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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Lizard Lord
Why call her Data? Didn't Wizard of Oz with their Tin Man come before Star Trek? There may have been even older uses of this trope, though I don't know of them.
Personally I hope that Jones isn't emotionless, because I can't sympathize with, or feel anything for, an emotionless character. If Jones doesn't actually care about her decades of loneliness then why should I? If Jones doesn't can't actually feel things like friendship towards another person then why should we care that she outlives all the people she may have felt things towards?
To summarize: If Jones can't feel emotions then why should I feel emotions for her?
To be picayune, it wasn't that Nick Chopper - the Tin Woodman - didn't feel emotions. He started out as a normal human, but the Wicked Witch of the East enchanted his axe so it would cut off a piece of him until there was nothing left. He got around this by having a tinsmith fashion a new part whenever he lost one, but the tinsmith didn't make him a heart. And without a heart, Nick didn't think he had emotions anymore. But if you the book, it's clear he DID, even before the Wizard gave him a humbug heart. That might be Jones' problem. She sees humans having these emotional fireworks all over the place, and because that's not what SHE feels, she assumes she doesn't have them. But you can destroy a rock in a second with an explosion, or over millions of years by wearing it away. It may be what Jones feels is just as strong as a human, but very slow. So slow that the object of her emotion usually ceases to exist before she becomes aware that she feels something towards it/them...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Mewtarthio
If she were a philosophical zombie, then she wouldn't appear so emotionless. P-zombies are capable of emulating human emotions flawlessly, even though they lack the capacity to feel them.
I always thought the idea of s P-Zombie was that nobody was home. There is no 'they', no 'I' inside. Traditionally yes, in the thought experiment such a creature is capable of perfectly expressing emotions without anything feeling them, but it is hardly necessary for the core of the concept: a hollow shell, a person who isn't.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Nothing on the new one yet? Wow.
I got nothing.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Well its just been so confusing nobody is sure what to say.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Scowling Dragon
Well its just been so confusing nobody is sure what to say.
Actually, not really. Jones is voicing the same ponderings we had for the last update.
The new thing we have is Jones' footprints, and she is acknowledging them as her footprints, in the fossil record. That they're seen as hoaxes intimates that a number of her footprints were found in the record prior to the 'homo' genus evolving.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
sihnfahl
Actually, not really. Jones is voicing the same ponderings we had for the last update.
The new thing we have is Jones' footprints, and she is acknowledging them as her footprints, in the fossil record. That they're seen as hoaxes intimates that a number of her footprints were found in the record prior to the 'homo' genus evolving.
She has such a monster ego that she looks for references to herself in obscure texts. I bet she edits Wikipedia, too.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
I am not thrilled about the recent strips. I think they should've ended at one or two strips right after the trip-to-formation-of-earth.
GC is about discovery process, where some questions get answered but more are raised, and that happens within context of something going on. It is normally a mystery, with clues given sparingly and indirectly, and the fun is piecing them together. The recent ones have been way too much exposition and too much information dump just for its own sake.
Don't take me wrong, it is still good stuff. Much like Giant, Tom is too skilled at his craft to know not to write something unreadable. I just don't find it to be up to his usual high standards.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Nah. Im for once happy somebody just wanted answers and got them. Not every mystery needs to be cryptic and go on for 5 arcs.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Who wants to bet the fingerprint on the moon is going to come up again?
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
PhantomFox
Who wants to bet the fingerprint on the moon is going to come up again?
Well, it should. After all, it does reflect the power Coyote was granted by the human psyche if he's capable of affecting reality like that.
Which should also bring up the chasm that Coyote created between the forest and the Court with his claw...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
eee
To be picayune, it wasn't that Nick Chopper - the Tin Woodman - didn't feel emotions. He started out as a normal human, but the Wicked Witch of the East enchanted his axe so it would cut off a piece of him until there was nothing left. He got around this by having a tinsmith fashion a new part whenever he lost one, but the tinsmith didn't make him a heart. And without a heart, Nick didn't think he had emotions anymore. But if you the book, it's clear he DID, even before the Wizard gave him a humbug heart.
Well yea, that is what I meant. Someone that doesn't believe they have emotions, but they actually do. I suppose the confusion may come from the fact that I didn't watch a lot of Next Generation.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
PhantomFox
Who wants to bet the fingerprint on the moon is going to come up again?
You have your moon. And some other goodies.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
What is Gunnerkrigg Court? It is man's endeavor to become God.
The implications of that statement, combined with Coyote's hypothesis in today's last panel, combined with the Court's in-depth etheric studies, are frightening to consider.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Pheehelm
The implications of that statement, combined with Coyote's hypothesis in today's last panel, combined with the Court's in-depth etheric studies, are frightening to consider.
Ah, but of course it's frightening. Instead of subconciously guiding the Etheric, Gunnerkrigg is aiming to learn how to directly control it... like any other power.
We already see the first glimpses of what they've learned they're capable of - Kat's Mom's computer system ... the shields used against Ysengrim and Reynardine ... the bots, which are starting to act very human-like...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
'Starting', what do you mean, 'starting'?
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Speaking of the robots, I think Coyote's theory also raises some interesting questions about Kat. She's a more-or-less normal person now, but the robots are already making myths about her.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Yeah, that comes up in discussion a lot. Remember how Zimmy perceived Kat? She might achieve apotheosis some day, if the robots can affect the ether.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
My google-fu fails me and I really don't want to go into an in depth archive dive, is there any way someone could link me to the comic where zimmy says how she sees kat?
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Fjolnir
My google-fu fails me and I really don't want to go into an in depth archive dive, is there any way someone could link me to the comic where zimmy says how she sees kat?
One selective archive dive later...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Ah I was in an earlier space than that...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
spectralphoenix
Speaking of the robots, I think Coyote's theory also raises some interesting questions about Kat. She's a more-or-less normal person now, but the robots are already making
myths about her.
... can't believe I didn't even think about that.
I believe that a "oh crap" is in order.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Qwertystop
Actually, I think that's the mentioned bit of the book. Unless what I quoted was in fact a direct quote and not a paraphrasing of what you just said. Which it might be.
You are correct, I was paraphrasing it to fit the situation, and what Raven's Cry quoted was the phrase from the book I was talking about. Yay understanding! :smallbiggrin:
EDIT: What with the recent discussion, and the linked page, I feel like THIS is... quite relevant.
Edit 2: And this page was already posted. Whoops.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Ah, now we're finally getting to the important part. Ysengrin...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
eee
Ah, now we're finally getting to the important part. Ysengrin...
It must be hard for someone who hates humans be told that his very existence is due to humanity...
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Why's she thinking about Ysengrin? Does he have a relation to the ether experiments, or is she just thinking about his outrage about Coyote's story?
And yes, this answers a lot of questions about Zimmy's perception of Kat. Zimmy, being oversensitive to the ether, is seeing the stories being told about a robot angel.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Mephit
Why's she thinking about Ysengrin? Does he have a relation to the ether experiments, or is she just thinking about his outrage about Coyote's story?
The second, I believe.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
Not sure he actually hates humans, though, given the recent... events we've seen him and Coyote in. (What with Coyote removing memories selectively. Makes it easy to manipulate Ysengrin.)
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
I wonder...
Does Coyote remove the memory of him removing memories?
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Qwertystop
I wonder...
Does Coyote remove the memory of him removing memories?
If he's got any common sense at all, he'd remove the memory of the removal as well. And Coyote has much more than merely "common" sense.
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Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 3: Mystery Solved!
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Originally Posted by
Domochevsky
Not sure he actually hates humans, though, given the recent... events we've seen him and Coyote in. (What with Coyote removing memories selectively. Makes it easy to manipulate Ysengrin.)
His past behavior has shown a bit of animosity towards humans. No humans in the forest (unless invited); he doesn't want to spend any more time in their company than necessary; the condition that humans, should they want to live in the forest, first give up being physically human; him calling any forest-dwellers that go to the Court 'traitors'...
Yes, he feels regret after he attacks Annie and comes down from his rage... but then Coyote steals anything that makes him introspective as to his thoughts regarding humans, making him just as implacable as before. He never grows, he never changes... he's Ysengrin, Guardian of the Forest.