-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
Shotguns don't get them additional attacks. A Land Speeder Storm is open-topped, so they can assault on the turn they disembark. Why would you rob yourself of an additional attack if that's what you're doing? All that accomplishes is making them suck worse than tacticals in assault.
Shotguns, compared to pistols, are Assault 2, which essentially gives them extra attack at I11, or ability to put more hurt on something you won't assault. Plus, supposedly, in 6th edition, assault weapons will also count as CCW, according to rumors, anyway.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Let me put it another way. Please assault my infantry platoon with five scouts with AP - weapons and one attack each; I could use an assault I can win preceded by shots I actually get to make a save against. :smalltongue:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
Let me put it another way. Please assault my infantry platoon with five scouts with AP - weapons and one attack each; I could use an assault I can win preceded by shots I actually get to make a save against. :smalltongue:
Hey, Scouts replace their Boltguns for Shotguns.
...They still have pistols. No save for you!
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Hey, Scouts replace their Boltguns for Shotguns.
...They still have pistols. No save for you!
In which case they'd be better off with combat blades. :smallamused:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
In which case they'd be better off with combat blades. :smallamused:
Probably, but if was up to me, I'd be Assaulting Command Squads. I also run Sergeants with Power Fists and Combi-Flamers for just such an occasion.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Probably, but if was up to me, I'd be Assaulting Command Squads. I also run Sergeants with Power Fists and Combi-Flamers for just such an occasion.
In a Chimera. Sorry. :smallbiggrin:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
In a Chimera. Sorry. :smallbiggrin:
This assumes the Scouts would have charged in blindly, with no support, into a fight they had no reason to be in, though. Them having all the mobility they need to pick when and where to fight, that seems rather unlikely - the Space Marine player would hold the Scouts back until something else cracked that Chimera, or send them against a different, more suited target to begin with, I'd think...
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Winterwind
This assumes the Scouts would have charged in blindly, with no support, into a fight they had no reason to be in, though. Them having all the mobility they need to pick when and where to fight, that seems rather unlikely - the Space Marine player would hold the Scouts back until something else cracked that Chimera, or send them against a different, more suited target to begin with, I'd think...
The point is my lists only ever have one infantry unit, and it's a huge blob that gets more attacks than the scouts due to having four or five times as many bodies and has at least one power weapon in for just such an eventuality. If my Chimeras are all cracked, I've probably already lost, because trying to footslog meltas to their targets via T3 Sv 5+ bodies doesn't tend to work very well.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
In a Chimera. Sorry. :smallbiggrin:
It's almost like you think I don't deal with Mech on a regular basis.
Land Speeder Storm Outflanks. Bypassing the entirety of your shooting. There's very little you can do about an Outflanking Skimmer. Especially one that's Fast. The Multi-Melta on the Storm gets in range of the tank, cracks it.
Scouts Assault what comes out. Or, the Scouts stay in the Storm if that's what's beneficial. Nobody says you have to Assault. Having Shotguns allows the opportunity of not Assaulting. Although you can do the same with Boltguns.
Using Land Speeder Storms and minimum-man Scout Squads takes finesse. And a lot of players don't have it. That's why they play Blood Angels. :smalltongue:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
While I love Land Speeder Storms as much as the next guy, I'd like to point out that the fact that you were able to fire your Multi-Melta means that your Speeder moved no more than 12 inches.
What if, for instance, your Multi-Melta shot fails to destroy said transport? The scouts would either have to sit in their Speeder (which has no cover save), and take return fire on your enemy's turn, or assault the transport itself and hope that the Powerfist will be able to hit the transport. Even then, if they manage to destroy the transport through assault (pretty unlikely, but it happens) they won't be locked in the relative safety of assault. Meaning they're going to get shot.
Honestly, I'd rather use my Land Speeder Storms to deliver my Scouts to things like Long Fangs, Broadside Battlesuits, etc.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
... I can't believe running the captain with the assault marines and the Chaplain with the DC didn't occur to me sooner... Though that might be because i didn't know captains could be run with jump packs.
Timberwolf, thank you for suggesting it. :smallsmile:
...'course, now i gotta wait to go buy jump pack bits... Ah well. Plenty of painting/assembly to occupy my time till wednesday.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Razaele
While I love Land Speeder Storms as much as the next guy, I'd like to point out that the fact that you were able to fire your Multi-Melta means that your Speeder moved no more than 12 inches.
What if, for instance, your Multi-Melta shot fails to destroy said transport? The scouts would either have to sit in their Speeder (which has no cover save), and take return fire on your enemy's turn, or assault the transport itself and hope that the Powerfist will be able to hit the transport. Even then, if they manage to destroy the transport through assault (pretty unlikely, but it happens) they won't be locked in the relative safety of assault. Meaning they're going to get shot.
Honestly, I'd rather use my Land Speeder Storms to deliver my Scouts against things like Long Fangs, Broadside Battlesuits, etc.
They're Landspeeders and they're scouts. Their standard tactics are high-risk propositions to begin with and you want to begrudge them that?
How the hell do you use Landspeeders? Hidding in cover in the furthest corner of the board? :p
"Boss! 'Es shootin' at me!"
"Wat? Well shoot 'im back ya grot!"
Besides, Scouts are weenies so there's a good chance your opponent might ignore them in favour of something scarier.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tarinaky
They're Landspeeders and they're scouts. Their standard tactics are high-risk propositions to begin with and you want to begrudge them that?
I never said that I wanted to keep my Scouts out of harm's way. I just said that I think it would be more reasonable to use them against things that will more likely crumble against them in assault. Taking out a transport is all well and good, and I agree, sometimes absolutely necessary. But like Cheesegear mentioned, Scouts are a unit that requires finesse.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tarinaky
How the hell do you use Landspeeders? Hidding in cover in the furthest corner of the board? :p
If you'll read my post, I specifically said that I'd rather use my Land Speeder Storms to deliver my Scouts to things like Long Fangs, Broadside Battlesuits, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tarinaky
Besides, Scouts are weenies so there's a good chance your opponent might ignore them in favour of something scarier.
True for your enemy's long range heavy weapons. Not true for your enemy's squad that was in that transport that you just tried to target. You know, the one that has those close range anti-infantry weapons, such as Bolters and Lasguns.
Using your Landspeeder Storms to take out transports can work, but what I'm trying to say is that I think they're better off targetting things that should never be in assault.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Ok. I've been rude and abrasive about my lists, and i'm sorry. Cheesegear was right, i should've expected critique on a list towards optimization if I didn't say i just wanted to check if it was legal...
I would, however, like to optimize deployment for this list:
Spoiler
Show
Captain
- Storm Bolter
- Lightning Claw
- Jump Pack
Chaplain
- Jump Pack
Death Company
- Thunder Hammer
- Jump Packs
- +2 Marines
Assault Squad
- Meltagun
- Powerfist
- +5 Marines
Scout Squad
- Sniper Rifles
- Missile Launcher
- +5 Marines
Tactical Squad
- Missile Launcher
- Chainsword
- Flamer
- +5 Marines
I'm sure i'm going to split into combat squads for the tactical and scout squads, run the captain with the assault squad and the chaplain with the DC but otherwise i'm drawing a blank here... Ideas?
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
The beauty of things like Landspeeder Storms, Kommandos, Wolf Scouts and outflankers is that those units are capable of getting into combat the turn they come but also that they genuinely affect your opponent's deployment, pushing them away from table edges and sides and oftentimes closer to you. Unless your opponent is bad/inexperienced/unable to adapt to curveball tactics. In which case, have fun clubbing your seal.
Also the scouts don't have to charge whatever the Landspeeder shot at, being a seperate unit and all that. You guys knew that already, though. You could feel the waters out, maybe end up immobilizing a transport, and end up charging the blob/long fangs/broadsides/lootas anyway--even if you won't roflstomp them, you still stand a very good chance of denying them shooting for AT LEAST a turn.
Shotguns was correct, as far as arming them goes, unless the vehicle rules get some kind of "units embarked count as stationary" overhaul next edition...I wouldn't get my hopes up there.
I was gonna whine about not having cool landspeeders or Shotguns for Wolf Scouts, but I guess Smurfs gotta have some exclusive toys. The storm intrigues me enough that I've considered on several occasions abandoning the DA codex for my bike/speeder Ravenwing army to go that route instead, but IDK.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HalfTangible
I would, however, like to optimize
deployment for this list:
Spoiler
Show
Captain
- Storm Bolter
- Lightning Claw
- Jump Pack
Chaplain
- Jump Pack
Death Company
- Thunder Hammer
- Jump Packs
- +2 Marines
Assault Squad
- Meltagun
- Powerfist
- +5 Marines
Scout Squad
- Sniper Rifles
- Missile Launcher
- +5 Marines
Tactical Squad
- Missile Launcher
- Chainsword
- Flamer
- +5 Marines
I'm sure i'm going to split into combat squads for the tactical and scout squads, run the captain with the assault squad and the chaplain with the DC but otherwise i'm drawing a blank here... Ideas?
Well as far as all infantry lists are concerned, you don't have that many stuff that needs to march all over the field. When you split up your squads, you have M. Launcher Marines and scouts that are sitting on your side of board and Assault and DC guys that are flying over. That leaves you with 5 regular marines and 5 scouts who need to run in.
That said, my best bet would be this:
Annihilation -> Don't squad anything, sit on your side with scouts, run everything else forward.
Objectives -> Scouts sit on objective, with M. Launcher tacticals close if scouts get wiped, or need help. Jumpy guys go forward as fast as possible, with the rest of the scouts and marines running (in shooting phase), hoping to score objectives on the middle, or in opponents side of the field.
Quick note, I think your captain is better with dual claws instead of just one, it gives you extra attack in melee for only 5 points.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bodez
Well as far as all infantry lists are concerned, you don't have that many stuff that needs to march all over the field. When you split up your squads, you have M. Launcher Marines and scouts that are sitting on your side of board and Assault and DC guys that are flying over. That leaves you with 5 regular marines and 5 scouts who need to run in.
That said, my best bet would be this:
Annihilation -> Don't squad anything, sit on your side with scouts, run everything else forward.
Objectives -> Scouts sit on objective, with M. Launcher tacticals close if scouts get wiped, or need help. Jumpy guys go forward as fast as possible, with the rest of the scouts and marines running (in shooting phase), hoping to score objectives on the middle, or in opponents side of the field.
Kthx
Quote:
Quick note, I think your captain is better with dual claws instead of just one, it gives you extra attack in melee for only 5 points.
Yeah, but I don't have a second claw to give him and he looks better with a storm bolter imho.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HalfTangible
Yeah, but I don't have a second claw to give him and he looks better with a storm bolter imho.
Honestly, if I were playing against you, and you write on your list pair of claws, but model you unit with a stormbolter and one claw because it looks better, I would say go for it. After all, codex allows you both on your Captain anyways.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bodez
Honestly, if I were playing against you, and you write on your list pair of claws, but model you unit with a stormbolter and one claw because it looks better, I would say go for it. After all, codex allows you both on your Captain anyways.
Yeah but if i put both my point total goes over anyway :smallfrown:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HalfTangible
Yeah but if i put both my point total goes over anyway :smallfrown:
Make the Thunderhammer into P. Fist? Other then that, no idea.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bodez
Make the Thunderhammer into P. Fist? Other then that, no idea.
Nah. I'll stick with one claw and add this to the 'do these things for your 2000 point list' list.
- Make the Chaplain a Reclusiarch.
- Storm Ravens.
- Give the Captain a second Lightning claw.
- Get a larger Death Company.
- Storm Ravens.
- Furioso Dreadnought/Death Company Dreadnought
- Buy a librarian model, mutilate it, and use it as an objective marker. For the Lulz.
- Storm Ravens.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HalfTangible
Nah. I'll stick with one claw and add this to the 'do these things for your 2000 point list' list.
- Buy a librarian model, mutilate it, and use it as an objective marker. For the Lulz.
Now this is a shame. Objective markers are hardly that unimportant, surely you can find something more deserving to be a marker :smallbiggrin:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Alright, thanks for the advice Cheesegear.
i did a bit more digging and found a sale that would be better for my idea, giving me an idea for this list:
Yes i name all my units
what do you think?
eh, i'll try for infantry guard maybe ill actally start winning :smallamused:
DM
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
I think you should put all your plasma guns on one unit of veterans and all your meltaguns on the other; mixing them up isn't good.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
I think you should put all your plasma guns on one unit of veterans and all your meltaguns on the other; mixing them up isn't good.
I guess, they are kind of jack of all trades and master of none this way.
but with my luck the squad with the meltas will be up against the terminators and my plasmas will be up against the land raider. i feel a bit more secure in knowing that they might be able to handle either situation this way.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
HalfTangible
Nah. I'll stick with one claw and add this to the 'do these things for your 2000 point list' list.
- Buy a librarian model, mutilate it, and use it as an objective marker. For the Lulz.
Can't say I agree with this part, but, what the heck. You could also scour ebay for the Spacehulk Dead Blood Angel marker and say it's a Librarian.
The rest of it looks good especially the gunships although I would also add Sternguard to this. With Combi meltas and a Drop pod. Why ? Because they rule, that's why.
Let me tell you about my day.
Spoiler
Show
I went over to a friends and we ended up playing 3 games. Because time wasn't an issue, we played 3000 points, by far the biggest games I've ever played. Whenever we play, it's always a complete bloodbath where we're lucky to still have a couple of units left at the end and today was no exception.
My list
Spoiler
Show
The Sanguinor
Librarian
Furioso Dread
Drop pod Sternguard with 9 Combimeltas and a Heavy Flamer
4 x Scout squads with snipers, missiles and camo cloaks
Death Company - 11 marines with 2 power weapons, power fist and thunder hammer + Land Raider Crusader
Death Company Dread
Landspeeder (twin multimelta
2 Baal Predators
3 x Stormravens
My friend was playing chaos, he took Abaddon, Kharn, Terminators, noise marines, plague marines, Berserkers, a defiler, 3 Obliterators, A vindicator, 2 Landraiders (dedicated transports).
Game 1 was 5 objectives, pitched battle. He started well, killing a Stormraven, my landspeeder and a couple of scouts on the first turn. Then the Death Egg (sorry, but this is my name for a Sternpod) landed and flashfried his Obliterators and a landraider. They all died to his Khorne Lord (he swapped him out for Kharn in games 2 and 3) but they did their job. It ended with me killing his objective holding noise marines with the Sanguinor and then getting him into the Berserkers who were holding the central objective, meaning that I won 2 to 1
Game 2 was 2 Objectives, spearhead. Again, the Death Egg performed wonders, killing a Landraider and immobilising the Defiler. They all died to Abaddon this time, but since he was walking, I wasn't too unhappy. This game ended with me chasng his 5 remaining Plague Marines into their building while sitting outside it with 2 Stormravens and the Landraider with the Death Company getting ever nearer. Luckily for my opponent, he rolled a 3 to see if we got turn 7.
Game 3 was Dawn of War, kill points.
I shall give you 3 guesses as to what the Sternguard killed and what happened to them.
Well, a Landraider certainly died, along with the Vindicator. Then Kharn emerged from the smoking wreck of his favourite ride and killed them all with a bit of help from his bodyguard (although he killed one of them) Abaddon killed the Sanguinor after every thing in the Chaos army had shot at him (Game one gave my opponent a new found terror in the BA codex) and reduced him to a wound before shooting 4 Lascannons, 5 Meltas and a pair of Melta bombs at the Landraider, failing to even glance at each and every turn. I was amazed by this, but not about to question it. Abaddon then died under a massive spam of Death Company. Rain stopped play on this one, but it was only a matter of time before annihilation of the heretics.
All in all, the Sternguard, Landraider and the gunships were my standout units. They killed a lot of stuff dead. My Landspeeder... dear me, how much fire and how much priority did my friend place on killing it ? So very much for an 80 point unit. I think I'll take 3 next time.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Timberwolf
Let me tell you about my day.
Spoiler
Show
I went over to a friends and we ended up playing 3 games. Because time wasn't an issue, we played 3000 points, by far the biggest games I've ever played. Whenever we play, it's always a complete bloodbath where we're lucky to still have a couple of units left at the end and today was no exception.
My list
Spoiler
Show
The Sanguinor
Librarian
Furioso Dread
Drop pod Sternguard with 9 Combimeltas and a Heavy Flamer
4 x Scout squads with snipers, missiles and camo cloaks
Death Company - 11 marines with 2 power weapons, power fist and thunder hammer + Land Raider Crusader
Death Company Dread
Landspeeder (twin multimelta
2 Baal Predators
3 x Stormravens
My friend was playing chaos, he took Abaddon, Kharn, Terminators, noise marines, plague marines, Berserkers, a defiler, 3 Obliterators, A vindicator, 2 Landraiders (dedicated transports).
Game 1 was 5 objectives, pitched battle. He started well, killing a Stormraven, my landspeeder and a couple of scouts on the first turn. Then the Death Egg (sorry, but this is my name for a Sternpod) landed and flashfried his Obliterators and a landraider. They all died to his Khorne Lord (he swapped him out for Kharn in games 2 and 3) but they did their job. It ended with me killing his objective holding noise marines with the Sanguinor and then getting him into the Berserkers who were holding the central objective, meaning that I won 2 to 1
Game 2 was 2 Objectives, spearhead. Again, the Death Egg performed wonders, killing a Landraider and immobilising the Defiler. They all died to Abaddon this time, but since he was walking, I wasn't too unhappy. This game ended with me chasng his 5 remaining Plague Marines into their building while sitting outside it with 2 Stormravens and the Landraider with the Death Company getting ever nearer. Luckily for my opponent, he rolled a 3 to see if we got turn 7.
Game 3 was Dawn of War, kill points.
I shall give you 3 guesses as to what the Sternguard killed and what happened to them.
Well, a Landraider certainly died, along with the Vindicator. Then Kharn emerged from the smoking wreck of his favourite ride and killed them all with a bit of help from his bodyguard (although he killed one of them) Abaddon killed the Sanguinor after every thing in the Chaos army had shot at him (Game one gave my opponent a new found terror in the BA codex) and reduced him to a wound before shooting 4 Lascannons, 5 Meltas and a pair of Melta bombs at the Landraider, failing to even glance at each and every turn. I was amazed by this, but not about to question it. Abaddon then died under a massive spam of Death Company. Rain stopped play on this one, but it was only a matter of time before annihilation of the heretics.
All in all, the Sternguard, Landraider and the gunships were my standout units. They killed a lot of stuff dead. My Landspeeder... dear me, how much fire and how much priority did my friend place on killing it ? So very much for an 80 point unit. I think I'll take 3 next time.
Nice. I've been thinking of getting a Land Raider or Stormraven myself, but I'm not sure how effective they'd be in my otherwise de-meched list.
In related news, I've been giving my GKs a good bit of play lately. Figuring out what works and what doesn't, that sort of thing.
But no matter what I do, I can't seem to come up with an interesting 1500 point list other than my default "20 Terminators with Inquisitorial support" Deep Strike list. So I was wondering if you folks had any suggestions for any other interesting lists I could run?
I'd like to stick mostly to the models I have already for the most part, but I can certainly do a bit of counts as if there's anything crucial I don't have. It's not like I haven't been proxying my Inquisitors' ever-changing Henchmen warbands since I picked up the army. :smalltongue:
My next additions are likely to be the previously mentioned Henchmen, but I'm also considering picking up a Land Raider or Storm Raven. I'm also in the middle of removing the Falchions from some of my Terminators thanks to the FAQ killing any possibility of use they might have had.
Here's the models I have:
Spoiler
Show
Unique:
- 1x Inquisitor (Sword+Hellrifle)
- 1x Inquisitor (Power Armour+Sword+Bolt Pistol)
- 1x Grand Master/Brother Captain (Incinerator+Sword)
- 1x Librarian (Sword)
- 1x Brotherhood Champion
- 1x Dreadknight (Sword+Heavy Incinerator)
- 1x Vindicare Assassin
- 1x Rifleman Dreadnought
Terminators:- 12x Halberds
- 4x Daemonhammers
- 4x Psycannons
- 2x Incinerators
- 1x Apothecary+Halberd
- 1x Brotherhood Banner
- 1x Warding Stave
- 3x Falchions (Need to redo these with something more useful)
Power Armoured:
- 6x Sword
- 5x Halberd
- 4x Psycannon
- 4x Incinerator
- 1x Daemonhammer
So yeah, hit me with any ideas you might have floating around, and I'll let you know how they go. I'm open to trying just about any sort of list.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tome
Nice. I've been thinking of getting a Land Raider or Stormraven myself, but I'm not sure how effective they'd be in my otherwise de-meched list.
Take 2, or, better yet, 3 (Although the last is practical for me in a 1500 list with my usual 85 point troop choices. Grey Knights... not so much)
From experience, a Stomraven is tough enough to take a lot of punishment. Be advised though, people will hate your gunship, especially after the first few times you use it, and will devote a lot of resources to killing it. This is good and bad and the reason for taking multiple examples, every lawcanon devoted to its destruction means that the other one stands a better chance of survival. It can also carry a 5 man squad of terminators with a Terminator IC.
Also, one on one, a GK's Stormraven is no match for a Blood Angels one. Unless the Bloodstrike missiles fail (which can happen but is unlikely), you'll be very down on firepower in comparison. I personally have blown up several GK Stormravens on the first turn because of my 72" range S8 AP1 missiles.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
So, played my first game with my IG yesterday. I'm still not completely happy with the list but if I get a few more models that should be fixed.
Highlights were:
- Hellhounds are cool. Or Hot. Probably Hot.
- Having 40 guardsmen and have them all fire three shots is pretty nice, even with lasguns.
- Leman Russ demolisher with plasma sponsons. Rawr.
- Psyker battle squad (converted from Empire flagelants) is great, being able to choose between making a Panic test harder or dropping another template to make sure they have to make one is great.
Downlights:
- 30 teleporting Boys, right into my battleline. That probably cost me the battle as everything in my army needed to shoot the buggers that turn where they should have been pounding the rest of the orks. The fact that he threw snake eyes on his panic check didn't help either.
- turn 5, after ten Nobs and their Boss trundled and slaughtered across all of the board "hey, mega armour has the Slow and Purposefull rule, wonder what that does?"
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Timberwolf
Also, one on one, a GK's Stormraven is no match for a Blood Angels one. Unless the Bloodstrike missiles fail (which can happen but is unlikely), you'll be very down on firepower in comparison. I personally have blown up several GK Stormravens on the first turn because of my 72" range S8 AP1 missiles.
I'm guessing that Fortitude and the Shrouding don't really make up the difference. What loadout would you recommend for them? I'm thinking Multi-Melta for cracking tanks, and the Plasma Cannon and Mindstrike Missiles ought to be good for alpha striking an enemy unit, particularly one that's carrying anti-psyker defences like a Farseer or Librarian.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tome
I'm guessing that Fortitude and the Shrouding don't really make up the difference. What loadout would you recommend for them? I'm thinking Multi-Melta for cracking tanks, and the Plasma Cannon and Mindstrike Missiles ought to be good for alpha striking an enemy unit, particularly one that's carrying anti-psyker defences like a Farseer or Librarian.
Not with 4 of them. 3 usually hit and at least one of those will penetrate and they're AP1.
Loadout depends on what you want. I never leave home without the sponsons and yours, with the psycannon ammo are better than mine. If I'm, taking 3, I take 2 assault cannons and one lascannon, if I'm running 2, I take a lascannon and assault cannon. if it's 1 it's assault cannon.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Y'know what's great? How the casual meta-game is completely flipped on it's head.
The Casual meta-game is nearly exclusively under what people can afford and whatever is in the boxes with little to no conversion work or part-swapping. To that end, nearly nobody buys Dedicated Transport vehicles and nearly the whole game is dealt with in Infantry.
Guard are considered crap because people take Veterans without vehicles (it fills the 2 Troops quickly at cost), Land Speeders are absolutely terrible because people buy one, it performs terribly and they never get any more. And Tau and Necrons are considered unfair because their Troops are too good. Yes. I'm actually talking about Fire Warriors. Not Kroot. Predators are terrible because nobody takes light vehicles, and Vindicators are way, way better because they kill blocks of Infantry.
Seriously, it feels really weird when you ask somebody what the best unit in the game is, and they say Hammernators in a Land Raider. Really? That's the best unit at ~500 points a piece? The Monolith is also apparently OP.
I'm not saying Casual gaming is bad. Far from it. I'm speaking from the point of 'If everyone has the same amount of money, the game is far, far different', and that's pretty terrible if you ask me.
I know the game is expensive. I'm fully aware. And I live in Australia where the prices are stupidly high for no reason (well, there are a few reasons, but they aren't good ones). But, to the point where how much money everyone has directly affects the state of the meta-game...Yeah.
I don't know. Just rambling on from something I saw earlier today. I'm sure somebody can make it more coherent.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
I always thought Vindicators were better than Predators anyway because it's hard to beat a Demolisher Cannon.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
In my own metagame, I'm the only major mechanized list player because I have a fairly high-paying job while most of the rest of the people in the local game store's club are either high school students or working at Wal-Mart and/or a fast food joint. We have people with mech lists come from out of town for our tournaments (they're considered good because prizes are awarded in store credit, rather than merchandise that the winner may or may not want or need like many other tournaments in the region), but for casual play, the closest I think we get is the other Guard player with his all of five chassis, and while everyone wants to play Apocalypse, I'm the only one running around with a superheavy. Income really does make a huge difference.
Sadly for my win/loss ratio, I don't have a lot of time for casual play due to the schedule of my fairly high-paying job, so I go to tournaments and get roflstomped by people with tank-heavy lists and years more experience instead.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tarinaky
I always thought Vindicators were better than Predators anyway because it's hard to beat a Demolisher Cannon.
Cover saves. After (or before, sometimes) that, the First-Turn Tank-Kill of your choice. A Vindicator has to move forwards to shoot. Moving forwards, generally means getting into Melta range or being able to be Assaulted by Power Fists, and both of those are terrible ideas. Especially since if you're not Blood Angels, you're only moving 6" a turn.
Predators, on the other hand, are themselves, a First-Turn Tank-Kill with Las-sponsons, and don't have to move forwards to do it.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Thunderwolf cavalry can assault 24" if they get lucky running, but I can't think of much else that can that can also take power fists. (Though of course I don't know every Codex, so there might be something out there.) Keeping a Demolisher cannon out of assault range for most things while still being able to shoot is a matter of a practiced eye for distance more than anything else.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
Keeping a Demolisher cannon out of assault range for most things while still being able to shoot is a matter of a practiced eye for distance more than anything else.
Yeah, but Guard Demolisher Cannons come attached to Leman Russes and have RA 11. Marine Demolishers are attached to Rhinos.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Renegade Paladin
but I can't think of much else that can that can also take power fists.
Doesn't have to be a fist, just has to be able to punch rear armor I'm usually happy enough with a stun or weapon destroyed anyway. Rough Riders probably work fine for that. Beastmasters too? I believe we had a discussion about Space Wolf Auxillaries and the hilarity of wolf-mounted rough riders. While Assault Marines and bikes can grab 18", thats still quite a bit and they're probably packing melta if they can't make the full two feet anyway. Terminators in a Land Raider are capable of getting farther than you think if your opponent knows what he's doing--park the landraider sideways on your starting line, pivot for free, full tilt forward, disembark the closest one at maximum distance and then charge--You can probably get a good 22" that way. Even more if roads are involved. Stormravens, of course, go further, but that is their job. All those are at least vaguely threatening to a Vindicator. Most of them to a Demolisher.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Cheese you are as apt as always. Your current casual play metagame describes my local store perfectly.
I have noticed that everyone goes for infantry heavy armies with only a few supporting tanks. I myself have have two such armies. My tau with only a hammerhead and devilfish and my space marines with only a razorback.
Only now that I have a job and have experienced the game more am I building a fully mechanised army but its kind of a moot point anyway because I am building it for casual play.
Oh and to push my blood angels army up to 1500pts I am thinking of
-2x Baal predator with flamestorm cannon
-2x vindicator
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Yeah, my local metagame fits the casual mould as well. The only people who have competitive lists are two Guard players, both of whom run Mech lists. Everything else is fairly casual hybrid lists.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BoSheck
While Assault Marines and bikes can grab 18", thats still quite a bit and they're probably packing melta if they can't make the full two feet anyway. Terminators in a Land Raider are capable of getting farther than you think if your opponent knows what he's doing--park the landraider sideways on your starting line, pivot for free, full tilt forward, disembark the closest one at maximum distance and then charge--You can probably get a good 22" that way. Even more if roads are involved. Stormravens, of course, go further, but that is their job. All those are at least vaguely threatening to a Vindicator. Most of them to a Demolisher.
Something like a Vindicator stands an excellent chance of dieing to a shot in the side from any of these options before assault. especially anything packing melta, which they all have the potential to do unless you take the infamous schizophrenic Landraider and even then, I think they might be able to as well. A Russ has far more chance of surviving that to be assaulted.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Wow, i feel kinda sorry for you guys with your casual vs compeditive metagame.
I probably have the most casual metagame in my store and i run a Vulcan Drop Pod list.
My store's painted models only rule may have something to do with that though.
anyway ive been working on this list here:
Spoiler
Show
Traitor guard 1250 points
HQ
Cersi Fearblade
Carapace Armor
Power Fist
Melta Bombs
100
Fearbringers
Company Command Squad
Astropath
Powerfist
Bolt Pistol
MediPack
Regimental Standard
2 Plasmaguns
172
Troops
Bloody 7th
Infantry Platoon 1: 320
Platoon Command
Power Weapon
Bolt Pistol
Commisar w Power Weapon
Vox Caster
Lascannon
112
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Broken 13th
Infantry squad 2: 230
Platoon Command
Power Weapon
Bolt Pistol
Commisar w Power Weapon
Vox Caster
Autocannon
112
Infantry Squad
Autocannon
60
Infantry Squad
Autocannon
60
Fast Attack
Farwalkers
3 Scout Sentinels
Heavy Flamers
Searchlights
123
Heavy Support
Skullhammer
Leman Russ Battle Tank
150
Xerkor Tormentor
Leman Russ Battle Tank
150
1249pts
Both the infantry platoons will be combined squads
what do you think?
DM
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Darius Macab
Wow, i feel kinda sorry for you guys with your casual vs compeditive metagame.
I probably have the most casual metagame in my store and i run a Vulcan Drop Pod list.
My store's painted models only rule may have something to do with that though.
anyway ive been working on this list here:
Spoiler
Show
Traitor guard 1250 points
HQ
Cersi Fearblade
Carapace Armor
Power Fist
Melta Bombs
100
Fearbringers
Company Command Squad
Astropath
Powerfist
Bolt Pistol
MediPack
Regimental Standard
2 Plasmaguns
172
Troops
Bloody 7th
Infantry Platoon 1: 320
Platoon Command
Power Weapon
Bolt Pistol
Commisar w Power Weapon
Vox Caster
Lascannon
112
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Broken 13th
Infantry squad 2: 230
Platoon Command
Power Weapon
Bolt Pistol
Commisar w Power Weapon
Vox Caster
Autocannon
112
Infantry Squad
Autocannon
60
Infantry Squad
Autocannon
60
Fast Attack
Farwalkers
3 Scout Sentinels
Heavy Flamers
Searchlights
123
Heavy Support
Skullhammer
Leman Russ Battle Tank
150
Xerkor Tormentor
Leman Russ Battle Tank
150
1249pts
Both the infantry platoons will be combined squads
what do you think?
DM
Your store only allows people that have painted models to play there, or am I misinterpreting this?
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Craftworld
Your store only allows people that have painted models to play there, or am I misinterpreting this?
You got it in one.
"painted to tournament standard" is the rule of thumb. There is however a "curse of the unpainted model" at my store, unpainted models rarely survive past the second turn, and most players will go out of their way to kill unpainted models first.
To play at my store you need: painted army, codex/armybook, rulebook and army list.
DM
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Darius Macab
You got it in one.
"painted to tournament standard" is the rule of thumb. There is however a "curse of the unpainted model" at my store, unpainted models rarely survive past the second turn, and most players will go out of their way to kill unpainted models first.
To play at my store you need: painted army, codex/armybook, rulebook and army list.
DM
I understand why it is done, but...wow...at my store that is only enforced at Tournies, and if you bring out unpainted or even proxied models, who cares! I like my store.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Craftworld
I understand why it is done, but...wow...at my store that is only enforced at Tournies, and if you bring out unpainted or even proxied models, who cares! I like my store.
Well that's kind of our stores thing; people who have nicely painted armies and want to play against nicely painted armies come here.
I'm the youngest and newest there and I've been playing since I was 12 (so 3 years). All 3 of my armies a are fully painted with another two in the works. There are lots of stores in my area so if you don't have a painted army you can play somewhere else.
I like my store too.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Brainstorming ideas for a Grey Knights Coteaz list. Say, 1500 points.
Obviously Coteaz, so that's 100 pts. I was thinking on some comments Cheesegear made about Death-Cult Assassins in Stormravens. Let's say, one squad of 9 Death-Cult and 3 Crusaders (to soak up wounds with their storm shields, though maybe this isn't a good idea), which is 180 points. With a Stormraven, that's 385 points, with no upgrades on the Stormraven. We can have another one of these squads easily, replacing one Assassin with an Ordos Xenos Inquisitor, equipped with, oh...power sword, power armor, and most notably, rad grenades. That's 58 points for him personally, so the total squad (with Stormraven) is 428 points, bringing our list total to 913 points.
Not sure where to go from here. Perhaps some objective camping warbands with Jokaero? Or just normal GK strike squads, outfitted for longer-range combat? By all means, please weigh in.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
I think having to have a fully painted army is a bit unfair. What about when you just start an army? It means you cannot play it until you have finished painting your entire army. Like now for example I have just started a new army. I have just built it but wouldn't be able to play for another 4-5 weeks while I paint it. Seems a bit pointless.
I have no problem with unpainted armies as long as they are making progress each time you see them.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Brainstorming ideas for a Grey Knights Coteaz list. Say, 1500 points.
Obviously Coteaz, so that's 100 pts. I was thinking on some comments Cheesegear made about Death-Cult Assassins in Stormravens. Let's say, one squad of 9 Death-Cult and 3 Crusaders (to soak up wounds with their storm shields, though maybe this isn't a good idea), which is 180 points. With a Stormraven, that's 385 points, with no upgrades on the Stormraven. We can have another one of these squads easily, replacing one Assassin with an Ordos Xenos Inquisitor, equipped with, oh...power sword, power armor, and most notably, rad grenades. That's 58 points for him personally, so the total squad (with Stormraven) is 428 points, bringing our list total to 913 points.
Not sure where to go from here. Perhaps some objective camping warbands with Jokaero? Or just normal GK strike squads, outfitted for longer-range combat? By all means, please weigh in.
One of my friends experimented a bit with that, and found out a 1/1 mix of assasins and Crusaders made for a stupidly effective unit, that could both soak up a lot of damage in a melee, and deliver a really brutal beating to meq units.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Darius Macab
anyway ive been working on this list here:
Well, I can certainly offer a few opinions...
Spoiler
Show
Quote:
HQ
Cersi Fearblade
Carapace Armor
Power Fist
Melta Bombs
100
The powerfist feels risky, since he's, quite frankly, a weak independent character. Also, the carapace could probably be replaced with a camo cloak, thus granting stealth to one of your infantry blobs...
Quote:
Fearbringers
Company Command Squad
Astropath
Powerfist
Bolt Pistol
MediPack
Regimental Standard
2 Plasmaguns
172
Once more a power fist, only this time it's attached to six guardsmen (albeit one with extra wounds). Still, most enemies where the powerfist would be useful would probably be more than capable of seeing of the threat before it goes off...
As for the Astropath, why? The only thing you have outflanking is your sentinels. I would venture to say that you either should remove it or get more outlfanking units...
Finally, why the bolt pistol? It's just a waste of points that rarely is going to make a difference...
Quote:
Troops
Bloody 7th
Infantry Platoon 1: 320
Platoon Command
Power Weapon
Bolt Pistol
Commisar w Power Weapon
Vox Caster
Lascannon
112
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
Infantry Squad
Lascannon
70
You do realize that the command squad can't be combined into the big blob, right? Cause right now, it would seem that you don't.
TO fix this, move the commisar to one of the infantry squads, were he'll do a bit more good, and get a vox in there as well (or remove the vox in the command squad)
Also, once more you have a bolt pistol. This is even more harmless here...
The Power weapon would perhaps be nice if it was combined into the blob, but as is, it's in no way dangerous. Either the enemy will trounce your five little guardsmen before they get to swing, or the enemy won't CARE if a few of your attacks ignore its armour save.
As for the infantry squads, perhaps consider a special weapon, either plasma or a humble grenade launcher?
Finally, consider utilizing the command squads ability to take more special weapons by decking them out with three of the same. The exact kind doesn't really matter. I'm partial to grenade launchers, but melta or flamers could be equally good.
Quote:
Broken 13th
Infantry squad 2: 230
Platoon Command
Power Weapon
Bolt Pistol
Commisar w Power Weapon
Vox Caster
Autocannon
112
Infantry Squad
Autocannon
60
Infantry Squad
Autocannon
60
This is pretty much the same as above, so the same advice applies, except that grenade launchers are even more welcome in the infatry squads now.
Quote:
Fast Attack
Farwalkers
3 Scout Sentinels
Heavy Flamers
Searchlights
123
Exactly how do you intend to use these? The heavy flamers says that you want to get close, but then you basically have to outflank (despite being in
Fast Attack, sentinels do not move around fast), making the searchlights useless... I would recommend to exchange the flamers for multilasers or autocannons, and remove the searchlights. Then, you can either use them to take out light armour from turn one, or outflank them for side/rear shots and/or taking out enemy artillery units.
Quote:
Heavy Support
Skullhammer
Leman Russ Battle Tank
150
Xerkor Tormentor
Leman Russ Battle Tank
150
Well, not really much one can say here.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ricky S
I have no problem with unpainted armies as long as they are making progress each time you see them.
The last part is the crux of the problem though. No two people paint at the same speed and will make anything near a similar amount of progress over a given period of time. If someone plays infantry guard and gets 1 guy painted a week they are making progress but they could still take 4 years to get the army fully painted. Of course someone else could get that same army painted in a month or two, if the second person painted nothing for 1-2 years then paints it all at once, well thats worse because they weren't making any progress for a long time but in the end they were done much earlier.
But as people get used to seeing and playing with unpainted units and armies it gets easier to just accept and harder to get mad at someone else for using them.
The problem I have is that I've gotten to the point that I don't want any of my models to have a mediocre paint job, even my basic troops I'll put some effort into. And I really like how they are coming out but its too much work for quick 5-15 minutes paint sessions and I don't have the time (that I want to dedicate to gaming) at this point to give units the hours they need to be at the standard I want. So nothing ever really gets done, which I realize is rather ironic that I would rather play with just primers models then poorly painted ones, but thats what it is.
And I do know that if I was required to paint the models to play, I might only be playing 500 point games now but I would at least have the incentive to get more done.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IthilanorStPete
Not sure where to go from here. Perhaps some objective camping warbands with Jokaero? Or just normal GK strike squads, outfitted for longer-range combat? By all means, please weigh in.
Well, I still want to see this "mass template Chimera"-concept I came up with once tried sometime, even though it can hardly be considered serious:
A Chimera has 5 firepoints and can take 12 passengers, right? So now let's take full advantage of both. 8 Psykers give you an S10 AP1 5" explosion, and only take up one firepoint. Three firepoints can be taken up by Servitors with Plasma Cannons. That leaves room for one more passenger, which can conveniently be the Inquisitor to negate the Servitors' Lobotomized rule... and if it's an Ordo Xenos Inquisitor, s/he can be equipped with a Conversion Beam for yet another powerful explosion.
Probably not all that powerful, and it gets screwed over by something like Eldar Runes of Warding real hard, but utterly hilarious. :smallbiggrin:
EDIT: Heh. Regarding the whole "painted models only"-thing, I find Erloas' post so utterly mirroring my own current situation that I'm starting to suspect he is actually me from the future, or something. :smalltongue:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Welp, I tried out a couple of Land Raiders today. They're definitely not compatible with my list. The Terminators are durable enough as it is, have frag grenades already and want to shoot a bit before they assault. If I were running a Death Cult Assassin unit, then I'd take them. The firepower of the Land Raider wasn't enough to justify it on it's own. If I go up against a gunline, the one time I want to plunge into assault as quickly as possible, I can always Deep Strike/Outflank them.
I might give a Stormraven a try next. The Mindstrike Missiles seem like they'd be a good way to take out Psychic Hoods/Runes of Warding and they've got a bit more dakka.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tome
Welp, I tried out a couple of Land Raiders today. They're definitely not compatible with my list. The Terminators are durable enough as it is, have frag grenades already and want to shoot a bit before they assault. If I were running a Death Cult Assassin unit, then I'd take them. The firepower of the Land Raider wasn't enough to justify it on it's own. If I go up against a gunline, the one time I want to plunge into assault as quickly as possible, I can always Deep Strike/Outflank them.
I might give a Stormraven a try next. The Mindstrike Missiles seem like they'd be a good way to take out Psychic Hoods/Runes of Warding and they've got a bit more dakka.
Since when did Terminators have grenades?
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Tarinaky
Since when did Terminators have grenades?
I play Grey Knights. GK Termies come with Frag, Krak and Psyk-Out Grenades as standard. :smallsmile:
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
...Guys...I had a thought. More of an idea, really. A dangerous idea.
So, orks. Specifically, ork Kommandos with Boss Snikrot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ork Codex Page 62
Ambush: Snikrot's mastery of guerilla tactics is legendary. If the owning player chooses, Snikrot and his unit may be held in Reserve. When Snikrot and his unit become available from Reserve, they may move on from any table edge.
Now, I know that a unit can only give the ability to outflank to Dedicated Transports (I checked), but this isn't outflank, it's a special rule. Ambush. So, here's my idea.
15 Kommandos (2 Burnas) + Snikrot + Battlewagon with Deffrolla. Include other upgrades as desired.
Can this monster unit come on as a single Ambushing unit? I know you can embark infantry onto non-dedicated transports while still in reserve, and they come on as a single unit, so it SEEMS like I should be able to do it. And I know I can include an HQ (probably taking a PK-Warboss and adding a Boarding Plank) in Snikrot's crew and Ambush with them, so do you think this would work? And aside from 'For The Lulz', do you think it would be worth it?
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
You need a reason other than lulz? What kinda Ork iz ya?!
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hootman
...Guys...I had a thought. More of an idea, really. A dangerous idea.
So, orks. Specifically, ork Kommandos with Boss Snikrot.
Now, I know that a unit can only give the ability to outflank to Dedicated Transports (I checked), but this isn't outflank, it's a special rule. Ambush. So, here's my idea.
15 Kommandos (2 Burnas) + Snikrot + Battlewagon with Deffrolla. Include other upgrades as desired.
Can this monster unit come on as a single Ambushing unit? I know you can embark infantry onto non-dedicated transports while still in reserve, and they come on as a single unit, so it SEEMS like I should be able to do it. And I know I can include an HQ (probably taking a PK-Warboss and adding a Boarding Plank) in Snikrot's crew and Ambush with them, so do you think this would work? And aside from 'For The Lulz', do you think it would be worth it?
You might be able to make it better by instead of a Power Klaw Warboss, a KFF Big Mek with a Power Klaw. Not sure because it takes away a Big Mek from the rest of your army but this seems to make sense to me.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
...So, I have way more orks than I thought. Enough that I'm seriously considering running them for the semi-finals of 'Ard Boyz, because I don't think people will be as prepared to face the Green Tide, and it will be FUN. I know 'Ard Boyz isn't about having fun, but that doesn't mean I'm not allowed to try.
This is the list, based on what I know I have and what I think I can convert. I'm willing to spend a little money if I "need" something, or to convert things in as-yet un-thought-of ways, but I figured I'd try to get a head start on this (2 weeks until the tourney is a head start for me).
ORKS, 2500 POINTS
Spoiler
Show
HQ
Warboss, 105pts
-Powerklaw, Shoota/Skorcha, Cybork Body, Bosspole
(In the Battle Wagon)
Weirdboy, 85pts
-Warphead
(In a Looted Wagon)
ELITES
Kommandos 15, 265pts
-2 Burnas
-Boss Snikrot
(In the Battle Wagon)
TROOPS
Nobz 9, 615pts
-Nob Bikers, geared in the spoiler.
Spoiler
Show
Nob, 70
-Bike, Powerklaw
Nob, 75
-Bike, Powerklaw, Shoota/Skorcha
Nob, 80
-Bike, Powerklaw, Shoota/Skorcha, Bosspole
Nob, 90
-Bike, Powerklaw, Shoota/Skorcha, Waaagh! Banner
Nob, 60
-Bike, Big Choppa, Shoota/Skorcha, Bosspole
Nob, 55
-Bike, Big Choppa, Shoota/Skorcha
Nob, 53
-Bike, Big Choppa, Ammo Runt
Nob, 50
-Bike, Big Choppa
Nob, 80
-Bike, Painboy, Grot Orderly
Ork Boyz 30, 220pts
-Sluggas & Choppas
-Nob with Powerklaw & Bosspole
Ork Boyz 11, 106pts
-Sluggas & Choppas
-Nob with Powerklaw & Bosspole
(In a Looted Wagon)
Ork Boyz 11, 106pts
-Sluggas & Choppas
-Nob with Powerklaw & Bosspole
(In a Looted Wagon)
Ork Boyz 20, 170pts
-Shootas, 2 Big Shootas
-Nob with Powerklaw & Bosspole
Ork Boyz 20, 170pts
-Shootas, 2 Big Shootas
-Nob with Powerklaw & Bosspole
FAST ATTACK
Warbuggies 3, 135pts
-3 Skorchas, Red Paint
Warbuggies 3, 135pts
-3 Skorchas, Red Paint
Warbuggies 3, 135pts
-3 Skorchas, Red Paint
HEAVY SUPPORT
Battlewagon, 140pts
-Deff Rolla, Red Paint, Grot Riggers, Boarding Plank, ZZap Gun
Looted Wagon, 70pts
-Skorcha, Big Shoota, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Reinforced Ram
Looted Wagon, 70pts
-Skorcha, Big Shoota, Red Paint Job, Grot Riggers, Reinforced Ram
This list is unfinished (I think it's 2527 points, which is just a few too many), but it's essentially done. Now I'd like some critiques and suggestions, if you'd be so kind, before I get into the business of hacking off whatever limbs will save me that handful of points.
-
Re: Warhammer 40K Tabletop XIII: "Ironclads, Furiosos and Soul Grinders, oh my!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Hootman
...Guys...I had a thought. More of an idea, really. A dangerous idea.
15 Kommandos (2 Burnas) + Snikrot + Battlewagon with Deffrolla. Include other upgrades as desired.
Can this monster unit come on as a single Ambushing unit? I know you can embark infantry onto non-dedicated transports while still in reserve, and they come on as a single unit, so it SEEMS like I should be able to do it.
No. Since the Battlewagon is not part of Snikrot's unit. They are separate units entries. Snikrot has a specific rule for his unit. A Battlewagon is a separate unit for all intents and purposes.
When embarking in a non-Dedicated Transport, you can usually do that because neither unit (Infantry nor Vehicle) has any special rules that say that they can't do that, as in, everything enters as normal Reserves.
Scouts and Land Speeder Storms can go Outflank at the same time because both have the same rules, and that's how they can be deployed together.