least for me) is that I don't want to be a different person. I want to keep being me, dumped-everything-but-intelligence and all. Fiddling with physical stats may not be too bad in this sense as long as I don't have to exercise to keep them up or anything, but I definitely want to keep my mental stats right where they are.

Certifications would be a pain for those that need them and aren't readily acquired by someone who can demonstrate the skills.

Still, even for a would-be superhero, there must be some skills that would be useful, especially if we go with the general premise that a 6th level character is at or near the peak of baseline humanity's ability to do things.

Being able to be a foremost expert in a field within 4 or 5 years (or less if one is accruing XP) should count for something, even if it's being computer savvy enough to manage playing off one's activities as a hoax or urban legend.

If nothing else, I suppose changing one's identity gets simpler with world class or better than world class forgery abilities.

Or I suppose one could be the next Banksy, especially with access to teleport.

Hmm, come to think of it, I wonder how long it would take to make something Wonder of the World worthy and at what level one could have it done before anyone notices...

Also what level we're looking at for someone to start making their own moon base...

Edit: Now I'm imagining a troll build that acquires XP by jumping into zoo enclosures, punching out gorillas and bears and tigers and the like within a few seconds, then scarpering. How quickly could we get that off the ground with both the ability to punch out animals and escape retribution for it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Malimar

The little problem with this (at least for me) is that I don't want to be a different person. I want to keep being me, dumped-everything-but-intelligence and all. Fiddling with physical stats may not be too bad in this sense as long as I don't have to exercise to keep them up or anything, but I definitely want to keep my mental stats right where they are.

---

Unless you're around genius level, then a 15 is probably at your int or higher, IIRC.

Would suck to have to give up a feat to not get dumber, though, if one goes with 3.5.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Coidzor

Unless you're around genius level, then a 15 is probably at your int or higher, IIRC.

---

Yeah, not saying my int is an 18 or anything, just that it's my only stat above 10.

If I were being really generous to myself, I suppose I might allow that my wisdom and constitution could be as high as 12. But my str, dex, and cha are definitely garbage.

You know, as I was sitting in my study drinking a cup of dark, rich cocoa, the thought occurred to me that I was going about this all wrong.

I was pursuing this from the angle of independence and freedom. I was viewing this with the understanding that, assuming you're the only one like you in the world - or at least, one of relatively few - you will be discovered, and you will be hunted down; it's simply a question of when. Following that logic, I determined that the easiest way to maintain one's freedom is to have a suite of at-will abilities that could allow you to easily and effortlessly elude or escape capture, such as flight, invisibility, and tactical teleportation. Also lasers, because they're fun.

I forgot one important angle. There's another way to elude or escape capture. It's called diplomatic immunity.

Consider it a 180 if you must. I had previously disparaged Psion (Telepath) as an option, because the powers at low levels (even with my unreasonably high Int score) are few and far between, and unimpressive. But, as has been pointed out, they're easy to conceal. Furthermore, in a mere five years, you're on the cusp of that noblest of PrCs: Thrallherd.

That's what I realized. If I were, say, a less-disfigured combination of Victor von Doom and Darth Vader, I really wouldn't have to worry about world governments pursuing me, because I would be a world government. By the time I reach Thrallherd, I can speak any language, read minds, stop someone's breathing, and spray psychic stuff. So I'm in a good position to depose the ruler of a small dictatorial island nation, and impose myself as the new ruler. I'm in position to enact whatever laws I see fit, such as would entice great minds of the world to come to my island to create, and entice great wallets to come to my island to invest. My nation would be small enough that nobody would bother warring with us, but influential enough that nobody would want to provoke us by acting against our glorious leader, being me. In less than a decade from now, I would be eligible for a seat on the United Nations.

In retrospect, it's shockingly obvious.

The question, however, is whether to go with the Psion (Telepath) or the Erudite. Frankly, StP Erudite seems the obvious choice if PCs other than myself exist. If I am the only PC, Psion is the obvious answer, as Erudite (StP or otherwise) is only able to learn powers beyond those granted by acquiring them from others, from stones, or by taking a feat - none of which seem terribly helpful when I'm the only one.

So, allow me to rephrase my answer with more finality. In a world where I am the only PC, this is me.

Spoiler

Show

Red Fel
Psion (Telepath) 1
STR: 8
DEX: 10
CON: 12
INT: 26¹
WIS: 13
CHA: 14

Feats: Overchannel (Human bonus feat), Psicrystal Affinity (Psion bonus feat).
PP/day: 2+4²
Powers Known: Charm, Psionic; Inertial Armor; Mindlink.

¹ The 15 in the Elite Array is here replaced by Red Fel's natural Int score, which has previously been established as 26.
² INT grants a bonus to PP/day.

In a world where PCs are a thing:

Spoiler

Show

Red Fel
Erudite (Spell to Power variant) 1
STR: 8
DEX: 10
CON: 12
INT: 26¹
WIS: 13
CHA: 14

Feats: Overchannel (Human bonus feat), Psicrystal Affinity².
PP/day: 2+4³
Powers Known⁴: Attraction; Demoralize; Far Hand; Inertial Armor; Matter Agitation; Mind Thrust; Missive; Synchronicity; Synesthete; Vigor.

¹ The 15 in the Elite Array is here replaced by Red Fel's natural Int score, which has previously been established as 26.
² The Spell to Power variant Erudite gains Psicrystal Affinity as a normal Erudite, but loses its bonus feat.
³ INT grants a bonus to PP/day.
⁴ An Erudite starts play with two 1st-level powers known, plus one for every point of INT modifier. Red Fel has an INT modifier of +8.