Just as an aside, Moonspeaker is a great PrC for a Favored Soul if you can swing the reqs (Knowledge Devotion does the trick).
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Just as an aside, Moonspeaker is a great PrC for a Favored Soul if you can swing the reqs (Knowledge Devotion does the trick).
Spirit Shaman is brilliant. Good call.Quote:
Originally Posted by ATHATH
You'll also want some way to get the SNA line on your list, for the level 4 perks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thurbane
The weapon is reasonable, but the soulmeld strikes me as unlikely to feature on most druid builds. The question isn't precisely whether such bonuses exist, but rather how many druids, especially late level druids going by this argument, feature such a bonus as part of their build.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nifft
True. Might be worth stating explicitly that the ACF is probably better than the animal companion later, and worse than one in the earlier stages of the game. It's pretty trivially the case that a riding dog is better than first level beast spirit stuff, after all.Quote:
However the loss of an animal companion especially at the lower levels is really a significant decrease in utility.
Soo. New here, but I've been using this handbook for over a year diligently. As a huge fan of Druids, this is literally my dream handbook.
That said, my particular focus is with Planar Shepherds. The handbook here got me into the field some, but the fact is that much of the work with this class I've had to do myself since Reshy's handbook is broad but only contains details on certain select forms, and leaves off many of the details critical to the Planar Bubble (namely, planar traits).
Could they, perhaps, be fleshed out somewhat? Just curious about this.
If you have been working with Planar Shepherd for a year, may I suggest that YOU may be in the best position to write an expanded Planar Shepherd handbook?Quote:
Originally Posted by Alphaeus
Would that Eggynack just included a (more obvious) link to Tweedledope's Planar Shepherd Handbook.
Stormrage (Druid8) from Spell Compendium is missing. It seems it would combo well with control winds, lets you fly, and acts as a sort of reserve feat with a 1/round lightning ray.
I'm also curious what you think of this article's raise volcano spell.
Ooohhhh. I had never noticed Stormrage before. I'm so using that in our upcoming game. For exactly that combo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Endarire
We have a full frontal storm-the-beaches invasion to mount, in which my druid is planning on using some weapons of mass destruction, including a couple of control winds (hurricane plus a tornado) to soften up the enemy. Being able to be up flying about during the storm, casting earthquakes and such, rather than waiting it out with the enemy, is a serious tactical advantage.
Edit: as an 8th level spell, and only minutes per level, it's not as strong a choice as I initially thought.
I feel that Stormrage is one of those spells that can be great to persist if you pick up that functionality. Combine with (extended) Control Weather FTW.
Planar shepherds really aren't a thing I know a ton about, and they're ludicrously dense, so it's pretty unlikely that I'd do a huge thingamajig on them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alphaeus
As Hiro Quester notes, the duration/level renders it pretty bad. This is basically an in combat buff that you're using for this combo with control winds and the lightning bolts, and that's not a lot. It's cool though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Endarire
Bad. It's a 9th level spell that costs 5,000 GP and XP which combines a decent earthquake effect with a decent blasting effect, but you have to maintain concentration to get it to work. It'd be vaguely decent as a wider radius earthquake, except druids are amazing at casting tons of earthquakes without spending resources or maintaining concentration.Quote:
Yeah, it's a reasonable option for that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebel7284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rebel7284
Huh, well. Never thought of that, but I know I could do it and enjoy it.Quote:
Originally Posted by eggynack
As to density, I think part of the key about Planar Shepherds is that out of all of your options, there are only a handful of planes actually worth attuning to (unless you are going for flavor only and deliberately underpowering the class).
On a note related to this and Eggynack's guide in general, between the Skin of Kaleator (know I spelled that wrong) and the Wild Shape amulet and the X of Beast item set {+4 +4 +1, respectively}, you can get your wildshaping up to around 25 HD, which opens up a world of new options. Might be worth including an appendix of options for that.
I actually tended to keep this in mind while monster searching, but there's just not all that much in that HD range worth using. I may well have missed something, especially because I tend to discount these creatures due to their high acquisition cost, but my guess would be that it's just not much of a thing. There're a few major reasons for the seeming absence of usable creatures in this range, I think. High HD creatures are rarer than the low HD alternatives, creatures beyond a certain point become more and more likely to be gargantuan or larger, high HD creatures have a tendency towards epic behemoth status throwing them towards inaccessible extremes, and what creatures are available angle more towards beatsticks rendered uninteresting by the high level.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alphaeus
True point for traditional wild shape. See, when I see this, I'm thinking of it as a Planar Shepherd, which makes the higher HD creatures extremely viable because the focus is less upon the inherent stats and more upon the abilities you get (which can run the gamut of interesting to flat out insane on many of these).Quote:
Originally Posted by eggynack
Outsiders and Elementals (and magical beasts) start becoming much more attractive at higher HD.
But yes, I think at this point I'll start thinking about my own Handbook for Planar Shepherds. I'll toss it up here when it is (EVENTUALLY) done. There are just so many ridiculous hacks if you look for them (for example, Kelvezu demons -- be able to drain 8 Con each round with NO save from your weapons, going up to 14-20 if they fail saves on your poison).
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That aside, I would suggest the feat Natural Ambush for addition to this manual.
Requires +2d6 sneak attack (which can be obtained from either an item or a feat), and then allows your Rogue levels to count as Druid for animal companion and wildshape, and Druid levels to count as Rogue for SA dice.
There is an argument for this that if you can get the +2d6 SA from some alternate source, then you don't even need a dip in Rogue for this to happen, but even a one level dip in exchange for full-on sneak attack dice seems fair.
Druids have so many ways of going undetected, flanking (with which your companion helps), landing hits, and having numerous attacks that these dice go from good to great quite quickly.
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As a humor note, I tried to figure the max damage you could do from melee attacks as a Druid. The best result so far is thus:
Natural Ambush to get SA dice.
Wild shape into Elder Viper Tree.
Cast Invisibility of some kind.
Cast Venomfire on yourself.
All in all you end up with a max damage output per round around 1500 damage, give or take a couple hundred. This means your AVERAGE damage would be in the 750 range. Even if you did half of your average at 375, assuming no fire resistance in the target (or the ability to bypass it) you can kill essentially anything in melee with just a round or two.
Other requests to Eggynack:
-Include a section on templates. I know that templates are generally ill-advised on Druids due to costing LA (or/and EXP to remove), but what if we can get templates for free or cheaply? The Dark and Quasilycanthrope templates are the best I've found for 1 LA and the Saint template is a strong consideration for 2 LA. (These evaluations assume free templates or easy buyoff.)
-Include a section on fighting swarms. Our GM has put us against these repeatedly, and, gracefully, our party Bard's Dragonfire Inspiration has been enough to let us hurt them. Otherwise, we'd be hurtin'.
-I'd still like that Plant Companion section in part because you said you already had it written and, second, even if it's 'meh' overall, I'd still like the option to consider if it's right for my character.
-Update the spells section to include your verdicts on Girallon's Blessing (3), Stormrage (8), and Mass Snowshoes (3).
Where is the Natural Ambush feat from? A few quick Google searches turned up nothing (of relevance).Quote:
Originally Posted by Alphaeus
Oreads speak Dwarven, Sylvan, and Terran. This might matter.
Moon-ivy is an armor listed in Arms&Equipment. It's very expensive, but it's druid-safe, and it has one fun little mod for anyone trying to optimize wild empathy: +3 to Charisma checks, doubled if the target has Scent.
Already got one, and the saint template in particular is listed amongst the exalted stuff. Just haven't seen overmuch cause to make it all that extensive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Endarire
Not sure there's much to talk about here. Spells that hit an area, and wind spells especially, are good. Single target stuff is bad.Quote:
-Include a section on fighting swarms. Our GM has put us against these repeatedly, and, gracefully, our party Bard's Dragonfire Inspiration has been enough to let us hurt them. Otherwise, we'd be hurtin'.
I had a version of it written, but I neglected the fact that it gets standard progression which makes it significantly more viable. Which, in turn, makes analyzing the thing significantly more complex, because when you're teetering on the edge of viability the actual options available become important. It's a thing I'd like to add, in any case, but it needs some more research.Quote:
-I'd still like that Plant Companion section in part because you said you already had it written and, second, even if it's 'meh' overall, I'd still like the option to consider if it's right for my character.
Still pretty down on stormrage and medium on blessing, but snowshoes is a pretty easy add I suppose.Quote:
-Update the spells section to include your verdicts on Girallon's Blessing (3), Stormrage (8), and Mass Snowshoes (3).
Added the former two to the speak language entry.Quote:
Originally Posted by Endarire
Yeah, there's quite a bit of armor stuff that's plausible. Not entirely sure it's necessary to optimize overmuch, given the nature of wild shape and the viability of alternate options, but the stuff available is pretty interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimers
It might be worth noting that Frostburn's snow walk is one spell level lower (2nd level) than mass snowshoes, for basically the same effect (one ally/level), +10 to movement across snow. Plus its harder to track you through snow. The only downside is that it's 10 min/level, not hours/level.Quote:
Originally Posted by eggynack
Combined with Snowsight (cast on each member of the party with a metamagic rod of chain spell if possible), it's great way to make a Blizzard something that only hampers your enemies, but you and your friends can see through and skate over.
The thing that makes snowshoes good is that its speed bonus, going by its wording, applies universally, not only when you're on snow or ice. And, because it's a bonus to speed, instead of a bonus to land speed, it works on all movement modes. That it also happens to have nifty applications when you're trudging through the snow is nice, but not really essential to its core functioning.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiro Quester
Being also able to skate over non-snowy land is debatable, but I could see some DMs allowing that.Quote:
Originally Posted by eggynack
But Snowshoes that put an icy blue glow on your feet and lift you above the snow, improving your swim speed or flight speed is an interpretation I'd have a hard time running by my DM.
It's weird, I'll admit, but it's pretty unambiguously what the text says.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hiro Quester
If I decide to play a Druid without Natural Spell (shooting myself in the foot, I know), what would be a good lv 6 feat?
I was thinking about taking Extra Wild Shape, since I'll probably be swapping to and from Wild Shape more often than the average Druid
Leadership (Bard), Rashemi Elemental Summoning
Introducing Hi Welcome or shoving it to beatsticks at every level. That may help.
Both of these feats are banned. Rashemi cuz it's Forgotten specific, and Leadership cuz... well... it's LeadershipQuote:
Originally Posted by Endarire
Also, I've already taken all recommended Animal Companion feats
I like Sculpt Spell or Energy Substitution, but both of those requires another Metamagic feat first (Sudden Extend is usually my go-to for those). Mobile Spellcasting (Complete Adventurer) can be useful, either to move around the battlefield or to cast two swift-action spells on your turn. Draconic Aura (Dragon Magic) might be worth a look if Dragon Shaman auras are available. Ancestral Relic (BoED) is usually a solid pick. Otherwise... Improved Initiative if you can't find anything else.Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyfuel
I've seen it argued that a solid number of aberration forms can cast spells without natural spell, specifically the ones that have hands. If you get one that has hands and speech, then you don't even need to bypass that particular limitation. Then you just need to make your component pouch accessible by some means, which isn't that difficult. So, aberration wild shape is possibly still viable without natural spell.
Dragon Wildshape is probably also spell-compatible.
What say you to Complete Arcane 156's Elemental Monoliths and the L9 Cleric/Druid/Wizard spell that summons them?
I've seen the spell mentioned a decent amount, which may be justification in and of itself for inclusion, but I really don't understand the hype on this one. If we're on standard face punching, which is more or less all the earth and fire versions can do, then it seems kinda do nothing. We're dealing like 43 to 86 damage a turn (46 to 92 on fire monolith, but with lower to-hit odds), dependent on whether there's a full attack and on whether they can hit. They're solid numbers, but quite a bit less so when you have to maintain concentration to keep up that damage figure. If you're not just damaging, then you're using whirlwind or vortex+water mastery. In the former case, I dunno why I'm not casting control winds for a massive tornado, and in the latter, it's a decent effect but it seems rather situational and replaceable. Is there really no other way to screw with underwater creatures or ships? If I really want to prepare a 9th level summoning spell that's water specific for the most part, should I not simply cast doom of the seas? It just feels like there's a lot working against this one, particularly the spell level, concentration requirement, the fact that you're actually preparing a summoning spell instead of going spontaneous, and that the utility seems broadly replaceable, if not replaceable perfectly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Endarire