More Magic, More Fun -- Sorcerer/Wizard Remixes (3.5, PEACH)

I love these! Forms is maybe the greatest way I've seen to make a wizard actually fun to play! I hate preparing spells... This mitigates that problem.

Now, if all casters, prepared or not, had a limited number of spells known, and the "way-too-good" spells were nerfed (which you did pretty well with those revised spells), DnD would most likely be a lot funnier to play, IMO.

Iv' never really understood why divine casters know all their spells... Of course, their gods are able to grant them whatever powers they want, but does the cleric really know every single prayer ever created? Or does the cleric just say "yo, god, I want some lightning stuff!" and the deity replies "okay, man! You use this spell here, hope you like it!"

But I digress... Great remixes! I'll try to convince my DM to let me play one of them next time!

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Originally Posted by Lemmy

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Thank you! I'm glad you enjoy my 'brew. Let me know how it works out if you do wind up playing one.

Incidentally, if you're interested in a similar treatment of divine casters, you could take a look at my Druid , which was in some ways the precursor of the battle magic/utility magic split, and my "Miracle Worker" cleric replacement, with spontaneous casting based off domains.

Good news!

I'll play the sorcerer remix in a one-shot adventure tomorrow!

It'll be Pathfinder, but we'll keep it as faithful as possible to your post, it should not really be much of a difference...

Party is composed of 5 players at 9th level, I think. DM says that dependending of which adventure he brings us, it could be 13th level.

Another player will be using homebrew too, so can't really compare. But there'll be a Druid too, so at least I'll be able to see how it fares against another full caster.

Depending on how things go, I may be allowed to use your Wizard remix in the next one-shot.

I'll post the results!

EDIT: Here's what the sorc looks like in the character sheet...

Julius Bluewisp - Human Sorcerer 10 (Fey Heritage) - NG
STR 8 DEX 16 CON 16 (20 with Belt) INT 12 WIS 10 CHA 20 (24 with headband)

So I can cast 5 level-5 spells and 10 level-4 spells per day, as long as I have enough Arcana points, right?

I'll try to make good use of Body Burn (and Soul Burn, if we get to 10th level) and see how it impacts the game. PF allows me to get extra spells known as a Favored Class option, but I'll pick extra HP instead, this way it'll be closer to your original design.
I won't use bloodline-related spells, class skills or bonus feats. Since they don't appear in your remix.
But now that I think about it, those would be pretty cool to add to your version! They give more fluff to the different heritages.

I'll try and post my impressions tomorrow night if I can, maybe sunday.

Of course, I forgot to post sunday... My memory does suck!

Okay, our party was level 9. It was a druid, a gunslinger, a homebrew rogue, a homebrew fighter and my sorcerer.

Our quest involved transporting war-prisioners (who we rescued) across enemy territory, setting them free and going back to the front, where we'd be told to sneak into the enemy's headquarters to sabotage their weapons and/or kill their commanders. It was pretty cool.
I had 70 Arcana points. With a daily limit of 5 5th-level spells and 10 4th-level spells. I had 6 spells known of my 2 highest spell level and a lot of the lower ones.

Being able to cast 5 of my most powerful spells per day was really, really cool, Wall of Stone and Summon Monster 5 allowed me to be useful in and outside of combat, and I still had some juice even after spending over half my arcana. This was great 'cause it extended the adventuring day. I was not in top form after the 1st 2 or 3 encounters, but I could still help meanningfully!

I had OPTIONS, not just 2 or 3 spells! I could actually pick fun spells instead of just learning the most powerful ones. This is the 1st sorcerer I made who had Tongues and Suggestion in his spell list!

His ability in combat was as good as you'd expect from a tier2 class, really powerful tricks, but not much variety. The DM was pleased that he didn't have to worry about me having different spells every single day.

The druid was never bothered by me, tier1 is still more versatile than the sorcerer (but not nearly as fun :smallbiggrin:). The rogue, fighter and gunslinger enjoyed having a decent caster who could go longer than 10 minutes without needing to rest for 8h.

Magesight and Magetouch were really cool to roleplay, and add a lot of flavor to the sorcerer.

Body Burn is useful, but not abusable. 2d8* (or 2d10) damage per caster-level is a lot when you have a d6 HD, poor AC and mean enemies! :smalleek: But I had the impression that at higher levels, the damage was not gonna be a real problem, since I'd have more HP and most enemies would be able to 1-hit-KO me anyway. Soul Burns is much more limited, even at high level.
*Since sorcerers have d6 HD in PF, we increased Body Burn's damage accordingly.

My conclusions are:
1- The Sorcerer Remixed is more powerful than the official version. But not "tier 1 powerful".
2- His increased versatility means he can learn both utility and combat spells, so a wizard, while more versatile, is not utterly necessary.
3- The sorcerer remixed is MORE FUN!
The extra spells known allow the player to pick those cool spell he always wanted to, but didn't 'cause they are less than optimal. And the extra spell casting means the 15-minute adventuring day is at least a 2-hours adventuring day. :smallbiggrin:

Really, the only problem this sorcerer has is the fact that he's still a full-caster, and as such, can still break the game. But this is an issue with D&D/Pathfinder, not the class. If those broken spells are nerfed or removed, the sorcerer could be very balanced. In the case of the wizard, not so much, as he'd still be able to basically be whatever he wants everyday.

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Originally Posted by Lemmy

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Thanks! Glad it's working out well for you.

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Body Burn is useful, but not abusable. 2d8* (or 2d10) damage per caster-level is a lot when you have a d6 HD, poor AC and mean enemies! :smalleek: But I had the impression that at higher levels, the damage was not gonna be a real problem, since I'd have more HP and most enemies would be able to 1-hit-KO me anyway. Soul Burns is much more limited, even at high level.

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Yeah, the damage isn't that terrible at higher levels, but neither is the caster level boost-- direct damage is weaker than all other forms, and nothing else really benefits from the caster level that much (+3 rounds of duration to a 10-round spells? please)

No need for thanks, man, it's a really good homebrew.

You said your goal was to make the sorcerer more fun.

Well, mission freaking accomplished. :smallbiggrin:

- Edit, have you tought about adding those bloodline-specific bonus spells? They do make the sorc even more flavorful.

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Originally Posted by Lemmy

- Edit, have you tought about adding those bloodline-specific bonus spells? They do make the sorc even more flavorful.

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I did think about it, but I ultimately decided against it because he was getting so many extra spells known as it was-- and, I admit, a certain unwillingness to go through and figure out 9 spells for 12 bloodlines :smallredface:.

Take them from Pathfinder... I promise I won't tell anyone! :smallwink:

Unless they give me pie... No secret can resist pie...