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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Forge - Round 10
Guess the cat's out of the bag... but my actions remain hidden. =)
Refs & LoS:
Spoiler
Show
Standard Action: Attempt to cast spell from scroll:
UMD Check (DC21): [roll0]
If successful, pop the spoiler below, otherwise ignore as scroll fails to activate:
Spoiler
Show
Shield scroll successfully cast, targeting self. Duration: 1 minute
Forge will then take a move action to draw an alchemist's fire.
Free Action: 5' Step to P2.
Done.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Forge
Current Position:P2
Equipped: 2 scrolls (color spray and shield)
6/8 hp
AC 19 (11t,18ff)
*Invisibility - 4 rounds remaining*
*Light of Lunia - 10 minutes remaining*
2 infusions remaining
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Shooter, turn 11
Double move to G-2.
Speak Elven:
Spoiler
Show
"Should we stay here and wait him out?"
End turn.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Location: G-2
HP: 12/12
AC: 18, FF: 12, Touch: 16
Cat's Grace: 22/30
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
TP
I guess I don't need the LoS spoiler now. Move to H2, and this time I'll ready an action.Spoiler
Show
I'll ready an action to move into melee if I detect Forge within a move action of me.
[roll0]
Speak ElvenSpoiler
Show
"Stay seperate so he can't get us both with area spells. Keep your ears open!"
Stats:Spoiler
Show
HP: 11/11
AC: 20 Full, 17 FF, 15 Touch, +5 Armor, +3 Dex, +2 Tree
Saves: Fort +4, Ref +4, Will -2
Special: Steely Resolve 5
Spoiler
Show
1. Crusader's Strike
2. Vanguard's Strike
3. Charging Minotaur
4. Stone Bones
5. Moment of Perfect Mind
[roll1]
[roll2]
[roll=Granted]1d3[/rol]
Turn Complete.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Ganurath, you were already in H-2. Are you planning to move somewhere or stay where you are?
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
I didn't realize it at the time, but I kinda got ninja'd by the ref. In any event, I will remain in H2 for the time being.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Forge - Round 11
Guess the cat's out of the bag... but my actions remain hidden. =)
Refs & LoS:
Spoiler
Show
Standard Action: Attempt to cast spell from scroll:
UMD Check (DC21): [roll0]
If successful, pop the spoiler below, otherwise ignore as scroll fails to activate:
Spoiler
Show
Shield scroll successfully cast, targeting self. Duration: 1 minute
Forge will then take a move action to draw an alchemist's fire.
Free Action: 5' Step to O1.
Done.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Forge
Current Position:O1
Equipped: scroll of color spray and alchemists fire
6/8 hp
AC 23 (11t,22ff)
*Invisibility - 3 rounds remaining*
*Light of Lunia - 10 minutes remaining*
2 infusions remaining
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Refs:
Spoiler
Show
For some reason I can't make the forum roll this. 2 attempts already, going to try again now.
Done.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Refs:
Spoiler
Show
Stupid forum dice roller... work!
UMD check: [roll0]
Sorry... don't mean to post so much on this.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Shooter, turn 12
Move to D-4.
Ready an action:
Spoiler
Show
Ready an action to shoot Forge if he becomes visible and is more than 5ft away from me.
End turn.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Location: D-4
HP: 12/12
AC: 20, FF: 14, Touch: 18
Cat's Grace: 21/30
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
High Ref PsiDog
Spoiler
Show
Shield has a verbal component. DC 0 to hear.
TeamPlayer is 35 ft away, 20-3 = success by 17
[roll0] is 55 ft away = success by 5
Forge
Spoiler
Show
You have LoS to the others.
McArcher
Spoiler
Show
You hear speaking to eastish of yourself.
TeamPlayer
Spoiler
Show
You hear chanting east of yourself.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
TP
I'll remain in the tree square and ready an action again.Spoiler
Show
I'll ready an action to move into melee if I detect Forge within a move action of me.
[roll0]
[roll1]
[roll2]
I'm looking to Spot something in particular, which is explained in what I'm saying with Speak Elven for ref reference.
Speak ElvenSpoiler
Show
"Eyes on the bog for footfalls, his feet will make fine craters to expose him if he enters."
Stats:Spoiler
Show
HP: 11/11
AC: 20 Full, 17 FF, 15 Touch, +5 Armor, +3 Dex, +2 Tree
Saves: Fort +4, Ref +4, Will -2
Special: Steely Resolve 5
Spoiler
Show
1. Crusader's Strike
2. Vanguard's Strike
3. Charging Minotaur
4. Stone Bones
5. Moment of Perfect Mind
Turn Complete.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Forge - Round 12
Refs & LoS:
Spoiler
Show
Standard: Cast Infusion into self.
Spoiler
Show
'Shield of Faith'
Move Action: 15' move to N2.
Done.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Forge
Current Position:N2
Equipped: scroll of color spray and alchemists fire
6/8 hp
AC 25 (13t,24ff)
*Invisibility - 2 rounds remaining*
*Light of Lunia - 10 minutes remaining*
*Shield - 9 rounds remaining*
*Shield of Faith - 10 rounds remaining*
1 infusions remaining
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
HighRef PsiDog
@Refs
Spoiler
Show
Forge does spell stuff (DC 0 + distance) and moves half speed (takes 5 for DC 6 + distance)
TP makes the listen check by 10 on the spellcasting, and by 5 on movement
[roll0] A new round, a new listen.
Shooter gets simple successes on both
Shooter
Spoiler
Show
You hear more speech and movement to the east.
Note on Spot Checks: A DC 20 will notice the presence of an invisible creature within 30ft, but RAW makes no allowances for seeing tracks by spot.
Team Player
Spoiler
Show
You hear more chanting and movement to the east
Note on Spot Checks: A DC 20 will notice the presence of an invisible creature within 30ft, but RAW makes no allowances for seeing tracks by spot. Finding tracks requires a search or survival checks by raw
Forge
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Shooter, turn 12
Move: Spot check
[roll0]
Ready an action:
Spoiler
Show
Ready an action to shoot Forge if he becomes visible and is more than 5ft away from me.
End turn.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Location: D-4
HP: 12/12
AC: 20, FF: 14, Touch: 18
Cat's Grace: 20/30
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
TP
I'll remain in the tree square and ready an action again.Spoiler
Show
I'll ready an action to move into melee if I detect Forge within a move action of me.
[roll0]
[roll1]
[roll2]
"Come on, tin can, are you trying to bring down the lightning?!"
Stats:Spoiler
Show
HP: 11/11
AC: 20 Full, 17 FF, 15 Touch, +5 Armor, +3 Dex, +2 Tree
Saves: Fort +4, Ref +4, Will -2
Special: Steely Resolve 5
Spoiler
Show
1. Crusader's Strike
2. Vanguard's Strike
3. Charging Minotaur
4. Stone Bones
5. Moment of Perfect Mind
[roll3]
[roll4]
[roll5]
Turn Complete.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Forge - Round 13
I'll post the full turn even those you don't have LoS until *after* my attack.
Move Action: 20' Move to J3
Standard Action: Release Light of Lunia as 2 ray attacks against Shooter in D4. Attacks catch Shooter flat-footed.
Ray 1 attack: [roll0]
Ray 1 damage: [roll1]
Ray 2 attack: [roll2]
Ray 2 damage: [roll3]
Done.
***LoS established here incase I trigger any readied actions by appearing.***
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Forge
Current Position:J3
Equipped: scroll of color spray and alchemists fire
6/8 hp
AC 25 (13t,24ff)
*Shield - 8 rounds remaining*
*Shield of Faith - 9 rounds remaining*
1 infusions remaining
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Both attacks miss.
Readied action to shoot Forge if he becomes visible and isn't within 5 ft of me goes off.
[roll0]
[roll1]
Shooter, turn 13
Rapid shot on Forge
[roll2]
[roll3]
[roll4]
[roll5]
End turn.
Stats:
Spoiler
Show
Location: D-4
HP: 12/12
AC: 20, FF: 14, Touch: 18
Cat's Grace: 19/30
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Appearing within range of a move action triggers a readied action to move adjacent. In this case, I2.
TP
Let's give Stone Bones a swing.
[roll0]
[roll1]
[roll2]
[roll3]
After that, hit or miss, I'll take a move action to D4. Assuming I don't get a lucky crit, take your AoO.
Stats:Spoiler
Show
HP: 11/11
AC: 18 Full, 15 FF, 13 Touch, +5 Armor, +3 Dex
Saves: Fort +4, Ref +3, Will -2
Special: Steely Resolve 5
Spoiler
Show
1. Crusader's Strike
2. Vanguard's Strike
3. Charging Minotaur
4. Stone Bones
5. Moment of Perfect Mind
[roll4]
Turn Complete.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Shooter/refs:Spoiler
Show
As an idle observation... how did a flat-footed touch attack miss on an 11 against Shooter?
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Need a clarification from Team Player:
You had a readied action to: "Move adjacent to me should I appear within range of a single move action?"
The way I understand readied actions, the following should occur:
1. Your readied action is triggered when I appear at the end of my turn.
2. You take your readied action(which is a move action, no attack), which reduces your initiative count so next turn you go after me.
If all this is correct, is Team Player stuck with the same basic action and die rolls next turn?
Same basic questions to Shooter as well, it's like they skipped my turn.
I'll take my next turn with the assumption that Team Player is in square I2.
Good Gaming!
-Jason
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
I'm not sure what happens to initiative when using readied actions, to be honest. I'd love a ref ruling.
Tanaric/refs:
Spoiler
Show
I'd forgotten that Light of Lunia is a touch attack, but even so I'm in a square with a tree. It says nothing about what type of bonus the +2 AC from the tree is, so I'd assumed it applied to all.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master_Rahl22
I'm not sure what happens to initiative when using readied actions, to be honest. I'd love a ref ruling.
From the SRD:
Quote:
Initiative Consequences of Readying
Your initiative result becomes the count on which you took the readied action. If you come to your next action and have not yet performed your readied action, you don’t get to take the readied action (though you can ready the same action again). If you take your readied action in the next round, before your regular turn comes up, your initiative count rises to that new point in the order of battle, and you do not get your regular action that round.
You guys want me to just take 2 actions and we'll be caught up?
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Neither of us took our readied actions in the next round. So if I understand that right, my initiative dropped to the count on which I took my readied action which would be the same as Forge, and since I have a higher modifier I now go after TP and before Forge. Then TP's action goes off too, and he is now on the same initiative count as all 3 of us, and his initiative modifier is in the middle. Thus we have the same initiative order as we used to, and once you finished your turn that provoked the actions, we pick back up just like normal with my turn.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Your readied actions didn't get triggered until after my turn was complete. My invisibility drops after my attack and my attack was the end of my turn. That means you go after me in the following round.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
The readied actions went off when Forge appeared, so somewhere between the first and second attack. In other words, before your turn ended.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Ah, pedantic rules debates, the soul of the Arena...
So, as I see it, this is what happens. Forge takes his attack (both rays are simultaneous). While he has no further actions planned, it is still his turn. Shooter's initiative count comes before TP's, so his readied action goes off first, placing his initiative just before Forge. TP's readied action then goes off, placing his initiative between Shooter and Forge. Then Forge's turn finishes, making it Shooter's turn. As far as I can tell, this would seem to be consistent with Arena precedent and RAW, but if you're not convinced, feel free to present evidence to the contrary (or just go bother Kyeudo...).
Edit: Just to clarify, the reason I say the readied actions happen on Forge's turn - he still has actions available, despite declaring the end of his turn, and if he so wished, he could take them in response to the readied actions going off.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
The above Salleraism* would appear to be correct by my understanding of things, if you needed input from another ref.
*Salleraism: A statement or ruling that is both amazingly speedy and surprisingly accurate.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Sallera
Edit: Just to clarify, the reason I say the readied actions happen on Forge's turn - he still has actions available, despite declaring the end of his turn, and if he so wished, he could take them in response to the readied actions going off.
Your arguement makes sense based on the premise that I still had actions available and prematurely ended my turn.
Except that I didn't. A character may make a move action and a standard action per turn. Free actions take up no time, which is why they are 'free' and don't fit into the standard breakdown of limited actions. I made a move and then a standard action. No other actions available. My invisibility vanished after my attack which was at the completion of my turn, not in the middle of it.
I specifically asked Kyeudo about when my invisibility would drop and he stated that this would occur after the attack. Those readied actions can't trigger until after my attack, since my attack ended my turn the triggering event occurred directly after my initiative count as my initiative count passed with the completion of my attack.
I'll ask Kyeudo to rule on this. Like I said, Sallera's call was a good one but based on an incorrect premise. Forge had no further actions available.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Swift actions still exist, even if you don't have the ability to use them.
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Re: Arena Tournament, Round 69: Macintosh & Forge vs. Shooter McArcher & Team Player
Free actions are also available, and while they may take up no time, you can still only take them on your turn, which means you could take them in response to the readied actions. Just because you had no useful options available doesn't mean you didn't have any options available.