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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
HunterOfJello
no Cleric as a class?
ya know, I always felt the Druid was more scary. and flavorful. comparing the two, it's all about the druid in my book.
and Runestar, you're quite right, it's mostly going overly literal that lets people abuse the hell out of it, no right minded DM is letting anyone abuse Dragonwrought unless everyone else gets shenanigans.
and given you have to be a beholder to qualify for beholder mage, it's got some steep requirements. really steep requirements.
CockroachTeaParty, I agree.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
I'd probably add the Leadership feat to the list of Top 10 Most Powerful. So many abuses...
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
ya know, I always felt the Druid was more scary. and flavorful. comparing the two, it's all about the druid in my book.
But Clerics have the better spell list.
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and given you have to be a beholder to qualify for beholder mage, it's got some steep requirements. really steep requirements.
That... isn't really a hard requirement.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
sofawall
But Clerics have the better spell list.
That... isn't really a hard requirement.
true, but druids have cooler abilities, and can still pull the same shenanigans, with less trying.
it is if you're a PC. even if you can convince a DM to let you do it, you will be attacked whenever you go in a city.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
it is if you're a PC. even if you can convince a DM to let you do it, you will be attacked whenever you go in a city.
Illusions are somewhat handy for disguising your form. Also, PaO for qualifying.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
and given you have to be a beholder to qualify for beholder mage, it's got some steep requirements. really steep requirements.
I'm not sure if being a Beholder is all that steep of a requirement. Heck, I'd jump at the chance to play a Beholder, would be interesting.
Hmm, as for most powerful? Divination's. Sure, everything else listed will kill everything before they are even aware they are under attack, but ya still have to find the guy, and with spells like Legend Lore, Discern Location, and Greater Prying Eyes, you'll find anything you need to kill real quick.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
sofawall
Illusions are somewhat handy for disguising your form. Also, PaO for qualifying.
they won't work where the big eye is. you could cover it up, but I'd think a large amount of concentration is needed to make the illusion not look tacked on to this random piece of cloth or armor.
unless the beholder mage can cast it's spells into an antimagic field. which is kinda scary all by itself. I don't think it can, but I can double check.
regardless, like i said in OP, what do you guys think the 10 most powerful things are? make your own list, and put beholder mage on it.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
they won't work where the big eye is. you could cover it up, but I'd think a large amount of concentration is needed to make the illusion not look tacked on to this random piece of cloth or armor.
unless the beholder mage can cast it's spells into an antimagic field. which is kinda scary all by itself. I don't think it can, but I can double check.
regardless, like i said in OP, what do you guys think the 10 most powerful things are? make your own list, and put beholder mage on it.
If you haven't hit the final level in beholder mage, I believe you still have little eyes left, and so can close the big eye to prevent antimagic. If you have hit the final level, well, I'm sure there are spells that let you shut your big eye and still see, so you can still use illusions.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
they won't work where the big eye is. you could cover it up, but I'd think a large amount of concentration is needed to make the illusion not look tacked on to this random piece of cloth or armor.
unless the beholder mage can cast it's spells into an antimagic field. which is kinda scary all by itself. I don't think it can, but I can double check.
regardless, like i said in OP, what do you guys think the 10 most powerful things are? make your own list, and put beholder mage on it.
IIRC one of the requirements for Beholder Mage is putting out the Antimagic Field eye. Besides which you can use a Polymorph Any Object for going through town and dismiss/dispel it later. Hell of a surprise to anyone trying to dispel your magical protections in that case.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
they won't work where the big eye is. you could cover it up, but I'd think a large amount of concentration is needed to make the illusion not look tacked on to this random piece of cloth or armor.
unless the beholder mage can cast it's spells into an antimagic field. which is kinda scary all by itself. I don't think it can, but I can double check.
regardless, like i said in OP, what do you guys think the 10 most powerful things are? make your own list, and put beholder mage on it.
You have to destroy that antimagic eye to become a beholder mage, although you can always polymorph into a beholder (yes, into another one just like you, but with that eye intact) and take the Assume Supernatural Ability feat to get it back.
You may or may not lose your class features for the duration of the polymorph, though.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
ah, see I missed that.
well regardless, I am about as liable to see a beholder mage in game as Pun Pun, so I still hold to my list.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
ah, see I missed that.
well regardless, I am about as liable to see a beholder mage in game as Pun Pun, so I still hold to my list.
You want the most powerful and broken things in D&D, and you're refusing to write them in due to being too powerful? :smallsigh:
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
Lycanthromancer
You want the most powerful and broken things in D&D, and you're refusing to write them in due to being too powerful? :smallsigh:
I see your point. you win this time Lycanthromancer. :smallfurious: THIS TIME!!!!
:smalltongue:
(though, as far as details go, it was because I don't think I'll ever see it in game)
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
it is if you're a PC. even if you can convince a DM to let you do it, you will be attacked whenever you go in a city.
Central Eye concerns aside, if you are a guard, or even a squad of guards, making about 1 SP per day, and you see a beholder floating through town, minding its own business, chatting with its humanoid friends, you say you are going to attack it???
Run away? Likely.
Ignore it unless it breaks the law? Possible.
Send some private in to very politely ask it what it is doing in your town and would it please leave soon because it is scaring everyone? Maybe
But attack it?
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
Gnaeus
Central Eye concerns aside, if you are a guard, or even a squad of guards, making about 1 SP per day, and you see a beholder floating through town, minding its own business, chatting with its humanoid friends, you say you are going to attack it???
Run away? Likely.
Ignore it unless it breaks the law? Possible.
Send some private in to very politely ask it what it is doing in your town and would it please leave soon because it is scaring everyone? Maybe
But attack it?
all the cities with really good stuff to sell tend to have a pretty good quality guard system. I don't think the Lady of Pain would mind though tbh...
look can we leave the beholder discussion? I'm sorry I don't think playing a floating, paranoid head with killer dreads would be fun.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
the humanity
all the cities with really good stuff to sell tend to have a pretty good quality guard system. I don't think the Lady of Pain would mind though tbh...
look can we leave the beholder discussion? I'm sorry I don't think playing a floating, paranoid head with killer dreads would be fun.
A half-beholder would also qualify. Imagine a normal person but with a small beholder for a head, and chitinous armor plates all over his body.
Now, who wants to speculate on just HOW you get a half-beholder?
I know I don't.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
Right off hand, the most broken things I can think of in 3.5e D&D:
Tainted Scholar/Taint
Beholder Mage
Epic spellcasting
Gate
Shapechange
Manipulate Form (Sarrukh ability)
Shadow Miracles (Shadowcraft Mage PrC interpretation)
Wish SLA (Runecaster PrC, I believe)
Psionic Artificer (craft anything interpretation)
Spell-to-Power Erudite
Not everything on that list needs to be abused, but pretty much anything there will break or define a campaign if someone starts pushing its limits. Metamagic abuse through Incantrix just doesn't seem as bad as being able to craft anything for free, or cast any spell in existance at will, or casting nine spells a round, or free wishes.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
I have yet to meet a DM who would let a player be a beholder (except for some wacky one-session games), much less one who would allow one to put out their AM eye. How do you put out your eye using RAW? The rules don't cover maiming or mutilation anywhere, & blindness/deafness can't be permanency'd, even on yourself.
The Beholder Mage is an obvious NPC class, & any player trying to use it for themselves is blatantly munchkinizing. IMO, it doesn't qualify as a PrC as we commonly understand it, IE a class that players can aspire to take.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
Simulacrum can get you infinite free wishes by level 1.
See: Precocious Apprentice (summon mirror mephit).
Summon the mephit, have it make you a simulacrum of an efreeti, then wish for more simulacrums. Voila.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
The Omniscificer, Twice-Betrayer of Shar, Pun-pun, 1d2 Crusader, and the DM... to start things off...
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
Open-ended Polymorph effects, including Manipulate Form. They give us Pun-Pun, easy qualification for Beholder Mage, rogues and fighters turned into 12-headed cryohydras and firbolgs for more attacks and more strength, wizards turned into gold dragons for extra Int, Warshapers who have spent their last few hundred move actions turning themselves into a ball of Colossal tentacles, and so much more.
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Originally Posted by
Thespianus
I fail to see how "No, that guy is too fat to be hurt by your fire" would make sense.
Sigged.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
In no particular order:
-Taint
-Tainted Scholar
-Subverted Psion
-Unfettered Heroism
-Planar Shepard
-Dweomer Keeper
-Spell To Power Erudite
-Wizard
-Cleric
-Druid
-Archivist
-Humans
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
Diplomacy? I mean, sure, it's not exactly chain-gating, but there are a few deities that I wouldn't mind having on my side and being directly helpful to me.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
I can't believe I forgot Leadership! Of course, getting a 2nd PC of nearly the same level will be a powerful benefit. I also forgot about the Celerity feat as well; I guess I just wasn't thinking of feats at the time.
Then again, Leadership is only as bad (or as good) as the classes you have access to.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
OracleofWuffing
Diplomacy? I mean, sure, it's not exactly chain-gating, but there are a few deities that I wouldn't mind having on my side and being directly helpful to me.
skills are useful, but everybody has the ability to use them... consider skills included in classes, for example you could justify beguiler being scary because they get diplomacy as a class skill and enough skill points to use it.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
I think number one on the list should be common sense followed closely by clever ingenuity.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
Shinizak
I think number one on the list should be common sense followed closely by clever ingenuity.
The first is Wis and the second is Int, but it's mostly just fluff-text.
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
Nope, I don't mean wis and int. a clever player with his choice of 5 levels could probably take out a powerful (10+ cr) enemy given the right time and terrain.
=D
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
Wings of Peace
In no particular order:
-Taint
-Tainted Scholar
-Subverted Psion
-Unfettered Heroism
-Planar Shepard
-Dweomer Keeper
-Spell To Power Erudite
-Wizard
-Cleric
-Druid
-Archivist
-Humans
I actually don't get how Taint itself is supposed to be broken without the obscene PrCs that base casting off of it (which are on the list separately).
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Re: the 10 most powerful things in D&D
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Originally Posted by
Eurus
I actually don't get how Taint itself is supposed to be broken without the obscene PrCs that base casting off of it (which are on the list separately).
't ain't.
:smalltongue: