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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Well I have to agree that kroot are **** in gameplay. They do nothing at all except keep a unit off your gunline for another turn (which admittedly can be helpful on occasion). I have used a unit a few times and it performed terribly each game and thats not for lack of tactics or planning. The only thing I can suggest is using them as a cheap troops choice for holding objectives in your half. Put them in reserve and you have yourself a back up unit for capturing objectives. I do like how they look though :smallsmile:. They look like killer chickens, which is extremely cute. I also thought of something interesting. I was reading a blog about Tau super heavy units and they were complaining that the only super heavy was the manta and barracuda which are technically super heavy flyers. I totally forgot about the greater knarlocs! Now I dont know the rules for them exactly but they work like squiggoths, I think, in terms of wounds etc.
Tau devilfish really are awesome and although they are 115 pts with the good upgrades (multi tracker, SMS, Disruption Pod) They really are worth it. They skim around the battlefield firing off missiles, dropping off troops at vital locations and generally annoying enemy heavy weapon teams as they pour copious amounts of fire into the devilfish without it going down. Once I have more money I will definately be getting 4 devilfish, 1 for my pathfinders and 3 for my firewarriors.
Necrons are basically the painting noobs army. I mean, sure you can do them well but they are so easy to paint quickly. White spray paint undercoat, Boltgun Metal Spray, Mithril Silver Dry Brush over the whole model and then green for the eyes. Easy! I dont know why people complain all the time about painting because to have a good looking army all you really need is to paint cleanly and you dont really have to even bother with highlighting, shading, washes or any of that. Remember starting on the largest colour first making it easier.
I undercoat my marines chaos black, paint the entire model shining gold. I paint in the black areas which are the rubber of the joints, eagle insignia on the chest. I paint the shoulder pads and helmet ultramarines blue and give them a highlight by dry brushing ice blue (as the light would fall should it be around mid day). I dry brush the chest insignia with skull white. I paint the eyes mechrite red, give them a blazing orange highlight and put a dot of skull white in the top corner giving the appearance of light reflecting off the lense. I paint the boltguns silver on the metal and black on the side and give the edges a mithril silver dry brush. I then freehand a lion insignia onto the right hand shoulder pad and use the decal arrow on the left shoulder pad.
I can easily build and paint a tactical squad in roughly 5 hours. Now if your remove the drybrushing and the lenses you can easily paint marines or indeed any unit in a small amount of time. When I go to my local GW store people comment on how awesome my army looks. Its not because they are 'eavy metal standard but because they are uniform and neat with contrasting main colours. I also actually enjoy painting now that I have set time aside each week.
People need to get back into the modelling part of our hobby. It really is fun once you get into it. Plus its a great way to spend an afternoon talking with mates while painting at home, or at a local GW store.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Winterwind
What is missing though is a comparison of the armies as a whole; something that illustrates what the entire army does better or worse than the other, how this is compensated for in the other army, what the differences in play-style between the armies are, etc.
Well, I'm mostly thinking about highlighting all of the differences between the different Space Marine types.
But I have highlighted the difference. Take your Space Marine Codex. Everything in the 'Blood Angels' post is the same except for what I've pointed out. Same with the Black Templars. There are bad points in there too.
Or, you want me to retype...
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Originally posted in The Guide
Dark Angels: Outdated Codex. A few minor differences. Many people are best off going with Codex Marines rather than playing by Dark Angels rules. The only reason to play Dark Angels is for Ravenwing. And, even then, sometimes you might be better off with Codex Marines with a 'Captain on Bike'. *
Black Templars: Outdated Codex. Slightly more focused on close combat. With some unique rules. ***
Space Wolves: Slightly focused on close combat. With some unique rules and units. ***
Blood Angels: Focused on close combat so much that it may lead to a detriment to their shooting capabilities. Some unique rules. Some expensive (in points) squads and vehicles. Also have Assault Squads as troops. ***
...But retype it in a way that takes me 5-6 paragraphs?
But, then I'd just be pretty much re-printing what you can find in a Codex. And, due to someone on this board, I kind of don't like having to explain myself anymore when it's already written down in a Book.
The goal of The Guide (and it's offshoots) is not to reprint a Codex in different words. It's to provide an outline. And if you need more than that, you should read the Codex.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Ricky S
I can easily build and paint a tactical squad in roughly 5 hours. Now if your remove the drybrushing and the lenses you can easily paint marines or indeed any unit in a small amount of time. When I go to my local GW store people comment on how awesome my army looks. Its not because they are 'eavy metal standard but because they are uniform and neat with contrasting main colours. I also actually enjoy painting now that I have set time aside each week.
5 hours for a Tactical Squad? That's roughly the time I need for a single Chaos Space Marine, if he has any weapons with particularly detailed weapons or such (Noise Marine sonic weapons with all these cables and fine details are a female dog when it comes to that). For a regular Chaos Space Marine... something like 3-4 hours, I guess. People at my local GW store comment how well painted my army is quite frequently, too, but a tactical squad is a project for a month to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ricky S
People need to get back into the modelling part of our hobby. It really is fun once you get into it. Plus its a great way to spend an afternoon talking with mates while painting at home, or at a local GW store.
Preaching to the choir, I think. :smalltongue:
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Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
But I have highlighted the difference. Take your Space Marine Codex. Everything is the same except for what I've pointed out. There are bad points in there too.
Well, let me put it this way - right now, for instance, I don't quite see when one would want to ever take regular Space Marines instead of Blood Angels or Space Wolves, other than for a Bike list.
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Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Or, you want me to retype...
...But retype it in a way that takes me 5-6 paragraphs? I supposed I could...
The way you formulated it, it sounds like just blowing it up for the sake of blowing it up. I'd rather call it "retype it in more detail". :smalltongue:
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Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
But, then I'd just be pretty much re-printing what you can find in a Codex. And, due to someone on this board, I kind of don't like having to explain myself anymore when it's already written down in a Book.
The goal of The Guide (and it's offshoots) is not to reprint a Codex in different words. It's to provide an outline. And if you need more than that, you should read the Codex.
Fair enough. As I said, do it only if you are willing to do so. It was (meant as) a humble request, not a demand. :smallwink:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
crazedloon
actually I personally like the idea of cold one riding Salamanders (or if you really want to shell out the money and want some intimidating models carnosaur)
just my .02
A cold one would certainly fit on a cavalry base better than this, but I don't think it's strong enough to carry a Space Marine. A carnosaur is, but is too bipedal for my own taste.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Ricky S
Necrons are basically the painting noobs army. I mean, sure you can do them well but they are so easy to paint quickly. White spray paint undercoat, Boltgun Metal Spray, Mithril Silver Dry Brush over the whole model and then green for the eyes.
1. Prime black.
2. Drybrush Boltgun.
3. Go to the pub.
Also, if we're talking how we paint...
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Ork Boy:
Skin:
-Knarloc Green basecoat
-DA Green wash
Shirt: Depends on colour. Different Boyz get different colours:
Red:
-Iyaden Darksun basecoat (Only started recently)
-Blood Red basecoat
-Baal Red wash
Yellow:
-Iyaden Darksun basecoat
-Golden Yellow basecoat
-Gryphonne Sepia wash
Blue:
-Mordian Blue basecoat
-Enchanted Blue basecoat
-Asurmen Blue wash
Dark grey:
-Charandon Granite basecoat
-Badab Black wash
Pants: 4-colour camo pattern. Varies, but generally I stick with forest, desert, urban, and blue. Precise colours vary.
Straps and pouches and gloves:
-Calthan Brown basecoat
-Bestial Brown basecoat
-Devlan Mud wash
Boots:
-Chaos Black
Metals:
-Boltgun Metal/Tin Bitz/Chaos Black mix basecoat
-Macharius Solar Orange drybrush
-Boltgun Metal drybrush
Eyes:
-Iyaden Darksun basecoat
-Baal Red wash
Mouth:
-Mechrite Red basecoat
-Leviathan Purple wash
Teeth:
-Dheneb Stone basecoat
-Gryphonne Sepia wash
Bones: as teeth.
That seem like more steps to you? Seems like more steps to me.
e: And I'm taking a ton of shortcuts.
e2: My models get complimented. Not my army. Sadly, Orks don't have the clean, crisp aesthetic that makes people go "Wow, that's a well-painted army".
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Winterwind
Well, let me put it this way - right now, for instance, I don't quite see when one would want to ever take regular Space Marines instead of Blood Angels or Space Wolves, other than for a Bike list.
The problem is, it sounds like you do want me to go through individual units, but, all at the same time.
Like how Space Wolves get expensive Terminators (in the end, anyway), but they get good Scouts. But their Tactical Squads have more attacks. But they don't get Sergeants. But Space Marines get Scouts as Troops, and Blood Angels Scouts get Locator Beacons and Black Templar Terminators have Furious Charge. And Space Marines have Ironclads and Black Templars have cheap Dreadnoughts and Space Wolves get gypped and Blood Angels have Furiosos...
The only sane way to do that, is to go...
Scouts;
Space Wolves; Elites, Sweet Outflanking rules. Better stats. Better guns. Rifles cost points. No Hellfire Shells.
Blood Angels; Troops, Locator Beacons. No Hellfire Shells.
Black Templars; None. Scouts are filtered through Tactical Squads. No Rifles. No Heavy Weapons...
Which you'll find that I've already done (using Codex Marines as a baseline) for Black Templars and just now Blood Angels. I've put links to the posts. Or, do you just want it all in the same place like the above? That'll get real time-consuming, really fast.
I prefer doing one Codex at a time. If you want to compare Codecies, click the links.
You already know what Space Marines can do. By simply reading what I've written, I'm sure you can work out the differences without me having to explain everything to you...I mean, I thought you were better than that Winterwind. Not like someone else...
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Actually, I wasn't thinking about unit comparisons at all. I rather meant something like "Blood Angels and Space Wolves are both better in close combat than Space Marines, who make up for this by having better access to (shooting because (their special and heavy weapons are cheaper/they have access to shootier units/their regular troops are cheaper)/numbers because (their regular troops are cheaper/their specialized squads are cheaper). The difference between Blood Angel close combat and Space Wolf close combat is that (BAs are more about getting the charge while SW are good all around/BAs are good in close combat in general, SWs can specialize for close combat against (light infantry/heavy infantry/monstrous creatures)/BAs are better in close combat against hordes while SWs are better against elite units). Blood Angels move around more quickly than the others; to make up for that, Space Wolves are (more durable/stronger once they get there/cheaper in points), while Space Marines (do not require to move around as much due to being shootier/are even cheaper in points/have other options to move around equally quickly). Space Marines and Space Wolves employ more generalist squads, good in every situation, while Blood Angels have more specialist squads that need to be in the right position to work well (but work better than their counterparts when they are)."
And so on.
All of the above statements being just for the sake of the example, rather than having any connection with what the respective armies actually are like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
You already know what Space Marines can do. By simply reading what I've written, I'm sure you can work out the differences without me having to explain everything to you...I mean, I thought you were better than that Winterwind. Not like someone else...
Awww, assaulting my conscience? It works, too. :smallfrown:
Fair enough, I'll be less lazy then and try to figure it out on my own. :smallwink:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Winterwind
5 hours for a Tactical Squad? That's roughly the time I need for a single Chaos Space Marine, if he has any weapons with particularly detailed weapons or such (Noise Marine sonic weapons with all these cables and fine details are a female dog when it comes to that). For a regular Chaos Space Marine... something like 3-4 hours, I guess. People at my local GW store comment how well painted my army is quite frequently, too, but a tactical squad is a project for a month to me.
Don't you paint units at once?:smalleek:
If you paint each guy individually of course it's going to take longer.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Closet_Skeleton
Don't you paint units at once?:smalleek:
If you paint each guy individually of course it's going to take longer.
I, uh... am not sure I understand. How does one paint a unit at once, other than by painting its members one by one? I mean, okay, I guess I could paint everything that is going to be basecoated with colour A on all models, then the same thing for colour B, etc., but I don't think I'd actually gain all that much time by doing so... :smallconfused:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Winterwind
I, uh... am not sure I understand. How does one paint a unit at once, other than by painting its members one by one? I mean, okay, I guess I could paint everything that is going to be basecoated with colour A on all models, then the same thing for colour B, etc., but I don't think I'd actually gain all that much time by doing so... :smallconfused:
actually you gain quite a bit of time if you do batches of color because by the time you get to the end of the unit with 1 color the first model is dried and you can go onto the next color. And this method does not take away from the detail ether provided you still use the same precision with each model that you do in your current method.
Also the above has the advantage that should you stop mid painting of a unit (perhaps you have run out of time) your army looks like it is progressing with its paint job thanks to whole units getting paint on them at once :smallwink:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
crazedloon
actually you gain quite a bit of time if you do batches of color because by the time you get to the end of the unit with 1 color the first model is dried and you can go onto the next color. And this method does not take away from the detail ether provided you still use the same precision with each model that you do in your current method.
I don't really ever wait for paint to dry; there is always some spot elsewhere on the model I can paint while waiting for whatever I painted before to dry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
crazedloon
Also the above has the advantage that should you stop mid painting of a unit (perhaps you have run out of time) your army looks like it is progressing with its paint job thanks to whole units getting paint on them at once :smallwink:
Yeah, but it also has the disadvantage of being more tedious (at least, in my perception), as rather than painting various parts in various colours, one keeps painting the same parts with the same colour over and over again. :smallwink:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Trust us and try it some time. The simple fact that you're cleaning your brushes less helps a lot (for time if you're a careful cleaner and for how long your brushes last if like me you're not).
edit:
It's also a good way to practice, so after trying it you can go back to painting the other way and be better at it.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Mmm... alright, I shall try with the next batch of Noise Marines. Thanks, both of you. :smallwink:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
I switch between painting individual models and painting whole sections. Usually, I'll basecoat everything, then start going down the length of the sprues with a specific color. Lets say I want to paint some Orks. I'll basecoat all their arms and bodies and weapons and stuff. Then I'll take Snot Green, and paint all their arms, faces, and necks. Then Scorched, which I put on all the pants and belts. Then Boltgun Metal and go over all the weapons and armor.
Granted, I'm not painting for detail at that point, but rather for area. Afterwards, I'll clip out the pieces for a model and assemble it. Then I get to work on the details, washing and drybrushing new coats and details onto them, like dirtying their weapons and rusting their armor... All in all, it takes me several hours to get a handful of models done. My last sit-down lasted about 4 hours, and I got 7-8 Shoota Boyz done. And boy, are they pretty... :smallamused:
I actually compared them to my older AoBR Slugga Boyz, and was horrified by how ugly my original paint jobs were. I didn't even paint the belts and armor straps... I just painted everything brown! :smalleek: I'm probably going to go back and touch up my Slugga Boyz, and maybe even strip and completely redo a few of them... :smallconfused:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Lycan 01
I actually compared them to my older AoBR Slugga Boyz, and was horrified by how ugly my original paint jobs were. I didn't even paint the belts and armor straps... I just painted everything brown! :smalleek: I'm probably going to go back and touch up my Slugga Boyz, and maybe even strip and completely redo a few of them... :smallconfused:
Just yesterday I was looking at some of my original models. First off, 2nd ed. SM are ugly. Secondly, my painting ability looks just absolute garbage. I think I painted my marines in different colours.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Anyway, the reason people still take Space Marines over Space Wolves or Blood Angels (Black Templars are a completely different kettle) come down to;
1. Combat Tactics
2. Librarian Powers
3. Thunderfire Cannons
4. Better Captains
5. Different Uniques, and
6. Bikes
Due to Matt Ward being a hack, you can actually transcribe the 'average' Space Marine army into Blood Angels. But, it's not really worth the hassle.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
So with my Black Templars army:
13 scouts with bolt pistol and close combat weapon
2 scouts with shotguns (I got sick of the limited crappy poses you get out of the melee scouts)
14 bolt pistol and chainsword marines (3 with terminator honours)
2 meltagun marines
2 flamer marines
1 power fist marine
1 power axe marine
1 apothacary
1 company champion with power sword, bolt pistol and combat shield
1 marine with bolt pistol and storm shield
1 standard bearer
1 emperor's champion
1 hero with storm shield and power sword
1 foot chaplain
1 jump pack chaplain
1 terminator chaplain
3 terminators with power fist and storm bolter
2 terminators with power fist and assault cannon
3 terminators with twin lightning claws
2 terminators with storm shield and thunder hammer
1 jump pack marine with plasma pistol and power fist
1 jump pack marine with plasma pistol
3 jump pack marines with storm shields
5 jump pack marines with bolt pistol and chainsword
2 attack bikes with multimeltas
2 attack bikes with heavy bolters
2 land raider crusaders with multimeltas (removable)
1 rhino
1 dreadnought with missile launcher and lascannon
About 3000 points under the Black Templars codex
Would that actually be better off using the Blood Angels codex?
My guess is "yes if you had more APCs".
Or should I stay with "that which does not kill us only makes us run slower"?
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
good breakdown for the BA Cheese, only thing I disagree on is the Fruioso bit. Iron Clads may be better at taking out tanks cause of the hammer, but Fruioso's take out troops far easier. Furioso's also have ws6 which from memory is better then an ironclads and front armor of 13, side 12 rear 10.
Each has its place but I dont think ones better then the other at all.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Winterwind
"Blood Angels and Space Wolves are both better in close combat than Space Marines, who make up for this by having better access to (shooting because (their special and heavy weapons are cheaper/they have access to shootier units/their regular troops are cheaper)/numbers because (their regular troops are cheaper/their specialized squads are cheaper).
But sweeping, broad statements like that are wrong. No-one says you have to take Assault Squads in Blood Angels. Blood Angels are only good in Assault (if we use Codex Marines as a baseline) if they pass/fail - depending on your viewpoint - their Red Thirst check and/or load out on Blood Chalices.
Quote:
Blood Angels move around more quickly than the others; to make up for that, Space Wolves are (more durable/stronger once they get there/cheaper in points), while Space Marines (do not require to move around as much due to being shootier/are even cheaper in points/have other options to move around equally quickly)[/I].
Wrong. Tournament-Level Space Wolf Drop Pod armies are the fastest thing in the game. They drop on the board. And then Space Wolves aren't encumbered by Heavy Weapons. They then have Counter-Attack. When they get Assaulted in their opponent's phase.
Raven Guard (Codex Marines even) armies continuously make 1st Turn Assaults. With Infiltrate (Ninja Marines - all Scouts with Combat Blades) and Fleet. Oh, right...24" Assault range Assault Marines? What? Infiltrating, Fleet, Lightning Claw Terminators? Nah. Blood Angels are way better at Assault... :smallsigh:
Are you telling me that Space Wolves on the Assault or Counter-Attack, with three attacks each (Grey Hunters) or four attacks (Blood Claws) can't take out hordes? You're wrong. Space Marines - regardless of kind (Marines is Marines) - can do anything they want. That's what's so good about Space Marines.
Once again, you can't make broad statements like that. Because it all boils down to how you want to build your army. Which, with Space Marines, is any way you want.
Quote:
Space Marines and Space Wolves employ more generalist squads, good in every situation, while Blood Angels have more specialist squads that need to be in the right position to work well (but work better than their counterparts when they are)."
Wrong. Blood Angels can take Sternguard, Scout and Tactical Squads too. In fact, given their Chapter structure (page 9), they're not even supposed to take that many Assault Squads. Haha. Just kidding. Players don't care about fluff. :smallwink:
I haven't said anything of the sort of like what you said, Winterwind, because you can't make statements like that about Space Marines. Now that I've seen what you mean, I know exactly why I didn't do it that way. Not including the insanity-inducing portions. I could've. But I went for the 'Bullet Points' instead. Hopefully my reader-base isn't too noobish.
Necrons - who only have one Troop unit - and who need as many Necrons as they can. Do, only work one way. And that's why you can make Sweeping Arguments about Necrons.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
DranWork
only thing I disagree on is the Fruioso bit. Iron Clads may be better at taking out tanks cause of the hammer, but Fruioso's take out troops far easier. Furioso's also have ws6 which from memory is better then an ironclads and front armor of 13, side 12 rear 10.
Lies.
An Ironclad's ability to take dual Heavy Flamers and Assault through cover makes it amazing at killing Infantry. What's good, is that it's also really good at killing armour.
An Ironclad is also 13/13/10. Since it's FA 13, and S10 Power Weapon, it will also paste most ICs (who don't usually have better than S6 at the best of times). I run my Ironclad into your Furioso (yes, I would do that in an actual game). Furiosos apparently only come with Blood Talons, despite what it says in their entry. So I laugh.
I don't lie when I tell you that Ironclads rock like Ducatis. However, I did say "At least Furiosos cost less points."
A Furioso Librarian and a 'proper' Ironclad (Heavy Flamers and Frags) both cost the same points and are both very good. Like I said, Librarian Furiosos are really good.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Whelp I just came back home from watching Iron Man 2, while an awesome film, what happened after was also very interesting.
Swinging by the nearby GW and having a chat to the freindly staff led to the fact that this July's (Australian) white dwarf will have the rules for the tank-based Spearhead suppliment, but with it will come new plastic kits for an Eldar Tank (no names, but the Fire prism was suspected as being the only kit with metal still in) and a new Imperial Guard Tank kit.
Very excited about the Plastic Eldar Tank, even if it isnt the Fireprism, it may mean a Forgeworld model brought to plastics, such as the Night Spinner.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Nitpick but Furiosos can take dual blood fists as well.. so they would have str 10 attacks *shrug* but then you dont get the crazy follow through attacks that you get with blood talons.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
DranWork
Nitpick but Furiosos can take dual blood fists as well.. so they would have str 10 attacks *shrug* but then you dont get the crazy follow through attacks that you get with blood talons.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Furiosos apparently only come with Blood Talons, despite what it says in their entry. So I laugh.
He was just using confusing language and claiming that no one would take dual blood fists.
Do Blood Angels lightning claws have that rumoured "switch to rerolling wounds" ability? If so 6 assault terminators in a land raider crusaider with a reclusiarch and a sanguinary priest will be even nastier than my black templar assault terminators led by their reclusiarch.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Closet_Skeleton
Do Blood Angels lightning claws have that rumoured "switch to rerolling wounds" ability? If so 6 assault terminators in a land raider crusaider with a reclusiarch and a sanguinary priest will be even nastier than my black templar assault terminators led by their reclusiarch.
But Lightning Claws have always been re-rolling To Wound. :smallconfused:
People have been running Chaplains and Lightning Claws for a long time.
The only difference is that Blood Angels do it by costing a few more points and get Feel No Pain from the Priest - which Terminators don't really benefit from much anyway.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
One Step Two
Very excited about the Plastic Eldar Tank, even if it isnt the Fireprism, it may mean a Forgeworld model brought to plastics, such as the Night Spinner.
GW is making plastic Fire Prism and Deathspinner. Apparently.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Definately paint units at a time, yes it can be tedious at times but thats why there are characters. Also having the radio on or tv can help pass the time.
Speaking of Furioso dreadnoughts I saw one plough through a full mob of orks and when I say full I mean all 30. It was some of the jammiest dice rolling I have ever seen. It was pretty bloody awesome and I wish I could use them in a normal space marine army. I am thinking of buying the model and just using it as an ironclad. Plus the claws will really fit the theme of my army (celestial lions).
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Wrong. Tournament-Level Space Wolf Drop Pod armies are the fastest thing in the game. They drop on the board. And then Space Wolves aren't encumbered by Heavy Weapons. They then have Counter-Attack. When they get Assaulted in their opponent's phase.
Raven Guard (Codex Marines even) armies continuously make 1st Turn Assaults. With Infiltrate (Ninja Marines - all Scouts with Combat Blades) and Fleet. Oh, right...24" Assault range Assault Marines? What? Infiltrating, Fleet, Lightning Claw Terminators? Nah. Blood Angels are way better at Assault... :smallsigh:
Are you telling me that Space Wolves on the Assault or Counter-Attack, with three attacks each (Grey Hunters) or four attacks (Blood Claws) can't take out hordes? You're wrong. Space Marines - regardless of kind (Marines is Marines) - can do anything they want. That's what's so good about Space Marines.
[...]
Wrong. Blood Angels can take Sternguard, Scout and Tactical Squads too. In fact, given their Chapter structure (page 9), they're not even supposed to take that many Assault Squads. Haha. Just kidding. Players don't care about fluff. :smallwink:
Erm... as I said before, that entire paragraph I wrote up there was merely to illustrate what I meant, with no basis in reality. I wasn't trying to claim any of the Space Marine variants were particularly good or bad at the things I wrote there, or that the differences between them in any way resembled those I outlined; it was just meant to be an example of what I was asking for.
So once more: No, I am not claiming that Blood Angels are faster or better in assault, I am not saying Space Wolves are inferior against hordes, I am not saying Blood Angels cannot take any of the units you mentioned. All of this was just a purely fictitious example to illustrate what I meant. As I had explicitly said in the first place. No need for any of this "Wrong! How can you say that?! You are wrong! Wrong! Wrong!".
Sheesh, I merely made a polite request whether you could, maybe, time and willingness provided, write up a synopsis of the differences in gameplay between the various Space Marine chapters. This increasingly hostile assault on me, how wrong I am, how disappointed you are in me and how stupid what I am asking for is is really, really uncalled for. And untypical of you. :smallfrown:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Once again, you can't make broad statements like that. Because it all boils down to how you want to build your army. Which, with Space Marines, is any way you want.
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I haven't said anything of the sort of like what you said, Winterwind, because you can't make statements like that about Space Marines. Now that I've seen what you mean, I know exactly why I didn't do it that way. Not including the insanity-inducing portions. I could've. But I went for the 'Bullet Points' instead. Hopefully my reader-base isn't too noobish.
Hmm... seems to me that if there are sufficient differences in gameplay between them to justify the existence of separate codizes, it should be possible to outline these differences in gameplay just fine.
I guess I will try to figure them out and write them up myself, then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Necrons - who only have one Troop unit - and who need as many Necrons as they can. Do, only work one way. And that's why you can make Sweeping Arguments about Necrons.
Arguably, there are at least two ways - take as many Necrons as possible, or neglect the Necron count, take the most broken, indestructible models possible, and hide the entire Necron part of the army so it cannot be attacked at all.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Winterwind
This increasingly hostile assault on me, how wrong I am, how disappointed you are in me and how stupid what I am asking for is is really, really uncalled for. And untypical of you. :smallfrown:
My apologies. It's just that as of late there have been two or three of us here that have begun to annoy me. And I sincerely apologise to you. You're not the one I should be annoyed with. Hey, you've been in this thread a long time, and you've always treated me fairly (even when I've been wrong, it's been known to happen a bunch of times), so I see no reason for why my statements are justified.
I admit, I probably could've worded things nicer. But, what you've asked me to do actually is quite hard, because of the way the game works and how nobody has to actually play their army the way that it's 'suggested' in the Codex. That's why it's hard to pigeon-hole Space Marines, because they really are good at everything and they can play however you want them to.
For Blood Angels; The only real difference in the List is more options to take Jump Packs, Fast vehicles, and a slight bonus to Deep Striking. That's it. It may lend itself to Assault if you read it that way. But, you don't have to do any of that if you don't want to. You can play a 'sit and shoot' list if you want and it wont make a difference when you compare it Codex Marine list. I primarily believe this is due to Matt Ward being a hack though and using the masterful writing skill of Copy-Paste.
I could probably work on it. But, don't expect it to happen soon. Partly because a 'unit-by-unit breakdown in comparison to Codex Marines and others' is the easiest way to do it. I honestly can't think of any more I could say on the Blood Angels (as above), as there's really nothing else to say. Except to say where they have extra Jump Packs and why Fast vehicles might be useful - which I've already done in the breakdown.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
But Lightning Claws have always been re-rolling To Wound. :smallconfused:
People have been running Chaplains and Lightning Claws for a long time.
The only difference is that Blood Angels do it by costing a few more points and get Feel No Pain from the Priest - which Terminators don't really benefit from much anyway.
I was confusing myself.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
My apologies. It's just that as of late there have been two or three of us here that have begun to annoy me. And I sincerely apologise to you. You're not the one I should be annoyed with. Hey, you've been in this thread a long time, and you've always treated me fairly (even when I've been wrong, it's been known to happen a bunch of times), so I see no reason for why my statements are justified.
I admit, I probably could've worded things nicer. But, what you've asked me to do actually is quite hard, because of the way the game works and how nobody has to actually play their army the way that it's 'suggested' in the Codex. That's why it's hard to pigeon-hole Space Marines, because they really are good at everything and they can play however you want them to.
Alright, I understand. In that case, let's not dwell on it any longer. My apologies, too, if I should have been overly obnoxious/slow on the uptake/stubborn/*insert fault here*. :smallsmile:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
For Blood Angels; The only real difference in the List is more options to take Jump Packs, Fast vehicles, and a slight bonus to Deep Striking. That's it. It may lend itself to Assault if you read it that way. But, you don't have to do any of that if you don't want to. You can play a 'sit and shoot' list if you want and it wont make a difference when you compare it Codex Marine list. I primarily believe this is due to Matt Ward being a hack though and using the masterful writing skill of Copy-Paste.
I could probably work on it. But, don't expect it to happen soon. Partly because a 'unit-by-unit breakdown in comparison to Codex Marines and others' is the easiest way to do it. I honestly can't think of any more I could say on the Blood Angels (as above), as there's really nothing else to say. Except to say where they have extra Jump Packs and why Fast vehicles might be useful - which I've already done in the breakdown.
Mmm, alright - thanks for the discussion anyhow. :smallsmile:
And, you are definitely right in that it will certainly be far better for me to do some thinking on your own, using your unit analysis, rather than having you do all the work for me. I may try to write up that Marine-type comparison myself sometime, too (though I'm missing a few codizes there. Yet.). :smallcool:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
My sisters lost to sanguinary guard. 20 sisters and 30 guardsmen shot at 5 of them led by Dante and Astaroth for 3 turns and before we ran out of time I'd lost all the guardsmen and 13 sisters while he'd lost 4 guard and 2 wounds on each of Dante and Astaroth.
Last time I fought Sanguinary Guard they butchered my chaplain lead assault marines and my terminators.
Either they're better than everyone thinks or my army lists suck. Probably the latter since my guard squads had missile launchers and grenade launches and plasmaguns/lascannons would have killed those guys a lot quicker. I was also unlucky to have my sisters only get 1 successful psuedo-rending hit when they needed to despite rapid firing 7 bolt guns and getting 5 heavy flamer hits and 9 flamer hits.
Blood Angels list I managed to make with my Black Templars models
Spoiler
Show
HQ
Reclusiarch 130
Honour Guard with chapter banner and blood champion 165
Reclusiarch 165
Jump pack
Elites
Chaplain 130
Terminator Armour
5 terminators 235
1 assault cannon, 1 chain fist
5 assault terminators 210
2 with storm shields and thunder hammers
Land Crusader with multi-melta 265
Troops
10 assault marines 220
power fist, flamer, rhino
10 assault marines 205
meltagun, power sword, land raider crusaider with multi-melta 230
8 scouts with combat blades
Fast Attack
10 vanguard veterans 415
3 storm shields, 2 plasma pistols, power fist
2 attack bikes 80
2 attack bikes with multi-meltas 100