The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

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Image credit: Wayne Reynolds, ©Paizo Publishing

Designer's Notes:

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This class gives us a look at what the Warblade might have been had it officially been the Fighter fix. As such, it should not be used in conjunction with any material straight from Tome of Battle. Part of the reason I use the same terminology though is so, for people that want to playtest this, they can port any maneuvers/stances over to my mechanics that I haven't gotten to yet without much fuss. A good rule of thumb should be, "if this Fighter is at the table, no content from Tome of Battle should be used by the players, except by DM approval on a case-by-case basis."

What if we could unite the fans under the Warblade with a few tweaks? What if, with a new but similar design, we could build a better Warblade? But we won't call it the Warblade. We'll just call it what it is. It's the Unofficial Official Fighter fix, and it embraces the path of the Warblade, but marches to the beat of its own drum. Eventually, the design goes in a different direction entirely. Can we create a class that uses the best concepts of Tome of Battle's design and yet retains what we all love about the Fighter, that impossible dream of satisfying customization coupled with ease of play? I think we can.

First we need to tweak the fluff of the class and its abilities and then we tackle the presentation. Ditch the eastern mythology and the blade magic stuff and return to the more grounded and gritty roots of the soldier of fortune. Replace maneuvers and stances with a set of mechanics that offers a similar range of raw power but with a presentation that doesn't make people think, "ew, you got spells in my Fighter." Finally, give the class a wider, more readily acceptable range in power levels. Making it capable of playing Tier 4 to Tier 2 would go a long way. Making it capable of replicating a wider variety of character archetypes (ranged jumps out, and screams, in particular) would take it another step forward.

Alignment: Any
Hit Dice: d10
Class Skills: The fighter’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (Architecture and Engineering) (Int), Knowledge (Geography) (Int), Knowledge (History) (Int), Listen (Wis), Martial Lore (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Search (Int), Spot (Wis), and Swim (Str).
Skill Points per Level: 6 + Int modifier.

Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
Arts Known

1st +1 +2 +0 +0 Arts of War, Bonus Feats
4

2nd +2 +3 +0 +0 Uncanny Dodge
5

3rd +3 +3 +1 +1
6

4th +4 +4 +1 +1 Bonus Feat
7

5th +5 +4 +1 +1
8

6th +6/+1 +5 +2 +2 Improved Uncanny Dodge
9

7th +7/+2 +5 +2 +2
10

8th +8/+3 +6 +2 +2 Bonus Feat
11

9th +9/+4 +6 +3 +3
12

10th +10/+5 +7 +3 +3 Combat Cunning
12

11th +11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +3
13

12th +12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +4 Bonus Feat
14

13th +13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +4
15

14th +14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +4 Unimpeachable Skill
15

15th +15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +5
16

16th +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +5 Bonus Feat
17

17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +5
18

18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +6 Stance Mastery
18

19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +6
19

20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +6 Lord of War, Bonus Feat
20

All of the following are class features for the fighter:

Weapon and Armor Proficiency
A fighter is proficient with all simple and martial weapons as well as with light, medium, and heavy armors, and with shields (including Tower Shields).

Designer's Notes:

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Alternatively, if you want more of a drastic change to the basics, use these proficiency rules instead: "A fighter is proficient with the basic weapons group and his choice of four others. He is proficient with all light armors, Hide Armor, Scale Mail, and with shields (but not Tower Shields). By giving up one of these weapon groups, he may choose Weapon Group (Exotic Weapons) to gain proficiency in the exotic weapons of his other three groups, if he likes. The fighter must make all such choices at 1st level. Additionally, by spending 12 hours practicing with an armor, a shield, or a weapon that he is not proficient with a fighter gains proficiency with that item. This practice need not be taken consecutively."

This sort of change would be one that would accompany sweeping changes to how weapons and armor work, specifically, large scale improvements to medium and heavy armor, as well as encumbrance rules that subsume the role of ACP and speed reduction (like they almost already do). It also restricts the 1st level Fighter to equipment that he can afford. Why would he be proficient in the use of something like Full Plate that he can't possibly own?

Arts of War
As a fighter gains levels he learns maneuvers, stances, and utility powers that vary from fighter to fighter based on individual training. At 1st level, a fighter starts knowing three maneuvers, a single stance, and no utilities and he learns new "Arts" as shown in the table given above. With 12 hours of practice, a fighter may choose to learn a new Art in place of an old one, effectively losing the old Art to gain the new one. This practice need not be taken consecutively. For descriptions of individual maneuvers, stances, and utility powers, see the next post.

Maneuvers and utility powers are specific, one-shot effects. When a fighter uses one of these he is considered to have "initiated" it. Maneuvers, as well as utility powers, cost the fighter 1 Stamina Point to initiate (see below). Maneuvers may only be used in combat encounters, while utilities may be used at any time.

Stances, on the other hand, are more particular postures or methods of movement, and they grant a fighter passive benefits. A fighter may know multiple stances but may only "enter" and remain "in" a single stance at a time (though see Stance Mastery, 18th level). While a fighter remains in a stance he enjoys its benefits indefinitely. A fighter may enter any stance he knows, or change from one stance to another, as a swift action. He may "exit" any stance he is currently in as a free action (without entering another). Most stances cost no SP to use, but see below.

A fighter starts each day with a number of Stamina Points, or SP, equal to 1 + his Constitution modifier (minimum 1). He may spend one of these points as a free action (even when it isn't his turn) to initiate a maneuver or utility he knows, or to reroll an attack roll. With a short rest (5 minutes or longer) he recovers all spent SP. Some especially powerful maneuvers, stances, and utilities, labelled with the Taxing keyword, can cost extra Stamina Points. Each time a Taxing maneuver or utility has been used since his last short rest, beyond the first, doubles its SP cost (until he recovers his SP again). A Taxing stance on the other hand costs 1 SP to enter and 1 SP for every 5 rounds the fighter remains in it.

At 5th level, and every fourth level thereafter, a fighter gains 1 additional SP per day. These extra SP are recovered just like the rest of his SP, after a short rest.

Designer's Notes:

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Fear not, ye faithful! For now all I have up in the Arts section are a scant few maneuvers/utilities/stances that are kind of hard to qualify for, but I'll be working to rectify that soon. Feel free to test the mechanics of this class for yourself, adding any existing ToB maneuvers/stances to the Arts section as appropriate or using homebrew disciplines to flesh things out. Some easy guidelines to follow would be that maneuvers usually have feat prerequisites and the lower-level the maneuver the more common the feat prereqs (1st level maneuvers have no prereqs, 2nd level maneuvers usually shouldn't unless they are more powerful than normal); utilities always have skill prereqs based on level; while the stances always have feat and skill prereqs. Got it?

Bonus Feats
A fighter gains a bonus feat at 1st level drawn from the list of Fighter Bonus Feats. He gains additional bonus feats from that list at 4th level and every four levels thereafter. Furthermore, with 12 hours of practice a fighter may gain a new Fighter Bonus Feat in place of an old one. In effect the fighter loses an old feat to gain a new one after practicing for 12 hours. This practice need not be taken consecutively.

Additionally, with only 1 hour of practice with a weapon, the fighter may change the designated weapon for any feat (or feats) he possesses that applies only to a single weapon (such as Weapon Focus) replacing one weapon for another in both the prerequisites and the feat's description. He must have in-hand the weapon to be designated during his practice and he must be proficient with it to make this change.

A Fighter can adjust any number of feats with a single practice in this way, but he doesn't have to adjust them all in the same way. He cannot change the designated weapons in such a way that he no longer meets the prerequisites for another feat he possesses. Feats adjusted in this way remain so designated for as long as he likes. He may re-adjust to a previously designated weapon as a swift action within 1 day per Fighter level of adjusting from that weapon, otherwise he must spend another hour in practice to adjust his feats.

Starting at 3rd level, for the purposes of qualifying for Fighter Bonus Feats the fighter's ability scores are each treated as 1 point higher. At every fourth level beyond 3rd, this number increases by 1.

Designer's Notes:

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Maybe you want something a little more complex, organic, and robust. If so, here are some rules that allow the fighter to learn lots of new feats as he plays:

As a fighter gains levels he gains combat feats and adds them to his repertoire in a manner similar to the way a Wizard might add spells to a spellbook. At 1st level, he begins play with the knowledge of just one Fighter Bonus Feat, which is automatically added to his repertoire. At fourth level and every four levels thereafter, the Fighter gains a new Fighter Bonus Feat and automatically adds it to his repertoire. In order to add a feat to his repertoire, a fighter must meet all of that feat's prerequisites.

But, a fighter may also add feats to his repertoire through practice and/or observation with a successful Martial Lore check (see table below for DC). Anytime a creature within 30ft of the fighter actively uses the benefit of a Fighter Bonus Feat it knows that the fighter doesn't know, the fighter should be given an opportunity to identify that feat with a Martial Lore check. After identifying a feat in this way, the fighter must spend a short rest in order to add it to his repertoire. He must do so before he takes his next long rest (8 hours or more) and no more than 24 hours after he has identified it. At the end of his short rest, the fighter gains all feats he had identified in this way.

If the fighter is able to hire someone to teach him a feat (Hireling level × the Martial Lore DC gp per day), the DC to learn it is reduced by 10. Learning a feat in this way is easier, but takes longer, requiring one day (8 hours per day) of practice per 5 points of the feat's Martial Lore DC. At the end of this period, the fighter makes a Martial Lore check against the reduced DC. If this check is successful, the fighter adds the feat to his repertoire. If not, he may pay his tutor for additional training.

A fighter's repertoire may never exceed four Fighter Bonus Feats per fighter level, and a fighter may never learn more Fighter Bonus Feats at any given level in this way than his Constitution modifier (to a minimum of 1). A fighter gains all feats in his repertoire that he qualifies for as bonus feats

Martial Lore and Learning Feats
{table=head]DC|Situation

20|
Add a feat to your Repertoire.

+1|
Per point of BAB in the feat's prerequisites.

+1|
Per point of Fighter Level requirements in the feat's prerequisites.

+2|
Per prerequisite feat.

-10|
Learn with hireling.
[/table]

When using these rules a good assumption to make would be that he adds one Fighter feat per level to his repertoire in addition to any bonus feats he would gain through his class levels.

Feats from the Tome of Battle, specifically Martial Study and Martial Stance, should not be allowed to be added to the fighter's repertoire, at least not without serious DM consideration and explicit approval.

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 2nd level, a fighter retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. If a fighter already has uncanny dodge from a different class, he automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 6th level and higher, a fighter can no longer be flanked. This defense denies a creature the ability to sneak attack the fighter by flanking him, unless the attacker has at least four more HD or character levels than the fighter has character levels. If a character already has uncanny dodge from a second class, the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead, and the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum level a rogue must be to flank the character.

Combat Cunning (Ex): Starting at 10th level, a Fighter is never caught flat-footed nor surprised and, thus, always gets an action during a surprise round. Furthermore, he may spend 1 SP to reroll any Listen, Spot, or Initiative check.

Unimpeachable Skill (Ex): Starting at 14th level, a Fighter no longer automatically fails his attack rolls or saving throws on a roll of 1; though, he might still fail the attack or save if his result fails to equal or beat the DC. Likewise, whenever another creature attacks the fighter or makes a saving throw against an attack made by the fighter, that attack or save is not automatically a success on a roll of 20; though, the creature might still succeed if its result exceeds the fighter's AC or the save's DC.

Stance Mastery (Ex): At 18th level and higher, a fighter may have two stances active simultaneously. Whenever the fighter uses a swift action to enter or change his stance, he may enter two stances simultaneously, enter a second stance, or change one or both stances he is currently in.

Lord of War (Ex): At 20th level, a fighter's warrior prowess is beyond all mortal and immortal creatures. Creatures may not apply the benefits of any Fighter Bonus Feats they share with the fighter when making attacks against the fighter or when being attacked by the fighter.

2013-03-23, 09:23 PM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Arts of War

Saving throw DCs of all Arts of War are equal to 10 + ½ the fighter's level + the key ability modifier given in the maneuver, stance, or utility's description (see the Key Ability entry).

Designer's Notes:

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The mechanics for this are currently in flux. I will be editing these thoroughly for the forseeable future, especially until I come up with satisfactory prerequisite guidelines for low level maneuvers. I want fighter feats to be involved, but that makes things frustrating for low level players.

For the moment, let's break the disciplines down by a core, uniting fighter feat. Desert Wind = Dodge; Devoted Spirit = Shield Specialization or Constant Guardian?; Diamond Mind = Combat Expertise; Iron Heart = Weapon Focus; Setting Sun = Improved Unarmed Strike?; Shadow Hand = Weapon Finesse?; Stone Dragon = Power Attack; Tiger Claw = TWF; and White Raven = [Blank]. I'll be following that template such that all maneuvers from those disciplines require those feats (except maybe 1st level ones).

Maneuvers
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Avalanche of Blades (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Combat Reflexes, Fighter level 15
Initiation Action: Full-Round
Take a full attack action. For each attack in that action that hits you may make an additional attack at the same attack bonus. You do not get additional attacks if any of these hits. None of your attacks need to be made against the same creature.

Bladetrap (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Fighter level 9
Initiation Action: Immediate
Initiate this maneuver when a creature attacks you to make an Opportunity Attack against that creature that resolves before the creature's attack. Your Opportunity Attack must be a Sunder attack against the attacking creature's weapon or natural weapon, but it gains a +5 bonus to the attack roll and deals 10d6 extra damage. If your Opportunity Attack destroys the attacking creature's weapon (or kills the attacking creature), then that creature's attack automatically fails.

Brilliant Flourish (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Dexterity or Intelligence
You flourish your weapon around you harmlessly, yet skillfully, catching the light and rendering each creature within 15ft of you dazzled for 1 minute unless it succeeds on a Fortitude save. Sightless creatures, as well as creatures already dazzled, are not affected by this maneuver. This maneuver may only be used within an area of bright light and has no effect on creatures within shadow illumination or darkness.

Counterattack (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Immediate
Initiate this maneuver when a creature attacks you to make an Opportunity Attack against that creature at the same time as the creature's attack.

Daunting Sneer (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Constant Guardian, Fighter level 9
Initiation Action: Immediate
Key Ability: Constitution or Charisma
Initiate this maneuver after a foe within Medium range (100ft + 10ft/fighter level) successfully hits you with an attack. Your opponent must then make a Will save. If this save fails, then the opponent is Frightened for 1 round and Shaken for 1 minute. If this save succeeds, then the opponent is merely Shaken for 1 round.

Empowered Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Constant Guardian, Shield Specialization, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. If that attack hits it deals double damage. Unless the target of your attack is a creature with at least one portion of its alignment opposed to at least one portion of your alignment (for example Chaos is opposed to Law), you are Fatigued after making the attack until you can get 5 or more minutes of rest.

Find the Gap (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a melee or ranged attack with a weapon. If melee, make a touch attack instead of a normal attack. If ranged, make a ranged touch attack instead of a normal attack. If the attack hits, you deal damage as if you had hit with a normal attack with that weapon.

Foehammer (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Shield Specialization, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. If it hits a creature with at least one portion of its alignment opposed to at least one portion of your alignment (for example Chaos is opposed to Law), then it deals 2d6 additional damage.

Full Moon Slash (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Whirlwind Attack, Fighter level 13
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Intelligence
Make a single melee attack roll and use the results to attack any number of creatures in a sphere-shaped area with a radius equal to your reach. For the purposes of this maneuver your reach is treated as though you were a size category larger or +5ft, whichever would grant you greater reach. Your attack bypasses all non-magical barriers to strike through walls and even the earth itself. Any creature struck by this attack suffers 8d8 extra damage and is Confused for 1d8 rounds if it fails a Will save.

Greater Foehammer (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Constant Guardian, Shield Specialization, Fighter level 11
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. If it hits a creature with at least one portion of its alignment opposed to at least one portion of your alignment (for example Chaos is opposed to Law), then it deals 8d6 additional damage and overcomes any Damage Reduction or Regeneration the creature may have.

Greater Insightful Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Fighter level 11
Initiation Action: Standard
This maneuver functions exactly as Insightful Strike except that you use double the result of your Autohypnosis check in place of your weapon damage roll.

Greater Revitalizing Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Constant Guardian, Shield Specialization, Fighter level 11
Initiation Action: Standard
This maneuver function exactly as Revitalizing Strike except that the extra damage is d8s, you regain hit points equal to the total damage dealt, and for every 10 hit points you regain in this way you also recover 1d3 points of ability score damage (or drain) and one of the following conditions: Blinded, Confused, Deafened, Fascinated, Fatigued, Shaken, Sickened, Staggered, or Stunned. You may initiate this maneuver and make the associated weapon attack even if you would ordinarily be unable to take a standard action.

Hamstring (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Dexterity or Wisdom
Make a weapon attack. If your attack hits and the struck creature fails a Reflex save, then that creature's speed is permanently reduced by ½ (rounded down). The creature's speed is returned to normal if it regains the hit points lost by your attack or if it receives a successful Heal check (DC equal to this maneuver's save DC). Such a Heal check requires 1d4 × 10 minutes of work. Multiple applications of this maneuver stack and increase the DC of the Heal check by 2 each time.

Hold the Line (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Fighter level 5
Initiation Action: Immediate
Initiate this maneuver when a creature enters your threatened area to make an Opportunity Attack against that creature. If that creature is using the Charge action against you, your Opportunity Attack deals double damage and occurs before the enemy's Charge attack.

Hurricane Slash (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Whirlwind Attack, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Full-Round
Key Ability: Strength or Constitution
Move up to your speed and make a melee attack against any creatures you move adjacent to during that movement. You do not provoke attacks of opportunity from creatures you attack in this way. You may avoid other attacks of opportunity if you provoke any with an appropriate Tumble check. Any foe you strike takes 2d6 extra damage and is knocked prone if it fails a Fortitude save.

Improved Iaido Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Quick Draw, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Standard (see text)
Key Ability: Dexterity or Wisdom
This maneuver functions exactly like Lesser Iaido Strike except that it deals 4d6 extra damage and, if the target failed its Reflex save, also inflicts 1d4 Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution damage (your choice) on a successful hit.

Insightful Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Fighter level 5
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. If it hits, in place of the normal damage roll, make an Concentration check and use the result of that check as the total damage your attack deals. Normal modifiers to your damage roll do not apply (such as your Strength modifier or Inspire Courage), but modifiers to your Concentration check do (such as your Constitution modifier or special items). If your weapon has special properties that add damage to your attacks (such as Flaming or Holy), those apply normally.

Iron Perfection (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, Fighter 9
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. That attack automatically hits and deals maximum damage. Roll an attack roll to determine if the attack is a critical hit (you still hit if this attack roll is a natural 1).

Lesser Bloodletting Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Dexterity or Wisdom
Make a melee attack. If it hits, the struck creature suffers 2 points of Constitution damage in addition to normal damage. A successful Fortitude save negates the Constitution damage, but not the normal damage.

Lesser Iaido Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard (see text)
Key Ability: Dexterity or Wisdom
Draw a weapon and immediately make an attack with it. The target of that attack must succeed on a Reflex save or be flat-footed against this attack. If the save fails, then your attack deals 1d6 extra damage. If it succeeds, then your attack roll suffers a -2 penalty. This maneuver may be used in place of an attack of opportunity if you are able to draw your weapon as a free action.

Mail of Sinews and Bone (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Constant Guardian, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Swift
You gain Damage Reduction 2/-- per four fighter levels (minimum 2/--) until the start of your next turn.

Matador Dodge (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Immediate
Gain a +4 bonus to AC against a charge attack. If the charging creature misses you, then it stumbles past you in a direction of your choice, moving up to 10ft away.

Meteoric Charge (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Full-Round
Key Ability: Strength or Constitution
Make a Charge attack. If your attack hits it deals 1d6 extra damage per fighter level (max 10d6) and the struck creature and all creatures adjacent to it (excluding you) are Blown Away if they fail a Fortitude save.

Moment of Alacrity (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Improved Initiative, Fighter level 11
Initiation Action: Swift (see text)
When you initiate this maneuver your place in the initiative order improves by 20, for the rest of the encounter, and the position you take your turn in the round changes accordingly. You may instead initiate this maneuver as you roll initiative at the start of combat, but before you have acted. If you do, you gain a +20 bonus to your Initiative check and lose your first turn's swift action.

Perfect Iaido Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Deft Strike, Quick Draw, Fighter level 13
Initiation Action: Standard (see text)
Key Ability: Dexterity or Wisdom
This maneuver functions like Lesser Iaido Strike except that if a living target fails its Reflex save, it is slain outright on a successful hit. Otherwise, a successful hit deals 8d6 extra damage and 1d4 Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution damage (even if your target's save is a success).

Revitalizing Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Shield Specialization, Fighter level 5
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. It if hits it deals 1d6 extra damage per four fighter levels and you regain hit points equal to ½ the total damage dealt.

Sheltering Shield (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Shield Specialization, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Immediate
Initiate this maneuver whenever you or an ally within your melee reach are the target of a ranged attack. If you are carrying a shield, then the ranged attack is automatically blocked so that you take no damage from it. This maneuver blocks even unusually massive ranged weapons (such as a Giant's thrown rock) and ranged spell attacks.

Shield Block (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Immediate
Initiate this maneuver when an ally within your melee reach is the target of an attack, but before you know the result of that attack. That ally gains a bonus to AC against that attack equal to your Shield Bonus to AC even if that ally already carries a shield.

Steel Wind (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard
Make up to two weapon attacks. The targets of your attacks must either both be adjacent to you or both be adjacent to each other.

Steely Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack with a +4 bonus. Whether or not your attack hits, all opponents with line of sight to you gain a +4 bonus to attack rolls made against you for 1 round.

Stone Vise (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a melee attack. If it hits, the struck creature suffers 1d6 extra damage and you may attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. No initial touch attack is required.

Stunning Blow (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Fighter level 5
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Wisdom
Make a weapon attack. If the attack hits it deals 2d6 extra damage and the struck creature is Stunned for 1 round unless it succeeds on a Fortitude save. A creature whose save succeeds is still Staggered for 1 round.

Tiring Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Wisdom
Make a weapon attack. If it hits, the struck creature becomes Fatigued unless it succeeds on a Fortitude save. This maneuver has no effect on a creature that is already fatigued.

Vanguard Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. If it hits, all allies with line of sight to the struck creature gain a +4 bonus to attack rolls against it for 1 round.

Void Parry (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Combat Expertise, Weapon Focus, Fighter level 13
Initiation Action: Immediate
When you are the target, or within the area, of any effect (including spells, spell-like abilities, or supernatural abilities), make an attack roll with a melee weapon in place of any associated saving throw and use the result of that roll to determine the save's success. Add your shield bonus (if any) to this attack roll. You may even use this maneuver against an effect that does not normally offer a saving throw at a DC equal to 20 + ½ CR of the encounter in which the effect is taking place. You can't use this maneuver if you are flat-footed.

Wall of Blades (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Immediate
When an enemy attacks you it must beat the result of your opposed attack roll in order to hit you instead of your AC. Your opposed attack roll must be made with a melee weapon. The attacker hits you even if the result of your opposed attack roll is lower than your AC. You can't use this maneuver against a spell, or if you are denied your Dexterity bonus to AC against the attacker.

Wolf Fang Strike (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Standard
Make one melee attack with up to two weapons you're holding. Any penalties you suffer for fighting with two or more weapons are reduced by -2. Add your full Strength modifier to damage with any off-hand weapons you attack with. These attacks need not be made against the same creature.

Wounding Blow (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, Fighter level 11
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Wisdom
Make a weapon attack. If the attack hits it deals 10d6 extra damage and the struck creature must make a Fortitude save. If this save fails, then for 1 minute the creature suffers a -6 penalty to Strength and is Sickened. Each additional application of this maneuver before the time is up forces the creature, if hit, to make a new Fortitude save. For each save that fails, the Strength penalty is increased by 1d4 and the creature is Nauseated for 1 round. Each additional application, on a failed Fortitude save, resets the duration.

Zephyr Dance (Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Immediate
You may initiate this maneuver after you know the result of an opponent's attack roll, or after you know the result of a Reflex save of your own, to gain either a +3 dodge bonus to AC against an attack or a +3 dodge bonus to a Reflex save you make to avoid damage. Compare either your new AC against the opponent's attack roll, or your new saving throw result against the effect's save DC to determine the outcome. Any bonuses gained through this maneuver apply only against a single attack or effect. You may use this maneuver even if you are flat-footed.

Taxing Maneuvers
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Air Slash (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Power Attack
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Constitution
Make a melee attack as if your reach were increased by 10ft. Your reach for this attack increases by 5ft per two fighter levels. This attack deals 1d8 extra damage per four fighter levels. If you have at least 4 fighter levels, a creature struck by this attack is Blown Away unless it succeeds on a Fortitude save.

Backbreaker (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Fighter level 5
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Wisdom
Make a melee attack against a humanoid creature. If the attack hits and the target fails a Fortitude save it is Paralyzed for 1 round/level. Regardless, the attack deals 4d6 extra damage.

Dirt Nap (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Swift
Key Ability: Strength or Intelligence
Initiate this maneuver after successfully tripping or knocking an enemy prone to give them a final shove. The falling enemy slams into the ground and falls unconscious for 1d6×5 minutes unless it succeeds on a Fort save. Normal noise does not awaken the unconscious creature, but the creature will wake if another creature spends a standard action to use Aid Another on it or if it is dealt lethal damage.

If a creature with fewer HD or character levels than the fighter successfully saves against this maneuver it is still Staggered for 1 round. If a creature with more HD or character levels than the fighter fails its saving throw against this maneuver if is Staggered for 1 round and Fatigued for 1d6×5 minutes rather than unconscious. This maneuver has no effect on creatures that have at least 4 more HD or character levels than the fighter.

Grisly Blow (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Flay, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Wisdom
Make an attack against the target. If the attack hits, the target and all enemies able to see the target must make Fort saves. If the target fails it is nauseated for 1 round/level. If any other creature fails it is sickened for 1 round/level.

Lightning Charge (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Mobility, Fighter level 5
Initiation Action: Full-Round
Key Ability: Dexterity or Constitution
Using the Run action, move up to 4 times your speed in a straight line. For this maneuver you may move through occupied squares, even those occupied by enemies, and you do not provoke attacks of opportunity. Make a single melee attack roll with a +2 bonus. You may use the result of that attack roll to attack any creature whose space you moved through during your Run action. Any attacks that hit deal 1d6 extra damage per fighter level (max 10d6). You suffer a -2 penalty to your AC until the start of your next turn. Each struck creature is entitled to a Reflex save to halve all damage dealt to it by your attack.

Pankratosword (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, Greater Weapon Focus, Greater Weapon Specialization, Melee Weapon Mastery (Slashing), Weapon Supremacy
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Constitution or Charisma
Make a sunder attack with a melee slashing weapon against the Atomos. If this attack is successful and the Atomos is destroyed, a 10 mile radius area centered on you (and including you) suffers a Disintegrate effect, as the spell, except that the damage is 2d10 per fighter level and the damage on a successful save is 5d10.

Witchhammer (Taxing Maneuver)
Prerequisites: Mage Slayer, Power Attack, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a weapon attack. If the attack hits, for each spell effect currently effecting the struck creature the controller of that spell effect must make a Concentration check to maintain the effect as if to cast the spell defensively. If the check fails to beat a DC of 10+damage dealt, the effect is dispelled as if by Dispel Magic.

Stances

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Absolute Steel Stance (Stance)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Balance 5 ranks
You gain a competence bonus to opportunity attack and damage rolls and to AC against opportunity attacks equal to +1 per four fighter levels (minimum +1). You may make a number of attacks of opportunity per round equal to ½ your fighter level (minimum 1).

Close-Quarters Archery (Stance)
Prerequisites: Point Blank Shot, Spot 1 rank
You do not provokes attacks of opportunity for making ranged attacks against enemies within your weapon's first range increment. Furthermore, whenever an enemy performs an action within the first range increment of a ranged weapon you wield that would normally provoke an attack of opportunity you may make a ranged attack of opportunity against that creature. The exception to this is movement, unless that movement would take the provoking creature outside your weapon's first range increment, in which case you are entitled to a ranged attack of opportunity that resolves before the creature moves beyond that increment.

Combat Superiority (Stance)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Combat Focus^PHB2, Combat Reflexes, Fighter level 5
You may make a full attack as a standard action or at the end of a charge.

Duelist's Challenge (Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Sense Motive 1 rank
Whenever you use your Dodge feat to designate an opponent you may issue a "duelist's challenge." If you do your AC bonus rises to +2 and you also gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls against that opponent, but you suffer a -2 penalty to AC and attack rolls against all other creatures. These bonuses and penalties last until you designate a new opponent, until the end of the encounter, or until you exit this stance, whichever comes first.

Forge Lore (Stance)
Prerequisites: Improved Initiative, Craft (Armorsmithing) 5 ranks, Craft (Weaponsmithing) 5 ranks, Fighter level 5
While you are in this stance you gain the benefits of the Craft Magic Arms and Armor feat and can produce alchemical or magical items and equipment as a spellcaster with an Effective Caster Level equal to your ranks in any relevant Craft skill (examples given below). This allows you to create items without needing to cast any of the required spells, though you must still take item creation feats to craft items other than weapons or armor.

EXAMPLES

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Craft (Armorsmithing) - Covers armors and shields as well as bracers, gauntlets, greaves, helmets, and other similar items.

Craft (Haberdashery) - Covers all cloth and leather articles of clothing such as boots, cloaks, gloves, pants, and shirts, as well as other related or similar items.

Craft (Metalwork) - Covers metal jewelry such as amulets, bracelets, or rings, and other simple metal tools and goods like spades or manacles and bells or chimes.

Craft (Weaponsmithing) - Covers all weapons, including arrows and bolts, and other related or similar items.

Iron Guard's Glare (Stance)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Intimidate 1 rank
Enemies you threaten suffer a -4 penalty on attack rolls against your allies as long as those enemies can see or hear you.

Leaf on the Wind (Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Mobility, Knowledge (Geography) 5 ranks
You suffer no penalties due to difficult terrain and against any creature that does suffer such penalties you gain a +2 bonus to AC, attack rolls, and all Bull Rush, Disarm, Feint, Grapple, Overrun, and Trip attempts.

Martial Spirit (Stance)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Balance 1 rank
Each time you successfully hit an enemy that is no more than 4 levels lower than you, you regain 2 hit points per four fighter levels (minimum 2).

Mental Focus (Stance)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Concentration 5 ranks
When you enter this stance choose Intelligence, Wisdom, or Charisma. While you remain in this stance you gain an enhancement bonus to the chosen score based on your fighter level; +2 through 6th level, +4 from 7th through 12th, and +6 from 13th level and on.

Physical Conditioning (Stance)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Balance 5 ranks
When you enter this stance choose Strength, Dexterity, or Constitution. While you remain in this stance you gain an enhancement bonus to the chosen score based on your fighter level; +2 through 6th level, +4 from 7th through 12th, and +6 from 13th level and on.

Punishing Stance (Stance)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Balance 1 rank
You suffer a -2 penalty to AC and gain a competence bonus to melee damage rolls equal to +2 per four fighter levels (minimum +2).

Quickness of Mind (Stance)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Concentration 1 rank
You gain a +1 competence bonus to AC, Initiative checks and Reflex saves per four fighter levels (minimum +1).

Rapid Relocation (Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Tumble 5 ranks, Fighter level 5
Whenever an enemy misses you with an attack, or whenever you succeed at a Reflex save, you may move up to your speed as a free action (even if it isn't your turn). You may make any movement-related skill checks as part of that movement as normal.

Roaring Avalanche (Stance)
Prerequisites: Power Attack, Improved Overrun, Balance 5 ranks
You may attempt an Overrun as a free action taken during your move. An opponent that wishes to avoid may only do so if you allow it to. If you do not, your opponent does not get a bonus to its opposed Strength check for being larger than you or for being more stable than normal. If your Strength check fails, your opponent may not attempt to knock you prone. Finally, if your Strength check succeeds, your opponent suffers 1d8 damage + double your Strength modifier.

Shield Wall (Stance)
Prerequisites: Shield Specialization, Knowledge (Architecture and Engineering) 1 rank
You gain Damage Reduction equal to your shield bonus to AC. This DR is overcome by magic weapons if your shield is non-magical, overcome by adamantine weapons if your shield is magical, and overcome by no weapons if your shield is both magic and adamantine.

Slivers of Time (Stance)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Concentration 10 ranks, Escape Artist 5 ranks, Fighter level 9
Whenever a foe provokes an opportunity attack from you, you may, instead, take any move or standard action that you wish. If you do, that action still counts as one of your opportunity attacks for the round.

Stance of Alacrity (Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Mobility, Concentration 5 ranks, Escape Artist 5 ranks, Martial Lore 13 ranks, Fighter level 13
Taking an immediate action does not cause you to lose your next turn's swift action. You gain an additional action each round, either an extra swift action on your turn or an extra immediate action when it isn't your turn. You may take only one of these additional actions each round (in addition to your normal actions).

Staredown (Stance)
Prerequisites: Shield Specialization, Intimidate 3 ranks, Fighter level 5
Key Ability: Strength or Charisma
While in this stance you gain a Gaze attack which never affects your allies. Enemies that fail their Will saves against your Gaze attack are Checked for 1 round.

Wind Stride (Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Tumble 1 rank
You gain a +5ft bonus to your speed. This bonus increases by +5ft for every four fighter levels you possess. During any round in which you move 20ft or more you gain 20% concealment miss chance against ranged attacks.

Taxing Stances

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Blazing Speed (Taxing Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Mobility, Tumble 5 ranks, Fighter level 7
Key Ability: Constitution or Charisma
You gain a +10ft bonus to your speed. This bonus increases by +10ft for every four fighter levels you possess. During any round in which you move 40ft or more, every square you exit is filled with flames which persist for 1 minute. A creature that begins its turn in, or enters one of those squares, is dealt 1d6 fire damage. The fire will catch fire to flammable objects as well as any creature that ends its turn in a burning square if that creature fails a Reflex save.

Enlistment (Taxing Stance)
Prerequisites: Improved Initiative, Gather Information 4 ranks
One round after you enter this stance a 1st level NPC Warrior or Expert enters the encounter through the nearest possible entrance (if this is one), of any LA 0 race, with any feats and skills of your choice (that it could normally qualify for or are normally on its skill list), and with the following ability scores placed as you like - 17 16 14 13 10 8 (before adjustments).

As long as you remain in this stance, your recruit will serve you, but if the recruit becomes subject to any Fear effect, loses more than half of its hp, or if you exit this stance, the recruit will flee and return home. If the recruit dies or flees you immediately exit this stance and cannot enter it again for 1d4 hours.

This stance may not be used while you are in a location that the recruit couldn't enter or exit, and the DM may rule that it can't be used while you are in a location where you couldn't normally hire the recruit with money. For every rank of Gather Information you have above 4 you may enlist an NPC of a higher level (Max level = your fighter level -2). NPCs above 1st level may have higher level adjustment instead of additional levels, but no templates. Any NPCs enlisted using this stance come equipped as NPCs of their level and will not part with their equipment.

If you are at least 5th level, you may instead enlist 1d3 NPCs whose max level = your fighter level -4 when you enter this stance. If you are at least 9th level, you may instead enlist 1d4+1 NPCs whose max level = your fighter level -8 when you enter this stance.

Savage Sirocco (Taxing Stance)
Prerequisites: Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Escape Artist 7 ranks, Tumble 7 ranks, Fighter level 15
You gain a +15ft bonus to your speed. This bonus increases by +15ft for every four fighter levels you possess. During any round in which you move 60ft or more, any further movement you make in the round may be flight if you wish, with perfect maneuverability, and you may move through squares occupied by creatures (even enemies) without provoking attacks of opportunity. In the path of your movement you create Severe Wind that lasts for 1 round, and if your movement encloses any circular radius area, you create a Tornado of equal radius, that moves according to your will and lasts for 1 round (wind effects found here).

Perfection of Form (Taxing Stance)
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise, Weapon Focus, Balance 10 ranks, Concentration 10 ranks
While you remain in this stance you gain an enhancement bonus to all ability scores based on your fighter level; +2 from 7th through 10th level, +4 from 11th through 14th, and +6 from 15th level and on.

Weapon Tempering (Taxing Stance)
Prerequisites: Weapon Focus, Craft (Weaponsmithing) 1 rank
Any weapon you wield gains an enhancement bonus to attack and damage rolls equal to +1 per four of your fighter levels (minimum +1). As long as you have at least 4 ranks in Craft (Weaponsmithing), weapons you wield are considered magic while you are in this stance.

Utilities

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Action Before Thought (Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 3 ranks
Initiation Action: Immediate
Make a Concentration check instead of a Reflex save and use the result of that check to determine the save's success.

After-Image Illusion (Utility)
Prerequisites: Balance 12 ranks, Concentration 12 ranks, Escape Artist 3 ranks, Tumble 3 ranks, Fighter level 13
Initiation Action: Immediate
Key Ability: Dexterity or Intelligence
Take a move action as an immediate action. During this action you may move up to double your speed. If you move, until the start of your next turn you are Invisible as the spell and appear to occupy the the space that you moved from before initiating this utility. This is an Illusion (Figment) effect. A successful Will save negates this illusion.

Analyze Equipment (Utility)
Prerequisites: Martial Lore 1 rank
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a Martial Lore check to determine the magical properties of a single armor, shield, or weapon as if through the Identify spell. The DC of this check is 10 + the highest level spell used to create the item + caster level required to create the item.

Battle Lore (Utility)
Prerequisites: Martial Lore 5 ranks
Initiation Action: Free
Choose a target creature within your line of sight (you don't have to be able to see it but you do have to know it's there). You learn any resistances or vulnerabilities that creature has against weapons possessed by members of your party.

Dust Up (Utility)
Prerequisites: Knowledge (Geography) 3 ranks, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Move
Key Ability: Dexterity or Intelligence
You kick up a small cloud of dust coating everyone and everything in an adjacent 5ft square and vaguely outlining invisible things in it. In addition, creatures in that square must succeed on a Reflex save or be blinded for 1 round. By spending a Full Round action a creature may remove the dust from itself or from an object. The DM may rule that this utility cannot be used in certain dustless locations.

Fade into Obscurity (Utility)
Prerequisites: Profession (Spy) 3 ranks, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: None (see text)
Make either a Hide check or a Move Silently check as if the skill were on your class skill list and you had maximum ranks in it.

Hearing the Air (Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 1 rank, Listen 9 ranks, Fighter level 9
Initiation Action: Move
Make a Listen check with a +5 competence bonus. You gain Blindsense effective out to 5ft per 5 points of your check's result until the start of your next turn.

Know Thy Enemy (Utility)
Prerequisites: Gather Information 5 ranks
Initiation Action: 1d4+1 hours or Free (see text)
You may gather intel on enemies you expect to face in advance, learning their special attacks and/or vulnerabilities as if using a Knowledge skill to identify a creature using a Gather Information check instead. This check takes the normal amount of time but during that time you gain insight on a number of creatures up to ½ your fighter level. This insight applies only to quite specific creatures, such as Lord Morpheus's Hellhounds or Tzeenrkhal the Red Dragon, and not in general to all Hellhounds or Red Dragons. Your intel remains good for 1d4+1 days.

When you face a creature in combat that you have identified in this way you may initiate this utility as a free action to gain a +4 insight bonus to any one d20 roll made against that creature during the encounter.

Mind Over Body (Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 1 rank
Initiation Action: Immediate
Make a Concentration check instead of a Fortitude save and use the result of that check to determine the save's success.

Moment of Perfect Mind (Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 5 ranks
Initiation Action: Immediate
Make a Concentration check instead of a Will save and use the result of that check to determine the save's success.

Quick Recovery (Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 5 ranks, Martial Lore 5 ranks, Autohypnosis 1 rank, Escape Artist 1 rank, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Immediate
You may initiate this maneuver even if you would ordinarily be unable to take an immediate action. Remove one of the following conditions: Confused, Cowering, Dazed, Fascinated, Frightened, Panicked, or Shaken.

Quicksilver Motion (Utility)
Prerequisites: Balance 5 ranks, Concentration 5 ranks, Escape Artist 1 rank, Tumble 1 rank, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Swift
Take a move action as a swift action.

Reading the Earth (Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 1 rank, Sense Motive 5 ranks, Fighter level 5
Make a Sense Motive check with a +5 competence bonus. You gain Tremorsense effective out to 5ft per 5 points of your check's result until the start of your next turn.

Sudden Leap (Utility)
Prerequisites: Jump 5 ranks, Tumble 1 rank
Initiation Action: Swift
Make a Jump check as a swift action and move the distance your check result would normally allow. Since this check is made as a swift action, it does not need to be made as part of another move action. You must move in a straight line and your movement provokes attacks of opportunity as normal (though you may attempt a Tumble check along with your movement as well). You cannot move through the spaces of enemies unless you succeed on an appropriate Tumble check.

Trap Scouter (Utility)
Prerequisites: Search 5 ranks
Make a Search check to find traps as if you were a Rogue with the Trapfinding class feature. If you accidentally spring any traps during this search you gain a +1 dodge bonus to AC and to Reflex saves made to avoid those traps per four fighter levels.

Wildspeak (Utility)
Prerequisites: Handle Animal 1 rank
Initiation Action: Full-Round or longer (see text)
Make a Handle Animal check to improve the attitude of an animal just like a Diplomacy check made to improve the attitude of a person. You and the animal must be able to study each other, which means that you must be within 30 feet of one another under normal conditions. You may also use this ability to influence a magical beast with an Intelligence score of 1 or 2, but at a -4 penalty to the check.

Wolf Climbs the Mountain (Utility)
Prerequisites: Climb 7 ranks
Initiation Action Move
You may initiate this maneuver as part of a Climb check in order to treat a creature that is at least two size categories larger than you as a suitable surface for climbing on. If this initial Climb check is successful you move into that creature's space and may continue to climb on that creature in subsequent rounds until you fall off (or are forcibly removed). Hammering a piton into a creature deals 1d4 + Strength modifier damage and is a melee touch attack; however the piton may only be placed if this attack deals at least 1 damage to the creature.

Taxing Utilities

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Expert's Aid (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Swift
Use the Aid Another action as a swift action and without making a check to grant a +2 bonus to an ally's armor class, attack roll, or skill check.

Fighter's Command (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Intimidate 3 ranks, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Strength or Charisma
A creature you threaten must succeed on a Will save to avoid being affected as if by the Command spell. If it succeeds you may make a single melee attack against it. This is a Fear effect that is both Language-Dependent and Mind-Affecting. This utility has no effect if more creatures threaten you than threaten the target, or if the target has at least 4 more HD than the fighter.

Follow Through (Utility)
Prerequisites: Knowledge (The Planes) 1 rank, Spellcraft 1 rank, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Immediate
When a foe within Close range (25ft + 5ft per two levels) uses a teleportation or extradimensional travel effect you are able to follow them through with a little know-how and sheer force of will. Until the end of your next turn if you are able to reach the space where the effect was used you may pursue the target mimicking the effect as if you had used it yourself, traveling to the same exact place. When you emerge, if the square is occupied, you are shunted to the nearest open square within Close range and dealt 1d12 damage per 5ft moved this way. If there is no open square within Close range the effect fails and you find yourself back where you started.

Guts (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Immediate
An ally within 30ft of you that can both see and hear you gains a +2 morale bonus to Fortitude saves for 5 rounds.

Improved Guts (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Survival 3 ranks, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Immediate
An ally within 30ft of you that can both see and hear you gains a +2 morale bonus to Fortitude saves and the Mettle special quality for 5 rounds. During that time, if your Constitution modifier is higher than that ally's, that ally uses your modifier in place of its own when making Fortitude saves.

Improved Warning Shout (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Escape Artist 3 ranks, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Immediate
An ally within 30ft of you that can both see and hear you gains a +2 morale bonus to Reflex saves and the Evasion special quality for 5 rounds. During that time, if your Dexterity modifier is higher than that ally's, that ally uses your modifier in place of its own when making Reflex saves.

Indomitable Indignation (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 5 ranks, Intimidate 9 ranks, Martial Lore 9 ranks, Fighter level 11
Initiation Action: Standard
Key Ability: Constitution or Charisma
You may initiate this maneuver even if you would ordinarily be unable to take a standard action. This utility frees you from enchantments, transmutations, and curses, and can reverse even an instantaneous effect. For each such effect, make a level check (1d20 + your fighter level) against a DC of 11 + caster level of the effect. Success means that you are free of the spell, curse, or effect. Against a cursed magic item, the DC is 10 + the highest level spell used to create the item + caster level required to create the item.

After making these level checks, if you are no longer subject to any harmful spells, curses, or effects you may let loose a booming shout of defiance. If you do, this shout deals creatures within 30ft of you 1d6 sonic damage per two fighter levels, and deafens them if they fail a Fort save.

Minor Timeslice (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 5 ranks, Knowledge (The Planes) 1 rank, Fighter level 3
Initiation Action: Swift
Ready a move action by spending a swift action. Normally that would cost you a standard action. This Readied move action follows all the standard rules for Readied actions.

Perfect Timeslice (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 15 ranks, Knowledge (The Planes) 5 ranks, Fighter level 15
Initiation Action: Swift
This utility functions exactly as Minor Timeslice except that it allows you to Ready a full-round action, something that characters normally cannot do using the Ready special action. Otherwise, this Readied full-round action follows all of the normal rules for Readied actions. You may also use this maneuver to Ready a move action, or a standard action, if you prefer.

Practiced Timeslice (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Concentration 10 ranks, Knowledge (The Planes) 3 ranks, Fighter level 9
Initiation Action: Swift
This utility functions exactly like Least Timeslice, except that you may Ready a move action or a standard action.

Quick Crafting (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: Craft (Any) 7 ranks, Fighter level 7
Initiation Action: Standard
Make a single Craft check at a -10 penalty to make an item representing one week of progress in a single standard action. You gain a competence bonus to this Craft check equal to ½ your fighter level.

Warning Shout (Taxing Utility)
Prerequisites: None
Initiation Action: Immediate
An ally within 30ft of you that can both see and hear you gains a +2 morale bonus to Reflex saves for 5 rounds.

More to come...
2013-03-23, 09:24 PM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Annnnnnd, reserved for even moar Arts of War.
2013-03-23, 09:40 PM
Poppatomus

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

very interesting, and it seems very cool. I think that, perhaps, martial law might be a bit frustrating, given the random element. To modify an idea I once suggested (trained feat), perhaps it might be better to lower the DCs, but cap the number of additional learned feats based on level/stat, or put a time limit on the use of the feat.

You could keep the tough roll to add something to the permanent feat list, while still letting fighters get some use out of the ability day to day.

Sorry if I am stepping in over my head, been away a long time, but fighter fixes really fascinate me.
2013-03-23, 09:56 PM
Garryl

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Any chance you can make it less dip-tastic? 3+Con saves and attacks rerolled per encounter at level 1 is just too good, especially on top of 6+Int skill points, 3 maneuvers and a stance (which are inexplicably not martial maneuvers despite using the exact same terminology), functional proficiency with everything (admittedly more of a cool factor than major power), and a presumably floating bonus feat (it never actually says what you do with the feats in your repertoire, just how you put them there, so this doesn't actually do anything as written).
2013-03-23, 10:03 PM
Waker

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

I don't have to many suggestions to make (especially since typing on a tablet is bloody annoying) but a few comments/questions.
-Maybe add Knowledge (Nobility). As a mercenary/soldier, being able to know the reputation of clients, ranking structures and the like would be importantish.
-Bonus to initiative and acting in surprise rounds. Always bothered me that the trained, professional soldier would be dragging his feat in the initiative count.
-Any plans to shore up the weakness with low reflex/will and general vulnerability against spells?
-Would damage reduction or a healing bonus be appropriate?
2013-03-23, 10:22 PM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poppatomus

very interesting, and it seems very cool. I think that, perhaps, martial law might be a bit frustrating, given the random element. To modify an idea I once suggested (trained feat), perhaps it might be better to lower the DCs, but cap the number of additional learned feats based on level/stat, or put a time limit on the use of the feat.

Martial Lore you mean. And there is a time limit... oh, you meant that he should only learn the feats for a specific length of time. No, I don't think that makes sense. But there are built in time constraints on exactly when he is able to learn the feats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garryl

Any chance you can make it less dip-tastic?

I originally had it at 1 + Con mod SP, I guess I'll bump it back down. Compared to the Warblade, which this is built from, what makes it more dip-tastic?

Quote:

3 maneuvers and a stance (which are inexplicably not martial maneuvers despite using the exact same terminology)

For reasoning see here and here. Also, Arts of War and martial maneuvers are not mechanically identical. For example, this Fighter can use the same strike as long as he has SP to spend. On the other hand, he is unable to recover his maneuvers in the middle of a battle.

Quote:

a presumably floating bonus feat (it never actually says what you do with the feats in your repertoire, just how you put them there, so this doesn't actually do anything as written).

You do with them whatever the feats say that you do with them. In this revision of the mechanic, the Repertoire is just a fancy name for the Fighter's collection of feats. I felt the need to give it a name since this Fighter does not have a finite number of bonus feats.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Waker

Maybe add Knowledge (Nobility). As a mercenary/soldier, being able to know the reputation of clients, ranking structures and the like would be importantish.

I may yet, though then I would probably also include Diplomacy. I'll be tinkering with the skill list.

Quote:

Bonus to initiative and acting in surprise rounds. Always bothered me that the trained, professional soldier would be dragging his feat in the initiative count.

This kind of stuff will be handled by maneuvers.

Quote:

Any plans to shore up the weakness with low reflex/will and general vulnerability against spells?

Again, this will be the purview of maneuvers and utilities.

Quote:

Would damage reduction or a healing bonus be appropriate?

Possibly stance/utility related.
2013-03-23, 10:42 PM
Poppatomus

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Martial Lore you mean. And there is a time limit... oh, you meant that he should only learn the feats for a specific length of time. No, I don't think that makes sense. But there are built in time constraints on exactly when he is able to learn the feats.

Apologies for the mistake, serves me right for posting and typing up notes at the same time.

I guess the concern I have is whether you could roll a 5th level char who spends half his starting gold to learn basically every active fighter feat? Not sure if that's possible given the set up you've provided, so some questions:

1.) Can you learn an identified feat without having the requisite feats, by making the higher roll, or do you need the requisite feats to even make the attempt? I presume the answer is you need the pre-reqs, but it is not clear.

2.) What exactly counts as an actively used feat? Is weapon specialization "active"? Exotic weapon proficiency? Improved initiative?

3.) Do you have to learn a feat from a "creature" or can you learn a feat from watching a person fight? If the latter, could I pay less money to a high level fighter to make one shield bash against me every few hours, and make the regular, unaided check 5 times a day? Could I just go watch the gladiators practice?

4.) Can I re-roll a failed check without seeing the feat again?

5.) Does the martial lore check reflect my ability to identify an unknown feat in the heat of combat or just the chance that I recognize enough of it that I can try to learn it?
2013-03-23, 10:57 PM
Garryl

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

I originally had it at 1 + Con mod SP, I guess I'll bump it back down. Compared to the Warblade, which this is built from, what makes it more dip-tastic?

The 3-6 rerolled saves (and attacks) per encounter? You know, the very thing that you dismissed when responding to Ashtagon as being too significant an influence on the rest of the game. Consider that people already dip Cleric 1 for a 1/day reroll and a pair of bonus feats. Besides, you already have arts of war for succeeding on saving throws (and attack rolls).

Quote:

For reasoning see here and here.

Then please change the terminology. Since they use the same terms, it is confusing with respect to interacting with ToB's system. You have maneuvers, so are you a martial adept? Do you gain full IL? Can I use Martial Lore to identify all disciplines you know when you initiate one of these maneuvers? Are your stances, describes solely in the context of Arts of War, mutually exclusive with martial stances?

(Also, fun fact regarding point #2 of the second link: The Wizard and Cleric also get +1 BAB on the levels that they don't gain new spell levels, except 19th.)

Quote:

You do with them whatever the feats say that you do with them. In this revision of the mechanic, the Repertoire is just a fancy name for the Fighter's collection of feats. I felt the need to give it a name since this Fighter does not have a finite number of bonus feats.

As written, you never gain or benefit from the bonus feats. You just add them to your repertoire (and in the case of the 1st level feat, you also "know" it).

Are you saying that with a one level dip and enough time and effort, the Fighter can get all of the Fighter feats he qualifies for as bonus feats? At the same time?
2013-03-23, 11:22 PM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poppatomus

1.) Can you learn an identified feat without having the requisite feats, by making the higher roll, or do you need the requisite feats to even make the attempt? I presume the answer is you need the pre-reqs, but it is not clear.

Good point. I will attempt to make clear that, yes, to add a feat to your Repertoire you must first know all of the prerequisite feats.

Quote:

2.) What exactly counts as an actively used feat? Is weapon specialization "active"? Exotic weapon proficiency? Improved initiative?

I intentionally left that vague and up to DM interpretation. If anyone has better guidelines for this let me know.

Quote:

3.) Do you have to learn a feat from a "creature" or can you learn a feat from watching a person fight? If the latter, could I pay less money to a high level fighter to make one shield bash against me every few hours, and make the regular, unaided check 5 times a day? Could I just go watch the gladiators practice?

If you're hiring someone to shield bash you every few hours, that's exactly what the training pay is supposed to be for, and exactly why you normally get a reduced DC. I guess if you really want to not have that fighter give you pointers on shield bashing while he does it, and make the unaided check at the higher DC, if the DM lets you, why not?

You can simply go watch the gladiators practice, if you have access to such an arena, and make unaided checks against feats you see them using.

Quote:

4.) Can I re-roll a failed check without seeing the feat again?

No, I will make that clear.

Quote:

5.) Does the martial lore check reflect my ability to identify an unknown feat in the heat of combat or just the chance that I recognize enough of it that I can try to learn it?

~~I might add some subtext to this aim, but really, that can (and maybe should) be up to each player to decide for his/her character.~~

EDIT: Ah, I see. Grod had changed my original ability, and when I copy/paste'd it from Grod's thread, I didn't notice. I have made edits to the ability now, inspired by Grod's change, that makes this more explicit (I hope).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garryl

The 3-6 rerolled saves (and attacks) per encounter? You know, the very thing that you dismissed when responding to Ashtagon as being too significant an influence on the rest of the game. Consider that people already dip Cleric 1 for a 1/day reroll and a pair of bonus feats. Besides, you already have arts of war for succeeding on saving throws (and attack rolls).

True. I knocked out the ability to reroll saving throws, I think before your post. And remember, it's now only 1 + Con modifier.

Quote:

Then please change the terminology. Since they use the same terms, it is confusing with respect to interacting with ToB's system. You have maneuvers, so are you a martial adept? Do you gain full IL? Can I use Martial Lore to identify all disciplines you know when you initiate one of these maneuvers? Are your stances, describes solely in the context of Arts of War, mutually exclusive with martial stances?

I would think it's obvious by the intent and the title that this class isn't supposed interact with Tome of Battle's system... Sure, I could change the names, but why would I when, A) the words chosen reflect the mechanics well, and B) the words are automatically associated by my readers with the concepts I'm trying to display? It's the presentation and fluff I want to distance this rewrite from, not the mechanics themselves (though I have changed them a bit too).

I can make a note at the beginning of the post explaining my intentions as a designer if that would make things clearer.

Quote:

(Also, fun fact regarding point #2 of the second link: The Wizard and Cleric also get +1 BAB on the levels that they don't gain new spell levels, except 19th.)

Heh, yeah, I should add that in as a further jab...

Quote:

As written, you never gain or benefit from the bonus feats. You just add them to your repertoire (and in the case of the 1st level feat, you also "know" it).

That's getting nitpicky isn't it? Okay, so if I change the terminology from "know" to "gain" you have no problems?

Quote:

Are you saying that with a one level dip and enough time and effort, the Fighter can get all of the Fighter feats he qualifies for as bonus feats? At the same time?

A Wizard can do the same thing for arcane spells (arguably for any spells he can find). The only problem here is that, you're right, a character could take a one-level dip in Fighter and use it to gain the "Repertoire" effect allowing them to then learn any feat at any time, since the only limiting factor to fighter bonus feats (the not **** ones anyway) is BAB.

Perhaps a limit to the size of the fighter's repertoire to the tune of two or three feats per fighter level?
2013-03-24, 01:55 AM
Garryl

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

True. I knocked out the ability to reroll saving throws, I think before your post. And remember, it's now only 1 + Con modifier.

Hence why I said 3-6 instead of 5-8. I tend to assume that adventurers have a minimum of 14 Con, and unless they're focusing heavily they rarely go above 20 until high enough levels that I don't really care about.

... but you didn't know that because I never actually said that, hence the confusion. I apologize.

Quote:

I would think it's obvious by the intent and the title that this class isn't supposed interact with Tome of Battle's system... Sure, I could change the names, but why would I when, A) the words chosen reflect the mechanics well, and B) the words are automatically associated by my readers with the concepts I'm trying to display? It's the presentation and fluff I want to distance this rewrite from, not the mechanics themselves (though I have changed them a bit too).

I can make a note at the beginning of the post explaining my intentions as a designer if that would make things clearer.

It would help to clarify the lack of interaction, thank you. I greatly prefer homebrew that is inclusive rather than exclusive (ie: that can be used together with existing material). Overloading terminology with multiple meanings is usually an exclusive thing as it causes confusion when both meanings would be valid in the same context, or when the usage with one would imply unintended consequences if interpreted with the other.

You might want to specify that Martial Study and Martial Stance can't be part of the Fighter's repertoire, both to clarify that this is very much so not for games using ToB, and so that anyone who decides to use ToB anyways doesn't get the bright idea to load up on ToB maneuvers and stances with those feats and the copious number of feats granted by the repertoire to make an actual Warblade feel outdone.

Speaking of no ToB, does this mean that are Fighter cannot multiclass with the ToB classes or otherwise use ToB content?

Quote:

That's getting nitpicky isn't it? Okay, so if I change the terminology from "know" to "gain" you have no problems?

Probably better to just add one sentence at the end (or the beginning, or wherever) that says "A Fighter gains all feats in his repertoire that he qualifies for as bonus feats." That would remove any and all ambiguity, and you wouldn't have to worry later on about whether you refer to learning or gaining or adding to the Fighter's repertoire if you add new abilities down the line that deal with the repertoire.

I apologize if I come across as nitpicky at times. I like my rules language to be as clear as possible when dealing with non-simulationist game aspects. My ideal homebrew is only slightly more ambiguous than contract law in Lojban. It's just the way I think about these kinds of things.

Quote:

A Wizard can do the same thing for arcane spells (arguably for any spells he can find). The only problem here is that, you're right, a character could take a one-level dip in Fighter and use it to gain the "Repertoire" effect allowing them to then learn any feat at any time, since the only limiting factor to fighter bonus feats (the not **** ones anyway) is BAB.

Perhaps a limit to the size of the fighter's repertoire to the tune of two or three feats per fighter level?

Wizards can, yes, but the power they can get out of it is still limited by their spell slots. A one level dip gets a few cantrips and 1st-level spells per day at CL 1, regardless of how many spells you scribe (and Clerics and Druids can do the same without having to bother with the scribing). Such limited spellcasting loses its power rather quickly. Infinite feats (not that you have that any more) do a pretty good job of being useful regardless of level. The sheer quantity of them is certainly too much for a 1 level dip.

Part of my reaction was simply the surprise at granting everything in the repertoire at once. Most Fighter fixes just give a limited number of feats at once, periodically reselectable, chosen from a larger list.

You do realize that you're falling prey to the classic trap of thinking that more and more feats actually fixes anything, right? Not that it doesn't help things when you're going for versatility in combat styles, but it doesn't fix higher-level issues at all, risks excessive power at low levels when the Fighter was already reasonably good, and adds a ton of complexity all the while. But you know this already, so why am I telling you? Probably because it's late and I need to get some sleep.

You should give a guideline about how many feats a Fighter who begins play above 1st level has in his repertoire.
2013-03-24, 07:30 AM
nonsi

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

What's the objective with this guy ? (tier, power level . . .)

Overall, I like your Bonus Feats mechanics.
For once, feats-repertoire expansion that makes sense.

>> "A fighter's repertoire may never exceed four Fighter Bonus Feats per fighter level,"
Definitely reasonable.

>>"... and a fighter may never learn more Fighter Bonus Feats at any given level in this way than his Int score - 10 (to a minimum of 1)."
I'd nix (or at least change) this one, because it'll suddenly make every other novice fighter a rocket scientist.

Btw, what about battlefield mobility and action economy ?

EDIT: ... and mental resilience? (can't build everything over Stamina points, you know)
2013-03-24, 09:15 AM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garryl

Hence why I said 3-6 instead of 5-8. I tend to assume that adventurers have a minimum of 14 Con, and unless they're focusing heavily they rarely go above 20 until high enough levels that I don't really care about.

... but you didn't know that because I never actually said that, hence the confusion. I apologize.

Right. Do you think I should just get rid of the re-rolling entirely and leave that to the maneuvers?

Quote:

It would help to clarify the lack of interaction, thank you. I greatly prefer homebrew that is inclusive rather than exclusive (ie: that can be used together with existing material). Overloading terminology with multiple meanings is usually an exclusive thing as it causes confusion when both meanings would be valid in the same context, or when the usage with one would imply unintended consequences if interpreted with the other.

Understood. This is more a look at what the Warblade might have been had it officially been the Fighter fix. As such, it should not be used in conjunction with any material straight from Tome of Battle. Part of the reason I use the same terminology though is so, for people that want to playtest this, they can port any maneuvers/stances over to my mechanics that I haven't gotten to yet without much fuss.

Quote:

You might want to specify that Martial Study and Martial Stance can't be part of the Fighter's repertoire, both to clarify that this is very much so not for games using ToB, and so that anyone who decides to use ToB anyways doesn't get the bright idea to load up on ToB maneuvers and stances with those feats and the copious number of feats granted by the repertoire to make an actual Warblade feel outdone.

Will do.

Quote:

Speaking of no ToB, does this mean that are Fighter cannot multiclass with the ToB classes or otherwise use ToB content?

A good rule of thumb should be, "if this Fighter is at the table, no content from Tome of Battle should be used by the players, except by DM approval on a case-by-case basis."

Quote:

Probably better to just add one sentence at the end (or the beginning, or wherever) that says "A Fighter gains all feats in his repertoire that he qualifies for as bonus feats." That would remove any and all ambiguity, and you wouldn't have to worry later on about whether you refer to learning or gaining or adding to the Fighter's repertoire if you add new abilities down the line that deal with the repertoire.

Yes, thank you, that makes a good deal of sense.

Quote:

I apologize if I come across as nitpicky at times. I like my rules language to be as clear as possible when dealing with non-simulationist game aspects. My ideal homebrew is only slightly more ambiguous than contract law in Lojban. It's just the way I think about these kinds of things.

Understandable. Clarity in rules language is a good thing.

Quote:

You do realize that you're falling prey to the classic trap of thinking that more and more feats actually fixes anything, right? Not that it doesn't help things when you're going for versatility in combat styles, but it doesn't fix higher-level issues at all, risks excessive power at low levels when the Fighter was already reasonably good, and adds a ton of complexity all the while. But you know this already, so why am I telling you? Probably because it's late and I need to get some sleep.

I'm not falling into that trap. Not really. A) I reduced the number of guaranteed bonus feats the Fighter gets from 11 to 6, so I wanted a mechanism for players to recoup that loss, and B) I'm keying maneuvers/stances/utilities off of feats, so that in order to learn the "Art" you have to have some Fighter Feats first. Though... I'm beginning to question the wisdom of B)... I may open up the Arts requirements a bit as I get to designing.

Quote:

You should give a guideline about how many feats a Fighter who begins play above 1st level has in his repertoire.

Easy enough. Will do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nonsi

What's the objective with this guy ? (tier, power level . . .)

Power level similar to Warblade but with a lower floor (middle Tier 4) and a potentially higher ceiling (middle Tier 2) that can vary by player choices and group preference.

Quote:

Overall, I like your Bonus Feats mechanics.
For once, feats-repertoire expansion that makes sense.

Good. That's what I was going for. I'm glad you like it.

Quote:

>>"... and a fighter may never learn more Fighter Bonus Feats at any given level in this way than his Int score - 10 (to a minimum of 1)."
I'd nix (or at least change) this one, because it'll suddenly make every other novice fighter a rocket scientist.

Yeah, I added that at like 3am last night. I have changed it to a limit up to Con modifier per level.

Quote:

Btw, what about battlefield mobility and action economy ?

No worries, my friend. Battlefield mobility will be taken care of by Utilities, while action economy will remain the purview of Maneuvers.

Quote:

EDIT: ... and mental resilience? (can't build everything over Stamina points, you know)

What do you mean exactly?
2013-03-24, 10:57 AM
Xhosant

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Knowledge (Architecture and Engineering)

Roy vs. Thog reference?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Combat Cunning (Ex): Starting at 10th level, a Fighter is never surprised and [...]

Fluff or crunch? He's never surprised, so he rerolls, or he's never surprised, and in addition he rerolls?
2013-03-24, 11:30 AM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhosant

Roy vs. Thog reference?

lol, no, I don't know what you're talking about.

Quote:

Fluff or crunch? He's never surprised, so he rerolls, or he's never surprised, and in addition he rerolls?

Ah, it is intended to be crunch. He's never surprised, also he gets rerolls. I'll link to the surprise rules to make it more clear.
2013-03-24, 11:45 AM
Xhosant

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

lol, no, I don't know what you're talking about.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0808.html

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Ah, it is intended to be crunch. He's never surprised, also he gets rerolls. I'll link to the surprise rules to make it more clear.

Thanks :D
2013-03-24, 11:53 AM
Morty

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

I couldn't find it in the designer's notes, so I have a question: what is this class's relationship with the other martial classes? Specifically, the Barbarian, the Paladin and the Ranger? It's obviously more powerful - but the question is, how would they be brought in line with it?

Of course, it's been my personal opinion for a while that the Barbarian class is redundant - it's just a Fighter or Ranger who gets really angry in combat.
2013-03-24, 11:56 AM
Xhosant

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morty

I couldn't find it in the designer's notes, so I have a question: what is this class's relationship with the other martial classes? Specifically, the Barbarian, the Paladin and the Ranger? It's obviously more powerful - but the question is, how would they be brought in line with it?

My guess is, as fighter, since he really is the fighter. Just because he's become viable doesn't mean he's got a different attitude. Unless he's gone snob, or if you factor in the Big Dumb Fighter stereotype, in which case he's gone less dumb whith whatever that entails.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morty

Of course, it's been my personal opinion for a while that the Barbarian class is redundant - it's just a Fighter or Ranger who gets really angry in combat.

Mr. Welch's no-no's #2300ish: I will not refer to the barbarian as a fighter with less bonus feats and more anger management issues.
2013-03-24, 04:04 PM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morty

I couldn't find it in the designer's notes, so I have a question: what is this class's relationship with the other martial classes? Specifically, the Barbarian, the Paladin and the Ranger? It's obviously more powerful - but the question is, how would they be brought in line with it?

Of course, it's been my personal opinion for a while that the Barbarian class is redundant - it's just a Fighter or Ranger who gets really angry in combat.

Well, I do agree with you somewhat on your personal opinion, but really, it's neither here nor there. This thread isn't about a system-wide overhaul. I've tried those in the past with little to no traction. This is just a showcase on the Warblade looked at through a different lens. It has the same relationship with the other martial classes that the Warblade has.
2013-03-24, 04:34 PM
Morty

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Alright, fair enough. I'm otherwise quite impressed with this class. Besides, other martial classes don't have as many problems as the Fighter.
2013-03-25, 01:11 AM
nonsi

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Power level similar to Warblade but with a lower floor (middle Tier 4) and a potentially higher ceiling (middle Tier 2) that can vary by player choices and group preference.

1. How do you intend to touch T2 (can do anything) without magical powers ?
2. Isn't this a bit unfair to novice players ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Yeah, I added that at like 3am last night. I have changed it to a limit up to Con modifier per level.

I find it hard to see how one's Con affect their capacity to process new combat insights.
Anyway, the total seems excessive to me. I mean, no player really needs (or will utilize in practice) a total of 4 feats per level.
I believe it would be enough if you limit it to 1 / level with the current bonus feats serving as floating feats (not sure about 1st level being appropriate for a floating feat slot though).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

No worries, my friend. Battlefield mobility will be taken care of by Utilities, while action economy will remain the purview of Maneuvers.

In that case, retraining should be allowed, so that one has chance to rectify past mistakes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

What do you mean exactly?

Without taking player's choices into account, the guy that stands in the forefront of battle shouldn't by so susceptible (low base Will saves) to mental influence.
2013-03-25, 03:13 AM
Just to Browse

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nonsi

1. How do you intend to touch T2 (can do anything) without magical powers ?
2. Isn't this a bit unfair to novice players ?

If you're using one of Z's fighter fixes, chances are you're not a novice. Even so, the design goal is to open the fighter class up so that people can underplay it and be interesting without outshining their fireball wizard-friend.

Quote:

I find it hard to see how one's Con affect their capacity to process new combat insights.

SADitty SAD SADderrson. Also I don't see how toughness explicitly effects something that is RAW written as partially luck (HP) and how your perception stat is linked to mental fortitude while "force of will" is not, or why you can't be precise with a bow. D&D is a system of abstractions.

Quote:

Anyway, the total seems excessive to me. I mean, no player really needs (or will utilize in practice) a total of 4 feats per level.
I believe it would be enough if you limit it to 1 / level with the current bonus feats serving as floating feats (not sure about 1st level being appropriate for a floating feat slot though).

The point is that there is a huge number of crappy feats out there, and this fighter will want weapon focus and dodge and the like so that he can pick up a variety of effective feats and actually be flexible in combat situations. The large number isn't unnecessary, it's absolutely vital.[/quote]
2013-03-25, 06:50 AM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nonsi

1. How do you intend to touch T2 (can do anything) without magical powers ?
2. Isn't this a bit unfair to novice players ?

1. The tiers aren't about magical powers. Tier 1 is a combination of raw power + excessive quantity of power + excessive access to power options. Tier 2 is that minus the excessive access to options. With stuff like this, I can get the fighter there if I want to, and still provide T4 and T3 options as well.

2. See JusttoBrowse's response to this.

Quote:

I find it hard to see how one's Con affect their capacity to process new combat insights.

Either there is no limit, or I base it on Intelligence, which is undesirable. So, I took a third road and added a limit based on the character's ability to train their body. I'll fluff the crunch up some.

Quote:

Anyway, the total seems excessive to me. I mean, no player really needs (or will utilize in practice) a total of 4 feats per level.

Well, I was considering moving it back to 3/level. But 1/level is just too low. And none of the feats are floating feats... I don't know where people are getting that idea. Also, didn't you in your last response say that 4/level seemed reasonable? :smallconfused:

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In that case, retraining should be allowed, so that one has chance to rectify past mistakes.

Yes, it should. That's something from the Warblade that I forgot to include in this reload, thank you.

Quote:

Without taking player's choices into account, the guy that stands in the forefront of battle shouldn't by so susceptible (low base Will saves) to mental influence.

I figure some people would disagree with you. I don't, but that's why I didn't bake in all good saves, because it would be "too powerful" for some people" For those that agree with you Moment of Perfect Mind and other maneuvers/utilities for higher level characters will provide the tools you need.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just to Browse

If you're using one of Z's fighter fixes, chances are you're not a novice. Even so, the design goal is to open the fighter class up so that people can underplay it and be interesting without outshining their fireball wizard-friend.

My hope here is that even a novice could pick up and play this class, and choose a bunch of stuff based on it sounding cool and still play at a mid-T4 level and not feel like they have no end-game content.

Quote:

SADitty SAD SADderrson.

Well, that's not really the point, but it doesn't hurt either. If you're a fighter you still need at least one of Strength or Dexterity (and having both is beneficial). So no fighter is ever going to be single attribute dependent without a huge rewrite of the game.

Quote:

The large number isn't unnecessary, it's absolutely vital.

Again, I wouldn't call it absolutely vital, it's just something I wanted to include to give the fighter an organic learning mechanism. It's true that their number of feats could become arbitrarily large, just like a Wizard's spells known, but in practice, Wizards very rarely know ALLTHESPELLS, and I imagine that fighters of this class would also rarely know ALLTHEFEATS.

EDIT: I made a few alterations to the class features and the proficiencies and the designer's notes. I changed how "low-level" maneuver prereqs work, and I think I'm confident enough now to move forward with Arts design. My thoughts on the really powerful T2 Arts will be that they can only be used once before Stamina is recovered (so once per encounter), and they will show up around the same time spells of similar power can be cast by a Wizard or Cleric 4 times a day.
2013-03-25, 11:21 PM
Mighty_Chicken

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

All the theory from the previous post is fascinating and this fix very, very fun. I was looking for a Fighter fix for my campaign, and yours introduces Warblade traits in an organic way.

It would be perfect (at least for my current needs)... if it weren't for the infinite-feats thing. If my campaign goes as long as they generally go, the group's fighter will have something between 24 and 40 fighter feats! And, if I understood this well, they're all active at the same time?

This is so... inelegant. I know I could just houserule it out if I wanted, but could anyone help me understand why is this a good idea?

~~A second question: how far behind of this fighter fix are PF rangers and paladins? I guess not much...?~~ (Already answered :) )
2013-03-26, 07:40 AM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mighty_Chicken

It would be perfect (at least for my current needs)... if it weren't for the infinite-feats thing. If my campaign goes as long as they generally go, the group's fighter will have something between 24 and 40 fighter feats! And, if I understood this well, they're all active at the same time?

This is so... inelegant.

I don't understand what you find inelegant about it, though I can see why DMs might be reticent to include this class because of it. But, to me anyway, it's that nagging voice in the back of your head that says it's a crazy power increase that make the Fighter whoa-em-gee broken. Once you learn to stop listening to that, and understand that the difference is very small between a Warblade 20 with 4 fighter feats and a Warblade 20 with 40 fighter feats, I think you'll not mind the feature so much.

Quote:

I know I could just houserule it out if I wanted, but could anyone help me understand why is this a good idea?

To me it just makes more sense to give the fighter an organic learning method in the same way a wizard has one. They both study their fields of excellence their whole lives. A fighter's breadth of combat knowledge shouldn't be capped, but that's just my opinion.

Regardless, making this fix as broadly applicable and accessible by as many game tables as I can was the goal, and if the infinite feats thing is too much, well, then, I'll have to provide an alternative. Thanks for the feedback, MC!

EDIT: With regards to your concerns, I have written this (and included it in the Designer's Recommendations spoiler directly after the current Bonus Feats feature:

"As an alternative approach, nix all of the rules for using Martial Lore to train new feats. Replace them with something more simple.

Allow the Fighter to train a single new feat at a time with 12 hours of practice (that needs not all be taken consecutively). The new feat takes the place of an old one; in effect the fighter loses an old feat to gain a new one after practicing for the required time."

How does that work for you?
2013-03-26, 10:29 AM
Greenish

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Why oh why does the warblghter pay two weapon groups for exotic weapons, especially since it can become proficient with any weapon at no cost (beyond a bit of time)?
2013-03-26, 10:44 AM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenish

Why oh why does the warblghter pay two weapon groups for exotic weapons, especially since it can become proficient with any weapon at no cost (beyond a bit of time)?

Good point. I'll reduce the cost to a 1:1 ratio. Does four weapon groups seem like overkill? Should I reduce it to three groups?
2013-03-26, 10:56 AM
Greenish

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Good point. I'll reduce the cost to a 1:1 ratio. Does four weapon groups seem like overkill? Should I reduce it to three groups?

Eh, four is what the fighterfighter gets, and with the mechanism to learn weapons it's not that big a deal anyway.

Lord of War seems to involve way lot of mid-fight fiddling, not to mention screwing over everyone who relies on Weapon Finesse, TWF, PA… actually, any damn melee strategy that doesn't involve full casting.

And, unrelated, but an ability to never be flat-footed might come in handy at higher levels, to be able to use the counters the warblghter may have.
2013-03-26, 11:02 AM
Ziegander

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenish

Eh, four is what the fighterfighter gets, and with the mechanism to learn weapons it's not that big a deal anyway.

Okay.

Quote:

Lord of War seems to involve way lot of mid-fight fiddling, not to mention screwing over everyone who relies on Weapon Finesse, TWF, PA… actually, any damn melee strategy that doesn't involve full casting.

To be fair, it screws over ranged strategies too. He's not calling himself the Lord of War for nothing!

Quote:

And, unrelated, but an ability to never be flat-footed might come in handy at higher levels, to be able to use the counters the warblghter may have.

Huh. Uncanny Dodge doesn't actually do that... how strange. Should I just add it to Uncanny Dodge and pretend that ability has always been there or should I add it to Combat Cunning?
2013-03-26, 11:09 AM
Greenish

Re: The Warblade Reloaded [D&D 3.5, From "The Fighter Problem & How to Fix It"]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

To be fair, it screws over ranged strategies too.

Yes, I meant to add that. Though most of all, it screws over the poor sods who actually try to use it in a game. Every time someone tries to attack the warblghter, you go over a list of a few dozen feats at least, cross over all that wouldn't apply, recalculate the attack, AC, DC, whathaveyou numbers…

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziegander

Huh. Uncanny Dodge doesn't actually do that... how strange. Should I just add it to Uncanny Dodge and pretend that ability has always been there or should I add it to Combat Cunning?

Could make sense in either, but might be easier for people to notice if you didn't change the ability they're already familiar with. Besides, never flat-footed and never surprised are already linked in Foresight, so why not here.

Level	BAB	Fort	Ref	Will	Special	Arts Known
1st	+1	+2	+0	+0	Arts of War, Bonus Feats	4
2nd	+2	+3	+0	+0	Uncanny Dodge	5
3rd	+3	+3	+1	+1		6
4th	+4	+4	+1	+1	Bonus Feat	7
5th	+5	+4	+1	+1		8
6th	+6/+1	+5	+2	+2	Improved Uncanny Dodge	9
7th	+7/+2	+5	+2	+2		10
8th	+8/+3	+6	+2	+2	Bonus Feat	11
9th	+9/+4	+6	+3	+3		12
10th	+10/+5	+7	+3	+3	Combat Cunning	12
11th	+11/+6/+1	+7	+3	+3		13
12th	+12/+7/+2	+8	+4	+4	Bonus Feat	14
13th	+13/+8/+3	+8	+4	+4		15
14th	+14/+9/+4	+9	+4	+4	Unimpeachable Skill	15
15th	+15/+10/+5	+9	+5	+5		16
16th	+16/+11/+6/+1	+10	+5	+5	Bonus Feat	17
17th	+17/+12/+7/+2	+10	+5	+5		18
18th	+18/+13/+8/+3	+11	+6	+6	Stance Mastery	18
19th	+19/+14/+9/+4	+11	+6	+6		19
20th	+20/+15/+10/+5	+12	+6	+6	Lord of War, Bonus Feat	20

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