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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oslecamo
Nitpick, but servitors are cyborgs and must have humie bitz, as the imperium can't or doesn't want to make fully automonous machines.
They're not autonomous. They're plugged into the Inquisitor's brain as a remote. Or, like the TfC (since we brought that up), we operate it manually. Either way, it doesn't make any difference to what you want your model to look like.
Servitors can be anything you want.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Nitpick, but servitors are cyborgs and must have humie bitz, as the imperium can't or doesn't want to make fully automonous machines.
Thats why stuff like the tarantula turret, cyclops demolition tank and assault cannon drop pod don't exist. :smalltongue:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Selrahc
One of them is remote controled, the other two just gun down anything that comes close untill they run out of ammo, so I wouldn't call them really autonomous.
But well if they're plugged to the Inquisitor's brain or being controled by some remote stuff I can go along with that.:smallsigh:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oslecamo
gun down anything that comes close untill they run out of ammo
You couldn't program a Servitor to do that? And then put it on wheels/tracks? :smallconfused:
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But well if they're plugged to the Inquisitor's brain or being controled by some remote stuff I can go along with that.:smallsigh:
A Cyber-Mastiff is what? A Combat Servitor. Plugged into an Arbite's Brain.
Same with Njal's raven as Familiars are just small Servitors (albeit highly specialised ones); like Servo-Skulls (one guess as to what 'Servo' means). Cherubims are also servitors.
It has precedent.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oslecamo
C-It can only use one special ammo at a time, and only one kind per game.
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Originally Posted by
Oslecamo
Yeah that's what I intentended to say, stupid english semantics...
Actually, that's how I originally read your post. He can only fire once per turn - hence, only uses one special ammo (albeit, at a time). Perfect sense, to me at least, and still a valid point; Vindicare can shoot either a Tank or a Librarian, but not both :smallsmile:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Trixie
Erm... I read that, and AFAIR, Living Metal only affects extra dice added. Such as Chainfist, Rending, or Melta. Vindicare TP doesn't add any dice, just uses stated amount, so I'd say he isn't affected by that, and is in fact best Monolith-killer in the game :smalltongue:
I have 2-dozen Wraithguard and a set of D-Cannon that would like to see you outside in the dark alley over there, sir :smalltongue:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Wraith
I have 2-dozen Wraithguard and a set of D-Cannon that would like to see you outside in the dark alley over there, sir :smalltongue:
Actually, any Dark Eldar Syrabite with Agoniser and/or Haywire Grenades will be there first. Then a Deffroller will crush everyone in the alley.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
You couldn't program a Servitor to do that? And then put it on wheels/tracks? :smallconfused:
Not exactly, because the servitor is suposed to be actualy capable of limited thinking, being a cyborg and not a pure bot. The servitor of the inquisitor is capable of, for example, bashing someone with his heavy bolter if they get too close or keep fighting if the inquisitor goes down, while your sugested pure machine tank-bolter shouldn't be able to act whitout orders or if someone just got on top of it.
You can still cut it's legs and give him mechanical wheels, but I see no pratical reason for an inquisitor to have an henchmen wich can't climb stairs.:smallamused:
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
A Cyber-Mastiff is what? A Combat Servitor. Plugged into an Arbite's Brain.
Same with Njal's raven as Familiars are just small Servitors (albeit highly specialised ones); like Servo-Skulls (one guess as to what 'Servo' means). Cherubims are also servitors.
It has precedent.
Familiars aren't servitors. They're bred (at the lack of best word as they're an amalgam of cyborg and genetic manipulation/cloning/embryo manipulation, suprisingly advanced stuff for WWII tech Imperium) from scratch for a specific purpose, while a servitor is picking a living creature and puting mechanical bitz on it untill it's more machine than living creature.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
They're not autonomous. They're plugged into the Inquisitor's brain as a remote. Or, like the TfC (since we brought that up), we operate it manually. Either way, it doesn't make any difference to what you want your model to look like.
I always thought it was more a case of some convict who'd been mindraped and reprogrammed, then outfitted with various bionics, - weapons, combat-stimms, data storage centres. Gets around the whole "no AI" thing. But bah - as you said:
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Servitors can be anything you want.
As an example: in White Dwarf a while back, there was someone who made a Sentinel into a plasma-cannon servitor. There was a (removeable) wire that fed down to the sage, who was a seperate model.
Meanwhile, I've used (and seen others use) IG officers with power fists/chainswords as Combat-Servitors, used an Empire Trooper guy with a sentinel chainsaw (replaced chainsaw with catachan long knife - indentured gardening servitor :p) instead of an arm, and have three IG guys with heavy bolters (on heavy weapon team sized bases) that have been used as heavy bolter servitors. In my experience, people don't complain too hard if your bases are too big, if at all. And if there's an awesome conversion/scenic base, it's pretty much all fine.
Henchmen in general can be whatever you want them to be.
Long story short, and trying not to get into a fluff/modelling discussion on the tactics thread: Lycan, just make an awesome looking unit. So long as you can justify things with the fluff (or rules - see also, my habit of "give two weapons, count as mastercrafted" and suchlike) given in the books, it'll be fine.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Oslecamo
Nitpick, but servitors are cyborgs and must have humie bitz, as the imperium can't or doesn't want to make fully automonous machines.
Servitors need biological parts but can be on the brain in a jar or fully armoured level.
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Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
BWAH HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
That doesn't even happen at the best of times, except for massive GDs with strict entry requirements. Not even I have my entire army painted.
My entire army is painted. Well, two and a half (out of five) of them are.
Which is nice for me I guess and not that relevant.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Lorn
As an example: in White Dwarf a while back, there was someone who made a Sentinel into a plasma-cannon servitor. There was a (removeable) wire that fed down to the sage, who was a seperate model.
That same model is in Codex: Witch Hunters.
In any case, both Inquisition Codecies give you a bunch of ideas for what you can use/do in their respective modelling sections. Google Images will likely produce a lot more.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Actually, any Dark Eldar Syrabite with Agoniser and/or Haywire Grenades will be there first. Then a Deffroller will crush everyone in the alley.
The Agoniser, I'm not too impressed with in comparison - a 1/6 chance to glance? Not bad, but that'd still take a lot of effort to annoy a Monolith.
But the Deffrolla? Holy crap, I missed the memo about that. Those things are awesome! :smalleek: :smalltongue:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wraith
The Agoniser, I'm not too impressed with in comparison - a 1/6 chance to glance? Not bad, but that'd still take a lot of effort to annoy a Monolith.
the real kicker is the haywire grenades. When you can roll up on the hardest to kill model in the game turn 1 and pop it without much trouble makes any player cry a little bit on the inside :smallbiggrin:
Edit: as for the servitor conversation, they are always bio based because to have a fully fledged AI is heresy. Servitors get around this by having the brains of humans as bases. The examples of AI given by others are normally just shoot the anything that comes close (some with a little more intelligence and can distinguish between friend and foe) but nothing on par with human intelligence. The servitor that the stat line represents has basic human reactions and instinct without the higher decision making abilities (i.e. basic servitor). That said they are your models and you can do with them as you want and remote controlled "servitors" can be more varied in shape in function because they rely solely or nearly solely on an outside intelligence to do anything.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
I was rereading Codex: Eye of Terror out of nostalgy and an idea struck me: using Wulfen to represent Thunder Wolves. Both rules depict a mean, mean beast. What do you think?
On a similar note, I was thinking of using a Legion of the Damned unit to represent Grey Slayers bursting out of the shadows to save the day, but the fact their saves are invulnerable prevents this...
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Well, according to A Thousand Sons, there are no Wolves on Fenris.:smallwink:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
crazedloon
as for the servitor conversation, they are always bio based because to have a fully fledged AI is heresy. Servitors get around this by having the brains of humans as bases.
Or being plugged into a human via a link - psychic, electronic or otherwise.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Discord
I was rereading Codex: Eye of Terror out of nostalgy and an idea struck me: using Wulfen to represent Thunder Wolves. Both rules depict a mean, mean beast. What do you think?
Fenrisian Wolves and Thunderwolves are Beasts and Cavalry, and need the base size to match. Which is kind of pointless for Wulfen-size models. But...If that's what you want.
Thunderwolves need people riding them, and need to be suitably represented as such. Otherwise you're skirting size and true LoS. And may be disallowed in certain areas.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Woooooooooooooo.......
Got my Assault on Black Reach kit. I was wondering -- what's a good Ork army, as in, what would unit choices look like? (I've already resigned myself to about 200$ worth of Bikers, as i hear they are flat-out amazing.)
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Boyz.
Just keep buying the cheap eight dollar 5-packs, and soon you'll have several cheap Boyz mobs. Rinse repeat until your enemy drowns beneath a sea of green.
No seriously, if your enemy is packing vehicles or heavily armored foes, some biker nobs with Power Klaws are supposed to be beastly. But your can get about 30 Boyz for 3 Biker Nobs with Power Klaws and Painboy stuff, and those 30 Boyz can ruin a day just as easily (though with more mess and less boomyness) as those 3 Nob Bikers. :smallamused:
Edit: 200 dollars = 15 or so Bikers, or 100 Boyz and 10 Nobs. Too lazy to calculate the exact points, but they're both over 1k worth. If 15 models make up 1k+ points in your army, you're taking a pretty big gamble... :smalleek:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
dentrag2
I was wondering -- what's a good Ork army, as in, what would unit choices look like? (I've already resigned myself to about 200$ worth of Bikers, as i hear they are flat-out amazing.)
Every Nob (that aren't part of units of Nobz) should have a Power Klaw. That goes for Warbosses too.
Big Meks are useful if you use their Kustom Force Field properly. Shokk Attack Guns are good on paper. Not that great on the table. Certainly doesn't hold a candle to Master of the Forge on a Bike.
Weirdboyz are okay. Most of the time you should be looking at Warboss and Big Mek. Or just two Warbosses if you don't like having friends.
Nobz are great. Nob Bikerz even more so - I assume you're using that $200 to make Nob Bikerz?
Meganobz are like Terminators. For the same points as Terminators. But worse.
Burna Boyz are fairly good. Though they need a Transport.
Tankbustas? No. Just no.
Lootas are great.
Kommandos are pretty bad.
IMO, the simple Ork Boyz mob is the best unit in the Codex. You should have as many Boyz Mobs you can possibly get away with without putting detriments on other areas.
Don't underestimate Shoota Boyz. Shoota Boyz also benefit from 'Eavy Armour more than Slugga Boyz.
You should generally limit yourself to ~20 Boyz per mob. 25 if you think you need it. Don't ever use less than this unless you're using a Trukk.
Gretchin get on an objective in your own deployment zone. They go to ground in Turn 1. They never move.
Stormboyz are crap. Don't do it.
Warbuggies are nice if you use the correctly and don't just pretend that they're Land Speeders - they're not.
Warbikers are quite nice. They should perform well regardless of what army you're playing against. Feel free to upgrade them to Nob Bikers for even more amazingness.
Deffkoptas are not actually that good. But, you get three in the AoBR box, there's really no reason not to use them until you get an army big enough and you find you no longer need them any more.
Battlewagon; Deff Rolla. Everytime. Or Killcannon. But not both. Also, don't pretend that Battlewagons are Land Raiders. They aren't.
Deff Dreads perform amazingly well, or are a massive failure. Too...Unreliable for me - even for Orks.
Killa Kans; Do it now. They will outperform a Deff Dread pretty much every time if you can keep them alive (see Big Mek with Force Field). Never take less than three. They work best in squads - unlike other things.
Flash Gitz are okay. It'd be better if there were more of them. But, they have a Painboy, so that's a plus. Unless you really like them, stick with Shoota Boyz.
Big Gunz; Eh. Some people like them, some people don't. Lots of people seem to like Lobbas (if they like Big Gunz at all).
Looted Wagon; Fun, if only for the modelling possibilities. Take the Boomgun. If you want to transport 12 models, you should be using Trukks.
Boyz, boyz and more boyz. You really don't need anything else. Warbikers are nice. Nob Bikerz even more so. But, without a proper backbone of Boyz in your army, you wont do so well.
Stay away from Tankbustas, Kommandos and Stormboyz.
Don't include the following unless you have a real plan, or just really, really, really want them because you like them; Burna Boyz, Flash Gits and Meganobz.
Your good units are; Boyz, more Boyz, Lootas, more boyz, Killa Kans, Battlewagons and more Boyz. Nob Bikerz are also good. But, only after you've got the rest of your army sorted.
In case you didn't get it; More Boyz.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Fenrisian Wolves and Thunderwolves are Beasts and Cavalry, and need the base size to match. Which is kind of pointless for Wulfen-size models. But...If that's what you want.
Thunderwolves need people riding them, and need to be suitably represented as such. Otherwise you're skirting size and true LoS. And may be disallowed in certain areas.
Good points.
It was just random wondering on how I could make a 13th Company army with the current Codex. Though I guess they could be used in very friendly games.
But I just found out (with no real surprise) that wulfens are not sold anymore anyway.
Back to Juggernaut-riding Salamanders then.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
And don't forget, more Boyz. :smallbiggrin:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
I'm rather surprised, cheesegear, that you would recommend warbuggies over deffcoptas.
I'll take T5, 2 Wounds, and a 4+ armor save over a Armor 10 opentopped vehicle any day. Aside from those defensive capabilities, they arn't very different from eachother. Though deffcoptas do also have the option to scout and outflank, which the buggies do not.
But personally, I don't care for either regardless.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
Myatar_Panwar
I'm rather surprised, cheesegear, that you would recommend warbuggies over deffcoptas.
Buggies are cheaper.
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But personally, I don't care for either regardless.
Agreed. Buggies and Koptas are like Sentinels. Eventually they're just not needed at a certain level.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Discord
Back to Juggernaut-riding Salamanders then.
actually I personally like the idea of cold one riding Salamanders (or if you really want to shell out the money and want some intimidating models carnosaur)
just my .02
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Cheesegear
Flash Gitz are okay. It'd be better if there were more of them. But, they have a Painboy, so that's a plus. Unless you really like them, stick with Shoota Boyz.
Flash Gits are far, far, far, far too expensive for what you get. Stick with Lootas or Shootas.
I also don't particularly like the Killcannon, but if you really want it more power to you. BWagons work best as transports and Deff Rolla awesomeness.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Ninja Chocobo
I also don't particularly like the Killcannon, but if you really want it more power to you. BWagons work best as transports and Deff Rolla awesomeness.
The problem is that Deff Rollas still allow saves. It's still a Tank Shock, but, still, it allows saves. It's good for ramming vehicles.
A Killcannon is Ordnance, Large Blast AP3. It's kind of good.
Killcannons work best when you've got a Battlewagon carting around Lootas, or even just giving your Lootas extra protection. Since apparently there's no rule stating that passengers inside a vehicle can't shoot if a vehicle shoots an Ordnance weapon (maybe because it doesn't come up much, and they didn't include the rule?).
Anyway, tomorrow I'll be posting the ANZAC (Green vs. Gold; Orks vs. Imperial Fists) Day Massacre battle report. It's an Assassination mission.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Killcannons work best when you've got a Battlewagon carting around Lootas, or even just giving your Lootas extra protection. Since apparently there's no rule stating that passengers inside a vehicle can't shoot if a vehicle shoots an Ordnance weapon (maybe because it doesn't come up much, and they didn't include the rule?).
Yeah... I don't think there is another transport tank with an ordnance gun.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
crazedloon
the real kicker is the haywire grenades. When you can roll up on the hardest to kill model in the game turn 1 and pop it without much trouble makes any player cry a little bit on the inside :smallbiggrin:
I see what you're getting at, and I *love* Haywire Grenades. The #2 cause for the death of my Autarch (after the #1 cause of trying to Warp Jump once too often...) is being shot in the face by my opponent's entire army after the tank he was just hiding behind, is suddenly vaporised and leaves him in the wide open.
I complain when it happens, but deep down I can't help but feel satisfied with such a trade off :smallbiggrin:
For similar points, however, you could get a Master of the Forge with a Conversion Beamer. Penetrates even a Monolith on 5+ and it still works against infantry or Walkers that aren't immobile, also in the first turn. In fact, more likely in the first turn :smalltongue:
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Wraith
For similar points, however, you could get a Master of the Forge with a Conversion Beamer. Penetrates even a Monolith on 5+ and it still works against infantry or Walkers that aren't immobile, also in the first turn. In fact, more likely in the first turn :smalltongue:
Let's compare...
My personal favourite, is
Autarch - 155 Points
Eldar Jetbike, Mandiblasters, Laser Lance and Reaper Launcher.
Is T3(4), with a 3+ save. :smallfrown: But has an Invulnerable save. And works well with Jetbikes, JetCouncils and Shining Spears (question below). So can't be picked out when getting shot at.
Is Relentless, so fires his Reaper Launcher at BS6 all day long. Has a Pistol weapon (it's not replaced) for +1 Attack. Also carries an S6 Lance weapon (kind of useless though), as well as Haywire Grenades. And, when Assaulting, has 6, S6 Power Weapon (which is what you really want the Laser Lance for) attacks at I6, WS6. And adds to Reserve rolls. Which is a plus for Swooping Hawks - who also carry Haywire Grenades (each) and Skyleap/Grenade Packs.
Spoiler
Show
So...Now I need to ask, the rule for the Shining Spears' Withdraw Exarch Power (page 37); Emphasis Mine.
"His unit gains the Hit and Run special rule."
If I deploy the Autarch with the unit, does the Autarch gain Hit and Run? Or does the unit lose it, because it's joined by an IC who doesn't have the rule?
Compared to;
Master of the Forge - 155 Points
Conversion Beamer, Bike
Has T4(5) and a 2+ Save. Doesn't have an Invulnerable. Also doesn't ride an Eldar Jetbike (Which is a Jetbike. Made special just by being Eldar). And 'kind of' sucks in Assault. I know I'd prefer the Autarch.
Master of the Forge on Bike also doesn't really mesh with any other unit in the Codex. It's very common to see them on their own. So shoot them. They can't allocate wounds to his squad.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
On Hit & Run- It's a skill with a star next to it in the Universal Special Rules section.
In every case, when unit with it is joined by IC without it, or vice versa, the starred skill is lost while the two are together.
So, unit with it would lose it, if joined by an IC, such as an Autarch, without it.
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Re: Warhammer 40K Tactics VI: Chaos Bringing Eternal Darkness? I brought my flashligh
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Originally Posted by
hamishspence
In every case, when unit with it is joined by IC without it, or vice versa, the starred skill is lost while the two are together.
Yeah. I included that as part of the question.
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So, unit with it would lose it, if joined by an IC, such as an Autarch, without it.
Would they? Because the Exarch gives the ability to everyone in the unit. If the Autarch is in the unit, he would gain the rule. Hence the question. Actually, you could apply it to all Aspect units;
Do Independent Characters gain the benefit of Exarch Powers? The FAQ lists Swooping Hawks and Warp Spiders as specific questions to which the answer is "Yes. If he has [gear].".
And the Shadowstrike Striking Scorpion power apparently needs to specifically exempt an Autarch (but not a Farseer, lol). Why don't the others?
There's no reason it shouldn't apply across the board. The Autarch is on a Jetbike after all, so, has the 'gear' to do it, as per the FAQ examples - And, my version also has a Laser Lance, if you want to get that anal. Fluffwise, an Autarch is supposed to be some sort of Master Aspect Warrior after all. There's no reason he shouldn't benefit from Exarchs.
So, I'm saying that they do. I'll bring it up with GW next time I'm there.